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Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Reubend on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:08PM (#37394776)
Could we get some more context than this tweet (which doesn't really explain what's going on)?
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by robbiet480 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:11PM (#37394809)
The game shown here, Midnight Club II, required the CD to be in the drive to play it. With the advent of Steam and companies releasing older games on Steam, they needed a way to bypass that check. Bypassing a CD (commonly called No-CD) was a very common crack/DRM bypass back in the day. Rockstar didn't want to bring up old source code and find someone who understood it enough to remove the check, so instead they just installed a No-CD crack into the existing EXE and uploaded the thing to Steam.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by jonny_eh on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:15PM (#37394876)
Razor1911 was the cracking group in this particular case.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by OnlyMortal on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:36PM (#37395138)
Heh. I recall their demos on the Amiga.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by tpmx on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:23PM (#37395730)
Perhaps Norway's most long-lived software export success. Founded in 1985.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by readyplayernull on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:15PM (#37396414)
Somehow I expected them to be founded since 1911, cracking those Analytical Engines.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by nikanj on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:13PM (#37397100)
It’s 0x777, making fun of all the l33+ 666 groups
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by OnlyMortal on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:32PM (#37397311)
666. My favourite error code to return when there’s a “wtf” error.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by gintoddic on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:20PM (#37394940)
understated context here
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bonestamp2 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:16PM (#37394889)
That's hilarious. I wonder what the license model is for the crack that they used.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by muttled on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:26PM (#37395777)
If there's not a name for it yet, can we call it "All's Fair in Love and Warez?"
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by mcronce on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:32PM (#37395860)
Also known as the AFLW 1.0 License!
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by rootw0rm on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:15PM (#37396406)
it's the "all rights reversed" license
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by kolanos on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:54PM (#37395354)
Did Rockstart have to license Razor1911's cracking software?

It would be ironic if Rockstar was in violation of Razor1911's copyright.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by baobabKoodaa on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:55PM (#37395373)
Sounds like Razor could sue Rockstar for copyright infringement. That would be hilarious.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by jiofj on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:18PM (#37395672)
They could. They would lose, though
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by wongarsu on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:40PM (#37395940)
A No-CD crack might not be transformative enough to warrant copyright protection as derivative work in the US. But they could sue in a jurisdiction that is more likely to give them a favorable outcome. Handling of derivative works and the minimum threshold for copyright varies considerably between countries.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Guvante on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:46PM (#37396011)
Likely Rockstar would counter sue for violating their original Copyright and the terms of use attached to them.

At best it would be a wash, there is a decent chance the damages for the countersuit would lead to a net loss.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by ArnoVW on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:04PM (#37396250)
The can sue them for anti-circumvention statutes in the DMCA. But not for infringement, since the developers did not do the infringement, they only enabled it.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by favorited on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @09:33PM (#37400332)
How did the cracked game enter circulation, if the crackers didn't redistribute it?
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by methou on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @12:32AM (#37401364)
In this very specific case, it's a no-cd patch, you can be a legitimate owner of the copy but for some very valid reasons that do not want load the CD every time you play the game. (Like disk and/drive wearing, or just don't like the hassle)
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by hnick on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @06:09AM (#37403205)
Do those statutes apply for interoperability? Which takes precedence?

This is basically how Rockstar used it - to make the game work on computers without CDs. So the actual rights holder has recognised that this tool or one like it is legitimately required for interoperability, between the game as a piece of technology and a modern computer. They won't work together otherwise.

Maybe I am being too tricky but that's how I see it. And if that makes it a legitimate work then it's funny to think about the consequences.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by ArnoVW on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @06:32AM (#37403332)
Certain excemptions are provided in the DMCA, and have been established via jurisprudenence:

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/10/28/2021-23...

Geeks often think that the law is some sort of blockchain-esque thing that is absolute, context-free and machine-interpretable.

In reality, many laws require 'guilty intent' (mens rea). This is why we have 'judges', who perform 'judgement'.

