News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jblow on Friday December 30, 2016 @02:34PM (#13286710)
Usually I have upgraded, but I currently have no intention of buying an iPhone 7 or later, unless they fix something!

For me it's a double whammy. I don't like the lack of headphone jack, and whereas I feel like I could manage grumpily ... for me it kills the excitement of buying the new device, and I think that is important. (My standard listening headphones are Etymotic ER-4Ps; there is no way I am going to downgrade to AirPods).

But the bigger part of the whammy is iOS. iOS is completely terrible at this point. I just can't consistently control the phone. A large percentage of taps or swipes do things I did not intend (how many I'm not sure -- 20%? 33%?) It's just completely crazy. They need to get rid of 3D touch, get rid of double-tap one-hand accessibility mode whatever it's called, get rid of weird swipes from the edge, fix the horrible inconsistencies in the way autocorrect works (or, please, offer a system that just underlines words-thought-to-be-wrong without changing them, and let me tap on them to change them, or use the current autocorrect system but let me tap on a word to un-"correct" it, the fact that the current system just changes what I typed and gives me no recourse to fix it apart from laborious deletions and re-typings, which I often have to do 2 or 3 times, is just haughty and offensive)... and in the meantime, might as well redesign the rest of the UI. Because right now the phone is not a joy to use, it's a constant exercise in frustration. I haven't felt good about using iOS since sometime back around iOS5 or 6.

So it's no mystery to me why sales might be slowing ... I don't want a new one if it's going to continue the downward trend.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by saurik on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:38AM (#13289857)
> They need to get rid of 3D touch, get rid of double-tap one-hand accessibility mode whatever it's called, get rid of weird swipes from the edge, fix the horrible inconsistencies in the way autocorrect works...

This is the same bullshit Apple has been doing with Mac OS X. I'm typing away in the terminal, doing something extremely productive, and suddenly my UI locks up for a second and I realize "shit, I must have accidentally timed a modifier key wrong and now I'm entering some crazy Mac mode" and then all of my windows fly around and I have to figure out how to get back to my terminal. I honestly don't understand why anyone wants any of these features, and if I did want them I'd want them to be super fast without the crazy slow animations, as every second I'm staring at them is a second I'm not working :/.

The one thing I can say is: just like on the Mac, you can turn most of this shit off on iOS. Essentially, they pretend that the only reason people would ever want to have an advanced option on iOS is because they are disabled, and so they hide everything under "Accessibility". You can turn off "3D Touch" and "Reachability" there. I'm not sure which edge swipes you hate, but if it is the one from the bottom, "Control Center" can be turned off (it is a top-level settings panel, turn off both "Access on Lock Screen" and "Access Within Apps"). You can also configure a lot about auto-correction under General/Keyboard.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by doomlaser on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:12AM (#13289955)
It's one of the critical flaws of Apple's modern design philosophy: Having a right mouse button would be too complicated, but hiding layers of complicated functionality through opaque multi-finger gestures, taps, and keyboard modifiers is A-OK.

And it's absolutely true that when Apple adds a new feature, it must have an accompanying slow animation tween to sell it. Frustrating.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Angostura on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:07AM (#13290262)
Since Apple has completely supported right mouse for 20 or so years now, I just think you're confused
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by justinsaccount on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:02PM (#13292196)
Large chunks of the UI do not support a two button mouse.

Wifi status in menu bar: left and right click on the icon do the same thing. To get the advanced menu you need to option click the icon.

Audio status in menu bar: left and right click do the same thing. To get the advanced menu you need to option click the icon. Additionally, 'scrolling' on the audio icon does not change the volume.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by doomlaser on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:35AM (#13290512)
They support secondary click, but they have never shipped a first party mouse with a standard right button, favoring sleight of hand input schemes to trigger a right-click — schemes that are not immediately discoverable.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by nkoren on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:11AM (#13290589)
The mouse they ship -- the Magic Mouse -- issues a right-button click when you click on the right side of it. There's no slight of hand: it's a two-button mouse.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jdietrich on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:20AM (#13290607)
Apple seem to have a terrible blind spot for mice. Ive-era keyboards have been consistently excellent, but the mice have been consistently awful. Remember the horrendous hockey-puck mouse that shipped with the iMac?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by grzm on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:30AM (#13290626)
The USB mouse ("hockey-puck") was particularly bad, as it wasn't easy to orient. The Might Mouse trackball was pretty bad, too. The others didn't have major deficiencies in my opinion. What in particular do you find fault with the others?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jdietrich on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:38PM (#13293597)
The Pro Mouse had one button when five were becoming standard. The Mighty Mouse would only right-click if you lifted your index finger off the mouse entirely. The multitouch on the Magic Mouse is woeful in terms of discoverability and frustratingly erratic. Ergonomics have been consistently poor, owing to Apple's refusal to make a mouse that actually fits the human hand. None of their mice are comfortable in palm grip, because they're needlessly low and flat. The rounded edges and gloss plastic of the Mighty Mouse and Pro mouse are difficult to control in fingertip or claw grip.

By comparison, Microsoft achieved near-perfection in mouse design with the venerable Wheel Mouse Optical 1.1a. After more than a decade, that mouse is still perfectly usable for competitive gaming. Contemporary high-end mice from companies like Steelseries and Zowie imitate the shape of the WMO very closely, because it's exceedingly comfortable for a wide range of grip styles and hand sizes.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by grzm on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:28PM (#13294210)
The Pro Mouse had one button when five were becoming standard.

Apple has always produced mice that have at most one physical button, while providing in the OS to support third-party mice that have more. This isn't something that started with Ive. There are plenty of people who think Apple should produce mice that have more than one button throughout its history.

Having used all of these mice extensively, primarily in desktop publishing and programming environments, I haven't found any of the issues you mention a problem. That's not to say others haven't. I enjoyed using the Magic Mouse in particular. I never had any ergonomic issues with any of them, other than the Apple USB mouse.

You mention gaming, and I can see how none of Apple's mice would be good for this. And it's great that there are third-party companies producing great mice, and have been for a long time. (Speaking of Microsoft, I've heard great things about their keyboards as well.) Given my (admittedly personal) experience with Apple's mice, I find the phrasing "consistently awful" to be hyperbole and unwarranted. That's not to say they're the best. There's a wide range between "near-perfection" and "consistently awful".

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jdietrich on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:58PM (#13294489)
Apple are supposed to be the paragon of industrial design, but their mice tend to fall prey to style over substance. Their mice designs look lovely, but there's no ergonomic rationale behind their shape. If you think that the Magic Mouse is satisfactory, I'd suggest trying some genuinely high quality third-party mice - the Logitech Marathon or MX Master, or anything by Mionix or Zowie. I think you'll be shocked at the difference.

Gaming is the extreme case for mouse use, but it's not an edge case. A good gaming mouse is simply a good mouse - not a puck that you push around the desk, but an extension of your hand with a sensor underneath. eSports gamers simply demand an excellent sensor and high-quality switches in an ergonomic package.

https://mionix.net/mice http://zowie.benq.com/en/product/mouse.html

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by flamedoge on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:54AM (#13290385)
is this the beginning of the end of Apple domination?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by cma on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:19AM (#13290291)
I was telling my dad over the phone to drag a file, and it wouldn't work. Apparently if he pressed too hard it engaged force touch or whatever and would just drop the file randomly. It dropped it in a random folder and he couldn't find it again.

They really started screwing up the core UI with just adding things for the sake of adding things.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by lstamour on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:47AM (#13291235)
Yes, drag and drop is very difficult on the new trackpads when "tap-to-click" is enabled also. I somehow end up "force-tapping"...
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spinningarrow on Saturday December 31, 2016 @12:00PM (#13291833)
Three-finger drag has been saving my life (it's hidden somewhere in Accessibility - Keyboard - Trackpad - Drag)
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by stcredzero on Thursday January 05, 2017 @01:21PM (#13329769)
"macOS" is unusable for me without three finger drag. But then I have to deal with deciding between two or three finger dragging. Why not make everything work either way? It seems like requiring the user to remember UI engineering details to make the UI work properly. ("This is a toolbar, so you should three-finger drag that, but that is a map, so you should two-finger drag to reposition that. But this other web-based map needs a three-finger and zooms from two finger dragging. Is that an Apple API implemented map?")
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by lostlogin on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:52AM (#13289903)
Got a good chuckle out of me - it's like something my parents would say "I didn't do anything and the things are moving around". It's rather less funny when I do accidentally. I've never seen anyone do any of those things intentionally.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by raquo on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:48AM (#13290541)
> I'd want them to be super fast without the crazy slow animations

I wonder if you mean standard-duration animations or their really-slow variations. Adding Shift to any OSX hotkey that involves animation will slow it down 20x or so (e.g. Cmd+Shift+F3). I guess it was originally introduced for show-off purposes, but it's weird how that still exists.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by diamondo25 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:01AM (#13290562)
Shift + clicking on a folder in the launchbar also slows down the animation of it opening.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by manigandham on Sunday January 01, 2017 @09:00AM (#13295736)
As a 1-week user of the iPhone 7, 3D touch has been the only new thing I really like. The apps I use seem to have made good use of it to improve UX, even though the rest of iOS seems is bulky and slow now.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by madeofpalk on Saturday December 31, 2016 @11:24AM (#13291626)
Going to be completely honest here - this isnt something I can sympathise with.

