Nothing about this situation describes a monopoly. Every single individual worker has the choice to bust the union; they just prefer not to.
We need to stop these filthy workers before they force company owners to lose a precious single digit percentage of yearly profit.
There are actually many good reasons for this.
Tbh I’ve heard a lot of critique of communists but this this the first time I’ve heard someone claim they were embarrassed about their position
You should check how that's working out for the citizens of the USA and Sweden, and ask the Swedish if they like getting more of the wealth they create or not. (hint: They love it)
That said, Sweden is clearly pro-union. If Musk didn’t want to have to deal with pro-union tactics, like those being employed and considered here, he should have stayed out of Sweden and/or any other market where he may find himself in a similar situation.
But Elon thinks he can throw his money and muscle around and win whenever he wants. I hope he finds out he’s about to get more than he didn’t bargain for.
How would you rate the abilties and compensation of union members Lebron James and Keanu Reeves?
https://www.inc.com/jeff-haden/even-though-lebron-james-make...
This is exactly a case of increasing the median salary at the expense of top performers.
If you check the recorded history you'll find that the NBA salary cap was there since the very first year of the league, and predates the union by several years: https://www.apbr.org/labor.html
Sweden Tesla worker salary is 4k/month, with full health insurance, free kindergarten, free school, free college. In case they get ill, workers get 2 years of 80% salary, and rehabilitation.
While you have at will contrracts in the US, unions in Sweden have ensured 3 months notice. Unions also negotiate minumum annual raise and gives you annual raise at least equal to inflation.
Unemployment insurance is handled by unions, you must be a member - 1 year of 80% salary and additional year. If needed, new training is obtained for free.
Without a union agreement, Musk workers are slaves.
No serious brand operates without unions.
I have no problem with unions so long as they are voluntary. Only if a union is voluntary can you make any fair comparisons to prove their value.
IIRC, you can't have more than a few lines in a movie without being union.
You cannot assume that unions will always do the “right thing”.
A lot of unions encompass the entire labor force of a sector effectively becoming monopolies on labor. Those aren’t healthy for the economy as there is nothing stopping them from abusing their monopoly position.
Frankly, corporations at least have antitrust laws to check them. Are there laws checking the power and abuse of power of unions?
What are the union equivalents? What aren’t unions allowed to do? Are there cases where unions have been sued by governments for breaking these laws?
It's not like they didn't try other means first. Capitalists like Musk will happily break labor laws and endanger their employees just so they can make even more money. Asking nicely and being reasonable doesn't work with people like this. It's not the unions who choose to go this route, it's people being forced to play hardball with greedy billionaires.
Wouldn't be the first time.
Supporting other unions' strikes has always been an integral part of the labor movement. Sometimes this is done with sympathy strikes. They are normal strikes, and all the usual rules regarding strikes apply. The people on strike lose money, which usually keeps excessive sympathy strikes in check.
The American way is having a union contract that states it explicitly that employees do not have to cross picket lines. When there is a strike somewhere, other companies may stop deliveries and other services to the affected company, because they don't have any employees who could provide the services. Those employees are still getting paid, because they are working normally and doing everything they were hired to do. Their employers just cannot provide the services expected from them.
Workers aren’t obligated to perform labor. They aren’t slaves.
Imagine another country was delivering opium to your country and the dock workers went on strike to stop it. This same dumb argument would apply.
If Tesla wants Swedish workers to work for them all they have to do is improve working conditions to the prevailing standard and hire a CEO who doesn’t spend most of his time being an asshole to other people on social media. Simple. Karma’s a bitch. Treat other people badly and expect people to return the favor.
Tesla’s profit per vehicle is well above industry standard, they can afford good wages.
No individual dockworker has "complete control", and the union only has the control its members collectively consent to.
Should pilots have complete control over all planes in the air?
Workers use leverage and they get condemned.
Companies and governments do it and they get praised for being paternal protectors.
If the suits who run the show don’t know how to unload a container ship that’s their problem.
Also, business owners routinely pull the exact reverse, where they withhold or alter their services to extort other participants of the system to give them what they want. Why is it "good business" when the CEO does it but it's "crime" when the workers on the ground do it? Probably, cause it threatens many peoples fantasy that they can be powerful, rich, and in control of the labor one day if they play their cards right.
Their country, threir rules or he can leave.
I am stronly pro unions as in Sweden, beacuse I worked there, and have seen it. They are not like the US unions. Around 70% of people in Sweden are members of unions for $15/month.
Sweden Tesla worker salary is 4k/month, with full health insurance, free kindergarten, free school, free college. In case they get ill, workers get 2 years of 80% salary, and rehabilitation.
