News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by SirensOfTitan on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:11AM (#24469159)
They’ve also quoted me more than a whole new pair to repair some AirPods Pro that I accidentally washed in the laundry. They didn’t tell me that was the case when I was on the phone with them.

Apple uses a lot of customer hostile behaviors nowadays. Recently:

* I canceled the Apple TV+ year trial that came with my iPhone. While, I believe, they require other apps to allow access until the trial ends, they ended my access immediately.

* Apple Music pulls up a slow interstitial almost every time I open it up to try to get me to pay. I have like 4 albums on my phone I listen to, it’s incredibly annoying how they’ve broken the music app to upsell their services.

I’m trying to get rid of most of my Apple devices in favor of anything else at this point.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by freeqaz on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:29AM (#24469289)
I just swapped from Android to an iPhone for privacy concerns. The other side of the fence is pretty user hostile as well. Google makes you disable a lot of functionality on the phone if you try to get out of their invasive tracking. And they are constantly nuking apps that I use like Google Play Music and Google Inbox.

Maybe check out PinePhone if you're interested in hacking something together!

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Abishek_Muthian on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:40AM (#24469978)
>I just swapped from Android to an iPhone for privacy concerns.

Understandable, if Apple's claim on Privacy is to be trusted, then it does seem to be a better alternative to android when it comes to privacy; But for a power user android ecosystem offers more without rooting, is not dependent upon 'trust on a company alone' and there's no separate power-user level ecosystem for iOS without jailbreaking.

e.g.

• AOSP, so there's LineageOS as aftermarket alternative, /e/ with e foundation phone or Fairphone, dozens of other alternatives.

• Firewall VPN for android are more refined e.g. Netguard (open-source) even allows selective blocking of connections per address/ per app; this is the closest thing to Little Snitch on macOS.

• Tasker allows automation to such an extent that, several things which required writing apps can now be performed by creating tasks. Tasker is Siri shortcuts on steroids without Siri.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by selfhoster11 on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:59AM (#24469554)
You can deactivate pretty much all the Google apps you're not using. I use VLC, Firefox and K-9 Mail instead of the default Google apps and have been doing it for ages. Pretty much doesn't break anything, other than some banking apps that immediately assume you must have Gmail installed, so they direct you to that instead of your default email client. That's not a big deal, you can just open your email client by hand. A small price to pay for giving less space to Google on your phone.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by oneplane on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:03AM (#24469605)
But you can't disable play store and framework(s) without losing a ton of integrated facilities. Probably also why the integrate most ad and tracking stuff in there.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Wowfunhappy on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:08AM (#24469660)
> But you can't disable play store and framework(s) without losing a ton of integrated facilities.

But can’t those basically be considered part of the operating system at this point? I can’t disable Apple frameworks on my iPhone either. Mind, iOS of course does less user tracking.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by freeqaz on Monday September 14, 2020 @03:54PM (#24474374)
> But can’t those basically be considered part of the operating system at this point?

That's exactly why I switched because the idea that I can't disable Play Services is bonkers. It does look like MicroG (open-source replacement) is maturing a lot recently though!

> I can’t disable Apple frameworks on my iPhone either. Mind, iOS of course does less user tracking.

Apple makes their money up front by me purchasing the device. That's why they're expensive. They are a hardware company.

Whenever you use an iOS feature for the first time, you are prompted with a privacy policy statement that is presented in both a summary and a long form to be read before you click agree. And they have an icon that they show you whenever data will leave your device.

With them being the forward about it, I trust it way more.

If you don't believe me, go and read this[0] privacy policy on (arguably) the creepiest feature that Apple provides you (Siri).

Some quotes from it:

> Siri Data is associated with a random, device generated identifier. This random identifier is not linked to your Apple ID, email address, or other data Apple may have from your use of other Apple services.

> Siri Data and your requests are not used to build a marketing profile, and are never sold to anyone.

