That and the guy who announced it last year fled to Facebook of all places.

>Goes to show that a year of anybody with any sort of clout complaining about the thousand little cuts of Liquid Glass on macOS will get a company to respond.

Worth remembering too that this isn't merely about "complaints", Apple has significant metrics on the rates at which users are upgrading to a new OS, or not. You can opt-out of sharing that data, but a lot of people (even technical people) may choose to check the box to share with Apple. Anecdotally, I myself and a LOT of other people have stuck with macOS 15 or earlier, but Apple should have a lot of hard data on it and adoption curves vs the past.

A real reaction does certainly suggest that this wasn't just a tempest in a teacup, but that they really weren't seeing the adoption on Macs they expected.

Given the other emphasis placed on performance improvements (likely in service to helping to mask the slowness of LLM Siri) I’m really hoping this is a modern Snow Leopard release. I’m looking forward to the Apple nerds digging and offering a compelling narrative about why I should care about updating.

And to add on to that, if this is a bug-fix bonanza release, hopefully we’ll also see a lot of positive movement during the beta period to keep shipping fixes. We’re getting a freaking EQ on AirPods!!!!111!!1! It seems Apple is finally taking some things to heart about listening to their users and I’m 10000% here for it.

I did not upgrade my laptop because it would come with the latest OS- I am not alone.

As far as I know, the best data the rest of us have is Google Trends. And based on that, it really does look like Liquid Glass elicited the largest negative reaction that Apple has ever had to an OS release.

"How to Switch to Android" hit 3x its all time peak, "iPhone revert update", hit 4x its all-time peak, "iPhone slow" hit 8x its all time peak, "iPhone bad now" hit 5x its all time peak, "iPhone fix battery" hit 3x its all-time peak (and 14x its five-year peak)

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=how%20to...

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=iphone%2...

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=i...

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=iphone%2...

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=iphone%2...

I mostly looked at this for iOS, but searches like "macOS slow", "mac slow", "fix mac battery", "fix mac", etc. all show similar hockey-stick jumps as Liquid Glass rolled out.

If this means a sudden highest-ever 10x shift in customer dissatisfaction - 1000% - then that has to have been significant.

The worst part, intentionally or not they left macOS 26 as the last release for all the Intel user.

DHH's dotfiles repo is not a viable replacement for macOS, I promise you. Linux is fun, but macOS is already enough of a *nix for most developers, and it works well without much tinkering.

I cannot believe that Apple is that insidious to have planned a milquetoast release to be the last one for Intel, but I totally believe that Apple is insidious enough to see how they can benefit from it.

That they're literally marketing macOS 27 as we've listened to your complaints about 26 completely deflates anyone's interest in running macOS 26 on Intel. Their Intel users are being marketed hard to switch to Apple Silicon.

How? Aren’t all update requests made to, and all updates downloaded from their servers?

Also, doesn’t the system that pushes emergency updates (https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/deployment/dep93ff7ea7...) have to know what OS you are running?

It’s a big problem, because running an old iOS is very bad for security. There’s still new vulnerabilities popping up in iOS, especially in the image and video decoders, that are fixed in newer point releases of iOS 26. I’m not sure if Apple is back porting all the fixes. I would definitely be a little afraid, because iMessage previews are a common attack vector and are zero-click. I don’t think anyone really turns off automatic previews; they’re very convenient.

I still would have liked a more genuine walk back (they sold it as "iterations and adjustments" as if the rewinded stuff were new ideas) but overall reassuring.

You will see that during this era Mac OS X was relegated to stepchild status and received far fewer support.

All this glory is just Steve Jobs selling it to us as a good thing! In the end it worked out, but it was more incidental and a collateral of the iPhone than the public memory likes to admit.

Probably the best reversion was getting rid of the butterfly keyboard and bringing back ports after Jony Ive was gone.

With a large enough trackpad, you could even move to a 1:1 type of movement, or add that functionality to a layer for the best of both worlds (like gyro enhanced aiming in games).

I’ve worked with some designers who did what you described with their huge tablets. Use the stylus to turn it into a giant touchpad. Works pretty good.

And before you mention it, yes the charging cable. In reality, plugging it in for literally 1 minute will get you enough battery to last hours. 5 minutes will get you an entire day. Normal people plug it in and go get a coffee or pee and then it’s fine until they log off for the day. Could it better? Of course, but it’s not so large an issue that they are losing customers on it, so it is what it is.

You’re not the target market for an Apple mouse and that’s okay.

It's also the terrible ergonomics.

It's the epitome of putting form before function. It's a desk ornament that leads to frequent injuries with use. See: https://www.google.com/search?q=magic+mouse+injury

Unfortunately I had to learn this when I got my first mac.

You don't have to go very deep into the ecosystem to encounter things that... well, things bottom out at shallow.

Looking back... glossy displays. flat keyboards without curvature to center your fingers on the keys. more and more hurdles to using macos as a technical person. prematurely missing USB-A. memory/storage that's not expandable. Dongles everywhere as a checkbox item/workaround.

and of course, anything that superficially seems to be a mouse.

It is neither a good trackpad replacement nor a good mouse design.

Any non-anecdotal data on that assertion?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hockey_puck_mouse

A good lesson in not messing with a good thing. If they had just put an electric motor in a classic Ferrari body, it could have been a nice moment for the energy transition.

I almost left apple entirely over those stupid switches lol.

They did it with Aqua when MacOS launched and again with the iPhone's original skeuomorphic UI and yet again with the flat redesign of iOS.

Classic case of the reality distortion field here.