So the same tool called 'no-cd', marketed as a backup tool may be judged 'OK', where 'WaR3z HaCk.exe' published by a group of known software pirates will be judged 'anti circumvention'

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by account42 on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @09:19AM (#37404709)
NoCD patches are commonly distributed as an already-patched version of the executable, which would count as infringement.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by therein on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @06:08PM (#37398451)
After some short searching online, looks like for copyright infringement litigation, the statute of limitation is three years.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by freejazz on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:08PM (#37396311)
I don't think people on HN understand what a derivative work is, considering how often I see it referenced incorrectly. You can't make a derivative work without a license. That's why it's derivative. It derivates from the copyrighted work and is therefore within the domain of the copyright and under the control of the copyright's owner.

A Harry Potter spin-off about Hermione (I don't know anything about HP, sorry in advanced) is a derivative of the original Harry Potter work. As I'm sure you are well aware, you cannot sell copies of your Hermione spin-off, because that'd be copyright infringement, because it is a derivative work.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by dragonwriter on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:14PM (#37396393)
> I don't think people on HN understand what a derivative work is, considering how often I see it referenced incorrectly.

Very true.

> You can't make a derivative work without a license. T

You can, but it is a copyright violation to do so unless an exception (like Fair Use) applies.

A derivative work is also a work eligible for copyright in its own right, and as such is copyright by the creator by operation of law when fixed in a tangible form, whether or not it also violates someone else’s copyright.

> It derivates

“derives”

> from the copyrighted work and is therefore within the domain of the copyright and under the control of the copyright's owner.

No, producing it is within the legally exclusive rights of the copyright holder subject to the limitations on those rights, but once created the copyright in the derivative is not under the control of the copyright holder of the original (though transferring or licensing back may be part of the resolution of copyright violation lawsuit over its creation.)

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by antiterra on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @09:24PM (#37400260)
I thought Pickett v Prince established precedent that you can’t copyright an unauthorized derivative work.

See 17 U.S.C. §103(a), which says that derivative works can be copyrighted, but that does not extend to any part of the work in which such material has been used unlawfully.

(not a lawyer but I did audit this class at a law school)

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bri3d on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:30PM (#37396585)
If the patch is distributed on its own, without the original binary, is it still a derivative work? Is the unique, creative work of writing "perform XYZ instruction at XYZ address," in lieu of the original executable, still derivative?

This is actually an unanswered/unproven question that comes up quite a bit in automotive tuning, where individuals and tuning companies modify OEM calibrations and create application software patches which, while they are unique and perform stand-alone functions, run on top of OEM ECU software.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by EvanAnderson on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:55PM (#37397617)
The history of General Computer Corporation's[0] arcade enhancement boards is an interesting example of this kind of "derivative" work.

GCC made an enhancement board for Missile Command and later for Pac Man ("Crazy Otto", which became "Ms. Pac Man"). Rather than employing simple "ROM hacks" as other enhancement board manufacturers did, GCC specifically built their enhancement hardware not to contain any code copied from the original game ROM. Their hardware patched the existing ROM only by overlaying their code onto the original ROMs, not by copying any of the original code[1].

There's some neat detail in the background slides here[2]. I'd love to hear that talk but I'm not immediately a recording of it.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Computer_Corporation

[1] https://web.stanford.edu/class/sts145/Notes/3_game_business/...

[2] https://trilobyte.com/pdf/golson_ReplayFX_2015.pdf

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by lmm on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:33PM (#37399820)
> If the patch is distributed on its own, without the original binary, is it still a derivative work?

Yes, just as annotations are recognised as being a derivative work even without the original.

> Is the unique, creative work of writing "perform XYZ instruction at XYZ address," in lieu of the original executable, still derivative?

If you can convince a judge that, on the balance of probabilities, you were divinely inspired to write it with no connection to the original executable, then it's not derivative. But good luck with that.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by CapstanRoller on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:47PM (#37396833)
>you cannot sell copies of your Hermione spin-off, because that'd be copyright infringement, because it is a derivative work

But you can distribute it for free, as fanfiction.

Also, a no-CD crack does not contain any of the original work. It's akin to a program that you can use to modify, say, your legally-purchased Harry Potter ebook in order to change all instances of "wand" to "wang"

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bragr on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:30PM (#37397280)
Fan fiction is basically illegal, or at best in a deeply gray area, it's just that most people realize suing your super-fans is a bad move. There are exceptions of course, Anne Rice was famously super litigious over any attempted fan fiction of her characters which generated a lot of bad feelings online.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/88gqjz/anne-rice-really-hate...