That immediately hits me differently from Google's policy (I read it a long while ago now), and it makes me view Apple with enough of a positive light to make the ecosystem jump.

0: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT210657

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by gowld on Monday September 14, 2020 @06:15PM (#24475774)
> Apple makes their money up front by me purchasing the device. That's why they're expensive.

Apple also charges 30% of much of your software and content purchases, and the hardest isn't particularly expensive relative to similar competitor hardware.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by freeqaz on Monday September 14, 2020 @07:18PM (#24476224)
> Apple also charges 30% of much of your software and content purchases

Ah, yeah. That's a good point!

> the hardest(hardware) isn't particularly expensive relative to similar competitor hardware.

Their margins are higher though because they are more vertically integrated. Especially on the higher end phones, they make serious $

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by RealStickman_ on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:23AM (#24469811)
You could try out LineageOSformicroG. (Basically LineageOS + microG + signature spoofing patch) It's not 100% of the user experience, but most things work well enough that it's worth it imo. (Running this daily on my OnePlus 3 since last year or so)
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by em-bee on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:13AM (#24469707)
/e/ ( https://e.foundation ) provides a google free android experience. i am quite happy with it.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by freeqaz on Monday September 14, 2020 @03:55PM (#24474388)
Thank you for sharing. This is awesome! It looks like they replace Google Play Services with MicroG and so this is (fairly truly) a full de-Google'd phone. I might try to flash this on my old phone sometime soon. :)
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dylan604 on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:30AM (#24470578)
How is anything Android Google free? Is Android its own separate entity not under the Google/Alphabet lineage? This has kept me from seriously considering Android as something I could ever use.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by colejohnson66 on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:00PM (#24471714)
They don’t mean it’s Android with no relation to Google; they mean that it’s Android with the Google parts removed.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dylan604 on Monday September 14, 2020 @01:29PM (#24472732)
I guess I'm asking what part of Android is not Google? I get trying to detach apps like GMail, Maps, PlayStore, etc. But if Google created Android, why is it assumed to be okay of doing Googly things?
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by em-bee on Monday September 14, 2020 @02:19PM (#24473327)
the concern is not code written by google, but code that depends on googles infrastructure, requires a google account, phones home, gives google control over my phone, is not released under a FOSS license (so i can't change it), anything that violates the users privacy...

so what /e/ is doing is essentially an audit of android, and an attempt to remove everything that is of concern.

it's a major project, and it's not complete. work in progress.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by gowld on Monday September 14, 2020 @06:17PM (#24475789)
Android core (AOSP) is Apache-licensed free open source.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by benologist on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:15AM (#24470391)
You can block a lot of apps individually from accessing the internet with NetGuard -

https://f-droid.org/en/packages/eu.faircode.netguard/

https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dontcarethrow2 on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:49AM (#24470792)
This and disabling google apps. Surprisingly not much of a difference in functionality, my data usage is low, downloaded local maps on OSM. Motorola something
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by iknowstuff on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:25PM (#24472010)
Fun fact, Google allows end to end encrypted backups, but Apple - due to pressure from the FBI - decided to keep access to your iCloud backups.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-fbi-icloud-exclusiv...

So if you use their cloud services, both Apple and Google have access to your photos, but Apple has access to all of your whatsapp and signal conversations, while Google does not (if you decide to password protect your backups).

And you have to use iCloud if you want to keep your 3rd party chat history safe, unless you jailbreak to extract it from the file system.

iMessage is of course purposefully flawed to allow for MITM.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by mafredri on Monday September 14, 2020 @04:05PM (#24474491)
This is not true for Signal, the conversations are safe as they are stored on device only, not in iCloud.

https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360007059752-Ba...

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by pseudalopex on Monday September 14, 2020 @04:00PM (#24474441)
Signal on iOS blocks even local backups, FYI.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by tandr on Monday September 14, 2020 @01:20PM (#24472635)
Yeah, death of Google Play Music will be remembered, and mentioned in the same saga as Google Reader's demise.

