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Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by largbae on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @07:40PM (#50448368)
Isn't this basically a GPU?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by ranger_danger on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @07:44PM (#50448398)
Yep, and they're probably simulating/emulating their CPU design on GPUs already.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by skavi on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @07:57PM (#50448483)
> This requires moving beyond the notion of shared mutable memory and linear instruction sequences.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by RachelF on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:54PM (#50448913)
Sure looks like it.

But they are ignoring the basic lesson of "new" CPU designs from Transputer to i432 to Itanium to Transmeta.

A new CPU design is easy, it is the compiler to use it that is the hard hard part.

Looked at another way, CUDA is a huge reason NVidia is so big right now. Their GPUs are broadly similar to AMD. Their software libraries are better.

But good luck to them, perhaps they have some great new idea. We need one.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by mixedCase on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:38PM (#50449161)
> it is the compiler to use it that is the hard hard part

We're in a wildly different world from the one Itanium got to live in and compilers are something with a super tight automated verification loop that can make LLMs thrive. Add that plus cheap formal verification and I think this concern goes away almost completely.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nl on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:56PM (#50449269)
> CUDA is a huge reason NVidia is so big right now. Their GPUs are broadly similar to AMD. Their software libraries are better.

This was pre-2026 story. CUDA isn't a moat anymore.

Now it's mostly market dynamics: People always ship ad optimize things for Nvidia because it's the most widely used platform, and people buy it because it has the most software.

This is much less of a barrier than it used to be though. Buggy AMD GPU drivers remain a problem though.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jcranmer on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:49PM (#50449225)
Not necessarily, there are other kinds of accelerator designs like dataflow architectures or systolic arrays.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by teknopath on Thursday November 12, 2026 @09:03AM (#50467257)
technically no : a GPU is basically multiple core running the very same program, with the only distinction being caused by a distinct identifier per core.

here they can do multiple programs

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nonesuchthing on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @07:53PM (#50448459)
Have you seen the new CPU architecture? It's on Mill. It's literally on Transputer. It's on Rock with Sun. It's literally on AMULET. You can probably find it on Itanium. Dude it's on Tesla. It's a CDC STAR original. It's on E1. You can program it on E1. You can go to E1 and program it. Get onto E1 right now. Go to E1. Dive into E1. You can E1 it. It's on E1. E1 has it for you. E1 has it for you.

In all seriousness congratulations on finding $30 million to launder and lose immediately. Hope your Porsche runs good.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by leetrout on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:13PM (#50449031)
Really would like to understand how the mill got going and how anyone can see it progressing at this point. I know folks are working on it on the side but it's just bleh now.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by orliesaurus on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:31PM (#50449765)
$30M to either do nothing at all, or change the world.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nonesuchthing on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @08:12PM (#50461644)
I wish them success, if only to keep everyone on their toes (the biggest change the MPU industry has seen in the last ten years is switching to the _slightly_ less bloated aarch64), but if I have to sit through the 10s animation on their homepage ever again I'm throwing my phone at the wall. Give me a whitepaper.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Onavo on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @07:54PM (#50448469)
Bet you they will turn into yet another ML accelerator company within the year.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by MiroslavPokorny on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:09PM (#50448583)
I always wonder where will x86 be in 10 or 20 years time. As data paths widen for SIMD, how many can they possibly cram even more generations of wider and wider groups of instruction with different opcodes and characteristics.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by throwaway2037 on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:43PM (#50448833)
Do you remember the 1990s everlasting arguments about RISC vs CISC? There were so many arguments (online and magazines) saying that "soon" RISC would eat CISC. And yet, it never happened. I'll be dead before the demise of x86. More likely: The computing landscape will get more complex. Probably ARM will become a legitimate competitor to x86 outside of handheld computing, and RISC V will become a legitimate competitor to ARM for single board and handheld computing.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nl on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:51PM (#50449246)
> Probably ARM will become a legitimate competitor to x86 outside of handheld computing

Err..

Are Apple Silicon and Nvidia Vera and Amazon Graviton are considered illegitimate or non-competitors for some reason?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by throwaway2037 on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:05AM (#50450182)
You are right! I didn't think about about Mac desktops. I was thinking that ARM is a second class citizen for Linux and Win32. X86 is still king there, but that will slowly change.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nl on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:58PM (#50460838)
> ARM is a second class citizen for Linux and Win32.

Nvidia Vera and Amazon Graviton are both primarily Linux platforms.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Narishma on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @10:46PM (#50449547)
I mean it did kinda happen. x86 is pretty much the only surviving CISC. Everything else that has come since 80s or 90s has been RISC.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by fooker on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:31PM (#50449764)
arm is very much a cisc, arm iphones have instructions that correspond to speeding up JavaScript hot paths (FJCVTZS)

Also some GPU instructions are several times more complex than the most complex cisc instruction from the 90s.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by 3reeDots on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:00AM (#50450162)
I think you are confusing CISC with specialized instructions. We just ask 3 questions to decide if something is CISC or RISC. 1. Are the instructions 32 bit wide? 2. Can the instruction only operate on registers? 3. Does it use microcoded, multi-cycle state machines for basic instructions?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jcranmer on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:41AM (#50450364)
That's not the usual way to discuss CISC or RISC (and ARM fails two of the three questions anyways).

To be honest, CISC versus RISC has not been a useful distinction in architecture design for 30 years. Intel managing to make a superscalar CISC processor, the Pentium, should have put to bed any idea that there's a fundamental distinction between CISC and RISC that is useful.

The reality is that RISC isn't a single idea so much as it is a collection of ideas for how to design a microprocessor, and some of those ideas have turned out to be good and some of them have turned out to be bad. Rather than evaluating on the merits of RISC or CISC, we should evaluate on the merits of the embodied ideas. Let's stop trying to view 2020s design decisions based on 1970s models, okay?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by imtringued on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @08:43AM (#50453327)
I still don't really get why people are obsessed over RISC as an antagonist of CISC.

It's not like CISC or RISC are architectures like Transformers or Mamba. They're design philosophies with a huge amount of overlap and leeway.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by BadApple2026 on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:35PM (#50449793)
for starters... drop ballast

Subject: x86 evolution for segmentation and paging

https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/CAKSQd8WX6xH7=njcGZNNFe8m1xbyhC... https://sourceware.org/pipermail/binutils/2026-September/151...

no-can-do the legacy-at-any-cost cargo cult crowd will say, of course

but... someone did apparently build it at scale already... so... who knows, eh?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by exmadscientist on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:12PM (#50448603)
TL;DR: it's basically Niagara/GreenArrays/etc again.

