> I’m a classical neophyte and struggle with composer/orchestra/conductor fit.

If you're new to classical music you really don't need to worry about this. Almost all available professional recordings are of high quality, and the differences between interpretations are relatively subtle.

What is important is to get a sense of which composers you enjoy. Classical music spans a large period of time with very different styles, so try a few well-known composers from different time periods to see what you like. I greatly enjoy classical music and I regularly attend(ed) concerts, but my interests are very narrow and I don't get a lot of enjoyment out of Mozart and Beethoven for instance.

In my opinion, classical music is best enjoyed when you devote your full attention to listening to the music, i.e. when you're not doing anything else (or something with a very low cognitive load, like walking/driving/etc). Focus on how the music makes you feel, but it's okay to let your thoughts wander off a bit.

I kind of disagree with this. For the post-Beethoven era, sure, but the standard way of playing Beethoven and before tends to be heavily biased towards an uninformed modern idea of what classical music "should" be, which is stodgy, slow, smooth, heavily refined, overcooked with crescendoes and decrescendos, and quite inauthentic. Almost as though it's shameful for music to be immediate and exciting at the risk of being unrefined. If you compare Furtwängler's[1] Beethoven symphonies to Christopher Hogwood's... one sounds like music for wealthy old people at a concert hall. The other sounds like music. (Don't get me started on the routine butchering of Bach...)

But that's just my opinion. The point is it really pays to try different conductors, performers and performances before the 1830s or so. I'm not sure why that time changes things, but I'd guess the romantic style that came after more closely aligns with artsy-fartsy performance practices, and that composers also became more careful about marking how their works should be performed. Anyway, trying different things is also a good exercise in developing personal taste, which is a key ingredient of music appreciation.

[1] I originally had von Karajan here, but I went back to have a listen and it wasn't as bad as I remembered. Substituted Furtwängler's inexplicably famous recordings, which sound like the entire orchestra took Valium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bOxcryX1VE . Compare to Beethoven's recommended tempo and historical style: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Y07M8e5g-Y

I wonder if this is a similar effect as the “classic white marble” impression of Greek & Roman architecture - we have an entire aesthetic (both artistic and cultural) built off of the “purity” of the white marble remains; meanwhile it turns out in their time they were garishly colored and decorated because the Greeks and romans, like all other humans, actually enjoyed living in places and looking at things.

It's quite similar. There's definitely a "white marble effect" coming from the original sources, that tend to be a very barebone notation of the music with basically no indications on how to perform it. But we know from written discussions that creative improvisation was key to performance in that era, and regarded as the very peak of music instruction even more so than composition itself! Sometimes we get lucky and have more detailed sources, that tell us how some pieces might have been performed in detail.

That’s a great point.

I wonder if in future there will be slow, dignified recordings of Nicky Minaj et al

Exactly! Furtwängler is just Beethoven chopped and screwed

You can find those all over Spotify already ;) More so if the artist does not have any music on there.

Between the two examples, the historical style feels much more alive, vibrant, dynamic. There's a real energy there.

I went back to the Furtwängler version and it felt like what my mind feels like when my depression kicks in. It's flattened out and lethargic, like it's lost the will to live.

I'm no classical music connoisseur, I rarely listen to it. But the difference is night and day to my untrained ears. One is boring and the other captures my attention.

I went to a performance by the Seattle Symphony back when Gerald Schwartz was conducting and he managed to make Beethoven's 9th symphony sound dull. It was an impressive feat. He explained, for reasons I've forgotten, that he even muted the violins. I went to a second performance a few years later by the same conductor, and it was equally devoid of spirit. It was enervated by far more than just the plodding tempo.

On the other hand, John Eliot Gardiner's Orchestre Révolutionnaire et Romantique plays Beethoven on period instruments at the tempo the composer indicated, and it's absolutely gripping.

I was with you up until you mentioned Christoper Hogwood. Not that there's anything wrong with him just that that wouldn't be the first name to pop up in my head when I think music vs 'stodgy music for wealthy old people'. It makes me think what you're trying to say in so many words is that you prefer music played on period instruments using something close to the orchestra that would have been available to the composer in their own time. That would limit you to music from sometime before the mid 1800's since composers since then pretty much have had the modern orchestra we have today so 'period' orchestras would be anachronistic and not what the composer intended. If you like period orchestras you should check out recordings of the Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra in San Francisco. They also play 'Hogwood' style on authentic period instruments.