While you have at will contrracts in the US, unions in Sweden have ensured 3 months notice. Unions also negotiate minumum annual raise and gives you annual raise at least equal to inflation.
Unemployment insurance is handled by unions, you must be a member - 1 year of 80% salary and additional year. If needed, new training is obtained for free.
Without a union agreement, Musk workers are slaves.
No serious brand operates without unions.
Imagine if another country was delivering opium to your country and the dock workers get a cut so they have a financial interest in keeping the opium flowing. You outlaw opium and the dock workers strike grinding all commerce to a halt until you un-outlaw opium.
Monopolies are generally bad. It gives the monopolist nigh absolute power and absolute power will often be abused.
What are most labor unions but monopolies on labor? It would not be so bad if there are competing unions but often there is just one.
As soon as it’s workers benefiting from corruption we can’t tolerate it, but as long as it’s a corporation or government benefiting we let it slide.
It’s a double standard. If you’re going to break up a union you’d better break up Amazon.
Why can't we just agree that monopolies are bad in both cases?
>Workers aren’t obligated to perform labor. They aren’t slaves.
When companies cooperate with each other and lobby and enforce their own labor laws, it's just the free market.
When workers do the same thing, and are only asking for a fair piece of the pie, it's apparently a "hostage situation."
Will nobody think of the poor multinational corporations and their billionaire owners?
Sarcasm aside, if Tesla has trouble dealing with labor in a certain country, they are always free to take their business of selling shitty cars out of there. There are other companies that will be glad to fill the gap.
From the accounting oligopolies, to the online ads oligopolies, to the b2b software oligopolies, to the publishing oligopolies, to the oil oligopolies, to the breakfast cereal oligopolies, to the music oligopolies, to the advertising oligopolies to...can you tell me what industry there are laws that prevent monopolies and oligopolies? Local restaurants and lawn care?
Finansförbundet will probably not signal until the strike has been going on for at least a few months, but I believe that a couple of other sectors will.
Tesla is like that guest who comes to your house only to refuse to follow the ways of those who actually live there. Tesla, Amazon and the rest of all these companies that are coming here is acting like it's America - it's not, and they will know this soon enough.
Collective agreements is how you do business in Sweden and their arrogance in thinking that they can come here and impose American business culture on our nation is so nonchalant that it probably have secured the support from the general majority in favour of the unions.
Let the games begin...
A company that comes here and wants nothing to do with unions can't fit into this system, because everything is built on the collective bargaining. Yes, the unions have an important position, you can call it a monopoly, what you miss here is that employers are also organized and have just as much leverage. The central bargaining means that there is literally no risk that a company gets singled out, the local union isn't going to demand a huge pay rise just for Tesla workers.
So there's little risk in signing an agreement with the union, nearly all the other sizable companies in Sweden have done so. On the other hand, no one is going to lift a finger to help Tesla if they continue to be stupid.
Sweden salary is 4k/month, with full health insurance, free school for the kids, free college. In case they get ill, workers get 2 years of 80% salary.
While you have at will contrracts in the US, unions in Sweden have ensured 3 months notice. Unions also negotiate minumum annual raise and gives you annual raise at least equal to inflation.
Unemployment insurance is handled by unions, you must be a member - 1 year of 80% salary and additional year. If needed, new training is obtained for free.
Without a union agreement, Musk workers are slaves.
No serious brand operates without unions.
Companies do favours for "unrelated" companies all the time - Tesla of all companies is in no place to complain about the same tactics being used on them. Outlawing this is what turned anglo countries into the capitalist hellscape they've become.
> if one union is responsible for unloading at all ports in Sweden (idk if this is the case and it wasn't that easy to look up), then that feels very much like a monopoly.
The union represents the workers. It's not a monopoly any more than a country having a single government is a monopoly.
In any case, analogies are not needed, this is typical union struggle, and it s how things work for a century. In the end there is compromise
That would probably be difficult, as construction workers and related unions would presumably also join the sympathy strike. Electricians are already involved.
> more of cartels than worker collectives, and getting involved in another unrelated unions negotiation seems to cross that line.
It's in all the unions' interest to defend the current model. Sympathy strikes make sense.
Their country their rules, but measures like this seem to go beyond negotiating and is just a hostage situation.
Would tesla be able to bring in their own employees to unload the cars, or would they be forced to build their own port where they're allowed to drive the cars off the ship themselves? I'm guessing it's the latter if it's possible at all.
There's a point where unions can come off as more of cartels than worker collectives, and getting involved in another unrelated unions negotiation seems to cross that line.
There's a large number of laws that exist to prevent monopolies from companies, but if one union is responsible for unloading at all ports in Sweden (idk if this is the case and it wasn't that easy to look up), then that feels very much like a monopoly.