If you do the wrong thing on any computer system and I'm sure something unexpected would happen.

I'm not saying that "you're holding it wrong", nor do I know 100% what you're talking about, but I don't think its entirely fair to complain like that about a computer system that you're not using 'correctly'.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Longhanks on Friday December 30, 2016 @02:50PM (#13286867)
I can definitely relate to that. Using iOS at this point frustrates me so much that sometimes I pull out my iPhone 4S running iOS 6 to remember what a wonderful UI and UX that was.

The bigger problem is the lack of alternatives. Android is such a mess of inconsistencies and bad UX, added to that are the problems with system updates, lack of a proper flagship device (the Pixel is a joke compared to the iPhone 6s in my opinion), and the fact that I don't like the Google ecosystem very much because of the way Google handles my data.

I really hope Apple gets back on track with iOS or Google finally nails it with Android so there would at least be competition. But at the moment, using 'mobile', for me, is more frustrating than it was in 2012.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by pdimitar on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:03PM (#13286963)
So much this, damn. 2016 felt like everybody was just walking backwards.

I share your sentiment about Google. They look like they only do the minimal effort possible for Android not to die -- and since they get a lot of user data and ad revenue, they're not trying very hard since they're not taking hits in the wallet. That's not good enough for me, and IMO many other people. I personally have been witness to 3 tech-savvy businessmen who were excited to support Android finally give up and go full Apple. It was a pretty sad story listening to their motivation but I can't blame them because I found myself in 99% agreement with them.

I have the Exynos S7 Edge which for me is pretty much the one and only Android device which is close to perfect. I plan holding on to it until I see something that really excites me, until the release of iPhone 7s / 8 that is. If I like the 7s / 8 I'll just buy that and honestly call it quits with smartphones for at least 2 years.

Had enough of being milked for money for practically no upgrades at all for quite a while. Only Samsung and Apple are really trying -- mostly in the internal storage space.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by beezle on Saturday December 31, 2016 @11:56AM (#13291810)
"They look like they only do the minimal effort possible for Android not to die"

I can understand some Android users have frustration over carrier issues. But every version I have used has been a significant improvement over the prior, especially under the hood. I suppose one can argue that Android allows for too much end user customization (directly or by third party) but I would rather suffer that than the alternative.

Android also runs on old harware. My LG G2, ancient by many measures, runs Android 7.1.1 via AICP and is more responsive in every way than the original stock 4.3. Unless I shatter the screen, there is no reason to replace this phone. Granted, custom ROMs are beyond grandma but for anybody with marginal tech know-how there are step-by-step guides to upgrade. Yet, iPhone owning friends with older models first complain about iOS updates being 'slow' and then eventually run to the store to "upgrade" their phone to the latest iVersion.

IMHO to say Google does just the minimum, especially compared to iOS, is not really the case.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by pdimitar on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:49PM (#13293068)
Android is an awful offender in terms of allowing every app under the sun to run in the background however. Does stock Nougat have a system app that allows you to white/black-list which apps can/cannot run in the background?

Samsung's SmartManager allows you to do so and it improved my battery life. Not by 100% but having in mind how notoriously bad Android's standby battery life is, even 2 more hours of SOT is a huge win.

What I am trying to say -- and I don't disagree with all your arguments, please have that in mind -- is that Google can step it up a lot more on the front of the housekeeping, yet they don't.

How long is gonna take for all us techies to realize that the non-tech people hate maintaining tech? Why doesn't Android (and iOS) have mechanisms for never allowing the device's cache to exceed a certain amount, for example?

Again, I don't disagree with you: your arguments are fair, but I believe mine are too.

EDIT: One of the things that seriously alienated me from Google's "vanilla" take on Android is them never allowing mobile Chrome to have content blockers. The amount of trash scripts and popups/popdowns out there on the web is astounding. Actions speak louder than words. I guess they don't want their scripts being blocked as well. That, or they are incompetent.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by xorxornop on Sunday January 01, 2017 @02:42AM (#13295017)
Yes. It has a high degree of control for that. I use many of these features; am running stock 7.1.1 Nougat on a 64GB Nexus 6P.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by pdimitar on Sunday January 01, 2017 @06:00AM (#13295395)
Would you point me at a web source? I'm considering a Nexus 6P with Copperhead OS, not Google's vanilla Android however.

I am very curious to find alternatives to Samsung's SmartManager.

BTW I am not talking about the "Data Saver" feature. I am talking about iOS-level of disallowing apps in the background -- they are killed and not allowed to run a single millisecond on the CPU, no questions asked. The "Data Saver" is a very minor and niche improvement.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by b2600 on Friday December 30, 2016 @05:35PM (#13288089)
"the Pixel is a joke compared to the iPhone 6s in my opinion" That's a very unusual opinion. Most reviews I've seen contradict this. Hell, you could compare the 6p with the 6s and the iPhone would win (in my opinion) but it wouldn't blow it out of the water. I haven't had hands on with the Pixel yet so I'll reserve my personal judgement but I have owned the 6s, the 6p, and the iPhone 7 (daily driver). Furthermore, it made be different in your use case but most iPhone users have all sorts of Google apps making the ecosystem argument irrelevant.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tw04 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @12:44AM (#13289694)
I have a pixel and an iPhone 6. Several close acquaintances with 7s. I have no idea what OP is talking about, but everyone I've talked to that sees the pixel and has an iPhone tends to have the reaction of "Wow, I'd actually consider dumping my iPhone after seeing that". Heck, one buddy actually returned the 7 and bought a Pixel because he was so frustrated with the 7 (didn't like the new home button, lack of headphone jack, buggy iOS updates, etc).

I'm not sure what about it he considers a "joke", but it's one of the best phones I've ever owned. It's what Android was always meant to be.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tenpies on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:25PM (#13287131)
> I pull out my iPhone 4S running iOS 6

Does iOS still spam you multiple times per day to "upgrade" to the latest version of iOS? That sort of constant nagging has me seriously thinking of ditching Apple products entirely.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by throwanem on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:15AM (#13289963)
This happens because you have the iOS 10 update (or whichever version) downloaded but not installed. If you delete the update from Settings -> General -> Storage & iCloud Usage -> Manage Storage, and turn off automatic app updates so it doesn't get downloaded again, the prompts go away.

Worked for me on iOS 9.3.5 after another HN user recommended it, anyway. Older versions I'm not sure about, but it can't hurt to try.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by enraged_camel on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:01PM (#13287405)
It annoys the hell out of me when apps do this, but I'm very forgiving when it comes to operating system upgrade prompts. The reason is simple: unpatched/out-of-date operating systems tend to have a lot of security exploits. This is also why I've learned to live with Windows 10's mandatory updates.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:53AM (#13290047)
It would annoy me a lot less if Apple (and the rest of them, to be honest) didn't just change stuff for the sake of change. Like oh hey, let's change four finger swipe up gesture to not be a toggle. Just because. Or, oh hey, let's just remove your battery life indicator. Ugh. Makes me scared to update anything.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by johnny22 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:27AM (#13290756)
Is it really just because? I've seen this mentioned before, but there must be some reason right?

I've never owned an iPhone (or any i* devices), so I have no experience here, but aren't the folks at Apple likely to do stuff for a reason? Or are things really that bad?

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Sunday January 01, 2017 @06:05PM (#13297935)
I try very hard to understand why they do some things, and come up short. With a lot of the minor UI tweaks, it's certainly not based on any real-world research, because some of the tweaks go against what's already established or being published in journals.

They probably do have reasons, but as to what they are, no idea. And as to whether their reasons are beneficial to the user, in many cases I can say no, absolutely not.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by throwanem on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:26AM (#13290920)
They've recently screwed up enough things badly enough to severely abrogate user trust, and I don't think they even realize it.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Godel_unicode on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:04AM (#13290080)
Serious question: why do you not use the "upgrade during off-hours" option? With my iPad it usually takes a few times because it's not on the charger that often. I always assumed a phone would be (I'm on Android).
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by kevinh on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:00AM (#13290244)
I assume they don't want to upgrade. I wish I had just put up with the incessant upgrade nagging/trickery because of how much I dislike iOS 10, especially with how much they changed basic stuff that I have muscle memory for.