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by PrimeMcFly on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:37PM (#37398114)
Paramount suing Star Trek fan productions is another great example. They recently took down the Wolf 359 audio book project for example.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by lmm on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:36PM (#37399849)
> But you can distribute it for free, as fanfiction.

Not legally.

> Also, a no-CD crack does not contain any of the original work. It's akin to a program that you can use to modify, say, your legally-purchased Harry Potter ebook in order to change all instances of "wand" to "wang"

Doesn't matter, it's still a derivative work, just as a translation or annotation that doesn't contain any of the original text is a derivative work.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by victorbjorklund on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:28PM (#37397262)
I'm not sure about american law but in EU (at least Sweden) you def get copyright to detivative work even if you don't have a license. If I create a derivative work based on Harry Potter the result will be that I have copyright to the derivative work BUT not to Harry Potter (I wish) so while I own the rights to my work I can't produce (etc) the work (at least not in a commerical capacity) because JK rowling owns the Harry Potter rights. However JK does not have the right to use my derivative work without a license from me.

A maybe more clear example is music. Songwriting is covered by copywrite. Singing is also covered by copywrite. If A writes a song and B sings the song without A:s premission it can be copyright infringment. However, A can not take a recording of B:s song and copy and sell it without B:s consent because B has the copyright to the performance (even if the performance was a copywright infringment).

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bombcar on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:08PM (#37399042)
You can skirt incredibly close, however - search Amazon for “unofficial Harry Potter”.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by freejazz on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @10:20AM (#37405561)
That just means they haven't been sued, there is no copyright czar that makes sure infringement never happens. Owners need to sue.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bombcar on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @10:54AM (#37406085)
It won't happen, as factual details can't be copyrighted.

So I can't write a story with HP characters, but I can't be copyright struck for writing that there is a book called Harry Potter that has these characteristics.

(The above is in the USA, other countries have different policies and rights.)

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by freejazz on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @11:21AM (#37406466)
Harry Potter isn't a fact. A book about the fact that Harry Potter was written and it's about wizards is about as long as that sentence.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bombcar on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @12:04PM (#37407081)
There are at least four books so far in the "unofficial" series, and if you believe that the companies involved wouldn't copyright strike it if they could, that's protected by the first amendment.

https://www.mugglenet.com/site/publications/

You can also find unofficial and unauthorized books in other settings, such as Minecraft, but you can argue that it's explicitly permitted as seen here: https://www.minecraft.net/en-us/article/commercial-use-guide... - but you can ignore those in the USA in many cases - here's one already: https://www.amazon.com/Minecraft-Monarchies-UnOfficial-Story...

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by freejazz on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @01:58PM (#37408657)
Okay, it's not "skirting incredibly close" to write those reference books, because they are in no way a substitute for the underlying fiction, which is why they would probably be considered a fair use.

>There are at least four books so far in the "unofficial" series, and if you believe that the companies involved wouldn't copyright strike it if they could, that's protected by the first amendment.

You have no idea what you are talking about. The first amendment isn't a defense to copyright infringement. transformative fair use with a de minimis copying is.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bombcar on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @02:06PM (#37408763)
I was saying that if you believed that the companies involved wouldn't strike these if they could, that belief is covered by the first amendment freedom of religion.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by freejazz on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @03:23PM (#37409900)
You said they were strikingly close to the line, they aren't. The implicit suggestion being one can just write harry potter fiction by referring to harry potter facts, you can't!
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by itiro on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:44PM (#37397480)
Most DRM crackers aren’t in it for money but to prove DRM is a flawed and ridiculous concept.