I would love to know how many subscribers of Google Music have they lost during this transition to YouTube music. Not that I think Google actually cares, and seeing how big companies BS themselves from inside, they probably sooth themselves with "it is temporary", "we will catch up on features", "they will come back".

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by vidanay on Monday September 14, 2020 @01:56PM (#24473072)
They lost me (I switched to Spotify), the problem is that now that I have cancelled my YouTube premium, YT is INCREDIBLY PAINFUL with ads.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by LegitShady on Monday September 14, 2020 @01:34PM (#24472786)
Everyone who paid for Google music for moved over to YouTube music. I don't think they've lost much yet. I hate the YouTube music app but the music and playlists are still there.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by tandr on Wednesday September 16, 2020 @03:39PM (#24496689)
Yes, I moved it too. Then cancelled the subscription altogether. I just cannot stand how badly everything sounds on it (everything is so "flat").

With Apple One now being announced, I am investigating if I can move everything there, but keep my Android phone for now.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by kop316 on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:04AM (#24469618)
Right now my android phone is GrapheneOS with no Google Play Services/Apps. I download everything via F-Droid. However like you said, there is a lot of functionality disabled.

I have a Pinephone and hope that sooner then later that I can use it full time.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by pc86 on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:37AM (#24469944)
I used Play Music and Inbox as well, and also just switched (3-ish months ago?) to an iPhone.

The YouTube Music app is not that bad, but definitely missing a feature or three that I used a lot on Play. It also seems to need to be manually started every time my phone connects to Bluetooth whereas Play would start automatically if it was the last thing that was playing on that BT connection.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by keanebean86 on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:29AM (#24470555)
Youtube music's biggest drawback is being required to subscribe to listen with the screen off. I was willing to change interfaces since I thought google play music was reasonable. Then my free trial ended.

I switched to Spotify and I'm glad I did.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by freeqaz on Monday September 14, 2020 @03:57PM (#24474407)
I use Spotify for 95% of my listening. Their ability to sync songs that aren't on Spotify though is pretty bad, and that's why I used Play Music. There are just some albums/bands that I want to listen to that aren't easily available without having the raw MP3 somewhere.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by danmg on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:45AM (#24470038)
I'm considering HarmonyOS for my next phone.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by sudosysgen on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:23AM (#24470484)
What makes you consider HarmonyOS? Just curious.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dvfjsdhgfv on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:00AM (#24469570)
For these rasons I use two phones. Apple for banking and communications involving personal data and Android for Gmail, music and ebooks.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by pc86 on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:38AM (#24469961)
Which one do you use the calls/texts?
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dvfjsdhgfv on Tuesday September 15, 2020 @03:02AM (#24478588)
Iphone for my family, Android for everyone else.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by extremeMath on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:49AM (#24469458)
Wait until you download all the same apps and get 0 privacy benefits.

The problem is barely Google. The problem are the Apps you download and giving full permissions.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by RealStickman_ on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:25AM (#24469825)
In terms of privacy you should be mostly fine if you stick to F-Droid and use microG instead of Gapps.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Tepix on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:48AM (#24469450)
If you go to the settings app and find "Music" there, you will find a toggle "Display Apple Music" - perhaps that will help.