Uninstalling Copilot and the local AI models is whats new on current insider builds.

https://redmondmag.com/articles/2025/10/08/microsoft-ends-lo...

Your links only apply to Home editions.

You can also use an autoattend.xml file on the install ISO to set up a local account (https://schneegans.de/windows/unattend-generator/) amongst other things like removing all the windows store apps, etc.

I believe they used the word edition because they plan on offering W365 cloud VMs with this config pre applied.

Also Jobs: fires the antenna designer

We could be holding it wrong, and Jobs be correct to point out that many rival phones at the time literally had manuals dictating how to hold their phones to avoid reception issues.

The antenna designer could have done a better job, preventing the situation, thereby not dragging Jobs into a PR storm.

Jobs could have handled the situation and communication _significantly_ better.

Whenever I use my personal Mac or iPad, still on the old OS, I wonder what they were thinking - I would guess it was rushed to hit the annual release, as it does have potential in parts.

That said, it looks from the few screenshots in this like you’re able to pare it back to something much closer to how it used to look, which is great and I’m glad they’re taking feedback on board.

I cannot help but think: they are such cowards, so afraid of anything that stands out after years of flat design. Like, you can almost feel like there is someone trying to sneak it in, only for it to get squeegeed at the last minute. The buttons could look like classic Aqua ( if they are allowed a background color that is), if it got slammed with a belt sander. Everything has to be too subtle, too toned down, too pale, and too faint, only noticable blown up to 4x on an OLED screen. It's like all they are allowed is "mimiminalizm", just remove, remove, remove, tone down, remove, slavishly, without thought. I'm supposed to cheer they added color back to in-focus window sidebars? First: good lord, what were they thinking? Of course they rolled such an utterly stupid decision back. Second: what color? Some single accent color applied to some whisper thin monochrome squiggles they call icons?

Its still more of the same. In the Installer app, there are windows where the dividing line between toolbar and content is like a 1px 30% grey line on same old bland 20% grey background, and that's with the new "Draw Borders" Accessibility setting turned on.

They can dress it up. Fix the worst issues. I'm thankful for it. Hell, I might not skip this one. But the problem still remains: Liquid Glass was a *bad, flawed* design from the start, whose central principle is contradictory (we'll get out of the way of your content by floating directly in front of your content all the time, in the way). There is no salvaging it.

Excep every time they do a big redesign like this. This happened when they moved away from skeuomorphism in iOS7(?) and then backpedalled hard in the following revision because of negative user feedback. Similar thing happened when they presented the reinvented Safari (I do't think that one even survived through betas). And it is happening now.

When they toned down the horrific excesses of skeumorphism (like leather textures) on macOS but still retained some skeumorphic design (e.g., buttons that look like buttons) people were pretty ok with it too. I remember some complaints that the lickable aqua buttons were gone but that wasn't really a serious complaint, just more of a "I kind of liked those gaudy buttons, sad they're gone" type of sentiment.

Given all other truly useful things you could implement as well as bug fixes, why did you think that investing time and money on Liquid Glass would deliver useful value to users?

I wonder how much time and money they wasted on something that nobody wanted, cared for, needed or solved any real problem?

It is so long, with so many unnecessary sentences. And it feels like everything is said at least twice; First a generic statement about the new feature. Then a specific example, or a deeper explanation of what the first generic statement was. Then a demo. And then a conclusion to the future.

The old Steve Jobs keynotes focused on the most interesting things, but now it feels like they are afraid not to include everything. So everything gets diluted.

It would help a lot if they would stop saying the same lines:"And now...", "We cannot wait for you to try our new XXXX ... ", or "We could not be more excited to...", "We are excited to... ".

"With that, now over to person-X"

If everything is fabulous and great and you’re always excited or proud, that becomes the baseline.

If I share it with a Polish or German friend and he says it's "not bad" then I know he is really impressed.

One of the main reasons that killed my desire to move to the US was the amount of fake questions during - on a paper - friendly discussions, when the point of those questions was just, and only just, visibility. An average American non corporate discussion is worse than a non-American corporate one. And that seems to be pretty global to me.

My brother and my sister-in-law watched “Somebody feeds Phil”, and we watched together the Sydney episode and after that some others, because I’d just announced that I’d move to Australia soon. That Sydney episode had quite normal discussions for us, Europeans. Of course, people had agenda, but they still reacted to what response they got. Even if things were cut, most times people seemed to react to something else from before. Then the next episode was from Las Vegas. And it had full with questions where nobody responded to the answers, nobody cared what the response was. And they kept those in the episode. There was a point when Phil asked the people in a line one-by-one what they work. And they basically just listed it, Phil had zero responses to any answers. Zero reactions from anybody. The point wasn’t to engage with the answers or the people. There was another case, when a girl talked about her shop. There wasn’t a single sentence which was organically connected to another. Phil and the girl had different agenda and they had to perform based on those, no matter what. And I was enough now there to say that that happens way more frequently than elsewhere. The next one was from Manila. And there were organic discussions again. I’ve never seen that clearly this phenomenon which bugs me. Of course, the usual scripting which happens with these shows, even helped to make this more announced. Probably, the people talking in that episode were way less interesting, but still as a visual to what annoys me is quite good.

Of course, I had good conversations also over there, and I had bad ones elsewhere in this sense. Heck, I did similar things before, but maybe this is the exact reason why I’m so sensitive to this, because it annoyed me greatly when I did it. But on average, it was the worse over the pond. Especially on the extremities. But even in day-to-day discussions. It was annoying that I have to peal down an additional layer with anybody to get real answers, which is not needed basically anywhere else.