I actually wish I could go back to iOS 6, but I've never been a fan of the flat UI style.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tempodox on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:56AM (#13290234)
Because just blindly upgrading is a REALLY bad idea, as with OS X. I wish I could downgrade some of my iDevices to an earlier OS.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by kombucha2 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:06AM (#13290864)
made the mistake of upgrading a friends \phone thinking it needed it like an android device...nope basically bricked it. I mean the 4s worked but but it was essentially not usable at that point. Gotta love planned obsolescence.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by PunchTornado on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:12PM (#13287495)
Isn't Apple just as bad as google with user data?

I feel that all of them, apple, google, facebook, amazon, they all disregard our privacy.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by nicky0 on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:39PM (#13287690)
Actually no, privacy is a point of difference between Apple and the other companies. Apple has very different philosophy regarding user data. Generally they try to keep it on your phone and they don't suck everything up into their datacenter, as they aren't in the business of selling ads. That's why their "intelligent assistant" stuff isn't as good as Google's.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by X86BSD on Friday December 30, 2016 @05:01PM (#13287857)
Google sells your data for $$. It is their main income stream. Apple doesn't. They don't want your data and don't enter markets in fact because they don't want to monetize you or your data.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by kalleboo on Saturday December 31, 2016 @12:57AM (#13289731)
Google sells access to your data for $$ (i.e., ads). They wouldn't sell the data itself, that would devalue it.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by lostlogin on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:56AM (#13289918)
It's somewhat reassuring seeing Apple stand up to the FBI, which I haven't seen any other company of their size do. There may be other examples but I've missed them.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Godel_unicode on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:06AM (#13290091)
Potentially relevant (although less so with no more fire phone)

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/...

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Infinitesimus on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:03AM (#13290692)
Didn't Apple recently start selling targeted ads for the app store?

Not the same as Google/FB of course but the fact that they can target an ad based on some profile means they have the data.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tomwilson on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:23AM (#13291104)
They're not really targeted. You just purchase keywords for your app and then they can display it at the top if someone searches for those words. They're not doing anything fancy like seeing what other apps you have or using any of the information they may or may not have about you.

http://searchads.apple.com

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by krrrh on Friday December 30, 2016 @05:17PM (#13287979)
They could hardly be more different. See:

https://www.apple.com/privacy/

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by PunchTornado on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:14PM (#13293714)
Pff. All bullshit.

  Finally, I want to be absolutely clear that we have never worked with any government agency from any country to create a backdoor in any of our products or services. We have also never allowed access to our servers. And we never will.
Did they forget that they participated in PRISM since 2012???

All empty words if you ask me.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by adamlett on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:19AM (#13290116)
I feel that all of them, apple, google, facebook, amazon, they all disregard our privacy.

You feel that?

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by X86BSD on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:59PM (#13287841)
Don't get me started on Google. They are so huge only because they had a halfway decent search engine. Their Android OS as you note is a mess. And you think that's bad? You should try their TV/DVR app on their Google Fiber service. It is a complete tire fire. Google absolutely SUCKS at UI.

I won't argue about Apple, they are not perfect, they are after all human, but for the love of $DEITY they seem to be the only ones capable of decent UI. It always needs polish, OS X, iOS etc, but its much better than the tire fire alternatives out there.

And people complaining about the lack of headphone jack, Samsung, as usual, copied apple right after and removed it too. So, whatever.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Godel_unicode on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:15AM (#13290110)
> Google absolutely SUCKS at UI.

My favorite Google UXs (by FAR) are Chromecast and Google Home. Especially together, they're magical. Is it a coincidence that there's no GUI there (OK, there kind of is for Chromecast, but only just)?

Google Home can pause/resume anything playing on any Chromecast or group of Chromecasts, even if Home didn't start the playback. It (play/pause) even works with apps like Plex which Google Home knows nothing about. It's gotten to the point where I'll find myself getting up to go to the bathroom at the movies and almost saying "OK Google, pause theater" (I'm not being hyperbolic, the thing which stopped me was not knowing what word went at the end of the command). Great UX, but no GUI.

Update: I use and love Android, but I wouldn't call it magical. It fits my usage patterns, but it definitely has some rough edges.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by smcl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:20AM (#13290121)
In your usability rants I have every one of those problems too (particularly autocorrect and swiping). I wonder how widespread this is? I'd like to add four more:

1. iTunes is slowly degrading into a usability nightmare - recommendations are often albums I own and bought from Apple!

2. the OS itself seemingly picks apps at random for the "play" button on the "swipe-up" menu. Like I might play a podcast on, say, Monday morning and then switch to music - but for the remainder of the monday and some of tuesday when I pause, lock and then later use the "swipe-up" menu it tries to resume playing the podcast not the music. not to mention this menu has two tabs, and switching between them involves a swipe - which usually triggers some of the sliders (Brightness, volume, position) on the screen. This clearly didn't go through any UX testing.

3. no way to disable "voice control" home key shortcut - my iPhone 6S has an AWFUL habit of interpreting background noise as "Dial my ex girlfriend". I somehow can't kill the call before it starts ringing, but usually I don't see it because something has pressed the home button in my pocket. It's truly embarrassing.

4. "Do you trust this computer?" for the millionth time, yes!

This is my last iPhone, I think.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by legodt on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:30AM (#13290145)
>iTunes is slowly degrading

That is incredibly generous considering the past decade of itunes, especially for Windows users. So much bad code, legacy cruft, and inconsistent UI decisions

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tdkl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:48AM (#13290209)
I'm a Windows user and love iTunes. There's just isn't any piece of software that lets me sync all my selected playlists with a single click via Wifi to Android (iSyncr app) reliably. I can also use a remote to navigate (Retune app) and access whole library.

Too bad there's no other contenders on Linux as well, there's a million players, but no syncing because apparently it makes more sense in 2016 to sync a song with uploading it to an other computer (teh cloud™) then download it back instead of copying it locally within 1m of proximity.

Surely it has grown into a behemoth with managing iPhones, online Music etc., but one can simply not use that.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by swiley on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:24AM (#13290617)
Rsync works well for me but I don't use much of the android specific apps. I think now that they fucked around with the storage permissions it might not actually be possible without root.

Phone OSes aren't rocket science, at this point I just want a phone that has buildroot support, even if that means it lacks a GUI.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tdkl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:04AM (#13290694)
With sync I mean full oneway sync with playlists created in the music player. I create a playlist which I'll then listen too in iTunes and with 2 clicks it's fully existing on the phone, with the .m3u playlist file, recognized by the media player. If I add/remove songs, change sorting in that playlist, the result is completely synced on the phone. I didn't find anything simple as this without extra fuckery and praying I can rely on it. It just works.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by swiley on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:51AM (#13291248)
Rsync can do two way sync, the only two exceptions are:

1) deletions don't sync

2) colisons are resolved by overwriting the side that is synced last

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by plorg on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:56PM (#13293657)

    --delete
is your friend
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jacobush on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:13AM (#13290597)
Plex (premium) works surprisingly well for me with music. Can sync or play from server. Should work in Linux too. https://launchpad.net/~plexapp/+archive/ubuntu/plexht
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tdkl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:07AM (#13290705)
> Tip!: The Mobile Sync feature requires an active Plex Pass subscription for the main Plex Media Server account.

Paying for being able to transfer files within 1m ? Yeah no. Thanks for the tip though.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jacobush on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:57AM (#13290835)
Well iTunes is not free either. I paid lifetime fee. It's expensive but to me worth the peace of mind. And should Plex go bad, it forces you to keep your files in a decent structure, so I feel confident I could migrate them to some other solution pretty easily, should push come to shove.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tdkl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:45AM (#13291230)
iTunes as in software is free. My music is mainly electronic livesets, nothing DRM, so all the streaming services mean nothing to my taste.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jacobush on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:37PM (#13294235)
Well, iTunes runs only on Windows and OSX, neither of which are free. Nitpicking maybe. I don't like streaming services either except my own. What did you mean by that "within one minute"? I didn't understand that.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by mustacheemperor on Saturday December 31, 2016 @10:54AM (#13291503)
Given the thread, I think the fact that your solution is based around an android phone is telling.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tdkl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:07PM (#13292229)
Well iTunes already syncs to iPhones natively in the same manner, also via a wireless connection. The only difference is that you control which playlists are synced in iTunes itself (not whole library, checkmark beside playlist), not on device.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by xorxornop on Sunday January 01, 2017 @02:39AM (#13295012)
Uh, you could just sync the playlists (and the music, too, if you wanted) to Google Drive or Dropbox. Drive is the better option if you want integration.

Google Play Music (or any other music app) will then pick up the synced playlists

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tdkl on Sunday January 01, 2017 @08:37AM (#13295686)
> apparently it makes more sense in 2016 to sync a song with uploading it to an other computer (teh cloud™) then download it back instead of copying it locally within 1m of proximity.