Not sure why this one will succeed where its forebears didn't.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by wang_li on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:14PM (#50449684)
They already got the UK government to give them some taxpayer money. Successful accomplished now it’s just mai tais on the beach.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by astrodust on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:27PM (#50448727)
Was about time we had another Transmeta.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by throwaway2037 on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:31PM (#50448755)
How will this be better than RISC V?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by gnabgib on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:33PM (#50448777)
Who do you expect to answer? It's a tiny future product announcement, it neither exists, nor is it a Show HN from someone involved
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by fusslo on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:37PM (#50448803)
a man can dream
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by tonymet on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:38PM (#50448810)
let's re-do the OS too. we only need about 10 syscalls. authorization is totally backwards (look how android runs a user per process).
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by bix6 on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:47PM (#50448867)
> Sources say that the company is already discussing a fast follow-up raise that would potentially value the firm at more than $1 billion. Neither round has previously been reported. Benchmark declined to comment.

https://www.newcomer.co/p/scoop-benchmark-backs-early-stage

VC is such a meme lmao. What’s next, Sam gonna acquire the company? No product needed!

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by cmd123 on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:10PM (#50449661)
According to article, his brother Jack is now on the board, and a general partner of Benchmark.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by bix6 on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:53PM (#50459209)
Hence my joke.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by shrubble on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:51PM (#50448892)
From the URL:

"Instead of starting from a sequential design, we’re building our processor to have thousands of cores operating in parallel. This requires moving beyond the notion of shared mutable memory and linear instruction sequences. To make this possible, we’re working in tandem on the open-source language Vine, which has been designed from the beginning to target a new wave of parallel-first architectures."

I wish them well but from their Vine language docs:

"For example, a < b < c is equivalent to (a < b) & (b < c)"

So how do you parallelize that? You can run the first part on 2 cores in parallel, but there is still a single check, a single cache, a single CPU for this to go through to complete the operation, right?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by DiabloD3 on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:12PM (#50449021)
I think thats a poor example (either that, or less charitably, they're scamming investors).

They just described a common superscalar optimization thats been done since the 90s.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by zamadatix on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @10:18PM (#50449387)
It took me a second to find you were referencing section 2.8 https://vine.dev/docs/features/conditions

With that context, this page is explaining `and` short circuits and `&` does not. The `a < b < c is equivalent to (a < b) & (b < c)` is just showing how that logically works, not how to utilize it to parallelize that particular comparison.

This exists to allow you to control whether parallel computation should happen or if it should resolve the first condition before wasting parallel compute to resolve the nth condition(s). E.g. imagine something like `isEven(x) & len(factor(x) > 2` vs `isEven(x) and len(factor(x) > 2`.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by zamadatix on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @09:25AM (#50453811)
Woke up this morning to the thought "last night I stated it backwards". I.e. the `a < b` and `a >= b` should be swapped.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by teknopath on Thursday November 12, 2026 @09:10AM (#50467396)
> So how do you parallelize that?

It depends on the scale of the computation. An Out Of Order CPU can allready exploit some parallelism at the instruction level. Multicore is parallelism at the procedure level.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by molticrystal on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @08:56PM (#50448924)
>Instead of starting from a sequential design, we’re building our processor to have thousands of cores operating in parallel.

Sounds like tweaking a gpu so it can be used like a cpu. There are some proof of concepts running unix on a gpu, along with some toy projects like gameboy emulators. I think an Nvidia engineer even tried to see if they could get linux working which helps explore what is deficient. And there is this https://github.com/robertcprice/nCPU .

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by 0xKapi on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:12PM (#50449022)
I'm quite interested to see how this evolves. But part of me is still being sad, because hardware is rarely the bottleneck these days - as opposed to software.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by tyingq on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:15PM (#50449037)
Hmm. The story over at https://millcomputing.com/ always looked compelling.

Pitchbook shows it as "Out of Business" since 2019.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jiggawatts on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @10:08PM (#50449334)
They spent way too long procrastinating, with zero silicon after decades of work.

For comparison, RISC-V started years later and had a tapeout within a year and working silicon available as a commercial product in seven years.

2003: Mill computing started

2010: RISC-V project started

2011: RISC-V first tapeout

2017: RISC-V production chips available in the market

2019: Mill computing dead?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by fhn on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:05AM (#50449930)
Yeah, but RISC-V came out of RISC-1,2,3,4; it didn't magically appear our of nowhere. "RISC-V was developed in 2010 at the University of California, Berkeley as the fifth generation of RISC processors created at the university since 1981".
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Philpax on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:44AM (#50450082)
Also, RISC-V is not particularly innovative or groundbreaking. It's a standard Von Neumann CPU optimised for simplicity and modularity.

The Mill was (is?) a much bigger swing, with much bigger problems to solve in getting to production.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by kragen on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:29AM (#50450311)
RISC-V intentionally contained almost no innovation of any kind. The whole point was to have the most boring, standard RISC design imaginable, without anything clever in it. That's what you want for introducing students to their first RISC architecture, and also as a basis for doing computer architecture or CPU fabrication research: on zero-overhead loops, compressed instruction sets, scalable vector instruction sets, IoT machine learning, indium gallium zinc oxide thin-film transistors printed on kapton, zero-knowledge virtual machines, or whatever.

They specifically wanted to avoid the kinds of "quirks" that vendors like Intel and ARM used to make people subject to their patents.

They did try to avoid what they saw as the blunders of past designs, like not leaving enough opcode space for compressed instructions, making instructions conditional, leaving out byte and halfword memory access instructions, having a flags register, having a complicated page table structure, having register windows, having delay slots, etc. None of that was innovative. The actual design of the compressed instruction set and the vector instruction set were innovative, but that came later.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jiggawatts on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:46AM (#50450386)
> The Mill was the opposite extreme.

Sure, but even so they should have made real chips and iterated on silicon, not just simulations.

It’s the SpaceX rapid iteration development cycle vs NASA waterfall.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by kragen on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:21AM (#50452107)
This could be wrong, but https://tracxn.com/d/companies/mill-computing/__5BCN3HKJOoke... says they raised US$100k in debt, and https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/mill-computing-inc says You Have Been Blocked but apparently told Google they were pre-seed funding. https://pitchbook.com/profiles/company/169749-55#funding claims that they raised US$3.2M (US$1.2M in angel funding in 02004 and US$2M in a seed round in 02016).

Even in 02016, I don't think US$2M was enough to tape out a silicon prototype of a working high-performance CPU. MPW ("shuttle") programs can give you working prototypes for as low as US$3000, but only in process nodes a decade or more behind the state of the art. US$30M is a much more plausible budget.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by RetroTechie on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @10:07AM (#50454339)
> leaving out byte and halfword memory access instructions

Huh? LB(U) / LH(U)

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by kragen on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @10:15AM (#50454421)
The Alpha left out byte and halfword memory access instructions, and ARM left out halfword access instructions; both had to correct the omission later. I said RISC-V was determined not to repeat "what they saw as the blunders of past designs", so it had those from the beginning.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by xgk on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @10:00AM (#50454274)
Distance-based ISA, which is the essence of belt-machines, is currently subject of intense R&D in Japan, see e.g.:

https://www.sigarch.org/distance-based-isa-for-efficient-reg...