That was my scene back in the day when there was less risk of the Feds kicking in the door. At least back then most of us saw it as a learning experience.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by bogwog on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:36PM (#37395897)
Because Rockstar is a huge company, or because the dev wouldn’t have a case?
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by parineum on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:41PM (#37395950)
What's the copyrighted work here?
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by baobabKoodaa on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:57PM (#37396954)
Both the original game and the no-cd crack are copyrighted works.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by parineum on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:18PM (#37399128)
Who owns the no-cd copyright?
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by baobabKoodaa on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:58PM (#37399527)
Well, obviously the people who wrote it. They don't own the game, which they didn't make, but they own rights to the cracking code, which they did make.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by enos_feedler on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:28PM (#37398011)
Former cracker for rzr here :) did not do this game unfortunately.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by effingwewt on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:49PM (#37398242)
Thank you for your service o7
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by apgwoz on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @06:46PM (#37398861)
Oh, you "didn't" do this game, wink wink, nudge nudge. ;)
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by pizzafeelsright on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:21PM (#37399158)
Question for you from the 17 year old me.

Why did you do this? Fame? Money? Challenge?

I didn't know enough to so it myself and no one would teach me.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by blagie on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:48PM (#37399428)
Having done similar (not identical) things at that age, a lot of it is quite literally for the LOLs, and more than a bit is for community identity.

Fame: Non-existent, since you don't tell people.

Money: Non-existent, you don't get paid.

In retrospect, I think a major drivers for teenagers for a lot of activities is a sense of identity. You feel like one of the role models in [name your favorite hacker movie]. It's the same reason why punks wore spikes and mohawks, goths wore black, and people might pick a genre of music (even if privately). I'd guess a lot of more negative things, like vandalism, are similar too.

You become part of a community too.

And ultimately, you contribute to it. As much as it might be illegal, cracking software helps other kids who can't afford that software. Few real engineers will use a hacked copy of AutoCAD, and literally everyone I know began to pay for music once they could afford it. On the other end of the bell curve are kids who can't afford those. Providing them with access is a community service. And it's going up against The Man. It's illegal, but by the code of ethics we followed at the time, it was very ethical.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by joshmn on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @09:43PM (#37400425)
I've done something similar in recent past on a large scale:

I did it because it was interesting, I wanted to prove DRM is a flawed concept and broken construct, and because the community which I built (as a result) was really great and a home to me when I didn't ever experience one.

It was never about money or fame, it was about providing something to people that had a value. People said the "thing" I provided was better than the "real thing", and that gave me a sense of pride: I'd never get hired by the company that made "real thing" to make their "thing" better because I didn't have the credentials on paper.

But at least my "thing" was better.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Agingcoder on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @02:40AM (#37401958)
It’s a great way to learn - so challenge. There’s neither fame nor money here I think.

At least in the 90s there were lots of tutorials to learn how to crack/reverse engineer, from +orc’s documentation to fravia ´s fortress of reverse engineering - I’d expect similar tutorials to still be around.

Reverse engineering also happens to be a very useful skill as a regular software engineer ( debugging compiler bugs, figuring out why software X is behaving strangely and what it is doing etc ).

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by rmilk on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @04:08AM (#37402485)
Exactly true. Was a teenage software hacker, reverse engineered many games mostly because I was a bored teenager with free time and many games I legitimately bought. Mostly it was to cheat a little, like tweaking player stats or number of lives in a save file.

All that reverse engineering experience gave me a particularly useful talent as a developer: an uncanny ability to sit down and grok other people’s code almost like magic.

Solid experience with reverse engineering really is a good skill to have.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by wink on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @05:57AM (#37403140)
Depends on when the people did this and how complex the mechanism were at the time. I do remember just learning about JMP in assembler and that you could bypass a lot of stuff by changing a true to false or vice versa. Not exactly rocket science. (Not saying this to downplay anything, but what seems magical to many non-techies was actually very easy to do if you knew the trick, and it already worked for like 30% of the games - I'm not talking about the real stuff later on, not even sure how complicated NoCD was.)

On the other hand, probably 15-20 years after I had last used a crack for a game I had to implement some basic protection like this into a piece of software (more like: make sure the customer will not run this demo version forever) and it was fun to discuss in the team what we all remembered from back then and which measures were adequate to implement.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by enos_feedler on Thursday September 07, 2023 @12:05AM (#37414637)
I did it for unlimited access to t3 zero day ftp sites
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by 3abiton on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:14PM (#37399096)
I wonder if No-CD was released under a specific open-source license, that would be hilarious
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by yomlica8 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:14PM (#37395617)
Are we sure they didn't just lose the source code entirely?
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by rightbyte on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:22PM (#37395724)
Probably unbuildable anyways without a lot of effort if you can't recreate the workstation that was building it.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by fragmede on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:47PM (#37397517)
These days you'd save a VM image, but if we all move off x86, what good will that do?
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Moomoomoo309 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:26PM (#37397984)
QEMU can run VMs that are a different architecture than the host. There's obviously a performance penalty to doing that, but it can be done.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by michaelt on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:10PM (#37399061)
These days you'd save a VM image, in case you need to rebuild the code in 20 years.