From the original post.

Been there done that, waiting in a full sport gear in the room for a playlist to sync going around the fucking planet while being 1m apart.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by zouhair on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:02PM (#13294124)
Did you try MediaMonkey?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by smcl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:34AM (#13290163)
Ah so I typed "iTunes" instinctively, but I meant the iOS app - guess it's called just "Music".

The desktop iTunes is a horror show in and of itself :D

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by function_seven on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:31AM (#13290149)
Weird. My experience is opposite of yours. When I try to adjust the brightness or volume, the damn thing swipes to the next card instead!

Also weird: My opposite experience is just as maddening :)

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by smcl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:32AM (#13290155)
I've actually had this too, but the other use-case is more common for me (I adjust volume using the buttons, and rarely change brightness). I think it's the flat-UI thing where it's hard to see the boundaries of the slider element - so I would maybe not swipe near it if there was a little boundary, and you wouldn't swipe outside it.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by krmmalik on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:59AM (#13291026)
I'd like to add Airplay issues to your list please. Airplay used to be magic and extremely dependable. Now it just randomly cuts out on me, things don't work first time around 30% of the time. It takes a number of goes sometimes to get things to work the way they did the day before. Its a nightmare.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by daigoba66 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:49AM (#13290809)
Thankfully you can turn off voice control in iOS 10. Settings -> General -> Accessibility -> Home Button.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by smcl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:46PM (#13294086)
You just became my favourite person of 2017 so far - thanks heaps!
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by ihuman on Friday December 30, 2016 @02:42PM (#13286787)
>My standard listening headphones are Etymotic ER-4Ps; there is no way I am going to downgrade to AirPods

The phone comes with a 3.5mm to Lightning adapter, so you can continue to use your existing headphones.

Also, you can disable 3D touch and reachability (the double-tap home button thing) in the accessibility settings, if those are causing your issues.

>offer a system that just underlines words-thought-to-be-wrong without changing them, and let me tap on them to change them

If you disable auto-correction in the keyboard settings, it acts just like that.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Washuu on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:05PM (#13286977)
> The phone comes with a 3.5mm to Lightning adapter, so you can continue to use your existing headphones.

Yeah, no. When will I need this dongle? Exactly when I left it somewhere else. Then Apple will need a "Find my Dongle" application next to all the other "Find my*" applications.

I am not going to buy expensive spare dongles just so I don't rage when I realize I left the dongle at work so now I can't listen to music in the garage while I work on my projects. I am not going to carry it around all the time with my phone just in case I need it. The removal of the 3.5mm jack is a failure by Apple.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by ihuman on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:20PM (#13287095)
I just keep mine connected to my headphones, since I use them more with my iPhone than a computer. Also someone made a cool keychain to attach it to if that works better for you. [1]

> expensive spare dongles

They're only $10 USD.

[1] https://uncourage.com/

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by legodt on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:36AM (#13290171)
Why are people so desperate to defend this clearly user hostile move? A dongle is a poor user experience and continues to degrade user experience over time. The fact that there was a market demand for a "cool" keychain shows how unnecessary the removal of the jack was. Believe it or not, people enjoy using things without unnecessary accessories that you have to keep track of and swap around
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Washuu on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:21AM (#13290300)
I think the best use case for a dongle would be the first MacBook Pro I bought. They had phased out the VGA port for a DVI port, but included a DVI to VGA adapter in the box. The great thing about that is it simple a physical wiring adapter with no other logic inside. It worked well and no one complained since carrying the adapter in the bag with the laptop is not a big deal.

In the case of the iPhone 7 the laptop bag is my pocket which has much more limited space and a hard connector getting situated in the wrong spot could end up being uncomfortable until readjusted. Additionally it is not just a wiring adapter. The Lighting to 3.5mm adapter actually contains a DAC and ADC inside of it which unfortunately causes the audio quality to suffer slightly compared to a higher quality dedicated DAC/ADC solution inside the phone.

http://ifixit.org/blog/8448/apple-audio-adapter-teardown/

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jeffwass on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:42AM (#13290530)
The conclusion on sound quality at the bottom of your link:

"when playing an uncompressed 16-bit audio file on the iPhone 6s, the dynamic range dropped from 99.1 dB at the headphone jack to 97.3 dB at the adapter. Though keep in mind, this slightly lower measurement is still higher than the theoretical maximum you get from a compact disc (which is 96 dB). So, is it a difference you are likely to notice? If you sit in a quiet room with a really, really good pair of headphones … and you’re a canine, the answer is: maybe."

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by 2muchcoffeeman on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:42AM (#13290352)
I will not upgrade to a phone that does not have a 3.5mm jack.

But arguing this is a poor user experience is probably wrong for most people. Apple is correct in that this is the way things are going. I bet all the Flagship Android phones will be jackless too soon.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by grzm on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:09AM (#13290435)
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by flamedoge on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:57AM (#13290397)
I am hoping they are not as apple-copying
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by rimantas on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:23AM (#13290302)
Believe or not only few care about that lousy jack. Most will use earbuds that come with the phone, others will permanently have dongle attached to their headphones. And those who go AirPods way will forget jack ever existed.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by josteink on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:05AM (#13290568)
> those who go AirPods way will forget jack ever existed

I'm pretty sure that this market segment, while surely it exists, will never overlap with those who care about good sound quality and a good music listening experience.

In other words: they're leaving significant market segments behind.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by kayoone on Saturday December 31, 2016 @10:44AM (#13291467)
Are you implying there are no good Bluetooth headphones ? A2DP and aptx solved those issues long ago.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jrnichols on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:55PM (#13293401)
> Why are people so desperate to defend this clearly user hostile move?

Partly because even months before the iPhone 7 came out, sales of wireless headphones overtook those of wired.

http://qz.com/745108/wireless-headphone-sales-just-hit-a-tip...

People are already using it without unnecessary accessories.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by greendesk on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:01AM (#13290246)
I do not like the audio jack in my phone. Sometimes the headphones slide halfway out and the sound gets distorted.

I, for one, agree with the decision to let go of the audio jack.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by bigtunacan on Friday December 30, 2016 @05:30PM (#13288049)
I have 5+ pairs of headphones. One for home, one for the office, one for the gym, and then a couple of spares for when I lose any of the main 3. I have the iPhone 7 and I end up carrying the dongle around in my jeans pocket when I am able to remember it. I'm certainly not paying $10 a pop for spare dongles when most of my headphones didn't even cost that much.

Getting rid of the headphone jack is by far the dumbest move I have seen on the iPhone in a long time.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by raverbashing on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:50AM (#13290991)
> Getting rid of the headphone jack is by far the dumbest move I have seen on the iPhone in a long time.

Then why did you get the iPhone 7? Should have voted with your wallet

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by bigtunacan on Saturday December 31, 2016 @11:13AM (#13291580)
Unfortunately I have a life saving medical device that only is compatible with the iPhone. I switched from Android to the iPhone 7 because of this.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by raverbashing on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:38PM (#13292394)
Somehow I can't understand how a life saving medical device would require a smartphone of a certain brand, but even if this is the case you could have gotten the iPhone 6 for example
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by bigtunacan on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:48PM (#13293065)
I'm a type 1 diabetic. There is a device by Dexcom known as a continuous glucose monitor that reads my blood sugar via interstitial fluids and then transmits the information via Bluetooth.

When I get unexplained low blood sugars in my sleep, which is believed to be the cause of Dead in Bed Syndrome, it sounds an alarm on the iPhone to wake me up before it's too late.

As for going with the iPhone 6

1) my money would still have gone to Apple

2) I didn't think about what a pain it was until after I bought them

Side notes

1) I have contacted Dexcom regarding an app for Android, but it doesn't seem like it will happen anytime soon.

2) I also tried an open source version for Android, but after purchasing 4 phones in a row that it had varying problems with I decided my life was worth more than being able to stay on Android.

[EDIT]

Diabetes is the number 7 leading cause of death in the United States and low blood sugar is the number one reason for ER visits by Type 1 diabetics.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by 1123581321 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:53PM (#13293863)
I have Dexcom CGM as well and I just use the hardware alarm that comes with it. The battery lasts days longer than a phone's and it is small enough to fit in my pocket with my phone. I'd argue you would have been safer buying Android and being forced to rely on Dexcom hardware instead of an app.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by bigtunacan on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:30PM (#13294034)
Replying here to your other reply since you can't nest that deep.

I know there have been some changes on the G5 so I'm not clear how that works.

With the G4 the Dexcom CGM acts as a proxy to the phone. So when everything is working correctly I get two alarms. So this gives me a certain level of redundancy. Anyway it works for me well enough that I can get a full night's sleep. For years I had alarms set to wake me up several times during the night.