I agree they are annoying.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by jonathanraiman on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:00AM (#24469573)
Super helpful tip. Wishing I knew about this years ago!
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by ubermonkey on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:24AM (#24469249)
Wow, I had no idea about the interstitial. I happily pay for Apple Music for the convenience / never-sync factor (and, if I'm honest, to make it easier for my wife to manage music on HER devices without having to hook them up to the server and download from our library), but that's a choice I made. If they're being obnoxious with an ad for people who just want to use the music app on their phone normally, that's really disappointing.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by vbezhenar on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:37AM (#24469355)
I'm using Music app without Apple Music subscription. They are not obnoxious, I think that's an overstatement. Yes, they remind about Apple Music, but that's quite a rare event.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by danlugo92 on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:15AM (#24469182)
Been a long time since I havent used apple devices (for unrelated reasons) this sounds so different from how they used to be.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by aphrax on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:20AM (#24469216)
Agree, about 7 years ago I spilt liquid on my MacBook Pro. They let me off the repair costs (significant, new motherboard etc..), just said be a bit more careful. Have recounted this story many times since, sad to hear things may have changed.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by machello13 on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:27AM (#24469278)
I've still encountered cases like that recently — I'm not sure the situation is any worse now (at least with support incidents). It's all just anecdotal.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by unicornfinder on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:58AM (#24469544)
I think to be fair it probably depends on which country you're in. In the UK I've found their support to be downright poor, even when compared to other device manufacturers, but I'm told in the US they're better.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by ksec on Thursday September 17, 2020 @01:56PM (#24507801)
All those free repair and decent Apple experience are all from US. Worldwide Apple Services tends to be crap.

I even heard in some part of the world Apple started to paid commission to Apple Retail Staff for products sales. ( They used to pride themselves the lack of conflict of interest and to provide the best services possible )

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by shantara on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:17AM (#24469750)
I had a similar anecdotal story just a couple of months ago. I've spilled a few drops of juice on my 16" MBP keyboard, which was enough for three keys to become sticky. They've replaced the keyboard and whole top case chassis for free without any comment and I got my laptop back in three days.

It was the best tech support experience I've had in my life.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by emeraldd on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:02AM (#24470241)
I wonder if this boils down to which level of support contract you buy?
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by aphrax on Tuesday September 15, 2020 @07:18AM (#24479934)
For what it's worth I had no additional support outside of a standard warranty..
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by mindfulhack on Monday September 14, 2020 @11:31PM (#24477632)
It's one thing for Apple's product quality (or quality control) to be less now that Steve Jobs is no longer with us. But it's another thing for customer-hostile dark patterns to become Apple's norm. :/ (I was subjected to the worst customer support experience of my life with the #KeyboardGate defect.)

Jobs was one of a kind.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by strogonoff on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:47AM (#24469436)
Counter-anecdote: I have spilled liquid on MBPs more recently (latest is 2019 MBP with touch bar) and didn’t need to bring them in for repair as they kept working after having been thoroughly dried.

Seeing reports about old laptops breaking from the same, I suppose the upside is that they are becoming less fragile.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by sbuk on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:07AM (#24469650)
I broke the screen on a new Macbook 2 years ago, days after buying it. It was entirely my own fault so not covered by warrantee. I called Apple support and was told £800. Since I bought it with an Amex card, it was covered on that insurance, so I made an appointment to get it replaced. I went to the Apple store and was given a formal quote of £645 parts + labour. They went off to get the paperwork and were gone for a while. When they got back, they told me that the part wouldn't be available for 3 months (it was a new release) and gave me a new laptop, free of charge, on the spot.

edited for clarity.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by jordache on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:48AM (#24470075)
Huh? Instead of charging you the cost of a repair, for that new unit, they just did a swap for you free of charge?
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by skygazer on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:37AM (#24470647)
Something similar happened with my two year old, out of warranty iPhone with maxed out storage. It had the original battery swollen. I assumed they would just swap out the battery and charge me, but they said they wanted to send the whole thing in to be inspected, and unfortunately they didn’t have any prior gen phones with that level of storage on hand, so asked if I would mind receiving a current gen replacement.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by buck4roo on Tuesday September 15, 2020 @03:22AM (#24478703)
This happens with automotive manufactures.

Vehicle breaks, the part or component that fixes it is unavailable/backordered/allocated for months+.

Manufacturers will offer to buy back the vehicle, at original sale price, rather than force you to wait (and relieving them from having to provide a loaner/rental).

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by sbuk on Monday September 14, 2020 @11:22AM (#24471222)
Yes.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Spooky23 on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:25AM (#24469827)
It’s a mass market set of products now, so different problems. Still, they are better than any competitor I’m aware of.