I have [this CD](https://www.allmusic.com/album/vivaldi-the-four-seasons-conc...) from 1990 of Vladimir Spivakov and the Moscow Virtuosi playing Vivaldi's Four Seasons. I have never heard a version of the Four Seasons that was so vibrant. Unfortunately I've never been able to find the exact recording on a streaming service, but I cherish that album.

As someone who doesn't listen to classical music, I'd say I prefer Furtwängler's recording to your other link. It sounds more epic, like an action movie, while the other one sounds more like the backdrop to some village festival. But I was surprised for sure how different the two sounded, and that's not something I had ever really considered before, so thanks for showing me this.

I totally agree with this. I used to listen to a lot of classical music (radio, vinyl, in concert). There seems to be something about the mid-20th century conductors where all their recordings are slow, ponderous and somnolent. Beethoven in particular, but many other composers get the same treatment. Hogwood's recordings are great. IMHO the best recording of Beethoven's 9th that I've heard is Leonard Bernstein's.

How is Bach routinely butchered, and do you have recommended recordings of Bach's keyboard works (let's say WTC and the inventions/sinfonias)?

Maybe try Nikolayeva's recordings?

WTC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNpwAZf6thY

Inventions and sinfonias: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bL7oyuqEwA

Lots of people recommend Gould in this thread. Check out the difference of the first invention in the link above with the first invention of Gould, and see what you prefer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQot-jM6FSw

I don't have an opinion about whether anyone has butchered Bach or not, but, after listening to a half-dozen interpretations of the WTC (all on piano), I find that I like Zhu Xiao-Mei's the best.

Harpsichord parts played on piano...

Glenn Gould was unsurpassed.

It's indisputable that he was a virtuoso on the keyboard, but unfortunately he accompanied that with annoying humming that many recordings pick up way too much of.

I agree with this answer. I listen to classical constantly but still don't really feel like I understand it well.

What I did was just listen..listen..listen and then look for patterns in what I liked.

I love Vivaldi and Bach, but I tend not to love too many of the other "big names". Turns out I really love most anything from the Baroque period! And I literally just used that Wikipedia entry as a starting part to continue looking for more composers.

If you like Baroque keyboard music, try something like Scarlatti. It's a bit difficult finding good interpretations (I have a CD somewhere), but here's an example

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTi-QXenilQ

Rameau is a different kind of beast from Bach:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbIGcj_Avb8 https://youtu.be/NK3-URQntcg?t=1383

I also really recommend giving Bach's cello suites a try:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGgG-0lOJjk

> If you're new to classical music you really don't need to worry about this. Almost all available professional recordings are of high quality, and the differences between interpretations are relatively subtle.

Agreed, but it's also important to understand that what's truly distinctive about Western classical music (as opposed to other music traditions) is it being a written art form first and foremost, with sheet music as the "standard" form for a piece and performance being subsequent to that. If you're "new" to serious/cultivated music, you really should start by learning to read the sheet music and follow along when listening to a performance. Everything else in music appreciation is downstream of that.

>what's truly distinctive about Western classical music (as opposed to other music traditions) is it being a written art form first and foremost

I find this hard to believe, music score can be copied down the generation with some degree of lost-in-translation, they might not be the full materialization of the composer's idea, some copier may write down their own idea on the sheets.

I would agree that music score is the only means of accessing composer's works for Western classical music, and thereby became the "standard". But this would also likely be true for other culture's music, and therefore it's not unique.

Hi, I find this useful https://old.reddit.com/r/classicalresources/

Also, I have used Idagio in the past, which has a mood-based suggester.

Related, I would recommend the book "1001 Classical Recordings You Must Hear Before You Die" [0]. The works are neatly arranged by chronological order, so you can easily discover new works from a period you like. And it gave me plenty of ideas just browsing it.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1214513.1001_Classical_R...

>best enjoyed when you devote your full attention to listening to the music, i.e. when you're not doing anything else

Reminds me of going to live concerts, and my guest being surprised that I spend most of my time with my eyes closed - so that I can focus on the music.

Bach: The Art of Fugue performed by Emerson String Quartet (Deutsche Grammophon)

Classical music rewards close listening, but orchestral pieces can be overwhelming to those who haven't trained themselves to listen closely. This is a good set of recordings to start with, as there are only a handful of performers, each with a distinctive sound.