[EDIT]

Also, responding to your question about the phone being louder than the Dexcom. The phone is an order of magnitude louder than the G4.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by bigtunacan on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:10PM (#13293940)
Yeah, that was what I tried at first. Unfortunately I'm an extremely heavy sleeper and the alarm on the Dexcom device doesn't wake me up. My wife was waking up to the alarm and then she would wake me. She travels frequently for work though so that wasn't ideal either.

Also though, which model do you have?

I have the G4 Platinum w/Share. The sensors for it now ship with a warning sheet stating that you may not receive audible alarms due to issues with the speakers.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by 1123581321 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:17PM (#13293966)
Ah, yes, I've had that heavy-head issue, but I wouldn't think your phone would be louder than that alarm. Is it?

I have G5 with Share (I think; I have a drawer full of old Dexcom stuff) and have gotten the same letter, but haven't had that issue. I definitely trust it more than Dexcom pairing with the phone. I'm glad your setup is working for you, though.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by raverbashing on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:49PM (#13293361)
Thanks for the clarification, and yes, T1 Diabetes is dangerous.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by rbrcurtis on Sunday January 01, 2017 @11:31PM (#13299045)
$2 per on ebay. Just throw 20 bucks at it and buy one for every pair you have.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by monkmartinez on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:25PM (#13287136)
Only $10??? That is a lot of money for something that shouldn't be needed in the first place. I haven't spent $10 dollars on my phone since I bought a case for it in 2013. Then again, I have expandable memory and a headphone jack (Galaxy Note 3).
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by nkkollaw on Friday December 30, 2016 @05:26PM (#13288023)
Alright, so you spend $800 for a phone, and you're complaining that you can't spare $10?

I'm not saying removing the headphone jack to make the phone a mm thinner wasn't a retarded move, but... Really? $10?

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Freestyler_3 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:24AM (#13290130)
If I buy an $800 device, I make sure it does what I want it to do with the least amount of friction (add/replace my other hardware).

What if I buy a router today and there is a company that sells routers with a nice gui, but all the rj45 jacks are removed and it requires a dongle on the power jack to be able to connect a rj45. (For some reason it comes with a dongle but that requires the router to run on batteries)

Anywho, I am not the guy that is going to buy apple hardware anyway. So I don't really have any impact on apple if I don't buy anything.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by nkkollaw on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:07AM (#13290426)
I'm buying a second-hand iPhone 6s instead of an iPhone 7 because of the headphone jack (mainly out of principle).

It's just that I see so many comments arguing that dongles are expensive... The problem is not that they're expensive. I agree that they suck, but I can't possibly believe that people that can afford to spend $1000 on an iPhone Plus all of a sudden can't afford a $10 or $29 dongle.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Freestyler_3 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:07AM (#13291057)
Agreed, if you buy it then it is your own responsibility to know that it requires more than just the money for the phone.

Then again, some people buy expensive cars and are surprised about the high price of spare parts. I guess many consumers like to pay a big amount of money for a single product, and not a big amount + 10 small amounts for a product that needs multiple other products during its life.

Its like a phone case, we all wish it wasn't necessary to have one, but many people buy cases because the phone needs it to stay nice/safe. And I don't think there is a solution readily available that makes phone cases abundant for those people.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by ryao on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:03AM (#13289755)
I thought the removal was to recycle the space while making waterproofing easier.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by _Codemonkeyism on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:48AM (#13289890)
The removal is to introduce a way to control which headphones are connected and to get license payments in the future.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by j2bax on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:21AM (#13290900)
Doubtful. My guess is within 1-2 generations max the iPhone will have USB C to follow the Macbook line.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by chrischen on Saturday December 31, 2016 @11:34AM (#13291691)
This statement is false.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by flamedoge on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:59AM (#13290401)
The removal is to sell dongles
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by nkkollaw on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:01AM (#13290406)
Ah, true. That was mentioned as well.

It's amazing that people would pick an extra millimeter trimmed off or waterproofing over a headphone jack (I assume they did surveys..?).

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by kalleboo on Saturday December 31, 2016 @12:50AM (#13289714)
Why bother with expandable memory if you haven't bought a memory card for it in over 3 years?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Dylan16807 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:08AM (#13290264)
It matters less as phone storage finally drops below $1 per GB, but traditionally it was not fun to pay 5x as much as a good-quality microSD, and that's if they even have the option to put in enough in the first place.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by legodt on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:37AM (#13290175)
Bad comparison, memory cards are a clear need (gotta have more storage space) and are not responses to poor design decisions (gotta counteract a port I use every day being taken away).
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by kalleboo on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:44AM (#13290193)
A clear need for you isn't a clear need for everyone. Maybe I have all my stuff in the cloud, so I don't "gotta have more storage space". Meanwhile I've been using Bluetooth headphones for a decade now, I have no need for the headphone port.

Don't get me wrong, I'm no Apple fanboy. But the real injustice here is that they're clinging to their proprietary Lightning port instead of going with the standard USB-C. That is complete bullshit.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by tdkl on Saturday December 31, 2016 @07:19AM (#13290735)
> A clear need for you isn't a clear need for everyone.

This goes both ways.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by rbrcurtis on Sunday January 01, 2017 @11:27PM (#13299031)
They're about $2 per on ebay.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jsz0 on Friday December 30, 2016 @10:36PM (#13289305)
> The removal of the 3.5mm jack is a failure by Apple.

It's been a total non-issue for me. Since the iPhone 7 comes with both the adapter and Lighting headphones work/home usage isn't a problem. I just use the adapter + existing headphones at home and the Lighting headphones at work.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by CountSessine on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:03AM (#13290076)
That's sort of what I found. I thought it was going to be a major inconvenience because I don't like talking directly on a phone without headphones and a mic.

It turns out that what I really don't like is having a conversation on a Samsung phone with the consistently awful earpieces Samsung puts in them (Note 4, S4, Galaxy Nexus, Nexus S...). I've been pretty happy with the iPhone 7 earpiece.

My plea to Samsung: you guys make killer displays; couldn't you figure out how to make an earpiece that isn't awful?

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by _Codemonkeyism on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:50AM (#13289896)
The adapter will go away in the future, it's just a technology to get people on the jackless train. I'm sure iPhone 8 will no longer support it.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by carloscar on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:29PM (#13287156)
I have just one pair of headphones that I use daily. How many dongles would you need to have one for every set of headphones?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Washuu on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:52PM (#13287777)
The headphones stay on the desk at work. Then there is the old set of Altec Lansing speakers in the garage. There are a few more spots that I rarely use, but they all have 3.5mm connectors.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by mahyarm on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:05AM (#13289758)
You can get a dongle attacher, like this one for the magsafe 1 adapter:

https://www.amazon.com/Cozy-Industries-MC-RD-1-2-MagCozy-2-P...

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by hyperbovine on Saturday December 31, 2016 @10:01AM (#13291290)
You'll probably want to pick up a dongle attacher attacher as well.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by reggplant on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:09PM (#13287003)
In my experience, the amplification that this adapter provides is not enough for larger headphones.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by throwanem on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:54AM (#13291006)
Larger headphones like what? Impedance should matter there, not size, and it would surprise me to learn that there are high-Ω headphones that an iPhone can drive effectively, but the adapter can't.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by matheweis on Saturday December 31, 2016 @11:12AM (#13291573)
A sysadmin I work who has had Apple-everything for years (iMac, MacBook Pro, MacBook Air, iPhone, Apple Watch...) with walked in last week without his Apple Watch.

Asking him about it, he pulled out a new Pixel and said it was for op's very reason. In particular he noted that the pixel had a much better DAC than any one iPhone he'd ever had - and in particular that it could drive all of his higher end headphones. He also mentioned that the new iThing adapter has it own DAC inside the adapter... it's apparently powered by the lightning port with its own drivers - and that he had tried it out anyway but found it incapable of properly driving any of his nicer headphones.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by mdani on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:55AM (#13289915)
You're absolutely correct - these things can all be fixed. I think the main point is that it kills the excitement of getting a new expensive device. It just becomes more and more work to regain the control back.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Godel_unicode on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:32AM (#13290004)
That's the thing I find really interesting about this debate; one of the things that creates excitement for me with new Android devices is customizing it to work exactly how I want. Turning things off, changing default behaviours, IFTTT-ing the device until it's hard for anyone else to actually use.

Same with Precision Touchpad laptops (Dell XPS 15 for instance), changing all the swipe gestures to work exactly how I want. I always joke with my colleagues that if they can use my laptop efficiently, then I'm not done setting it up yet.