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by childintime on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:38PM (#50457516)
Ivan once was here on HN, I wonder how he's doing.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by briansm on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:20PM (#50449065)
Maybe now the cpu arena is a patent graveyard instead of a patent minefield, some fresh developments can appear.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Animats on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:45PM (#50449198)
This is a "build it and they will come" project. It's not a "we put the inner loop of ML entirely in hardware" project. That would make more sense technically. You could cram a lot of little independent neural net inference units on one chip. But if it was pitched that way, the questions would be "Why isn't NVidia doing this", and "After you do it, what keeps NVidia from doing it". There are lots of people pitching "AI chips", with modest success.

The history of general-purpose massively parallel machines isn't good. From the Illiac IV to the Playstation 3, there's been dud after dud in this space. You can build them, but the users don't come. This sort of architecture is great if you have some specific problem that parallelizes, such as finite-element analysis or neural networks.

(I've used an NCube, and I kind of liked the Transputer concept. But both were dead ends.)

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by genxy on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:21AM (#50450267)
Being a dead end doesn't mean the idea was bad, things both fail and succeed for complex reasons. This is a tired trope.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by II2II on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:59AM (#50450825)
I don't think they were saying it was a bad idea, though they may have been suggesting it is a bad investment.

Personally, I wasn't impressed by the press release. It is so vague that it makes it look like they don't know the history of their field or they are outright ignoring it to make their product sound novel. The former is just as problematic as the latter. There are reasons why parallelization is typically offloaded onto coprocessors and reasons why the introduction of new CPU architectures are rares.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by adityaathalye on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:39AM (#50450730)
Alt: What if it's a "let's build a kickass thing because we wanna, and see how far we can take it" project?

Failure is all but guaranteed---a chip is nothing without a computer-manufacturing-distributing ecosystem, which implies handsomely beating existing CPU/GPU makers, which is practically impossible.

My feeling:

An "Epic win" outcome for these people would likely be exit to a leading chip maker, about a decade out from today.

Success would probably look like becoming a mini Texas Instruments type, making specialist CPUs for orgs that can build their own computers around said chip.

Failure would likely be a fire sale into some giant IP portfolio (hopefully not a patent troll... that would be tragic).

i.e. A worthwhile endeavour, in any scenario, for those building the thing.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by roncesvalles on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:33AM (#50451809)
Exactly. I think these days raising $30m is the equivalent of getting into YC 15 years ago. The bar at this level is "this is kinda cool" not "this is a totally sound business plan that is likely to succeed barring adverse acts of God".
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by marhee on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @03:01AM (#50450841)
Yes, plus what there are proposing is more like a GPU in a CPU jacket?

That being said, it is great that people are still attempting to disrupt the hardware space, even if there's dud after dud historically. Got to respect that!

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by toolslive on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @09:28AM (#50453857)
This has been done before: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xeon_Phi
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jonathanlydall on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @03:29AM (#50450970)
> From the Illiac IV to the Playstation 3, there's been dud after dud in this space. You can build them, but the users don't come.

From an armchair commentary perspective, my understanding was that the PlayStation 3's Cell processor had essentially two practical issues:

- It required extra talented software developers to be able to utilize the hardware to its potential.

- Almost all game makers wanted to also target the Xbox and potentially also PC which further discouraged the writing of platform specific code to truly utilize the unique capabilities of the Cell processor.

However, with AI today, it's completely possible that it changes the economics of being able to write software which can fully utilize new and novel architectures affordably.

So perhaps if the a Cell like processor was released today it would be more successful.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by MiroslavPokorny on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:33AM (#50451808)
I heard somewhere that a major problem with the PS3 cell was it had a very limited local memory for its programs and data, which meant the host (main) cpu had to constantly moved memory back and forth from main memory to individual cell memory.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Animats on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:18PM (#50456596)
Yes.

The idea of the Cell architecture is that programs were supposed to be organized as an assembly line, with data flowing into a processor in a stream, and coming out the other side after processing. That's a good fit to audio processing.

Each of the seven support processors had only 256KB (not MB) of local RAM, plus a wide long-latency path to the 256MB main memory, the other support processors, and the PowerPC CPU.

That 256KB was the problem. Not enough for a frame. Not enough for a level. Not enough for AAA title games.

That's the problem with the lots of little processors approach. If all the little guys are memory-starved, you can't get much done, except on very regular problems. Finite element analysis and neural nets are the big wins for such architectures. They're not general purpose.

Note that GPUs aren't arrays of isolated CPUs. All units work against the same memory, mostly. They're closer to shared memory multiprocessors.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by guenthert on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @11:22AM (#50455183)
> However, with AI today, it's completely possible that it changes the economics of being able to write software which can fully utilize new and novel architectures affordably.

I'm not complete sold on that one. You will need training material. While there have been impressive results even for architectures/programming languages for which I would not have expected to be much training material to be available, there will be a minimum. I'm afraid for a new architecture unlike everything else, your AI coding assistant won't be of much help.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by ghrl on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:04PM (#50455707)
But models can just ingest large parts of the documentation into their context window, write the code based on that (which they'd likely be surprisingly good at, adapting to the entirely different memory mechanics and so on using just a handful examples) and test+iterate on it until it produces the expected results (which they can compare against a regular implementation) and performs well.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by pseudohadamard on Thursday November 12, 2026 @04:08AM (#50464787)
> However, with AI today, it's completely possible that it changes the economics of being able to write software which can fully utilize new and novel architectures affordably.

With AI today, it's completely possible that it can't change the economics of being able to write software which can fully utilize new and novel architectures affordably.

So essentially it's gambling $30M on a coin toss that a clanker can magically fix something that hasn't worked the last 200 times we tried it.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by RantyDave on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @03:46AM (#50451071)
Aren’t we still bandwidth limited on ai? IOW you can make the most efficient computer you want, it’s still getting the data to it that’s the hard part.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Someone on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:07PM (#50458672)
[delayed]
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by hn_submit on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:14AM (#50451225)
"Because we patented it."
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by gnfargbl on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:23AM (#50451746)
One niche application which impressed me was the use of the TILE-Gx in Mikrotik's CCR routers. I used one for a good few years and you really got a lot of performance (provided your setup was suitably parallelizable) for very little outlay and a tiny power expenditure.

Nvidia bought the architecture and killed it, which kind of proves your point.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by imtringued on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @08:54AM (#50453458)
Before the advent of Rust all code was written with mutable aliasing by default in mind which has lead to the proliferation of single threaded code.

The other problem is that automatic parallelism with the right language is actually easy, but the scheduling cost eats the gains because you cannot launch subtasks in the 100s of nanoseconds timescale.