Then in 20 years you boot up the image and find you can't log in because your cloud Windows account was deleted 10 years ago for inactivity, your build toolchain is too outdated to download artefacts, the vendor of your text-padding library deleted it in a fit of pique, your code-signing certificates have expired, the guy whose cell phone is on the corporate account 2FA left the company 15 years ago, the OS vendor won't allow new releases to use those obsolete, deprecated APIs.....

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by jamesfinlayson on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @11:03PM (#37400886)
You'd hope not, but it could be backed on something like a tape drive: too much effort to retrieve and then access.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by ewzimm on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:51PM (#37396071)
Did anyone at Rockstar ever confirm that it was an official decision?

I wonder if they did assign someone all that and they took a shortcut.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by rpdillon on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:55PM (#37398302)
This is a great example of how today's "piracy" is tomorrow's "only working copy left". I wish there were a more formal way to explicitly allow this, though I'm probably just pining for shorter copyright terms. This game was released 20 years ago, longer than the original U.S. copyright term of 14 years.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by chrisco255 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @06:30PM (#37398684)
Disney lawyers, meanwhile, are looking to extend copyright to 50 years beyond the life of the author's 3rd generation descendant or the heat death of the universe, whichever comes last.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by darth_avocado on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:05PM (#37399026)
The way things are going, the death of Disney may come quicker.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by red-iron-pine on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @09:44AM (#37405045)
based on what? their stock is taking a hit but they're still a big, scary corp, and will probably win the fights with FL's a-hole governor.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by raymond_goo on Thursday September 07, 2023 @01:43AM (#37415155)
Walt Disney share price declined 3.9% on Thursday to close at $82.47, its lowest level in nearly nine years, or since October 16, 2014. Investors expect more weakness in Disney shares in the next few months. https://www.livemint.com/market/stock-market-news/disney-sha...
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by BearhatBeer on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:34PM (#37399302)
Nothing's worth saving any more, cinema died with LOTR, gaming died with Morrowind, honestly nobody's going to lose out if say, all culture post 2008 was simply deleted forever. Could, in fact, help us in the future.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by nick-of-time on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:02PM (#37399559)
Bullshit, you're just being curmudgeonly. Hades, Horizon Zero Dawn, Baldur's Gate 3, lots of clever little indie games like One Shot, music like Rujnuj and Mana, and way more.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by moehm on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:32PM (#37399802)
"1. Anything that is in the world when you’re born is normal and ordinary and is just a natural part of the way the world works.

2. Anything that's invented between when you’re fifteen and thirty-five is new and exciting and revolutionary and you can probably get a career in it.

3. Anything invented after you're thirty-five is against the natural order of things."

- Douglas Adams

[dead]
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by wetbaby on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:17PM (#37399675)
Condescending AND wrong. A two-fer!
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by warent on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:12PM (#37399630)
"whichever comes last" got me haha
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Akronymus on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @07:18AM (#37403559)
One game I really loved as a kid, sim coaster, has a nocd crack floating around, sadly it blocks some needed features further into the game.

And I can't find any non-crack iso to load into the VM. (Can't rip it myself, due to not having a cd drive anymore)

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by demarq on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:20PM (#37394932)
Cracking was a 90s term for pirating software
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by itsnotlupus on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:22PM (#37394959)
Cracking is about removing anti-features, typically copy protections. It pairs well with pirating, but neither one strictly requires the other.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by nonethewiser on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:19PM (#37397168)
> Cracking is about removing anti-features

Anti what features? Piracy?

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by function_seven on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:42PM (#37397452)
Anti-backup, Anti-I-don't-have-a-cdrom-on-this-machine, Anti-I-lost-the-stupid-dongle, etc.