I totally get that it's a difference of expectations, it's just interesting to me.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by irq on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:15AM (#13290109)
Please don't ever design something meant for public use :)
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Godel_unicode on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:56AM (#13290236)
You don't want designers who realize that everyone doesn't share their taste in how things are configured?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by frugalmail on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:44AM (#13289878)
I have headphones in multiple places, so I keep the dongle attached to the phone and realize it's scratching the phone or irritating my pocket. This was clearly a broken by design / apple screwing over consumers more / form over function insanity. They should have used standard USB-C for the damn phone too. Their laptops now standardize on it, but they still use proprietary crap on the phones.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by petre on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:10AM (#13289949)
Not an Apple fanboy, but the Lighting connector is way better designed than any USB connector, so I wouldn't call it crap. Proprietary, therefore sometimes annoying yes, but definitely not crap. The USB connectors are equally annoying when you try to insert them. With USB type A I always have to inspect the tip of the connector and the plug, and micro USB is always a pain to insert properly leading to connector damage at both the cable and the device ports.

The decision not to include a phone jack in the iPhone 7 was a crappy decision insteaead.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Godel_unicode on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:54AM (#13290051)
The USB-A/microUSB strawman notwithstanding, USB-C has the capabilities you're talking about (easy to insert, reversible).

Given that USB-C requires roughly the same vertical space as the headphone jack, the one thing lightning has going for it from my perspective is that it works in a phone too thin for a headphone jack.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by adamlett on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:13AM (#13290104)
USB-C didn’t exist when the Lightning connector was introduced.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by snovv_crash on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:16AM (#13290283)
It did when the iPhone7 was released, and had already been released on quite a few Android phones.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by adamlett on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:21AM (#13290608)
Sure, but having already invested goodwill and money in Lighting, the benefits of switching to USB-C would have to be substantial before it makes sense for Apple to do so. To reality is that for most of Apple's users, USB-C offers no discernible advantage and quite a few disadvantages (having to buy new cables and peripherals again).
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by snovv_crash on Sunday January 01, 2017 @05:19AM (#13295319)
>USB-C offers no discernible advantage

Well, besides being able to charge your phone from your laptop charger, use the same USB flash drive in your phone and laptop without an adapter, use the same powered noise-cancelling headphones in your laptop and phone, connect your phone to your projector/monitor/TV using the same adapter as the laptop, and so many more.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by adamlett on Sunday January 01, 2017 @10:34AM (#13296039)
So, there are some benefits if you already have other devices that use USB-C. Most people don't however. Not yet. What people do have, is tons of crap that is Lighting compatible.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by cyber_dude on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:30AM (#13290146)
>The phone comes with a 3.5mm to Lightning adapter, so you can continue to use your existing headphones.

What if I want to use my headphones while charging my phone?

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by threeseed on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:45AM (#13290200)
Quite a few companies sell adapters that allow for this.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by josteink on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:13AM (#13290595)
So now you need two dongles for one set of earphones.

And how is the quality of the DAC in that adapter?

Sure sounds great!

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by protomyth on Saturday December 31, 2016 @12:59AM (#13289741)
I wonder how those dongles work for blind folks that use a headphone to connect to ATMs? I know the AirPods and lightning head phones are a no go for them.

Also, I need to buy a 3rd party dongle since power is also important in my car and I'm not buying a new car because of a phone.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by sjtgraham on Friday December 30, 2016 @02:58PM (#13286926)
"It just works"
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jsz0 on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:55PM (#13287807)
> I just can't consistently control the phone. A large percentage of taps or swipes do things I did not intend (how many I'm not sure -- 20%? 33%?) It's just completely crazy.

I couldn't agree more with this. Just as bad (if not worse) on Android. I can't seem to use any modern phone without a huge number of unintended inputs. The reliance on gestures in apps is especially annoying because I don't use some of them often enough to memorize the different gestures. I very often just get stuck in various apps tapping and swiping randomly trying to make something happen. Just the other day I finally figured out when I get stuck in Instagram I can tap the Instagram logo to go back. Up till now I've been force quitting it instead.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by thomble on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:29PM (#13287628)
I feel the same way. The UX in iOS has gone way downhill. This is especially evident in the system notifications in-use, and on the lock screen. Do I swipe this? Which direction? Do I tap it? I get no visual feedback after a tap, but then a new notification window appears after a second? What do I do with new window? Swipe? Tap? I have to authenticate now? Do I hold my finger to the Home button, or do I press the Home button? Again, no immediate feedback to reinforce the 'correct' behavior.

I probably have a hagiographic image of who Steve Jobs was, but I have to imagine that the current state of iOS wouldn't have slipped past him.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by cyberferret on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:15AM (#13289962)
> They need to get rid of 3D touch, get rid of double-tap one-hand accessibility mode whatever it's called, get rid of weird swipes from the edge

Hear, hear. It's like my last days of using Windows. Every app window had so many "hot spots" crammed in that triggered something, so that whenever i had multiple overlapping windows and wanted to click on a background window to bring it to the foreground, I would inadvertently trigger an action or change program modes because there wasn't a single pixel of the underlying window that wasnt an active zone.

That behaviour totally broke the "multiple pieces of paper on a desk" behavior and instead turned your desktop into a myriad of booby traps ready to kill your productivity.

I am starting to feel the same way about iOS.

Bring back "dead space" on application windows that don't HAVE to do anything when you tap/click/swipe/pinch on them.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by fsloth on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:32AM (#13290002)
I'll have to inject a bit of criticism to this particular rant.

If one is using several applications on Windows and being productive about it - You don't switch applications in Windows by clicking then with mouse. You order them on the task bar and then switch between them using windows button - number (where number is the order on the task bar.).

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by cyberferret on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:58AM (#13290068)
I routinely Alt-Tab between my current 2 or 3 windows when working, but i often have 20+ windows open at a time across 2 monitors and often times I will SEE the window I want right there, but selecting it is nigh on impossible.

One of the biggest culprits is MS Office (especially Excel, where I routinely keep data i need to refer to every now and then). Unless the title bar of the window is visible, clicking on any other edge will change the current active tab, pull down a menu, open a dialog, disable recalculate mode or some other weird behavior that is sometimes not readily apparent.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by fsloth on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:06AM (#13290424)
Ah, yes, with that workflow I'll have to agree. I can timesplit my work so I can always arrange the windows to taskbar and have generally less that 9 windows to deal with in single task. Context, context, context.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:47AM (#13290033)
Depends on what you're doing. Direct visual manipulation is best if you're using the mouse. Winkeys can be better if you're primarily trying to stay on the keyboard.

I actually researched this back many years ago, and at the time, clicking on windows Exposé style won out reasonably convincingly over keyboard techniques, including winkey+#.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Too on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:28AM (#13290319)
"best" and "won out" how? Certainly not in speed. Win+# is O(1) in complexity and I already have my left hand in position to press the 2 buttons required to instantly get to the window I want.

Compared to expose which is first a hotkey to initiate(note that already here you lost the race in number of keys to press), wait 300ms for the animation to complete, find the window you want which is more like O(n), move hand to mouse, move mouse around to find the cursor, move cursor to desired window, click, wait another 300ms for animation.

Even if I happen to already have my hand on the mouse and know where the cursor is the best case will take you at least one second, this is much inferior to just pressing 2 keyboard buttons which is essentially instantaneous, even with faster animations you will not save much time as you need that time to find the window. With more than 5 windows open finding the right one can be a true challenge as they get very small and there will be a lot of them to scan.

For grandma who don't care about speed maybe expose is easier to understand and remember but for intense task switching by experienced users it is just in the way.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:54AM (#13290386)
An Expose-style interface with short animation beat all other interfaces (taskbar click (window), dock click (app), winkey+#, alt-tab) in mean task switching time over a series of controlled scenarios (not the user's normal workflow - just simulated scenarios). Expose style interface was invoked with a side button on the mouse.

From memory, Expose was around ~1.0s, taskbar click around ~1.2s, winkey around 1.5s, with other methods slower.

The physical action of flicking your wrist and clicking is actually surprisingly fast, possibly even faster mechanically than a two-key keyboard shortcut - think how fast twitch gamers are.

Decision time was the main component. Expose's decision time was the lowest mean, and the most stable. Alt-tab had the lowest decision time, but far greater stdev. Yeah this is a controlled test that may not represent a real user's workflow, hence my 'depends'. "Find the window" is actually an interesting one - as long as the interface is reasonably spatially stable, you actually don't need to find it because your spatial memory takes care of that for you.

In my experience, while I might have a few 'primary' windows that suit the ordered taskbar well, I've often got a number of other things that come and go. I'm never going to remember what place they are. So, while winkey+# is fast for a select few windows, it's really slow for others. I don't find it appreciably faster than an Expose interface, and it's easier and faster for me in my workflow to use one main task switching interface.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Too on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:09AM (#13290438)
Interesting that decision time is the highest component. When using win+# I've already decided beforehand which window I am going to switch to.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:21AM (#13290472)
When I say "decision time", I'm really referring to everything between "I need to switch to a window", and "I have just started performing the action needed to switch".
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by user5994461 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:17AM (#13290113)
Cool. One more keyboard trick to navigate windows efficiently.