1. e.g. lots of smiling, use of superlatives like "great"/"amazing" to describe mediocre items/effort/results

Execs are ‘super excited’ about everything. There is no dynamic range at all. They appear to have no opinions and no judgement because their opinion is always that everything is awesome. When the audience knows that stuff is either normal-level ok or actually fucked up, this message is insulting to receive.

Worse, it trains people downstream that shiny happy is the only valid comms. Hard to escalate a concern when you don’t know how to start the message with how super excited you are about it.

It drove me crazy during my corporate period.

If everything is at a “10” in linguistic intensity (“Incredible”, “Legendary”, “GOAT”) then nothing is exceptional.

It’s the linguistic equivalent of a Dorito chip.

I’m American and this marketing/corporate speak drives me up the wall. I have a harder time respecting the judgement of people who thoughtlessly speak this way.

At least to my British ears, Americans rarely sound authentic.

Its always grandiose statements and elaborate smiles.

See these old videos, where people talk in a straightforward way:

Car transmission https://youtu.be/JOLtS4VUcvQ

How to dial your phone https://youtu.be/PuYPOC-gCGA

The dial comes to town https://youtu.be/p45T7U5oi9Q

Now go watch that Apple video again and you’ll see what I’m talking about.

This is the type of people that sent us to the Moon. No non-sense engineers.

"I may be wrong", but perhaps 'Americans rarely sound authentic' to you simply because you're just more familiar with your own culture's idiosyncrasies?

Anyway, I love the Brits; no flame intended. I come in peace! :-)

"But, I've never done that. I'm pretty much always positive about things people present. I even said some of them weren't bad"

Yeah, high praise comes in subtle flavours if you're a Brit.

Americans generally say what they mean a bit more, so I think their mid point is just different.

Any native knows that "Interesting, but perhaps we should reconsider" means "You're an idiot and I don't understand how you ever learned to breathe."

The pinnacle is "Not bad", which can mean either deep approval or blistering contempt, depending on tone of voice.

It drives foreigners insane. But of course it's not our fault if they never learned English.

It’s like ‘American corporate’ is a totally different language that I don’t speak. The words sound the same, but that’s about it.

I think they mean well. But it feels weird.

Small talk is all lies. Almost all praise is fake. And it all drives me insane. I can fit in at work just fine, I can appear joyful and excited to come to work, I have 30 years of practice with it. But I avoid it whenever possible because it is all lies.

Americans appear to oversell everything because people get mad if you don’t.

“Why can’t you just be positive?!”

Because I’m not going to lie. I can’t fake praise, and I won’t even try. Being positive while lying is immediately obvious and it undermines the positive attitude that you’ve painted on. If anything, I take a negative message when I see someone faking a positive manner of speech.

But "almost all praise is fake" and "small talk is all lies" feels like a pretty depressing place to end up?

Why do you feel like that's the case? How do you differentiate sincere praise from "fake" praise?

No, not really. I just see it as a tool that normal people use to keep themselves happy. And that's not depressing, to me. It's kind of ... annoying that people are so fragile that they have to do that in order to have a "normal" day, but I can't fault anyone for doing things that make them happy. I wasn't given that opportunity; I was weird and if I didn't conform then I got in trouble. Yet normal people LOSE THEIR FLIPPING MINDS when asked to consider my behaviors normal and to consider my various physical movements as normal and tolerable. You have never seen such orchestrated and immediate pushback in your life, I promise. But I was forced to do what they refuse to do, which is to accommodate the other side. So, if anything, I'm angry about it all. Not depressed.

I don't need those platitudes to feel happy or normal, I need to be alone to feel happy, most of the time.

Praise given in private is usually legitimate. I value that. I feel that. Praise given in front of others (like ceremonies and ritual award reception stuff) are the fakest fake activity known to humanity. The ceremonies are for normal people. People like me can simply be privately told "well done" and given a piece of paper that they can look at, and maybe a raise, and that's enough. And maybe a mention during the ceremony that I will not be attending so that people know about it, if they're interested.

And to an outside ear, it does just come across as completely fake.

Jobs' "reality distortion field" was just the conviction in his voice as he spoke. There is no, none, nada, zero conviction in the way Apple deliver these missives. It reeks of corporate America and is therefore not trustworthy.

I'm also kind of surprised that no-one there has altered the format. There are a lot of smart people at Apple...

Even outside presentations, "awesome", "super-awesome", etc. were far more prevalent than one might expect within the reality I lived in, though.

Once in a while you get something like the M series chips, but the rest is reliably mid - functional, maybe a few nice tweaks, probably some better-than-average design, but nothing revolutionary.

So all of the "We know you're gonna love it!" doesn't land, because it's literally scripted and rehearsed, not spontaneous.

Jobs was rehearsed and passionate, which was part of the appeal.

It's debatable if Cook has ever been genuinely excited about anything.

But I can't recall him ever using a computer. I cannot, in my mind's eye, conjure an image of him sitting in front of a Mac and using it, whereas fuzzy black and white images of Jobs' messy-like-mine home office with a Power Mac G5 shaped external hard drive on his desk next to a 30" Cinema Display are trivial to remember. Like, when was the last time we saw him organically using any of the products the company sells?

Maybe it's just because he doesn't have the rizz, so I've just never seen the pictures, but he just feels like a dude who never goes into the Settings app and tweaks anything.

  > imitate Steve

This came across as part lip service, part cheeky “this should be the parent’s job, not the state”.

Even then it could have been 15% of the time with literally the same info.

If you didn’t notice it before, you’ll definitely notice it now.

I can understand how it might seem culty, but it's in the service of clear communication to a global audience. Anyone who represents a company to important customers and/or the public goes through similar media training.