Like parent says, cracking and piracy pair well, but I've had to do it many times just for compatibility reasons, on software I had purchased.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by xxs on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:33PM (#37398055)
The anti-what-word-is-on-the-17th-page-3rd-paragraph-of-the-handbook was a very common on for so many games.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Dylan16807 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:46PM (#37397513)
And just anti-convenience! Nobody wants to swap CDs purely to tick a checkbox.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by nonethewiser on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @11:52AM (#37406901)
> Anti-backup, Anti-I-don't-have-a-cdrom-on-this-machine, Anti-I-lost-the-stupid-dongle, etc.

All perfectly understandable to me. But from the perspective of the people designing the anti-something system, wouldn't they call it piracy?

We can argue if piracy is a charitable enough name for bypassing copyright protections but that's irrelevant in terms of whether or not that is the thing the software provider is trying to do.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by phpisthebest on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:44PM (#37395231)
pirating software (movies, and music) is a term from the 90's by the MPAA, Riaa, and Games industry in attempting to link the act of simple copyright infringement, a civil non-criminal violation of the law to violent robbery on the high seas...

Cracking is a method of removing undesired features or inclusions from software, often licensing controls, or other anti-consumer features.

Many many many people "cracked" their software who where not eganged in the act of copyright infringement, they legally owned the software but for a number of reasons has no desire to run the invasive software bundled with the game or content they purchased.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by justapassenger on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:29PM (#37395813)
> Many many many people "cracked" their software who where not eganged in the act of copyright infringement, they legally owned the software but for a number of reasons has no desire to run the invasive software bundled with the game or content they purchased.

Yes, many people. But not “many many many” people. You try to make it sound like cracking to pirate was minority use case.

It was a valid use case, sure, but as big as using torrents to download Linux ISOs.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by PeterisP on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:41PM (#37396740)
I seem to recall that for some games the community recommended fix for performance problems was to install a crack so that the game wouldn't try to read stuff from the CD, which might be slow depending on the drive you have, and would be very slow if the CD has some scratch so the drive repeatedly attempted to read the same spot until it succeeded.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by justapassenger on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:56PM (#37397637)
Sure, and I don't question that. But at the same time - 99% of people outside of western countries had pirated copies of games (because it was legal in many countries, plus paying normal price was often month+ salary for a single game). Tons of teenagers from western countries (main gamers back in the days) had pirated games, unless they came from a rich family.

Cracks helped to fix some serious usability issues (as DRM removal nowadays also helps with), but let's not rewrite history to pretend that was what majority of people used them for.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by dylan604 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:50PM (#37395300)
my favorite use was for software that required a USB dongle. if you lost the dongle, you lost access to the software. there is not "back up" option. so the cracking community came up with a way to emulate those dongles. the obvious abuse followed. we used the software for legit 1:1 installs to physical dongle on blade servers where all of the dongles could not be installed
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by extraduder_ire on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:34PM (#37395878)
My favourite failure case of this is dongles on hardware devices, like lighting controllers. Especially when the dongle does in on an exposed edge of the device and can get knocked loose.

I've heard stories of them getting disconnected because they were bumped, and the whole unit goes dead five minutes later. At least it's not immediate.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Stibinator on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @11:04PM (#37400900)
I nursed my Lightwave dongle through my early career as an animator. I've lost so many pairs of glasses, several wallets, a couple of phones, but I know exactly which drawer that usb stick is sitting in now. Not that I reckon I'll ever touch LW again.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by mattw2121 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:06PM (#37395514)
The term "pirate" definitely predates the 90's and RIAA, etc. We used it quite liberally in the 80's BBS era.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by timmb on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:57PM (#37395391)
That was the scariest term they could come up with? The romantic swashbuckling seafarer, antagonising empires and declaring his own rules? Surely they could have done better.

'software fraud', 'software theft', 'forgery'... hmm well there's a reason I don't work in marketing obviously.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by mrguyorama on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @03:33PM (#37396628)
They did those as well, and they also paid for extensive marketing material to make it seem like buying a cracked game was directly contributing to a mafia that was planning on killing your granny.

Do you not remember the ads? The "you wouldn't steal a car"?