What's needed is hardware accelerated scheduling within the same process so that you are no longer being slowed down by the software scheduler in the kernel.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by CyberDildonics on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @10:33AM (#50454635)
This is a big misunderstanding of languages and multi-threading. First, plenty of languages including C++ have a const keyword, rust is just const by default, so that doesn't enable anything new through the language. Even marking something const doesn't enable anything new, it's just convenient safety.

Single threaded programs being normal was originally from almost no systems having more than one core or CPU. Then there were few languages that had threading built in. Someone knowledgeable would have to use the OS API to launch threads.

After that threading has mostly come from structures that are already built. There is nothing difficult about copying data if that's what people want to do. There is nothing that says scheduling has to be slow since you can have threads taking data from a queue. None of this has anything to do with rust.

you are no longer being slowed down by the software scheduler in the kernel

This isn't necessary if you just create threads and let them grab data they need, work on it and move on.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by fentonc on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @10:06AM (#50454317)
I have a 64-node chunk of an NCube/10 that I was able to reverse engineer enough to get up and running! That thing is everything you could want in a 1980s supercomputer, it has a great architecture.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Animats on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:30PM (#50459691)
Oh, nice. Stanford had a 64-node NCube at one point. They got it from an oil company, which found it not useful. The case was a 1 meter cube, with slots for 16 huge boards, each with 64 CPUs. Only one board was present. One CPU was broken, and the architecture was such that you were then limited to 32 CPUs for a job. Other than a chess program, it was unused. It was shipped off to some other school.

Same machine, with one broken CPU? Few of those things were made, so it might be.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by fentonc on Thursday November 12, 2026 @01:16PM (#50471656)
This one came from Caltech, and was just a bare board (but thought to be working). I had to make a backplane and case for it, and then reverse engineer the serial protocol to build a USB-to-NCube adapter. I've only managed to get code running on a single CPU, but it's on my todo list to try multi-node.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by fanf2 on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @11:32AM (#50455323)
[delayed]
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by fuddle on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @09:50PM (#50449236)
This is my first time hearing about Vine - https://vine.dev/ I have to say the landing page is terrible, at least show an example of the language.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by martiancookbook on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:24AM (#50450626)
They've announced a playground [1] recently on their Discord.

[1] https://vine.run/

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jordemort on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @10:01PM (#50449295)
it’s the Transputer again, or the Emotion Engine again, depending on how old you are
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by SanjayMehta on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @10:09PM (#50449343)
FTA:

"Instead of starting from a sequential design, we’re building our processor to have thousands of cores operating in parallel. This requires moving beyond the notion of shared mutable memory and linear instruction sequences. To make this possible, we’re working in tandem on the open-source language Vine, which has been designed from the beginning to target a new wave of parallel-first architectures."

Reminds me of the Transputer and Occam. Each transputer had 4 comm links to form a flexible network of processors and Occam supported parallelism. Also one of the first languages to use indentation for block structures.

For a long time I missed their folding editor.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by AlotOfReading on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @10:33PM (#50449476)
This feels a decade late. I don't really see the value prop for customers in 2026 (or realistically, 2030+). Let's say I'm willing to rewrite all my software to a language that compiles down into interaction nets. Why don't I use HVM2 instead and buy GPUs from Nvidia? If I just want to use an exotic architecture, AMD is shipping dataflow processors at scale today, and they'll license related IP. And if I just want a massively parallel architecture to run my existing ML code on, I could just rent google cloud TPUs instead.

Who's the customer that wants an exotic architecture on an old process node running a custom programming language half a decade from now?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by yieldcrv on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:22PM (#50449718)
because rewriting your software is easy now, there are plenty of examples of Language Models looking at the architecture in front of them and recompiling themselves, their inference engine and harnes for faster inference on it or whatever their need may be

others have made entire OS's or gone back in time reinventing of removal of the OS and just running a single application with its own I/O stack per application

this is a guess that exotic architecture on old nodes means that the hardware can come out now at a lower price - or at least fulfill market needs at the price the market can bare without the delay - all because using exotic architecture is easy now, unstable opaque drivers are no longer an issue, and there is just a need to fulfill compute demands efficiently

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by AlotOfReading on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:57PM (#50449898)
If software stacks and compatibility didn't matter, AMD GPUs would be in nearly the same demand as Nvidia's. But we know they aren't and that's despite the fact that porting between GPUs is much easier than what we're talking about here.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by yieldcrv on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:46AM (#50450092)
its honestly just network effects at this point

this technology to make it easy is only a couple quarters old

the antiquated understanding of “CUDA being sooo stable and AMD drivers not” just takes a while to be revised

hyperscalers are buying AMD GPUs

AMD’s stock has tripled this year based on investment into their driver stack getting better and others realizing they don’t need to wait for AMD to leverage the compute

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by imtringued on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @03:10AM (#50450882)
No that proves the point. It took the invention of LLMs and agentic software development for AMD to fix their drivers.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by yieldcrv on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:08AM (#50451190)
A point that stopped being relevant as soon as it was proven possible, I don't know what kind of validation you need to see about exotic hardware being easier to develop for, but being slower to pick that up doesn't change the viability of the exotic hardware built on more available nodes now that there are examples of it being easier to run things on
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nukanse on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:50AM (#50450114)
Language models are efficient because they are trained with millions of examples that don't exist for newer architectures, and they are still mediocre to bad on stuff where they hadn't been trained
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by selfhoster11 on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:16AM (#50450564)
They are also good at TDD loops. With good enough testing harnesses and simulators, they can get things done quickly.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jurgenburgen on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:21AM (#50451736)
> because rewriting your software is easy now

Doesn’t really matter how easy rewriting something is, it’s still a waste of time if it brings no value.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by orbifold on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:39AM (#50450061)
What dataflow processors is AMD shipping?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by AlotOfReading on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:59AM (#50450155)
The XDNA NPU is a small dataflow processor. Originally derived from xilinx IP.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by ipsum2 on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @03:57AM (#50451128)
Is this a joke? No one uses HVM2, and hasn't been touched in years. It's a single one-off prototype that some guy made.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by jojohohanon on Tuesday November 10, 2026 @11:50PM (#50449859)
I thought greenarrays was incredibly cool. (144 native-forth cores on a chip)

I loved the mill architecture (self declared clean sheet cpu).

I thought transmeta had a good chance because they could inline across kernel boundaries.

But none of them was special enough.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by exabrial on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:14AM (#50449967)
Wasn't that what RISCV was supposed to do? apologies, dumb question
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by martiancookbook on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:35AM (#50450711)
I think RISC-V is intended to be a simpler-to-implement processor that can also be used as a compilation target for existing languages, b/c it still shares many properties of x86/ARM (e.g. pointers, memory addresses, etc.). I don't think Tendrils' chips are intended necessarily to be able to run existing code, but instead will require Vine to be able to program for their chips.