The comment is about how everyone in their videos does it. The over-use of it is the issue, like when you say a word too much and your brain stops understanding what it means.

A few of the keynote people kinda forgot how to walk normally on camera. It happens to me.

I’ve been to a few official Apple Developer events. What I’ve noticed is that they all have the same presentation style, to the point that it feels almost cult-like.

What is Apple but Lumon with a less mysterious CEO and a rounder HQ?

Just watch a normal presentation like Mac OS X 10.2 or 10.3, it's not iPhone level earth shattering but he made it fun.

- Steve Jobs, Macworld 1997 (telling photographers to stop hitting him with a camera flash every half second)

If my ship ever really comes in and docks at the harbor I’m going to remember to keep my wallet full of cash, so I can stop and get that strawberry ice cream cone without worrying about the long term consequences, which are all I would have left.

Sure, but I think it’s also b/c the target audience for these keynotes has shifted. Given their immense market cap, now there’s an increased fiduciary responsibility to control how presentation lands, such as earnings reports, which comes at the expense of the fun.

Would be a welcome change it if the incoming CEO went back to live on stage imho

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcjLEwZqcQI

According to what I was told by some FANNG people (I've never worked for them myself) some employees were/are were sent to public speaking classes after being hired specifically to teach socially awkward programmers how to talk on stage, and this is what they teach them, weird hand movements and all.

But then, I'm a fan of Apple, overall, and I like most of what they do.

For example the part about cameras, where they seem to advertise them not as security products but as a lifestyle aid.

The rehearsed marketing is so strong that it comes across in a very perverse way.

Apple is as much an aspirational lifestyle company as they are anything else. That's been their marketing aim for quite a while. It's less about the tech and more of a message of "This is the person/lifestyle you can be if you buy our products"

Ok, maybe it’s not that interesting on reflection, and how are they even supposed to advertise it, with burglars?

The bits that are fine: removing distractions from photos, extensions to the edges, fixing color/exposure etc.

  that second dose of soma had raised a quite impenetrable wall between the actual universe and their minds.
  - Brave New World, Aldous Huxley

In the past Apple has been pretty good at anticipating and responding to shifting cultural dynamics. I wonder if they'll recognize and adjust?

The siloed utopian landscape is the point. Apple tries to sell a modern, clean lifestyle status symbol. They are selling products for the person you hope you become, not the person you are right now. "Buy an iPhone, and this is what your life could look like."

Same deal as fad diets and gym memberships, its the illusion of being able to buy your way into a lifestyle without doing the hard work. Apple is selling an identity.

Apple has often in the past positioned itself as an aspirational product for those who aim to be tasteful, talented, beautiful and wealthy.

The risk of becoming too disconnected from reality is that the typical person may stop aspiring to the sort of rich-person reality Apple presents. Think of how many of the symbols of wealth of prior generations, like fine tableware, were rejected by younger generations.

Many of us don't want to watch people fumble with presentation problems. We don't want the lead in, setup, filler banter, so on.

I'll take this sort of "you spend your time perfecting your presentation instead of wasting thousands/millions of people's time doing it live"

Like the root post whining that it's too polished. Christ. Get a grip and go touch grass if this is the sort of pathetic nonsense someone actually takes the time to whine about.

It's actually funny how every single presentation like this always gets topped by profoundly boring people complaining about some aspect of the presentation: The people aren't standing right or moving the way you want. OMG look at his jacket. That joke wasn't funny. Etc. Christ.

Yes, most people just want the information, not some sort of organic, "all-natural" presentation.

I didn't feign to comment about presentation style until someone's complaint sat atop the entire thread. As always it gets sidetracked into meta and arrogantly held personal preferences. Could it be HN otherwise?

So I say I like it and why. To, in again classic HN style, to be met by someone declaring that no, nobody on the entire planet likes it.

Upset? LOL, no, I guarantee you nothing on this shakes fists at clouds site upsets me. Humours me? Sure.

A presentation is a live audio visual medium. If you just want the information as facts with no affect why not read the stats later?

I enjoy the presenters and the enthusiasm and nuance that they bring to the presentation. I do not need to see someone figure out how to switch a display or change a slide or fumble with wireless that is overwhelmed in a hall with a thousand wireless devices or... All of that is utterly unnecessary, so pre-recording it, doing all of the post production, reshooting so you don't trip people up on misreads / mispronunciations / fumbles / technical issues, etc, gets the human + the information without the ancillary bullshit.

It's actually funny because I don't stream Google or nvidia presentations for this same reason (I just wait for engadget or someone to just give the bullet list recap), and I suspect many/most of the people whining and gnashing about this one being "too produced" don't either. Somehow it always ends up being 80% in the weeds nonsense.

Now they completely control the narrative.

But I have only rarely heard anyone who liking the new-style presentations. It all seems fake with the same woolly business talk (everything is an 'experience' now, 'app experiences', etc.).

I certainly long back for the days where anything could happen, Jobs would work to convince the audience and Bertrand Serlet would come on and troll Microsoft.

Currently streaming the presentation, but it has mostly gone to the background as it's so insanely boring.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubm2dYzoDW8

I feel like I'm about to tell you there is no Santa or something, but did you really not know that Apple always stuffed audiences with Apple employees? Of the remainder it both through intentional and natural selection leaned towards sycophants. Did you really think the roaring response were organic feedback?

It was always controlled. Personally I'm happy to be done with the on-cue tumultuous cheering and whooping.

>But I have only rarely heard anyone who liking the new-style presentations

Well I have only rarely heard anyone who liked the slow, plodding old-style presentation. So...