Digression: once one has learned the pieces, this can be a good audio assessment tool. Some speakers over-amplify specific sounds. Some amps muddy certain frequencies or complex sounds. A string quartet performing similar melodies is a great way to notice this.

This specific album was the first that really opened my eyes to audio quality differences. If all four instruments are playing, I should be able to hear them. If all I can hear is the viola, there's something wrong with the system. Or, if I can suddenly hear all four where I couldn't before... These are significant differences, not minor ones.

From there, it was learning finer details. The first time I could hear the attack, sustain, and release of a note on a stringed instrument. Changing equipment and suddenly getting what "soundstage" meant. Etc.

This album also kept me honest when diving into the potentially incredibly expensive and super opinionated audiophile world. How does this compare to my personal system? Am I noticing anything I've not noticed before? Is anything missing? Do the answers to these questions justify spending money? Surprisingly, the answer most of the time to the last question was no.

I love the recording I have of Academy of St Martin in the Fields that has The Art of Fugue and Musical Offering (Philips, 1994). Both works are beautiful explorations of counterpoint. Especially MO if you read the story behind it. And the Crab Canon... Bach blows my mind. TBH I am no audiophile, but I like their performance. Have you heard it?

I have not. I will check it out. Thank you!

IMO you need percussion to really show the capabilities of the speakers or headphones. Cymbals especially sound like mud on bad speakers.

Four musicians is three too many for the Art of Fugue. Just listen to Hewitt or Koroliov or any other solo keyboard.

Others have recommended Mozart's Requiem if you like music with singing. If you haven't heard Robert Levin's completion, e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=457pvjOo9Hw, I think it takes the cake.

For a neophyte, I think it's good to start with the war horses, for which there are lots of high-quality modern recordings.

- Bach Brandenberg concerti (I like the Netherlands Bach Society, they have tons of great Bach recordings on Youtube. If you're into Bach, highly recommend you check them out.)

- Goldberg variations (I like Glen Gould's later recording, but Kimiko Ishizaka is also a great libre recording, and Netherlands Bach Society has a great recording on harpsichord)

- Mozart Symphony 40

- Mozart piano, violin sonatas

- Beethoven Symphonies 3,5,9 (I really like https://www.youtube.com/user/hrSinfonieorchester)

- Chopin waltzes, etudes, nocturnes

- Rach piano concerto 2, Rhapsody on a Theme by Paganini

- Sibelius violin concerto (I like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0w0t4Qn6LY)

- Bruch violin concerto

Personally I think watching videos helps bring the music alive in a way that listening to recordings doesn't. And maybe it's heresy to some, but I think modern recordings are, in general, a lot more pleasant to listen to.

HTH!

If you like baroque music, I can't help but plug my own New York City-based ensemble (named after Bach himself), the Sebastians: https://www.sebastians.org I'm the group's harpsichordist and director.

We've released a lot of free content on Youtube, especially this year: https://www.youtube.com/thesebastians . Just today I released four recent performances, including Bach's fifth Brandenburg concerto: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHr9-Ht2XSI .

Happy listening!

Not the OP but happy to help!

Since you already like Bach, start by exploring his work!

Let's start with the Goldberg Variations, which are 30 variations on a theme set for the keyboard. Glenn Gould's 1955 recording is perhaps the best known recording of this work: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cwas_7H5KUs

I also greatly enjoy Andras Schiff's interpretations of Bach: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbOwhF1hFcg

For opera, I suggest starting with the Magic Flute by Mozart. There are so many good recording to choose from but why not watch the thing? It's meant to be a visual/audio format, after all! I suggest this recording of the Metropolitan Opera - it's what got me hooked on operas many years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjZfHFPIk7g

If you like Maria Callas, you'll love Italian operas. Why not start with the classic, La Traviata? I can't find any of Callas's performances online (aside from clips), but you may like this performance with Anna Netrebko: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYGiRbDHr7k

Finally, a note on where/how to listen to classical music. I find Youtube to be an incredible tool for listening and for discovery. It's not necessary to dig back to vinyl or 8-track to listen to great performances - they've been remastered for CDs and lossless media.