Now I'll have to figure out if it can compete with a mastery of ctrl+tab and alt+tab (and windows+tab and their cousins ctrl+shift+tab).

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by _Codemonkeyism on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:47AM (#13289887)
Removing the headphone jack is just to get more money and control. First by selling dongles. Second after many people moved to new headphones they will introduce a license program for headphone vendors "Built for Apple" which costs say 10% of the headphone. Other headphones will no longer work (see what Sony did with PS4 bluetooth headphones).
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by AdeptusAquinas on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:08AM (#13289946)
After buying a recent macbook (not the touch bar version, ugh) I suspect the real reason is fashion related. One port is more sleek, more stylish than two or three ports. Functionality sacrificed in the name of a sleeker look...well, I appreciate the intent, even as I recognise I am not the target audience.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by georgyo on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:35AM (#13290010)
This could be true, but they choose to stick with the lightning connector. Which gives them licencing rights. Getting money from licencing is the only reason I can see for them having only the lightning connector.

They could have switched to USB-C, became standard, and then switched to one port. Then at least the head phones you but would also work on your shiny new MacBook.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by neotek on Saturday December 31, 2016 @10:11AM (#13291326)
Switching to USB-C on the iPhone would have been a hugely shitty decision given their ultimate goal is clearly to build a phone without any ports at all within a few years.

Consider what would happen in that case: right now there are hundreds of millions of iPhone accessories out there that rely on the Lightning port - everything from headphones to cars to health devices and more. If Apple removed the Lightning port all of those accessories would become obsolete overnight and people would be up in arms about it (just look at the removal of the headphone jack and the storm in a teacup that became.) Manufacturers would bring out USB-C accessories for the iPhone, people would buy them to replace their Lightning accessories, the furore would die down and things would go back to normal, and then boom - Apple removes the USB-C port too.

In the space of a few years they'd have fucked over hundreds of millions of people who wasted money on replacing their accessories and the outrage would be overwhelming. People would be accusing Apple of doing it on purpose just to sell more accessories (which is what they're accusing Apple of right now because of the aforementioned removal of the headphone jack) when in reality Apple has been telegraphing the transition to wireless for a while now.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by georgyo on Saturday December 31, 2016 @11:15AM (#13291590)
I don't think this is going to happen any time remotely soon, even if apple wants it to.

Going completely wireless would also destroy the current accessories market. No dongle or converter to fix it either.

Also apple already did change the connector for the iPhone once.

The iPhone will go USB-C because the rest of their products have. They can stay dumb and alienate their consumers, or finally start integrating with the world.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by owly on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:01AM (#13290561)
Exactly. Users can't even use their lightning headphones on a new Mac. The move to remove was a mistake, but there is no going back now. That would be admitting to a design flaw.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by neotek on Saturday December 31, 2016 @10:14AM (#13291338)
Not only was it not a mistake, ten years from now people will refer to the outrage over the removal of the headphone jack in the same way we currently refer to the outrage over the removal of the floppy drive.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by josteink on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:25AM (#13290618)
> there is no going back now. That would be admitting to a design flaw.

What's wrong with admitting that you took a bet and it didn't work out?

People do that all the time. Reasonable people, at least.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by gm-conspiracy on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:15AM (#13290885)
I am surprised nobody has responded to this comment with the USB-3 male to female Lightning adapter solution.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by neotek on Saturday December 31, 2016 @10:05AM (#13291310)
Apple made $230 BILLION in revenue last year, of which less than one fifth of one percent came from MFI licensing fees.

Removing the headphone jack had absolutely nothing to do with selling dongles and everything to do with Apple doing what it always does: seeing which way the wind is blowing and dragging everyone kicking and screaming into their vision of the future.

They did the exact same thing with the floppy drive and optical drive, they're now doing the same thing with USB and the headphone jack, and within five years you can be sure that every single one of their competitors will have made the same decision.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by rz2k on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:41PM (#13292409)
That's terrible to read. I'd hoped that Apple had just happened upon a streak of decisions that were inconvenient to users, and might reverse the trajectory. At less than 1/5 of $230B (more than 1/6?), and obviously at an extremely high profit margin, there's essentially no way.

I had been really optimistic about the adoption of USB-C, since it is as an open standard, but the discovery of such enormous licensing revenues that are essentially without expense to Apple, makes it almost inevitable that they will begin insisting peripherals get permission from Apple, too.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by neotek on Sunday January 01, 2017 @03:19AM (#13295085)
I think you may have misread what I wrote: one fifth of one percent, i.e, 0.2%. It's a minuscule drop in the ocean for Apple, such a small number it doesn't even show up on their financial reports. There's no way in hell they made a massive change like removing the headphone jack just to sell more accessories when their entire accessories revenue is little more than a rounding error.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by rz2k on Sunday January 01, 2017 @08:35PM (#13298502)
That's much better! Something approaching 1/5 made me think of movie theater concessions.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by bobbyi_settv on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:30PM (#13293272)
Apple has been wrong about this sort of thing way more times than it has been right.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by jrnichols on Saturday December 31, 2016 @05:00PM (#13293420)
Here's where people pile on and say [citation needed]

Maybe I'm just forgetting things today, but i'm not thinking of any.

ADB? FireWire? Which ones?

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by sssilver on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:49AM (#13289891)
Please, don't -- 3D touch is one of the big reasons I will never switch to a phone that doesn't support it.

It's an absolutely wonderful UX for me.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spacelizard on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:08AM (#13289944)
I get the appeal of 3D touch but it has absolutely no discoverability - this feels like a complete setback in UX design. Apple used to be known for having UIs that had a lot of visual cues and didn't hide features from the user. However it seems they have done a 180 on that in recent years.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Godel_unicode on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:22AM (#13290126)
Why do you find 3d tough less discoverable than e.g. long-press to rearrange apps?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by adamlett on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:26AM (#13290133)
Discoverability is not the be-all end-all of UI design. In most ways iOS is a huge step forward in UI design as evidenced by the legions of toddlers who can figure out how to use an iPad.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by legodt on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:42AM (#13290189)
No, it may not be the end-all, but it certainly is almost all of it
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by adamlett on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:07AM (#13290575)
Only if you define it so broadly as to strip almost all meaning from the term.

What about manageability, i.e. can a user fit a mental model of the system in their head, or is it too complex to do that? What about the related concepts of consistency and predictability? What about comprehensibility of the metaphors used? The clarity of language? What about ergonomics? Directness of manipulation? What about delight (think pull to refresh)?

Elevating discoverability above all other concerns means that there can be no hierarchy of information. Every feature becomes primary. Everything is on page one, everything is above the fold.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by josteink on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:26AM (#13290620)
> I get the appeal of 3D touch but it has absolutely no discoverability

I've had an iPhone for a few months now and I still have no idea what this is about.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by thedrbrian on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:59AM (#13289923)
I thought it was a bit of a gimmick in iOS 9 but since they went all in for iOS 10. It's almost like right clicking on a phone. Just wish more third party apps used it.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by sgt on Saturday December 31, 2016 @06:06AM (#13290572)
I don't share these experiences. iOS in my experience is by far the best mobile operating system out there and I am constantly using it and not experiencing any issues (this on my iPhone 6). I cannot compare experiences with you in terms of 3D touch though.

As for auto-correct, I forget that even exists as it is the first thing I disable on a new phone (I type in 3 different languages on a daily basis).

As for the iPhone 7 (which I will soon upgrade to), I've tested the phone and it feels fabulous. Lack of an ancient 3.5mm jack does not bother me. The DAC should be as close to your ear as possible, so it makes sense to most audiophiles. There is a dongle for that and I do not see an issue bringing that along if I need it.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Doctor_Fegg on Friday December 30, 2016 @05:43PM (#13288144)
Amen. Just let me turn the sideswipes off in Safari. Ten times a day I end up going back a page without meaning to.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by interpol_p on Saturday December 31, 2016 @01:07AM (#13289763)
I love the swipe-to-go back gesture in Safari. You can always recover if you accidentally trigger it because it doesn't actually go back until you slide the page off the screen.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:55AM (#13290054)
These two comments together cement why preferences are important in user interfaces.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by interpol_p on Monday January 02, 2017 @03:43AM (#13299877)
I'd rather my applications be opinionated about the way I use them. I want a designer to think it through carefully and choose what they think is the best.

If I don't like those design choices then I'd choose a different browser rather than spend time configuring one.

(And obviously people make browsers for people who love custom configuration. Safari is not one of those.)