Other than that, I don't think there's much relation between the two.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by stmw on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:22AM (#50449995)
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by quilombodigital on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:30AM (#50450028)
Am I missing something?

I couldn't find any parallel constructs in the language. So, as I understand it, it's a regular language that gets compiled into a graph, and the runtime parallelizes the execution of that graph.

This factorial won't run any faster with more cores, since each step depends on the previous one:

  fn fat(n: N64) -> N64 {
    if n <= 1 {
      1
    } else {
      n * fat(n - 1)
    }
  }
This other version can run in parallel, but only because the algorithm was deliberately written that way:

  fn fat(n: N32) -> Nat {
    if n == 0 { 1 as Nat } else { prod(1, n) }
  }

  fn prod(lo: N32, hi: N32) -> Nat {
    if lo == hi {
      lo as Nat
    } else {
      let m = (lo + hi) / 2;
      let left = prod(lo, m);
      let right = prod(m + 1, hi);
      left * right
    }
  }
So the programmer still has to think about parallelism; the language just removes the need for threads and locks.

Also, as the graph grows, sequential dependencies still limit the speedup, and more cores means more data moving between them. How does the hardware deal with that?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nukanse on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:54AM (#50450134)
The factorial can be calculated using a Taylor series, whose individual terms can be calculated and summed in parallel.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by martiancookbook on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:22AM (#50450609)
Bom dia, it's my understanding that there is no runtime. The hardware does all of the graph rewrites. If you look at their 'On Interaction Nets' post [1], it seems that part of the pitch is that many programs can be written 'naturally' and still parallelize well.

[1] https://tendrils.co/blog/2026-04-26/on-inets

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by quilombodigital on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @10:39PM (#50462779)
Hi, thanks, I initially understood that, but I gave a non parallelizable example to show that there sometimes it is serialized by design, but I agree that in theory "real world" examples should be more amenable to parallelization.

Looking forward to seeing how the hardware handles the cost of communication between cores.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by mohamedkoubaa on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:33AM (#50450038)
Let's not call it a CPU if it doesn't have SoTa single threaded performancr
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nukanse on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @12:45AM (#50450091)
As a programmer, I always wanted a cpu which instead of having n 64 bit registers, had a single register with 2^m bits, which could be split in arbitrary length sub registers, not all the same size, and could be treated as an array of bits, or a swar machine
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by kragen on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:12AM (#50450222)
That's a fun idea! RV32E is 512 bits of general-purpose registers, RV32I is 1024, and RV64I is 2048. AVX-512's ZMM registers total 16384 bits. So you could have, say, a 4096-bit register which you could access as any of 13 different sizes, from 1 bit up to 4096.

I think the on-chip bus interconnect and ALU are probably going to have some finite width, though. Above that number of bits in an operation, your instructions will get slower. Maybe that's what you have in mind, and you just want to abstract that away?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by genxy on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:32AM (#50450331)
This seems to be very close to RVV in terms of expressive power. The operations are going to be map,fold,filter
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by kragen on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:38AM (#50450351)
Don't forget scan!
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nukanse on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:46AM (#50450389)
An use of SIMD in x86 is fast ram copy/filling by sending all Avx register to ram with one instruction.

But I'm thinking more about having multiple logical CPUs, ALUs, or ports working on a single giant register. I think SIMD wastes a lot of hardware.

Example: radix sort needs to calculate a prefix sum. As the sum accumulates, it requires more bits, so the bit length should be adjustable. On x86, you can cast an array of bytes to a uint64_t and calculate eight prefix sums with a single multiplication. But eventually, you run into SWAR lane overflow problems. Ask an AI what this means and how the code works.

We need a CPU designed to handle lane overflow and dynamically adapt bit lengths, so at the start we do more parallel sums with less bits, and as the sum accumulate we increase the bit length gradually. This is just a simple use case. We could store more prefix sums as a periodic sum more deltas.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by adrian_b on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @09:36AM (#50453963)
Such a CPU is not difficult to design, but the problem is that for the majority of the applications it would be much slower than a traditional CPU, by having a much lower clock frequency, caused by the additional delays through a great number of multiplexers and buffers that would be needed in such a CPU (even the multiplexers that are not implemented with physical gates, but e.g. with tri-state buffers driving common bit lines, introduce extra delays due to driving greater capacitances).

Besides a lower clock frequency, such a CPU would also have a power consumption, due to a greater total capacitance of the internal nodes.

The number of problems whose solution could be accelerated by such a structure is too low to make it worthwhile.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by MisterMunchkin on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:43AM (#50450753)
You want RAM?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by imtringued on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @03:07AM (#50450870)
How to make a chip designer's life a living hell 101.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by flowerbreeze on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @03:22AM (#50450931)
That's fascinating! I've always wondered about whether there has ever been a cpu or if it'd be too difficult to build, that has 2 bit run-length registers. 1st bit -> value, 2nd bit -> has next. For processing arbitrary length data. Any size integer or string. It's not without a cost of course, but I find the idea of having a single atomic datatype of any length kind of nice.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Lerc on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:21AM (#50451259)
I think you could probably adapt the SERV design to do this. You'd end up with a tiny but kinda slow core,

You'd essentially have a 1 bit processor with a cache that translated groups of bits to whatever memory access width was. CPUs already fill cache lines with transfers wider than registers, so the theory is there.

There's always a sweet spot for bang-for-buck on any tunable size like that. I doubt it is at 1-bit unless you can figure out how to do cache coherency with a few million cores.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by MiroslavPokorny on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:36AM (#50451827)
Similar to my thoughts about having memory being bit addressable instead of being forced at byte boundaries. I am aware that this is inefficient but we have seen CPUs for example do byte addressing even thought they actually read words.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by eluusive on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:05AM (#50450179)
How do I get people to give me $30 M to work on nonsense?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by solyin on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:25AM (#50450630)
Step 1. Stop calling it nonsense.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by tintor on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:18AM (#50450244)
This is amazing!
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nathan_f77 on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:18AM (#50450249)
Vine sounds like it has a similar philosophy to Bend [1]. I'm sure it would be possible to compile Bend to run on one of these chips as well.