Piracy is just what they were able to get. Should have hired the bank's PR managers, who turned "failing to do due diligence on a customer's identity" into the customer's problem.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by SOLAR_FIELDS on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @07:54PM (#37399493)
Wasn’t it “You wouldn’t download a car”?

Which ended up being quite funny, because I very much would download a car

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by dron57 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:08PM (#37399605)
It was "you wouldn't steal a car". People on the internet rightly corrected it to "download".
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by retrac on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @10:09PM (#37400609)
Real piracy happens today. Men with machine guns in speedboats. It's not very romantic.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by TigeriusKirk on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:06PM (#37395513)
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by mjg59 on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:16PM (#37397142)
The use of "piracy" to describe unauthorised publication of a copyrighted work dates back to the 18th century, it's not something the MPAA came up with.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by lolinder on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:32PM (#37399801)
You're right! Etymonline traces it back to 1706 (without a source) [0], and I found it in the original Webster's [1]:

> A bookseller that seizes the copies or writings of other men without permission.

> PI'RATE, verb transitive To take by theft or without right or permission, as books or writings.

[0] https://www.etymonline.com/word/pirate#etymonline_v_16375

[1] https://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/Pirate

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by Bluecobra on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:34PM (#37398082)
Another alternative to cracking was to use something like DAEMON Tools to emulate the CD in the drive with an .iso so you could legitimately play multiplayer games without having to deal with stupid CD checks.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by hdjfkfbfbr on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @06:20PM (#37412189)
Daemon tools was the bomb
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by PrimeMcFly on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @01:50PM (#37395294)
I didn't feel old today until I jumped on HN and saw someone who didn't know what 'cracked' means in the context of PC games.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by IshKebab on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:19PM (#37397166)
He knows what cracked means. I think you misunderstood.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by PrimeMcFly on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:34PM (#37397331)
Not much room to misunderstand, and if he knows what cracked means what's going on should be obvious.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by paint on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @04:54PM (#37397609)
This seems like a weird hill to die on? yes it's obvious that rockstar (apparently) uploaded a cracked version of their game to steam. It's not obvious why they chose to do that (ie "what is going on")
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by PrimeMcFly on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:06PM (#37397750)
I'm not dying on any hill, I think that's a weird comment to make, let alone to make an issue out of my original comment at all.

The way the comment was phrased read as though they didn't understand what had happened, not that they didn't understand why. Especially since no one h as an answer to that, so no one can often an explanation.

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by paint on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:26PM (#37397982)
keep malding
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by PrimeMcFly on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:34PM (#37398084)
Great talk. Thanks so much for your input. I suspect you'll need to reply again, so have at it. Hope it helps compensate for whatever you need it to.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by barbs on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:45PM (#37398194)
> Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine.

> Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by PrimeMcFly on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @05:54PM (#37398287)
Yes. And what would you consider "keep malding" to be? In any case, I edited my reply to remove the snark.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by barbs on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @06:12PM (#37398485)
Not necessarily. You could understand that a cracked PC game means its copy-protection has been removed by someone illegally but not have a detailed enough understanding of the process to understand the tweet. Personally I'm not familiar with Razor1911 so I wouldn't have understood the significance of that string in the hexdump if it weren't for the context provided by other comments here.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by lolinder on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @08:11PM (#37399622)
I know what cracked means, but this didn't communicate anything to me. It seems that you'd need to both know what cracked means and know who "RAZOR 1911" is in order to get what's going on here from context alone.
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by magic_hamster on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @11:49PM (#37401140)
Considering the rapid change in HN audience I suspect this person is simply uninformed.
[dead]
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by novok on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:03PM (#37395468)
That sounds like zit lol
Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by CameronNemo on Tuesday September 05, 2023 @02:09PM (#37395558)
It sounds like something else too. Email [email protected] to find out.

https://www.npr.org/2023/03/20/1164654551/twitter-poop-emoji...

Re:Rockstar is selling cracked game copies on Steam by nottorp on Wednesday September 06, 2023 @04:16AM (#37402537)
I think that if you had a twitter account you could click on something and see more context.

Linking twitter has become worse than your average paywalled site, which you can look up on archive.something if it seems interesting.