Their staff are more empowered than most companies though. Usually I’m able to get what I want with a minimum of fuss, you just need to go in person and be very calm.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by fomine3 on Thursday September 17, 2020 @03:00AM (#24501909)
The problem on Apple is that there's only option: pay much
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by floatingatoll on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:38PM (#24472159)
The replacement price issue there is probably both a protection against resellers and an incorporation of an expedite fee.

AirPods are made of three components: left earbud, right earbud, and charging case. More granular repairs are neither offered nor possible due to glues and so forth, though damaged parts can be recycled for scrap. So repairs can only replace those three parts in total, and perform no other purpose. This is still useful if you lose an earbud on the subway, or if your charging case lid snaps off, but it opens the door for an exploit as well.

If you have a set of AirPods and you want to jump the line at Apple to buy another set and sell them to someone else, you can simply 'lose' each piece of your set of AirPods. Once you have a complete set of all three parts, you can assemble a fully standalone AirPods and sell it, using the parts that you got from repair.

To prevent this, repair sets their prices for the individual parts to exceed the final unit price of the whole. This isn't a big deal if you damage one part only

Repair costs probably also include 'expedited priority' versus those purchasing new products for the first time, so if there was a waiting list of 4-6 weeks to buy new AirPods, repair's full replacement price would bypass that list and get you your replacements immediately.

They still should have told you on the phone that the repair cost exceeds the repurchase cost and offered to discount the price in exchange for whatever the current wait is for folks buying them on the website.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by arvindch on Monday September 14, 2020 @01:16PM (#24472598)
I find it hard to believe that Apple overcharges all of its customers, just to combat the minority of scammers. Just seems so unbalanced...

Also, aren't waiting lists usually due to manufacturing latency? Not arbitrary delays that can be bypassed via purchasing repairs? Moreover, no one can assemble a Macbook/iPad/iPhone by ordering replacement parts. Your example only holds good for Airpods.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by LexGray on Monday September 14, 2020 @03:20PM (#24474004)
I’ve seen articles online of up to 60% of repairs in some countries being fraudulent. A bit more than a minority sadly.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by stevehawk on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:18AM (#24469205)
oh my god apple music. it's the worst f'n music player ever. it's a sales pitch that happens to play music if you get through the bullshit.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by danpalmer on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:31AM (#24469304)
How is it a "sales pitch"? I've had it since release and haven't seen anything in it for sale?
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by sjg007 on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:34AM (#24469337)
They want you to subscribe
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by rytis on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:41AM (#24469387)
And who doesn't want that these days?..
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by canofbars on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:44AM (#24469410)
If someone didn't subscribe the first few times you ask, just stop asking. The 100th popup isn't going to change their mind.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by xenophonf on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:00AM (#24469560)
Somebody please tell the YouTube app that.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by toast0 on Monday September 14, 2020 @11:35AM (#24471397)
Somebody please tell the people making videos that.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by danpalmer on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:19AM (#24469769)
So using it without paying is a sales pitch? Is that news? Spotify's free plan is the same, YouTube Music costs money.

I don't think it's fair to criticise a paid product for asking for you to pay for it.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by oarsinsync on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:17AM (#24470419)
I paid for my music in the iTunes Store. Why are they spamming me with adverts for a streaming service I don’t want, that they offer no free tier for?
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dwighttk on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:01AM (#24469577)
Settings > Music > turn off “show Apple Music”

Should fix the stupid interstitial

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by OldHand2018 on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:38AM (#24470656)
No such option exists for the Apple News+ interstitial.

It's obvious that there is a bug in the code, I get the interstitial at random times, not only when I open the app. Wifi drops and then comes back? Interstitial right on top of whatever I was reading...

PS, am I the only person that puts a "cancel free trial for XYZ" in my calendar the minute I sign up for anything?