[1] https://bend-lang.com/

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by librasteve on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:28AM (#50450302)
By my reckoning you can build about 256 small fast CPUs each with 16kiB RAM and IO on an M4 die area. Most of a modern CPUs gates are wasted on out of order execution and cache coherency.

https://bil-lang.org is a more explicit language that imo is needed for coders (or LLMs) to grapple with hammering algorithms onto a CPU array. But AI is a big lever to overcome this historic barrier.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by christkv on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:29AM (#50450309)
so reinventing the transputer?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by librasteve on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:31AM (#50450685)
unfinished business
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by christkv on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:33AM (#50450698)
Maybe what was missing as the llms to be honest to get these kind of architectures to work as you can have it run optimisations loop against hardware like this.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by librasteve on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:44AM (#50450761)
yeah well there's a perennial problem of needing innovative languages to get this to work (Vine?) vs. the temptation to package this sw with chips and become a closed technology

I made Bil as a way to try and break that - built on Go (and LLVM) under BSD. Quite easy to run up a simple scheduler for any new architecture particularly if they are an LLVM target.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by christkv on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:37AM (#50451835)
For sure, we need some sensible target for this to work with enough information to be able to generate performant code.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by timClicks on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:31AM (#50450678)
[delayed]
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by vidarh on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:30AM (#50451787)
Also Parallella[1]. I have two of their 16 (+ 2 ARM cores) core demonstration units sitting in a box somewhere. They were fun, and I'm sad they didn't get much further - I think they did get a 64 core version done, but the longer term goal was a 4096 core grid. You could directly access the memory in each core, and there was a predictable cycle count to do so based on location in the grid, so you could write algorithms that'd run in lock-step if you wanted.

There's also XMOS[2] that appears to have morphed quite far from the original concept but is still focused on parallelism.

The challenge for both is that it's really hard to carve out a decent sized space alongside regular CPUs and GPUs. They can't compete with CPUs on single core performance, and so far can't compete with GPUs on concurrency. Both seemed to try to carve out space in embedded / low powered systems. XMOS seems to have somewhat succeeded (at least they're still alive), while Parallella/Adapteva failed.

[1] https://parallella.org/

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XMOS

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by alexey-salmin on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:34AM (#50451366)
Out of order execution is not a waste. Itanium learned that the hard way.

Cache coherency is hardly a waste too. For general purpose compute you need at least some mechanism to exchange messages between cores so the transistor budget is needed. It wasn't convincingly demonstrated that CC is worse than alternatives.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by librasteve on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:53AM (#50451536)
hmmm - not sure I can agree with that. lets say we both subscribe to David Hennessy approach to quantitative CPU performance design. then depends on the workload.

I accept that modern day CPUs have co-evolved with modern compiler backends to be highly dependent on OoO - but the case of the many small CPU folks is that for a large class of performance hungry algorithms there are ways to distribute the workload efficiently over many parallel CPUs with no shared memory. In this case then there is a trade off of "does each CPU do OoO and take more die area" vs. "does each CPU NOT do OoO and take less die area" with proportionately more total datapath throughput per mm2.

I submit that for this class of problem, zero or very little OoO is the optimum. In the fag packet designs I have done it looks to me that a 2 dispatch integer pipeline with a small I-cache is fully capable of filling a 32-bit FP datapath (double pass if you want f64, four f16 per cycle) and in turn that can saturate a 256-bit SRAM unified on chip main memory bus. And, of course, the shorter the pipe to flush and the less deep the main memory latency then good things happen.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by CyberDildonics on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:32AM (#50452185)
You can not agree or 'submit for this class of problem' all you want, but the fact is that now and for a long time getting the most math instructions out of the smallest die size doesn't seem to be a problem.

Realistically in most applications you can get far more processing power than you need because of clock speeds, modern architectures, transistor budgets etc.

A disposable vape can have an arm cortex m0 that runs at 24 mhz and a $1 pi pico can have a dual core m0 that can run at 133 mhz to 200 mhz.

If you want raw math you can use SIMD or a GPU model and if you need single core power you need out of order execution to hide the memory latency, because that's the real bottleneck for the last 30 years.

These multiple tiny cpu core models just don't make sense to solve any real problem and they create a lot with their complexity and latency trying to communicate with each other.

There just isn't some bizarre niche that needs more math instructions with less power consumption. People have all they need even without being efficient. If someone needs more they turn to writing actual optimized software.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by adrian_b on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @07:01AM (#50452418)
The reason for the existence of OoO is that the latency of a memory read is much greater than the executions of tons of instructions.

The only algorithms that do not care about memory latency are the digital processing algorithms and the like (which include things like video/audio compression and decompression), where there is a continuous stream of incoming data, which must be processed.

Otherwise, whenever you have to read a previously unused memory location from an address that is not predictable by the hardware prefetcher, you must pay the latency penalty.

There are only 2 ways to hide the memory latency, by doing something else while you must wait the arrival of data. You can either execute instructions taken from elsewhere from the current thread, which is OoO and which requires a lot of complex hardware to find which instructions may be executed, or you can use either fine-grained multi-threading or simultaneous multi-threading, where either the programmer or the compiler have taken care to prepare a lot of independent concurrent threads, so that the hardware may execute any instructions from a thread that is not the current one, without having to search and analyze the instructions, to find their dependencies at run-time.

Because this is much easier for programmers, OoO is preferred for CPUs. Where the cost per core must be minimized, FGMT or SMT with a very large number of threads is preferred, like in GPUs.

In the parent article it is said that they will not use OoO, but nothing is said about multi-threading. If neither OoO nor FGMT/SMT are used, the result is a special-purpose processor, not a general-purpose processor, i.e. a processor whose use is restricted to DSP-like algorithms, because otherwise its execution units would stay idle almost all the time.

I have browsed briefly through the documentation of the programming language mentioned in the announcement, but it does not appear to have many features relevant for concurrent programming, not even of the level of the Occam language, which was used for Transputers.

The only unusual feature that I see, is a Fork/Drop thing, which works exactly like reference counts, except that instead of passing references to an object, copies to that objects are passed, which is an optimization that may be useful in a concurrent program, but it is something that can be done by a compiler, without being visible in the programming language.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by librasteve on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @11:55AM (#50455593)
I think my main disagreement with this well established line of reasoning is that a small CPU with dedicated SRAM can have a very low (2 cycle) latency on a very wide (eg 1024 bit) memory bus … so sure running a typical application workload tuned for a few shared memory cores will not improve much. But the raw MIPS/FLOPS per sq mm is much higher and with LLM we have a helper that can adapt to this unusual constraint.

So not general apps, nor pure pipeline DSP tasks that map onto a GPU. But I reckon there’s a lot of ground in between that is open for colonisation.

btw https://bil-lang.org is inspired by Occam style CSP and grafts that into Go … so yes a fast scheduler to overlap at the process level and a way to guide LLM via strict chan and par structure

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by IsTom on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:50AM (#50452312)
Until you find a way to speed up sequential computation using parallel processing (show what NC = P?) there will always be a need for singular beefy cores.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by christkv on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:34AM (#50450335)
There is also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XMOS which was funded by people behind the transputer.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by mrandish on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @01:48AM (#50450394)
The chip might be great but they really need to rework their overview blurb. I'm no CPU designer but even I know every single thing they mention like it's bold, new 'think different' stuff, hasn't been a 'new idea' since at least the 1990s. For example:

> Instead of starting from a sequential design, we’re building our processor to have thousands of cores operating in parallel. This requires moving beyond the notion of shared mutable memory and linear instruction sequences.