But ultimately you want to listen to it in person. I'll never forget seeing my first opera in person (The Flying Dutchman). Or the time I scored orchestra seats for Sibelius's 4th symphony. Until the performances return, you might want to buy a ticket to an online performance on DG Premium, which is Deutsche Grammophon's streaming service: https://www.dg-premium.com/

Good luck and good listening!

EDIT: Alas, the Magic Flute performance I linked to doesn't have subtitles! Boo! Here's one that does, though it's not the classic Met production: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPxrbeR5ZyE

Personally I find Gould's persistent humming to be very grating (not endearing) and recommend Kimiko Ishizaka over him any day.

If you'd like to explore the BBC Music Magazine's list of 20 greatest conductors might not be a bad place to start for orchestral music. The ordering may be a bit controversial but these are all great artists and the listing has some of their best performances.

https://www.classical-music.com/features/artists/20-greatest...

Some personal favourites:

Brahms 4 - Carlos Kleiber / Vienna Philharmonic (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ho-H-8FzbU8)

Mahler 2 - Claudio Abbado / Lucerne (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MPuoOj5TIw)

Shostakovich Symphonies - Bernard Haitink / London Philharmonic / Concertgebouw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YS4dcZ90fN0)

One thing to look out for in baroque is original instruments vs modern instruments performances. Original instruments have a very different - leaner - sound. I find I much prefer them now. Someone like John Eliot Gardiner is amazing in original instruments Bach.

If you like Bach played on authentic instruments, you must know the "All of Bach" recordings

https://www.bachvereniging.nl/en/about-allofbach

All of Bach is a project of the Netherlands Bach Society. High-quality recordings of the works by Johann Sebastian Bach are made freely available for everyone.

Thank you - that looks awesome. Look forward to exploring.

I second the Mahler recommendation, I haven't heard that particular recording of Mahler 2 but it's one of my favorite symphonies ever and I was worried I was going to get through this thread without even reading Mahler's name.

I'd also add Bruckner to the list (my favorites are 4 and 8, and since I like big brass section then the Chicago Symphony Orchestra recordings with Solti fit me well, although I realize many classical music purists will probably disagree with me there).

Thank you. I'd second Bruckner and the Chicago brass!

The Lucerne Mahler 2 is a great performance - but it's also special for other reasons: Claudio Abbado had previously been Chief Conductor of the Berlin Philharmonic but has diagnosed in 2000 with stomach cancer and had to stand down. After severe surgery he was able to return to conducting (I think for the first time) in Lucerne with an orchestra of musicians that were hand picked by Abbado from the world's greatest orchestras and chamber ensembles. So a hugely emotional event as well as a great performance.

Wow very cool story, will have to check it out!

I love this question so much.

Try listening to string quartets. Here are a few brilliant ones:

All of Schubert: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_nK-_o1OYLszr8d...

Shostakovich 8: https://youtu.be/HgExfvXq7VI

Beethoven 10 (Harp): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exMaWKVcCEs

Mendelssohn 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UAU7xbTOyA

There are so many more but string quartets are such a wonderful place to get started. Intimate, pure music, with so much passion and excitement.

The Schubert link demonstrates one of the real bugbears of classical music which is streamed or ripped using the usual online metadata database: "Death and the Maiden" is #46–49, presumably because it was tracks 46 to 49 in the boxed set. In reality, it is a 30 minute piece in 4 parts which is normally performed on its own.

You wouldn't normally listen to just one part ("movement") and rarely to more than a couple of pieces at a time. Classical pieces are usually numbered ("opus", abbreviated "Op.", which is Latin for "work"). Schubert is one of those composers who didn't number them himself. He died young of syphilis and left his manuscripts in a disorganised mess. They were sorted through by a guy called Deutsch, hence the numbers here are "Deutsch" numbers. Here, "Death and the Maiden" is D. 810.

The Italian after the Roman numerals for the movements are speed markings ("allegro" = "fast"), and this piece shows a typical progression: fast, slow, playful/fast, faster. They should be listened to in order, one after the other. The idea is that the music takes you through a sequence of moods, like courses in a dinner.

If you think you might like opera check out the René Jacobs' recordings of Mozart's Italian Operas on the Harmonia Mundi label: Cosi Fan Tutte, Le Nozze di Figaro & Don Giovannni.

In general as a beginner I wouldn't worry too much about finding the best recording of any particular piece. Once you start to develop some favorites then you can pick a few and compare. Streaming services make this a lot easier and cheaper than it used to be.