But yes, HN is overwhelming filled with angry, shakes-fist-at-clouds "it ain't like the olden days!" sorts now. So if you really think this place represents the norm...

While I agree with you, I think even the controlled audience mattered.

The audience, even if they were largely Apple employees + journalists, did not know what was gonna be revealed. And there weren’t literal cue cards.

So you would never see the audience boo, but there were several situations where the Apple presenters expected cheering but got polite clapping instead, or cheering which was very evidently just the sycophantic employees (or the team that worked on something).

When something was truly exciting, the cheering reflected that in a way it didn’t when the announcement wasn’t.

Two very different examples of this were the Snow Leopard reveal, where the excitement could be felt throughout the presentation, culminating with the $29 price, and the iPhone reveal with the 3 devices in 1 gimmick.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeqPrUmVz-o

(Aside from clearly not an Apple employee, Jobs' way of taking the question is brilliant. Yes I know this was probably not the keynote, but it's a big, risky, filmed WWDC event.)

But yes, HN is overwhelming filled with angry, shakes-fist-at-clouds "it ain't like the olden days!" sorts now. So if you really think this place represents the norm...

Yes, let's resort to personal attacks. There are a lot of things that are better now. Apple Keynotes are not one of them.

If that's your evidence to rebut me, lol.

>Yes, let's resort to personal attacks

You took that as a personal attack? That is incredibly weird. It was a general observation about the sort of perspectives that top HN, but not in the general world, or even general technology. You don't have to believe it.

Like seriously, currently the top post to a discussion about Apple unveiling an array of software improvements is some guy whining and bitching about the presentation, whining that it isn't like the olden days.

Wait...they still don't do that?

Every one of the dozen or so speaker changes during that presentation involved a snippet of some jaunty bland corpo-pop song and some swoopy animation. Filler banter? They had a flying fucking VW Bus!

I'll take some sweaty nerd walking out on stage to applause and tripping on their shoelaces over that every day (except the Bus bit that was actually pretty well made)

I think Apple can't find their voice since Steve Jobs passed/stopped doing the presentations. Thats why it feels inauthentic. I imagine its also hard to really feel "best (iphone|ipad|macos|etc) yet" when they are debuting features that existed elsewhere for a while. Its just a massive disconnect from anyone but fans. The same could be said for innovative features, whats left to innovate on smart phones?

In some ways both things are like having to be the person coming on after an amazing presentation or comic or musical act. How do you follow it?

Hate him or love him; he knew that was the single largest stage for Apple and put the effort into each one. The keynotes today are like Apple overall, a fantastic organization that is starting to drift toward.. fake.

Funny to hear that after they mentioned how seriously they are taking privacy every 37 seconds.

   Under EU regulators’ extreme interpretation of the DMA, Apple would have to give any virtual assistant direct access to users’ private data — and the ability to directly control other installed applications — as soon as Siri AI is made available in the EU, without the essential protections necessary to keep users and their data safe.

App developers can already access the on-device foundational models through an API, but I don't think many developers want to do that because there are better models.

We have all kinds of data access controls, these could probably also be built around Siri and competitors.

Is that accurate?

This kind of thing overlaps with the anti-competitive practices driven by Apple's MBAs (like the whole thing with Epic), but it's a genuine concern and one their engineering people think about a lot.

If Facebook's Meta-Siri is being sketchy, that's a problem with Meta-Siri. Take it off the market, bring down the law. Promote competition, and bad actors must be made to loose. Can we not just status-quo fallacy that re dysfunctional consumer protections? or at maybe agree that the perfect-world scope is one that puts exfiltrators in jail, not just rejected from the app store.

Instead we'll just have Siri AI and Google Assistant AI, and no decent competition. I guess maybe we'll get a Meta phone, if the only way to compete is on the entire mobile computing vertical.

I know there are alternative phones that are more open, and I recognize that the level of ease and comfort I get from a big name phone requires some of those trade-offs. Linux was my desktop of choice and probably would be again if my employer allowed it, but I don’t necessarily want to deal with all the tiny sharp edges of Linux on a mobile device.

Once it leaves the device Apple does not know what those other ai chat apps will do with the gathered data.

> Siri AI is private by design and deeply integrated across Apple’s platforms using on-device processing and Private Cloud Compute, which extends the privacy and security of iPhone into the cloud. However, under EU regulators’ extreme interpretation of the DMA, Apple would have to give any virtual assistant direct access to users’ private data — and the ability to directly control other installed applications — as soon as Siri AI is made available in the EU, without the essential protections necessary to keep users and their data safe.

"We can't bring Time Machine to Europe, because we would have to allow other backup solutions, and that would mean other backups would have unrestricted access to your data"

Maybe there's more to it, but I'm not giving Apple the benefit of the doubt after their hostile strategy regarding third-party app stores.

As far as the backup software, the analogy doesn’t hold for me: there’s an expectation that it will have access to your hard disk. There’s also an expectation that you can disconnect your internet and still back up your hard disk - can’t exfiltrate data if you’re offline.

[1] https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2026/06/due-to-dma-siri-ai-de...

The "privacy" angle here is that Apple wants to give Siri access to user data across the system, without offering any way for competitors to get at that data.

[1] https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2026/06/due-to-dma-siri-ai-de...

This is due to EU's wider tech regulation "DMA"

And, in fact, it's due to DMA's mandate leaning _against_ privacy:

> under EU regulators’ extreme interpretation of the DMA, Apple would have to give any virtual assistant direct access to users’ private data — and the ability to directly control other installed applications — as soon as Siri AI is made available in the EU, without the essential protections necessary to keep users and their data safe.

https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2026/06/due-to-dma-siri-ai-de...