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by mikestew on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:42PM (#24472204)
am I the only person that puts a "cancel free trial for XYZ" in my calendar the minute I sign up for anything?

So much so, I have an "Add expiration reminder" iOS shortcut. Pretty sure I downloaded it from the Shortcuts gallery or something, it doesn't look like something I'd write.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dwighttk on Monday September 14, 2020 @03:54PM (#24474366)
Heh. I fix that one by not using Apple News.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Spooky23 on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:26AM (#24469836)
It comes back with some updates.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by odysseus on Tuesday September 22, 2020 @06:52PM (#24560942)
Had the same thing happen with my wife’s Apple Music 3 month trial.

She accepted the trial, then went into settings to cancel the subscription so she wouldn’t be automatically charged at the end of 3 months.

With no warning, the subscription was then completely cancelled with no ability to use the rest of the trial. (Unlike some other Apple trials.) When asking Apple Support about this, they referenced an obscure sentence in their terms and conditions. They could do nothing to re-offer the trial to my wife. So consumer hostile.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Abishek_Muthian on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:17AM (#24469746)
>Apple uses a lot of customer hostile behaviors nowadays

I think that's w.r.t personal experience, but they've been doing that for a very long time.

Remember the time Jobs told that we are holding the phone wrong?

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by parasubvert on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:16AM (#24470402)
The iPhone 4 was also one of their best selling models of all time (iPhone 6 I think exceeded it).

Geoffrey Moore’s “Inside the Tornado” makes an argument that companies deliberately need to become less customer focused when they’re in hyper growth mainstream adoption.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Abishek_Muthian on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:34PM (#24472108)
> companies deliberately need to become less customer focused when they’re in hyper growth mainstream adoption

But, Amazon doesn't seem to have done that. Someone even claimed Amazon sells customer service, they still seem to do so but at the expense of their employees.

Thanks for the recommendation of the book.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by rogy on Monday September 14, 2020 @04:19PM (#24474655)
Apples demolition of their entire universe of music products is unbelievably frustrating.

I know iTunes never got a great rep but it worked, and iTunes Match was fantastic. Now however they still charge for it, except its totally broken unless you instead pay for Apple Music (9.99/mo instead of 24.99/year).

Annoyed but there really isn’t much alternative on that front.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by odysseus on Tuesday September 22, 2020 @07:53PM (#24561429)
How is it totally broken? iTunes Match is working for me.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by deergomoo on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:09AM (#24470324)
Apple's pivot into services has just been the worst. They've been getting gradually stingier for years—to the point of it affecting product quality—but it's only recently they've started to add some scummy behaviour and dark patterns, and I can't see it getting any better.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by mlang23 on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:41AM (#24469386)
I was anoyed by Apple Music ads as well. To a point where I really started to hate them for that. I do not want a monthly subscription for a streaming service, I do prefer to buy what I want and thats it. After half a year of tapping "No thanks" it suddenly stopped. I am guessing they actually know that some of their customers hate the idea of music subscription. I havent seena Apple Music pop up since many moons.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by futurix on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:18AM (#24469762)
TV+ is a special case, because the trial period (1 year) is longer than the non-trial payment cycle (1 month).

Apple Music pop-ups are annoying, but I only saw them after some iOS version updates. There's also a setting to hide Apple Music features completely.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by JeremyBanks on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:07AM (#24470305)
I had an Apple Arcade trial, whose trial period matches the non-trial payment cycle, and the same thing happened.

There is one rule for Apple, and one rule for everyone else.

Tim Cook's Apple is more than happy to use the abusive customer-hostile patterns they deny others.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by watermelon0 on Monday September 14, 2020 @05:55PM (#24475589)
Hm, trial period (3 months) is longer than non-trial payment cycle (1 month) for Apple Music, and in my experience, you can still use it after cancellation, until the trial period expires.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Hamuko on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:26AM (#24469832)
>They’ve also quoted me more than a whole new pair to repair some AirPods Pro that I accidentally washed in the laundry.