Hey! Sounds like Thinking Machines, that hot new startup out of MIT. Yeah, their Connection Machine was bleeding edge stuff... in 1983 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thinking_Machines_Corporation). Look, I get that it's an overview but they need to at least hand-wave at something new and different before talking like it's new and different.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by brainless on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:00AM (#50450473)
This is above my pay grade but since LLMs have become the 24/7 code writers, I started to wonder if our processing architecture could see much more innovation. I see light-enabled processing, analog processing and other headlines on posts/YouTube. Most are focused on inference though. But there is also the need to run generated code on cheaper, efficient chips.

I guess these are all really expensive and need VC funding. But perhaps there are existing architectures that allow baking code into silicon, or new architectures for NNs and so on. If costs are low, there is a massive demand coming for code that we want to write and forget - keeps on running on low powered last-mile devices. From factories, farms to home equipment.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by hingler36 on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:20AM (#50450590)
New CPU architectures have lived and died by supporting existing software, with Rosetta on Apple Silicon being an example of it working and Itanium an example of it falling apart.

All the best to anyone trying to design a new paradigm of processor, but I'm interested to hear how they'll avoid the pitfalls of their predecessors.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by martiancookbook on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @02:38AM (#50450727)
I'm guessing it will be easier with all of these automated (LLM) porting efforts. Also, there can be a middle-ish ground like GPUs where only portions of the program are written in CUDA and exposed via some higher-level API.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nojs on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:33AM (#50451356)
> how they'll avoid the pitfalls of their predecessors

It’s a reasonable bet that LLMs will make translation to other architectures effectively automatic. So that moat may completely disappear.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by mikewarot on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:32AM (#50451346)
I think we all have projects and ideas like this that go back decades. In my case, it's the BitGrid, which is a theoretical sea of look up tables that are clocked in alternating phases like a chessboard, to eliminate race conditions and the need to worry about timing.

I couldn't quite follow the diagrams of the theory page, but I'd be willing to bet a very small sum of cash that it'll eventually be something very much like the BitGrid.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by thesz on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @04:46AM (#50451474)

  > Tendrils is answering the question: what if we redo the CPU? Instead of starting from a sequential design, we’re building our processor to have thousands of cores operating in parallel. This requires moving beyond the notion of shared mutable memory and linear instruction sequences. To make this possible, we’re working in tandem on the open-source language Vine, which has been designed from the beginning to target a new wave of parallel-first architectures.
So they used a new and unknown language Vine.

Ten days ago there was a post that linked a Haskell-specialized CPU, please: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50319896

The link to the CPU demo: https://bathtub-01.github.io/technical/ouros-demo/

The Ouros CPU is a dataflow CPU, which means it is very, very scalable. It does not, from what I read there, contain content-addressable memory, which is a bottleneck for dataflow architectures. It supports multithreading from the ground, a parallel Haskell program will be executed very efficiently there.

There was an Id, a dataflow lenient functional programming language. The Id90 version of it was ported to Thinking Machines Connection Machine (then) supercomputer (I believe it was ported to CM-4 and CM-5).

Id90 programs running on Connection Machine demonstrated linear scaling to the available compute and, sometimes, even superlinear scaling - Id90's Content Addressable Memory was implemented in software and when CAM slice become smaller, there were less cache misses. Some of Id90 programs produced so much parallel computations that compiler had to introduce throttling so CAM will not overflow.

Here's a thesis on compilation of lenient functional programming languages to CM-5: https://www2.eecs.berkeley.edu/Pubs/TechRpts/1994/5850.html

I guess it shows that functional programming languages can be efficiently executed through parallel dataflow architectures and that dataflow architectures scale efficiently with compute.

I am putting it all here because I see the same pattern over and over again. People create some new language with some unknown properties (Rust, for example, got Turing-complete type system before being able to control for I/O) instead of first taking Haskell and embed their ideas there or, even, add an extension to play and/or investigate.

In this particular case, they take some Vine programming language instead of Haskell, despite Haskell already having several specialized CPU implementations, including dataflow one, guaranteeing scaling. And Haskell has a pretty mature infrastructure and tons of libraries.

Why? I don't know.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by trashb on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:00AM (#50451579)
My first thought was: $30 million that's not a lot for a project of that size.

  > Instead of starting from a sequential design, we’re building our processor to have thousands of cores operating in parallel.
Additionally they try to make a hyper parallel cpu? that seems like it would be hard to program. If they can make it easy to program parallelism it may be interesting. But perhaps they will just reinvent the Lisp machine.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by teknopath on Thursday November 12, 2026 @08:56AM (#50467131)
Yes, its a next gen lisp machine.

It has a better foundational data structure that enables very cheap and fine grained control operation (multithreading, etc).

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by philipwhiuk on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:50AM (#50451912)
This feels like a bad use of the UK Sovereign AI Fund.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by MiroslavPokorny on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @05:54AM (#50451935)
What about putting a million 6502s or 65816 or maybe a 32 bit address capable on single die ? Surely a million of them would get more done than a single modern X86 or ARM for a lot less power and price ?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by CyberDildonics on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:47AM (#50452288)
That would be about 3 billion transistors and a 7800X3D is apparently about 6.5 billion transistors, but there are lots of problems.

The first is that they would spend all their time waiting on memory. If you run a CPU at 5 ghz, you will have 500 cycles before you get the bytes from memory you want. 1% of a modern CPU is running the instructions, the other 99% is trying to keep it busy. You would then need to double the transistor count for cache, but even then you will be waiting on memory for everything that you haven't already used and put in cache. To counter act that you need prefetching so you can get from memory ahead of time etc. This goes on and on until you either build a modern CPU or a modern GPU.

The other problem is that this doesn't solve a problem anyone has. People aren't really clamoring for more raw math or instructions any more. Most of it goes to waste by running scripting languages that run at 1/100th the speed of naive C. Most C runs at 1/100th the speed of a real optimized program. It's as if someone built a super powerful engine and everyone just decided to fly jumbo jets to work instead of using the same cars and less gas.

Then finally there are modern GPUs which already can do one million floating point operations in the time it takes to get a single byte from memory (the single byte is really two cache lines which is the minimum and this also includes the memory not being in the TLB).

It's all memory latency and software optimization. The need for raw math is not a general computing problem any more, it has all been relegated to GPUs.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by MiroslavPokorny on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @07:04PM (#50460897)
> 1% of a modern CPU is running the instructions, the other 99% is trying to keep it busy. You would then need to double the transistor count for cache, but even then you will be waiting on memory for everything that you haven't already used and put in cache.

Waiting for those periods only occurs when a modern cpu is fetching memory outside its caches. When its all in cache it runs at basically full speed.

