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Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by sva_ on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:16AM (#40737338)
> In July, the Council Presidency will transfer from Belgium to Hungary, which has stated its intention to advance negotiations on chat control as part of its work program.

That does not make me very hopeful.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by pilsetnieks on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:26AM (#40737393)
"Make Europe Great Again". Seriously, that is the new slogan for the Hungarian EU presidency.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/06/18/europe/hungary-make-europ...

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by kergonath on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:55AM (#40737638)
It’s doublespeak. Orbán is not interested in making Europe or the EU any stronger, just in extracting as much as he can from it. He only cares about Hungary.

However, it is a signal (we cannot really talk of dog whistle here, it’s rather obvious) to other far-right parties with similar nationalist agenda that he’s on their side. So a better reading might be “make [individual countries in] Europe great again”.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by rebolek on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:00AM (#40737676)
He only cares about himself, not Hungary.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by cenamus on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:05AM (#40737715)
Money, power and football, in no particular order, to be precise
[dead]
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by sofixa on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:31AM (#40737978)
> The EU is a behemoth that absolutely steamrolls smaller countries into submission

Yet curiously Hungary has been allowed to steep down into authoritarianism, and none of Orban's excesses like media or judicial overreaches have been been overiden through submission.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by dtx1 on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:34AM (#40738012)
> That sounds fine for the people of Hungary whom he represents. What should he do, roll over and take it from Germany? The EU is a behemoth that absolutely steamrolls smaller countries into submission. But the squeaky wheel gets greased.

What a uneducated, populistic and stupid take. Just a litle basic statistics about net contributors vs net benificiaries: https://www.statista.com/chart/18794/net-contributors-to-eu-...

Gemany pays shitloads of money into the EU so that places like hungary can benefit. If they feel that's being "steamrolled" into accepting things like the contracts they fucking signed they can fuck back off into irrelevance. As a German tax payer i'd appreciate that very much.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by etx on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:50AM (#40738162)
Shhh.... keep cool.

As a German tax payer too, i appreciate very much that Orban does not roll over and take blackmailing* from Brussels regarding the migration crisis and what Hungary will allow regarding its remaining sovereignty.

* "Hungary has been ordered to pay a €200m (£169m) fine for its refusal to uphold the rights of asylum seekers"

Germany as well as other countries should be thankful that Hungary actually built border protections, something you will never see from established centrist parties and bureaucrats.

PS: Money, Power(, Football) - will always be of interest, be it for the Commies or the Righties. Corruption on both sides, it is just a human thing.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by dtx1 on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:58AM (#40738252)
Yeah another uneducated take from a new account who'd thought. Hungary is paying thos fines because they currently, actively and willingly violate human right laws.[1] Not because they "build border protections". Even if you want a significantly more strict immigration and asylum law, human rights must be protected.

But that's always the trick of the fascists, First violate the rights of the undesired so you can get people used to it, then violate the rights of the rest.

[1]https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2024/06/13/ecj-fines-hung...

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by account42 on Thursday June 20, 2024 @11:17AM (#40739691)
There is no violation of human rights mentioned on your linked page. Economically-motivated migration is not a human right.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by no_time on Thursday June 20, 2024 @10:09AM (#40738979)
> Even if you want a significantly more strict immigration and asylum law, human rights must be protected.

Says who? As a Hungarian I never voted for these “human rights” that allows third worlders to waltz through our borders and into our backyards.

If they don’t like being detained at the border they can pound sand and go back to where they came from. We never invited them and they went through several safe countries to get here.

I wonder how much migration would it take for the overwhelming majority to realize that these “ideals” are utterly ridiculous and go against the very idea of statehood. 10 million economic migrants? 50mil? maybe a hundred?

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by _zoltan_ on Thursday June 20, 2024 @02:32PM (#40741714)
you shouldn't drink the coolaid this hard.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by pilsetnieks on Thursday June 20, 2024 @09:07AM (#40738352)
I don't think there's that much thought involved, they're just aping their Republican heroes.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by HeckFeck on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:39AM (#40737504)
Connotations aside, using a well worn slogan 8 years later is uninspired. This makes it very ironic.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by kibwen on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:51AM (#40737601)
> well worn slogan 8 years later is uninspired

Ironic considering that "Let's Make America Great Again" was Ronald Reagan's campaign slogan in 1980.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by DougN7 on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:02AM (#40737695)
And Hitler used it too.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by JumpCrisscross on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:14AM (#40737811)
> Hitler used it too

Not really. The closest Nazism had to "Make Germany Great Again" was Völkism [1], an anti-modernist movement looking to resurrect not a proximate golden age but romanticised Ancient Germans.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Völkisch_movement

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by codetrotter on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:15AM (#40737824)
> What's True

> A prominent theme during the Nazi Party's ascendancy was restoring Germany to its former greatness, and Adolf Hitler used the phrase "make Germany great again" upon occasion.

> What's False

> "Make Germany Great Again" was not a (campaign) slogan employed by Hitler, and Donald Trump and Adolf Hitler are far from the only politicians who promised to make their countries "great again."

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/make-germany-great-again/

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by michpoch on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:45AM (#40738112)
Hitler wanted to make America Great Again?

He kinda succeeded…

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by UberFly on Thursday June 20, 2024 @11:44AM (#40740014)
Bill Clinton too I believe.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by 3836293648 on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:53AM (#40738188)
Wasn't Thatcher the first?