Weird considering that the AirPods are not repairable. They just replace them.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by colejohnson66 on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:05PM (#24471773)
That’s probably why they quoted OP at full price. They were just going to sell them a new set.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Hamuko on Monday September 14, 2020 @01:42PM (#24472891)
But it says "more than a whole new pair". So not full price, more than full price. Which makes no sense whatsoever.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by pc86 on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:36AM (#24469931)
Curious what benefit you get from using Apple Music compared to any other streaming music service?
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Spooky23 on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:15AM (#24469726)
Their treatment of the music app is criminal. They always futz around with the controls.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by glitchdout on Monday September 14, 2020 @11:26AM (#24471277)
They completely destroyed the music app. And they prevent third-party apps from having the same APIs as their music app! I used to use Cesium but Apple even managed to break that app.

http://mike-clay-vma5.squarespace.com/blog/api-safe

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by dr_dshiv on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:51AM (#24470818)
I second this. However, I've been short on them for years and consistently wrong.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by csommers on Monday September 14, 2020 @11:55AM (#24471646)
Did they prorate the AppleTV at least? If not, that sounds like outright theft.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by eigenvector on Monday September 14, 2020 @11:58AM (#24471687)
The first year is $0 when you buy a new iPhone, so pro-rating wouldn't make a difference.

I often sign up for trials and immediately cancel (so I don't forget about them). That way it requires a positive action on my part to keep the subscription. That doesn't work if your access ends as soon as you cancel.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by bzb5 on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:33AM (#24469317)
You can completely disable Apple Music in settings.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by SirensOfTitan on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:37AM (#24469356)
Ah didn’t know this! Thank you!
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by Nextgrid on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:43AM (#24469404)
You shouldn't have to though. Apple Music can potentially be offered once, or advertised in the App Store/iTunes Store, but not in the default, local music player app.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by colejohnson66 on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:09PM (#24471819)
It’s simply targeted advertising. People are more likely to consider your ad if it’s related to what they are doing. In this case, it’s a music streaming service ad when you are going to play music. The ad wouldn’t be as effective if it was in the iTunes/App Store.

Now, the constant nagging? That’s annoying.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by macjohnmcc on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:19AM (#24470433)
yeah if you cancel a trial of Apple TV+ it is canceled with immediate effect. Seems harsh.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by extremeMath on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:48AM (#24469447)
>Apple uses a lot of customer hostile behaviors nowadays

Nowadays? Apple has been doing anti-consumer behavior for multiple decades. I remember only allowing purchased itunes music being exported in their specific format.

You'd have to burn them to a CD and rip it back to a useable format.

This isn't new, any educated consumer is well aware of how Apple plays.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by pilsetnieks on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:23AM (#24469814)
AAC is just a different format, and a superior one at that. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Audio_Coding)

Maybe you're thinking of the DRM'd files that couldn't be played back by other players, and even iTunes on other computers without your iTunes store account. In that case indeed burning a CD and ripping it would be one solution. They stopped selling DRM'd files completely by 2009, though.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by extremeMath on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:43AM (#24470023)
Ahh that was it.

But yep that's how we bypassed it.

I think I bought 6 songs before I found a better alternative. Reminds me how I had 1 iphone (6) and would never get one again.

Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by pilsetnieks on Monday September 14, 2020 @09:54AM (#24470142)
The DRM was not a whim by Apple, it was demanded by the labels, though. At the time that was the only way they'd even permit an online music store. I don't think there were alternatives that weren't just as locked down, unless you're talking about sailing the high seas.
Re:Apple Tried Charging the Price of a New MacBook Pro for a... by colejohnson66 on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:07PM (#24471796)
This is exactly it. Songs were 99¢ with DRM. In 2009, Apple managed to convince enough labels to sell DRM-free copies, but at $1.29. You could, at the time, “upgrade” your DRM copy to be DRM-free for 30¢ a song.