> To counter act that you need prefetching so you can get from memory ahead of time etc. This goes on and on until you either build a modern CPU or a modern GPU.

Thats all true but what im suggesting is if you had MORE a lot MORE humble cpus even if they run at a much less than GHZ, doing a little work the sum of the humble cpus would actually become more than the modern fast cpu.

Think a lot of slow donkeys would still get move more than a ferrari, for less money and less fuel.

> Then finally there are modern GPUs which already can do one million floating point operations in the time it takes to get a single byte from memory (the single byte is really two cache lines which is the minimum and this also includes the memory not being in the TLB).

Thats all true but the cost of that performance is a lot of heat and silicon.

What if that power was given to a million 6510s ?

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by CyberDildonics on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @09:39PM (#50462392)
Waiting for those periods only occurs when a modern cpu is fetching memory outside its caches

I said that exactly. Half the cpu will be cache and it only helps once data is in the cache, which it won't be if you are running through big arrays. Big arrays would be necessary to supply a bunch of tiny cores, unless of course you had prefetching and other mechanics.

When its all in cache it runs at basically full speed.

L3 cache will not run at full speed. The latency is much better but you still have 40 cycles. That means that every lda instruction will wait for 40 cycles when in old computers it would take one cycle. That's just for anything already in cache, not the 500 cycles you would stall for something outside of cache. Don't forget that there are no cache lines and no out of order execution so you pull down a single byte after 500 cycles and if you read the next byte you wait 500 more cycles.

Thats all true but what im suggesting is if you had MORE a lot MORE humble cpus even if they run at a much less than GHZ

Your idea is clear, it's not a misunderstanding, it's just something that has been considered a long time ago and dismissed.

Think a lot of slow donkeys would still get move more than a ferrari, for less money and less fuel.

People don't want slow donkeys, they want to move themselves with a ferrari or jet, or huge amounts of stuff on a giant ship. Donkeys are obsolete. They don't cross water, they don't move fast, they don't go straight.

Thats all true but the cost of that performance is a lot of heat and silicon.

So what?

What if that power was given to a million 6510s ?

You would have the same number of transistors and you would be able to do 0 floating point calculations because those CPUs had no floating point units. You can't even multiply integers. You can add and subtract integers. Now you have to sit and wait on every memory load, you have lower Ghz and every math operation is going to use lots and lots of cycles because you can't even multiply integers. Good luck with that.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by MiroslavPokorny on Thursday November 12, 2026 @04:53AM (#50465119)
> I said that exactly. Half the cpu will be cache and it only helps once data is in the cache, which it won't be if you are running through big arrays. Big arrays would be necessary to supply a bunch of tiny cores, unless of course you had prefetching and other mechanics.

The 6510 did not have any cache. Im suggesting the cost/benefit of cpus that do not have any cache, no branch prediction, no out of order, just the minimum to execute its ISA.

Again cutting things down to as simple as possible and hope for the best.

> Your idea is clear, it's not a misunderstanding, it's just something that has been considered a long time ago and dismissed

It was dismissed because x86 has a very large impossibly expensive range of software that would be lost on any new different arch.

> You would have the same number of transistors and you would be able to do 0 floating point calculations because those CPUs had no floating point units.

The 6510 could do floating point in software. Im not saying that the solution must be a million 6510, one could add a simple FPU and advance some of the features. Im just suggesting an arch without all the extras that require lots of transistors like Out of order execution, caches and all that.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by CyberDildonics on Thursday November 12, 2026 @08:20AM (#50466706)
Im suggesting the cost/benefit of cpus that do not have any cache, no branch prediction, no out of order, just the minimum to execute its ISA.

Right, again this is clear. Although you did talk about cache earlier, it's not a mystery what you are trying to say. It's simple, easy and doesn't work.

Again cutting things down to as simple as possible and hope for the best.

These old CPUs are extremely efficient with transistor budgets but they do almost nothing.

It was dismissed because x86 has a very large impossibly expensive range of software that would be lost on any new different arch.

This is completely wrong. If this architecture worked, there would be a 100,000 original x86 cores on a chip. You can look at the evolution of x86, super scalar computers like cray machines, the successors to the 6502, chips from sun, dec, SGI etc. and see what they added and why.

There are new CPUs running riscv that you can buy right now and they don't do anything like this even though it is running on a completely new instruction set.

The 6510 could do floating point in software.

32 or 64 bit floating point numbers using just 8 bit integer add and subtract with bit shifts. Kind of seems like the thing that would be much better done in hardware. Maybe do 8 or 16 floating point operations in a single cycle.

one could add a simple FPU

The first FPU was 45,000 transistors. Now each chip isn't 3,500 transistors any more. Don't forget you are still moving single bytes around with every instruction, many instructions take more than one cycle to complete, you have almost no registers and the ones you have are all 8 bit and because you have no cache, every memory load takes hundreds of cycles while the cpu sits and does nothing.

Im just suggesting an arch without all the extras that require lots of transistors like Out of order execution, caches and all that.

Again, it's obvious that you are suggesting that and with a little research it's obvious why it doesn't work out.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by avazhi on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:07AM (#50452006)
Didn’t Apple already do this?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by kiradoki on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:12AM (#50452045)
Become the revenger of the philosophy "the right thing" if you can inherit the legacies given by interaction nets.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by Lichtso on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @06:32AM (#50452183)
1985: Inmos - Transputer

2006: Sony & Toshiba & IBM (STI) - Cell Broadband Engine

2009: GreenArrays - GA144

2012: Adapteva - Parallella

2021: Esperanto Technologies - ET-SoC-1

2024: Inspiresemi - Thunderbird

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by JonChesterfield on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @09:51AM (#50454157)
Xmos and Graphcore are the same stable too.
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by eqvinox on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @07:09AM (#50452485)
Tilera has tried and failed with a somewhat similar approach. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tilera]

Sounds like this is trying to go an order of magnitude further past that, but I'm not particularly optimistic it'll amount to much.

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by guenthert on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @11:36AM (#50455368)
I'd think there have been many attempts at similar. An odd one is GA144 (GreenArrays): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GA144
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by enygmata on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @07:49AM (#50452787)
Is their "interaction net" approach to computation related to Gerald Sussman's propagators in any way?
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by xgk on Wednesday November 11, 2026 @09:57AM (#50454228)
Interaction nets are a representation of proofs in Girard's linear logic and have well-understood proof-theoretic properties.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interaction_nets

Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by yencabulator on Thursday November 12, 2026 @02:17PM (#50472674)
Re:$30M Raised to Redo the CPU by nektro on Thursday November 12, 2026 @03:14PM (#50473499)
has the line "Instead of starting from a sequential design, we’re building our processor to have thousands of cores operating in parallel." and doesn't spend a single line explaining how this is any different from a GPU. bad post.