How can Apple guarantee privacy then?

I just hope the AI Apple use is smart enough for the task. And that giving the AI information it needs is easy (such as a snippet of the health data so it knows what it's working with).

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/256141236

Ugh so newer phones have this too? (15 pro max). Another reason to not upgrade.

It's still an extremely ugly, "worst of both worlds" combination of wasted space (from early-gen flat design) with gaudy effects (from late-gen skeumorphism), but at least now it is usable.

I'd never update to macOS 26, but 27 I might, begrudgingly.

Turns out they didn't actually believe that, they only said it because they were behind on GenAI. They caved to investor demand, no longer stand for any principles (if they ever had any in the first place)

Sometimes you just have to give customers what they claim to want instead of fighting them every step of the way.

I also laughed out loud when they are showing the "cleanup" tool and they guy is talking about removing "distractions" and then removes 2 of the 3 girls juggling and having fun.

Ah yes, those friends you were forming core memories with, or as our tech overlords call them, distractions.

It’s a bullying tactic, i shiver to think how some people will make happy memories out of things that aren’t.

[0] https://www.youtube.com/live/hF8swzNR1-o?t=3800s

so what is being captured is altered from the get.

yet i don't think you'd argue that the act of taking a photo is the same as photoshopping a giant giraffe into a photo :P

i don't think arguing that taking a photo which is cropped/enhanced (as in sharpening, color correction, ...) is akin to changing what's displayed in it.

those distortions only serve to let us better focus on what truly happened in a moment, not change the moment in essence.

I mean... that's your opinion, not a fact :)

I kinda agree, yet I will make small edits to my pictures to make them more like I felt than how it looked. Maybe in a happy moment the sky was more blue to me than it actually was and I want my picture to reflect it. Maybe I was happier and less tired than the picture remembers it and I want to fix it.

If some people want to AI process their pictures to make them match their memories better, or even to shape better memories, who are we to judge?

I’m just talking about iOS though. Haven’t updated to Liquid (Gl)ass on macOS yet.

Still the best OS around, but it looks like it was made by idiots.

At least macOS has configurability to turn off all the transparency. iOS just looks bad no matter how you configure it right now.

It’s also more palatable on iOS because you only have one window open at a time. Many of the complaints around Liquid Glass on macOS are focused on window management and issues that only occur with multiple windows on screen simultaneously.

But Liquid Glass on iOS has been one of my favorite updates. I like the look and feel of it. They made some tangentially related changes that go too far.

The best OS is probably something between Ubuntu and macOS. But nothing beats macOS on default, works out of the box, secure and usable and integrated with ecosystems of daily life.

I say this as someone who uses and has owned too many Macs, but can just never make them my primary machine. I promise, I've spent the last 30 years trying to make them my main.

- accessibility (hopefully improved soon)

- floating buttons over content that doesnt need to scroll

- switching light/dark when scrolling over content with borderline brightness

It looks hard to use ...

Also the 'floating semi-window but not a window' thing when using contextual siri in the context of some other app ... sure looks like it won't work with cmd-tab navigation ... I really hope is not the case ...

You're up to something, maybe they really have a broken pseudo-window with basic UI interaction hacked on top.

Which means, if shipped like this, the Siri dialog will be a poor excuse for a window with:

- no Cmd+Tab, no Cmd+`

- no minimize??

- generally no presence in the Dock whatsoever

- no keyboard shortcuts beyond basic text editing ones

- no smart window resize

- …

So in other words, no Justin, that’s not a window. That’s a resizable Spotlight pop-up with an “X” button.

Sigh, I wish we could stop re-inventing what was already solved 25 years ago.

Will it be available to developers in the EU though?

Even if they were functional you still would want to use a router-level VPN because you couldn't install a VPN before your device connected to the internet.

If you're wondering what I mean by "anti-trust violating", it has to do with Apple's "security" policies. Every feature Apple ships has to support third-party implementations now, so if Apple doesn't want a third-party app with the same access as the first-party version, they can't ship the feature at all. For example, if Apple ships Siri AI in the EU, then Facebook can ship their own AI that you can grant access to all the same data and Apple can't stop them from stealing it aside from saying "We don't think you should install Facebook's data theft app".

Of course, most of Facebook's data theft is also illegal in the EU. But, to Apple's (undeserved) defense, GDPR enforcement in the EU has also been hit and miss, mainly because the political layer of the EU is not yet interested in a fully mobilized trade war with the United States. So instead we have this annoying half-measure where Apple waters down their feature set to do below minimum EU antitrust compliance, Facebook does the below-minimum amount of GDPR compliance, the EU gets the political win of appearing to care about antitrust and data harvesting, and nothing materially changes.

Interestingly enough, however, they are shipping Siri AI on macOS, where you absolutely could write your own AI assistant, as well as visionOS and watchOS, which... well, actually, I'm not sure how the EU signed off on that one? Are they just not considered smartwatch or VR headset gatekeepers?

ChatGPT alone is among the most popular apps ever made, and it's available both inside and outside Apple's walled garden. Letting it reach audience in countries where Apple doesn't have much of a foothold.

I do wonder if new Siri is any good though. Apple used to be a genuine AI leader, but they totally sleepwalked through LLM revolution, and Siri's response quality was a sad joke for a while now. Did they bring it up to modern standard?