And Make Britain Great Again is so much better than America/Europe/literally anything that doesn't have great in its name

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by bryanrasmussen on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:56AM (#40738222)
It's true, as an acronym MBGA just slips off the tongue.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by rainsil on Thursday June 20, 2024 @11:46AM (#40740044)
That’s a good thing. Expanded slogans have object-level meanings. Acronyms just stand as identity markers, and are much easier to dismiss.

It’s harder to argue against “Make America Great Again” or “Black Lives Matter”. Their object-level meanings are fairly anodyne and positive. It’s much easier to argue against “MAGA” or “BLM”, since the meaning is obscured by the acronym.

Political movements with nice slogans should avoid turning them into acronyms.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by defrost on Thursday June 20, 2024 @09:09AM (#40738364)
The rebuttal from The Beat flowed

    I see no joy
    I see only sorrow
    I see no chance of your bright new tomorrow

    So stand down Margaret
    Stand down please
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by toyg on Thursday June 20, 2024 @11:19AM (#40739724)
It's fun to stay at the EEEEEM BE GEE AY, It's fun to stay at the EEEEM BE GEE AY...
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by AnimalMuppet on Thursday June 20, 2024 @09:53AM (#40738819)
It's even more ironic when Trump uses it. Like, weren't you supposed to do that 8 years ago? What happened? You didn't do it? Why should we think you'll do it this time?

I mean, I guess it's become like a brand name. But if you think about it for a minute, it's carrying a subtext that Trump failed last time.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by Maken on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:36AM (#40737475)
Orban never disappoints.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by dindobre on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:26AM (#40737398)
I hope they don't use Hungary as the scapegoat to pass this kind of stuff, the fact that something like Chat Control is even discussed is gross already.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by vasco on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:52AM (#40737615)
I think Hungary recently has had some spats with the EU so maybe they will use the approval of Chat Control as some sort of trade with something else they want to keep doing.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by p_l on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:21AM (#40737871)
Orban would welcome the powers gained through Chat Control, so...
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by soco on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:14AM (#40737803)
Just because somebody is called "president" doesn't mean they enjoy the same privileges as a US president. The presidency of the Council does nothing more than calling for discussions. No extra powers, no extra influence, so whoever is in charge matters way less than they'd like to claim (in this particular case to impress Putin, I would suppose).
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by JumpCrisscross on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:50AM (#40737593)
> does not make me very hopeful

Belgium proposed the damn thing.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by eigenket on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:52AM (#40737614)
This time the proposal got canned because Germany said they would vote against it. Unless that changes it isn't going to make any progress.

A lot of Germans still remember the Stazi, so its pretty unlikely that this shit is going to pass.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by JumpCrisscross on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:53AM (#40737625)
> the proposal got canned because Germany said they would vote against it

Both the far left and right in Germany are against this, correct?

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by eigenket on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:59AM (#40737667)
I'm far from an expert in German politics, but there are obvious historical reasons why Germans like the idea of having a right to privacy.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by JumpCrisscross on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:06AM (#40737732)
> there are obvious historical reasons why Germans like the idea of having a right to privacy

There are obvious historical reasons why they shouldn't try far-right, race-based politics, yet here we are [1].

[1] https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/rise-germanys-most-succ...

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by flawn on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:09AM (#40737764)
I don't even understand why people never look and understand the history that happened outside of their country. Just the sheer risk of having a society like in the DDR is reason enough to not do stuff like that.

We never learn (long-term) from the past.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by soco on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:16AM (#40737830)
A sizeable part of Germany is nostalgic after the good ole times, be it of 50 years ago or of 90 years ago. You can see them at the voting booths.
[dead]
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by moe_sc on Thursday June 20, 2024 @09:02AM (#40738296)
Funny you'd say something like this, after somebody made a comment about "sizeable parts" and never an absolute statement.
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by DocTomoe on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:32AM (#40737982)
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by pkos98 on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:05AM (#40737719)
two of the three coalition parties are against it - the greens and the FDP (the social democrats are in favour), thus the government doesnt support.

they are neither far left/right

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by JumpCrisscross on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:08AM (#40737749)
> they are neither far left/right

Are Linke and AfD are for chat control? They're by whom the coalition is being threatened.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by Tainnor on Thursday June 20, 2024 @11:19AM (#40739736)
The current government coalition is threatened by the CDU (centre-right), not by Linke (that has almost no voters left) or AfD (who no other party wants to form a coalition with).

The most likely outcome after the next election at this point looks like a coalition between the CDU and the Green party.

Unfortunately, CDU is probably in favour (they're pretty "law and order") and the Greens probably won't care enough to oppose strongly.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by DasIch on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:12AM (#40737789)
Die Linke (far left), Greens (left), FDP (socially liberal-ish but economically further right than CDU) and AFD (far right) are against it. SPD (left) is internally conflicted about this topic. CDU (right) is in favour.

So essentially everyone who isn't very into law and order type politics and cares about civil rights is against this, regardless of where they are on the political spectrum. This is typical for such issues in Germany.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by nebalee on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:29AM (#40737948)
> So essentially everyone who isn't very into law and order type politics and cares about civil rights is against this, regardless of where they are on the political spectrum.

That does not apply to the afd.

Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by DocTomoe on Thursday June 20, 2024 @08:30AM (#40737968)
German parties always are against something until they are in power, then they magically have changed their minds or agree "with stomach pain"...
Re:EU Council has withdrawn the vote on Chat Control by nalekberov on Thursday June 20, 2024 @07:46AM (#40737555)
Sounds to me more like boiling the frog.