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Saturday January 07, 2017 @02:23AM (#13342828)
Well, Safa is somewhat opinionated. What should I do if I like 99.9% of the browser except one small thing that infuriates me a huge amount? It makes sense to offer preferences, especially to turn off certain things like gestures. In this case, the designer hasn't really gone far enough in determining that certain choices they have made can have seriously negative effects.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by taf2 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:15AM (#13291080)
Let me echo the issues with iOS since the upgrade to 7 with an example from my children. We decided when my youngest was 3 to buy both girls a new ipad mini. This allowed them to watch shows. Sometimes but not often we'd also let them bring the ipad on walks (if you have not had kids don't judge). I was amazed at how well our girls figured out how to load a movie or show. It was pretty easy for my 5 year old to figure this out. My 3 year old struggled but after a few times showing her where and how to click she got it. A few weeks/months go by and ios7 is released. The new "flat" (cough invisible UI) is released into the wild. I am from the always upgrade generation because it's exciting so we upgraded everything. my 3 year was very very upset. Simple things like finding the video playback icon were now nearly impossible, even my 5 year struggled. Well, the worst possible outcome for us was my 3 year throwing the ipad in frustration down the street (literally we were on a walk). It gave me a whole new perspective on UI change. I believe Apple has improved since ios7 a lot - however many deficiencies remain that make the UI challenging - the multiple touch / 3d touch features. For us specifically, the distinction between a show or movie that is downloaded vs one that is not is crazy confusing and having to navigate into settings to switch between showing movies that are not on the device and ones that are has led to near repeat incidents of smashed ipads... I'm not sure what the right answer is for Apple... they have put themselves into a hard position for "fixing" things. Many people have probably become accustom to the new designs and features so a rollback is not what's needed. I believe they are mostly doing the right thing at this point which is to refine and improve, i just hope they can fix the extremely confusing itunes interface...
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by stcredzero on Thursday January 05, 2017 @01:12PM (#13329667)
I just can't consistently control the phone. A large percentage of taps or swipes do things I did not intend (how many I'm not sure -- 20%? 33%?) It's just completely crazy.

I'm an iPhone user since the 1st gen iPhone with 8GB.

the horrible inconsistencies in the way autocorrect works

The worst part of autocorrect is how it sometimes autocorrects at just the last moment when you hit send. It's like my iPhone wants to break me up from my girlfriend! (I was dating an aspergirl recently, so literal meanings had a bit more meaning. Now I'm dating a foreign born ex-college professor, and she's more insistent on correct grammar than anyone I've known.)

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by masterleep on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:40PM (#13287246)
totally agree. The home button has also become an object of mystery. It seems to have several functions too many, and it's always doing one I don't want.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by poisonarena on Saturday December 31, 2016 @02:36AM (#13290013)
I just hate the inability to turn off voice control.. half the time I unlok my phone I end up in voice control and there is no way to get rid of it
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by LoSboccacc on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:12AM (#13290102)
same here. still on a 5s waiting on a reiteration of se.

all you said applies to me as well plus the new generic form factor which is uninspirning bust most importantly too large for comfortably pocketing

the real thing that keeps me locked to apple for now is the app commitment, but if a se2 fails to materialize I'll definitely jump to android at the end of life of my 5s

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by gm-conspiracy on Saturday December 31, 2016 @08:23AM (#13290906)
I just bought a used 5s w/ 64GB of RAM, also waiting for a decent SE2.

I've been curious about the Sony Xperia Z5 compact.

I would really like a Kickstarter for replacement form-factor main boards for classic iPhones (4S,5S) to run modern android or something.

I have so many "obsolete" phones with working hardware and barely usable software.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by LoSboccacc on Saturday December 31, 2016 @09:15AM (#13291081)
myself was looking at the lg g5, mainly because it has recent android, as android hardware rarely receives updates. there's the pixel, of course, but that rear bulge :(
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spronkey on Sunday January 01, 2017 @06:09PM (#13297955)
I read your comment soon after you posted it and sort of nodded internally, but over the last two days I've been actively noting how often I'm making a slip (i.e. through accidental 3D touch, or accidental swipe or whatever).

I think the 20% is actually pretty damn close to what my real error rate is, which astounded me. Even just stuff like initiating a scroll, I'm finding that I've started subconsciously ignoring the accidental 3D touch activations. I thought it would have been maybe 5%.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by bobajeff on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:59PM (#13287839)
>fix the horrible inconsistencies in the way autocorrect works (or, please, offer a system that just underlines words-thought-to-be-wrong without changing them, and let me tap on them to change them, or use the current autocorrect system but let me tap on a word to un-"correct" it, the fact that the current system just changes what I typed and gives me no recourse to fix it apart from laborious deletions and re-typings, which I often have to do 2 or 3 times, is just haughty and offensive)

Android has this same problem and I wish they'd fix it using your suggestion. It would make typing so much better.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by geon on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:59AM (#13290404)
> please, offer a system that just underlines words-thought-to-be-wrong without changing them

Ios have had that for at least a year. Two years?

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by spacehacker on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:20PM (#13287092)
How does iOS compare to Android these days regarding everyday concerns like sluggishness, app switching, text editing?
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by wklauss on Friday December 30, 2016 @03:37PM (#13287217)
YMMV depending on what Android phone you want to compare it to, but it's still not 100% there, even in expensive ones.

That being said, it's not longer a deal breaker, I think, for most of the people that used to complain about it and if you have a pixel or a high end Galaxy its very rare to find instances of slugginess or dropped frames when scrolling.

I still face more sudden app crashes on Android than on iOS, weird error messages that are definitely not user-friendly and for some specific categories of apps, like games or sound/music, I still think iOS offers better selection and reliability.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by on_and_off on Friday December 30, 2016 @04:10PM (#13287479)
It is very rare for a Pixel, but Galaxy phones are a very large step behind them.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by Freestyler_3 on Saturday December 31, 2016 @03:29AM (#13290138)
When I need a new phone I am going with a company that supports sold phones for a longer time.

Samsung abandons phones so fast, android updates are rare. (I know in my case the carrier is also between it)

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by VladimirGolovin on Saturday December 31, 2016 @11:39AM (#13291719)
Android user here, recently switched to iPhone 6 when my Nexus 5 died (will definitely switch back when Google Pixel finally arrives to Russia).

Here are my conclusions after using iPhone for a couple of months as a daily driver:

1. The switch itself was, unexpectedly, a lot less painful that I anticipated. All my apps and mobile workflows were up and running in half a day. So I guess I'm platform-agnostic.

2. iOS feels very smooth. No stuttering at all. Sometimes I get lagging, but it's a minor annoyance, not a showstopper - except for cases when I can't pick up a phone call because the round draggy thingy just won't drag.

3. App switching via double-tapping the home button is easy and pleasant. I like it more than the Android way of switching apps.

4. Text editing on iOS is absolutely atrocious. This is a major downside, and a deal breaker for me. That's why I'm switching to Pixel as soon as I can get my hands on it. iOS's magnifying glass cursor is much less convenient than Android's "handle cursors", especially when the text I'm editing is near the top of the screen. Going into the editing mode requires a long tap, as opposed to Android's regular tap, which is annyoing as well. The stock keyboard is slick but useless because I'm a gesture typer. I tried Swype, but it's no match for Google keyboard. GBoard might be a good replacement, but it doesn't support Russian yet, so no opinion here.

4a. The only thing in iPhone that somehow mitigates the awfulness of text editing on iOS is 3D-touch cursor movement. You strong-press in the keyboard area and drag, and the cursor moves. This feature is very well done. I'll probably get me iPhone 6s just to have it (not iPhone 7 because I don't like their new home button). Also, this 3D-touch cursor movement may not work with non-stock keyboard like GBoard or Swype - I have no information about that.

Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by OkGoDoIt on Saturday December 31, 2016 @04:16AM (#13290284)
The one major area where I think Android leads (at least stock Android, Nexus, Pixel) is text input. The voice typing on android is significantly more accurate than on iOS, and has been my biggest hurdle in getting used to iOS. I know few people find voice typing practical, but once you get used to it it makes pecking out words manually feel incredibly inefficient by comparison. Also the android keyboard swipe technology works very well, and I miss that a lot on iOS. I know you can technically install third-party keyboards, but they tend to not work very well due to iOS restrictions, plus then you completely lose access to voice typing and I'm not willing to give that up even if it's inferior on iOS. Since switching to iOS from android a year ago, I still type significantly slower and with many more typos than on android. If I could use android's keyboard and voice typing on iOS it would be the perfect device.
Re:Apple to slice iPhone production 10% due to sluggish sales by rbrcurtis on Sunday January 01, 2017 @11:45PM (#13299100)
I do find it annoying that you can't use voice typing on 3rd party keyboards, but I use gboard for swipe typing and then will switch to the oem keyboard when voice typing. It's not perfect (because the kb switch button doesn't usually go the keyboard I want), but it does work ok.

FWIW, voice typing generally works well for me. Not sure why you're having so much trouble.