I don't think so, i don't think they want to be in the LLM laboratory business. They just want to leverage the technology to make money not invent it. Hence the reason why they made a deal with Google to license Gemini, let OpenAI and Anthropic fight it out while Apple just keeps making sales. I think they're betting that in the long run LLMs become a commodity more or less and the major labs go bankrupt/get acquired by their heavy duty investors. I feel like Athropic will goto Amazon (AWS) and OpenAI may end up property of Microsoft. Google will remain Google of course so they're not going anywhere which is probaly why they won the deal with Apple.

I'm pretty confident it's Gemini behind the curtain for Siri.

They just completely failed at capturing the modern chatbot wave.

They tried to catch up multiple times and, ultimately, gave up on doing it in house. Not because they didn't try, but because they tried and found themselves lacking.

Voice-only input to a cloud model with just a screen to show you what it's doing sounds like a nightmare. Why not subscribe for the TV hardware as well as the subscription, take it up a notch on the own-nothing.

My wife is part of the other 99% and she's already talking to a chat prompt for 90% of her computing needs. The fancy laptop we bought her a year ago sits collecting dust. She is Apple's target market - not the nerds that get a boner about "self-hosting".

I mean, they said it was.

Talking to my HomeKit, turning on and off lights, sometimes, other times, "I don't know what lights you are talking about", "I can't find those lights" even though they're visible and reachable and controllable about the app.

"Do X" "Okay", "Do [very very similar synonym for X]" "I don't know what you're talking about."

CarPlay and Siri, unless you make sure permissions match, with CarPlay giving you navigation, press the Speech button, "Find me the nearest Starbucks." "I'm sorry, I don't know where you are".

It has nothing to do with "not being in the LLM laboratory business". I get, and agree with that. But Siri has been around for 14 years at this point and is barely more than a simple voice control for alarm clocks and timers and "play music", at this point.

Now it remains to be seen if Siri AI will deliver anything close to a ChatGPT-like experience. But if they did, for the consumer segment that isn't using LLMs for agentic work and just ask it questions from time to time, I can't imagine one textarea has engendered some huge amount of brand loyalty over another.

when?

There was a real push from Apple at the time to enter the AI game - mainly for image processing purposes, which was the mainstream flavor of AI at the time.

Which either terminates the session, or goads the user into asking a follow-up question, improving retention - the user doesn't leave the app either way.

I don't even know if this is physically possible. iOS has something like 1.5B users, but ChatGPT reportedly crossed the 1B MAU line in May: https://www.reuters.com/technology/chatgpt-app-hits-1-billio...

By the time Apple ships Apple Intelligence, ChatGPT might have a larger install base than iOS.

If I can _actually_ replace my monitors with a headset, I’m in.

Vision Pro could do it but was way too heavy to use 8 hours a day

I hope apple actually considers the usecase of using the glasses instead of 1 or more monitors with more priority.

It would be a PR disaster, most people outside the SV bubble just find smart glasses what they really are: creepy.

Even more so because Meta is going to roll out face recognition and going to live-annotate people you encounter in the streets. Luckily that shit is not allowed in the EU.

- A lot of people found smart watches to be nerdy, something that only geeks would wear, until Apple made the Apple Watch. Along the same lines, everyone (on tech-oriented social media) thought the AirPods looked stupid and dorky when they were first announced, but now they're ubiquitous.

- People find smart glasses from Meta (and previously, Google) creepy, but – and it's anathema to say this around certain parts of HN – like it or not, people do generally trust Apple with their data in a way that they don't with those other companies.

- It seems like you're assuming Apple's glasses would include outward-facing cameras in the first place. Do we know that? The ideal device for me would just include the downward-facing IR cameras for gesture detection. Presumably only people under NDA can say for sure right now.

> Luckily that shit is not allowed in the EU.

What's not allowed? Facial recognition, street annotation, AI? Does it make a difference if it's local, on-device AI?

Further, it's still not obvious to me that an Apple glasses product would be a surveillance camera in the first place.

99% of "apps" for it were confused garbage, totally misunderstanding what it's for or how to use it.

The percentage of apps that "get it" is rising. Not sure if the disillusioned left, or if more are figuring it out.

Either way, when Apple releases something consumer facing, or for consumers' faces, this means there's a prayer of being more than a deluge of Oculus content.

Or at least I'd like to imagine that's what they're doing. :-)

Apparently there's a new fancy slider for making it more (but not completely) opaque? Did I miss an option for turning it off?

The iOS 7 flat redesign was a UX disaster. But they got back up to speed in subsequent releases.

There IS something to be said for design resets with follow-up refits to accomodate for actual human beings. Most companies just add crap on top of crap.

Not saying what everything Apple does is perfect, even as a user/fanboy since '86.

What I most enjoyed about todays's annoucement that they're doing a Snow Leopard performance/bug reset, because that was expected and needed. And they started out with it, so they know their WWDC audience.

So: Both a technical and UX debt effort, with some privacy-focused AI on top.

I can't complain.

Unless I can continue to neuter AI, and keep the older siri this is my last iOS.

Also for the ability to continue using Siri without Apple Intelligence would be nice. I rarely need to use Siri so it's already set for manual triggering with the power button long press only. But if Siri goes into the AI shitter then I'll just wholesale disable it.

Dumbphones exist, degoogled phones exist. If it weren't for the USA's telcom differences a fairphone with PostmarketOS would be great. I enjoy postmarketOS on my pinephone, the phone's hardware is just far too shit for daily driving.

I already have Siri limited to manual activation only. If they force all of this into Siri and I can't prevent AI models from actually installing their gubby hands all over the phone then that's it for me.

>no way to adjust what data gets cached or when it gets purged aside from rebooting

Unfortunately the only current ways to pull this off is to either artificially move the current time years forward so it hits a time gate and dumps the cached files, or use enough space on your iPhone to force it to dump the useless cached files then delete whatever you used to take up space temporarily.

Extending applications without having to launch a full agentic IDE. Macos is already very well equipped with GUI automation tools.

The 9 isn't even 3 years old yet until September, absolutely garbage support timeline for a wearable. I have a Series 9, and it's still essentially like new.

This might be the list for Siri AI supported watches or something.

iPads aren't free from this either but it's a little less severe [2]. For example, iPad Air 4th gen will be the minimum iPad Air and it was released in 2020. The M1 iPad Pro was released in 2021 and will be the minimum there.

[1]: https://www.macrumors.com/2026/06/08/watchos-27-drops-suppor...

j2]: https://www.macrumors.com/2026/06/08/ipados-27-drops-support...

[1]: https://www.macrumors.com/2026/06/08/apple-watch-series-9-mi...

On macOS, I also disable spotlight for everything because the indexing process has been the single biggest culprit of CPU spikes when it’s doing something insane like indexing a git repo. Again, I only use Spotlight as an app launcher.

I wish it were easier to opt into this “App Launcher only” mode. I had to really tinker with the settings to exclude everything except applications. And I’m sure I’m going to need to do it all over again after this update.

> iOS 27 coming this fall.

> Siri Al coming in English later this year.

So they're already admitting it won't be here in time for iOS 27.

I have an iPhone 16 that was promised to have it. Now they are saying some features are available only on 17+ models

Do they allow you to opt out of data collection to improve their models for Siri? What about allow users to choose on-device only processing?

If not, they are only speaking to the converted when they have Craig drill home their supposed privacy guarantees.

For them to just blanket announce that a bunch of stuff across the platforms perform better, that shows that Apple spent most of their effort on quality over shipping features. It’s also possible they’re preparing for less availability of RAM long term and trying to optimize.

The list of stuff they had go highlighted includes a whole bunch of small but impactful little tweaks.

iCloud shared libraries being easier to use outside of Apple operating systems, that’s great. And adding full resolution support, also great. I’ve left iCloud Photos and macOS for myself but I’m stuck on iCloud shared photos with family albums, so making it easier for me to participate is a big plus.

Custom EQ in AirPods. Awesome.

Smoother network transitions between WiFi and cellular. Huge positive impact.

Send indicator in messages, yes please.

The parental controls are industry-leading.

The AI features are the most boring and uninteresting to me, but the little stuff is all big news to me.

They've been awful for me. This is best-in-class software? It breaks constantly. It fails to notify me of all kinds of events that should work, but spontaneously fail to. This could be someone entering the parental control pin or requesting to download an app. It's misery to deal with.

I've used it for years across several devices and kids. It's some of the worst software I ever need to use.

Of course, now that I think about it, it’s a bit of a silly statement for me to say “industry leading” in the context of a duopoly.

That said, the foundational models they talk about running on it - is that something they've trained themselves? I know they had some sort of deal with Google; could it be Gemini weights loaded into their private compute or something?

I would be more excited if they said “AI? Yeah, we decided we aren’t interested in doing it anymore.”

https://www.macrumors.com/2026/06/08/wwdc-2026-live-coverage...

Try Wired’s https://www.wired.com/live/apple-wwdc-2026-live-blog-all-the...

At least a summary of what was missed.

there’s also a YouTube live stream that lets you go back

What is the non-browser workaround? E.g., can streamlink do it?

No new hardware, feels like the party is over. Thanks Altman for the greed.

Say the ChatGPT app would provide the functionality to the system and I'd allow a scary popup saying "these guys will own you, sure?".. I guess they are going all in into Gemini instead.

But I don't want Gemini..

Let's hope they don't get overconfident with Gemini and pull a MS Copilot..

I get this vibe too. Turning Siri into yet another chatbot is a far cry from the vaporware they showed at 2024's WWDC. Seems they found out LLMs can't actually do that, but investors aren't just going to let them ignore it unfortunately.

Feels like they are just phoning it in here and waiting on AI hype bubble to burst. "Here's your stupid chatbot, now shut up"

Cook is an enabler.

I can't help but think for most folks out there these features make using Apple products considerably more powerful and easy. They may be "boomer" features and you won't be able to roll them into your MCP server, but IMO it doesn't take a huge perspective leap to understand how they're game changers.

I dont like siri ai access everything on my devices. mails, photos, screen, camera, my credit card and passwords...

I appreciate making it available to everyone but it feels like there needs to be some kind of middle ground. IOS development just isn't as much fun absent the in-person community.

This is bad and mostly will result in two outcomes: a more systematic domestication to groom the child into accepting such surveillance from a higher authority, so later in life they are more susceptible to be monitored by employers or even the government, just like how schools domesticate people to be a cog in the machine later in life. The other outcome, is a complete radical shift where that kid goes on doing anything and everything as soon as they are in their own.

I have an older iPhone that can't run any of this new stuff, and I'm not upgrading because I have no reason to. I think I actually prefer at this point to be on an older phone that won't get all of this.

When is technology going to get exciting and fun again?

(that's not 100% true, I was excited to hear they were walking back liquid glass.)

- fixing the main liquid glass issues (transparency, toolbars, window corners)

- rewriting OS components to work better

- fixing the ever annoying "The compiler is unable to type-check this expression in reasonable time" problem (we knew this was going to happen by following the Swift project, but still)

Honestly, we really really needed a year with less features and more work put towards improving the platforms.

There used to be more information on WWDC and the State of Union. But with every year past they have deleted it to consumer level marketing speak.