I don't know if I agree with that. The recording can make the difference between a transcendent piece and dogshit. For example if Beethoven's Fifth is played too fast, especially if there's not enough of a pause between the first two phrases... it just ruins the whole thing.

Hah, that's funny. I grew up with a super fast Karajan (perhaps to make it fit on an LP?), and have had a hard time adjusting to the slower tempo that most recordings have.

Personally, for me all Beethoven symphonies >= 4 are a treat. If you ever get the chance to see one live, go. It's overwhelming.

Youtube can be helpful when it comes to interpretations. With some luck, there's going to be music geeks recommending other versions, so you can click around and find one you prefer.

> If you ever get the chance to see one live, go. It's overwhelming.

This is an important aspect of classical music (like any other music) that's easily missed. Even the finest recordings don't capture anything like the feelings of experiencing a live performance up close. The acoustics, the sense of space, the tension and urgency of mistakes and recoveries (which are barely tolerated in modern professional recordings, as lovely and "perfect" as they try to be).

If you have a chance to get to the symphony, or a string quartet recital, or a polyphonic vocal ensemble in a cathedral, take the opportunity! I guarantee it sounds different, often more vibrant, more real. (Not that this stops me from collecting tons of recordings, which are great too, just a different beast.)

You don't like the 3rd? I'd put the Eroica in my top 10 list of symphonies by anybody.

Honestly I’ve never seen a Karajan that I liked

wouldn't choose his recordings for the beethoven/bach/mozart, but he definitely had his moments

critics argue about his mahler 9th; i think it's amazing

they don't argue about his bruckner 8th and 9th; among his last gigs

and then there's stuff like strauss where he was unparalleled

Yeah that's true but if you stick to the major labels and performers you're very unlikely to hear a performance that bad. IMO worrying too much about this as a beginner is a distraction.

But once you start to develop some favorites then hearing different takes can add a lot of enjoyment I agree.

I agree this is mostly a matter of taste. Consider the endless debates over Heifetz and Argerich’s playing styles.

Do you want to read a really entertaining book?

The Great Pianists, by Harold C. Shonberg

https://www.amazon.com/Great-Pianists-Mozart-Present/dp/0671...

You don't have to worry about reading the whole thing. Read through Bach and Mozart (and maybe Beethoven) to begin with. You'll get a feel for the historical background, and mention of their major pieces. Then, you go listen to the pieces.

I know these are pianists, but a good number of the great composers were some of the foremost pianists of their time.

Supplement a composer you've read about with a YouTube video or two, and their entry in Wikipedia, and you're off to a great start.

Anyway, that's one approach.

You should definitely listen to Bach's mass in B minor and his cantatas if you like vocal work and Bach. Also listen to Mozart's Requiem.

Some other good stuff would be all the symphonies by Mozart and Beethoven. Vivaldi's four seasons.

Also try Bach's Brandenburg Concertos, and Goldberg Variations.

For opera listen to some of the overtures and highlights by Wagner (Tannhauser, Tristan & Isolde, Lohengrin).

Also check out Glenn Gould for Bach!

Concerto #1 in D minor

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljLi9A0H8H4

I asked a classical-loving friend this same question and she gave me a wonderful Spotify playlist that I can share if you're interested[1]. I also condensed it down to my own favorites if you'd like that as well[2].

[1]: Turns out I'm unable to share her playlist, but...

[2]: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/2Foxcns6j4SwiWIWiaEtKX?si=...

Ever really loved a classical piano song? No? Maybe you just don't like the controversial new way we've been tuning pianos for the last ~200 years.

Check out the 1/4 comma meantone version of Mozart Fantasie KV397 [1] which you can compare to equal temperament. (Please note this piece was unfinished, and the final section is believed to have been written by someone else.)

My secret love is Chopin Ballade No. 4 Op. 52 in unequal temperament [2]. Last year this video had ~4k views. I may be responsible for 1k and it's now ~8k views. You can compare a good ET version Krystian Zimmerman [3].

Jacob Collier has referred to Equal Temperament as a "hoax" [4]

[1]: https://youtu.be/lzsEdK48CDY?t=701

[2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJT5Q6HooyA

[3]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pe-GrRQz8pk

[4]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwRSS7jeo5s

BBC Radio 3 has a whole series about this called Building a Library. There’s a UK retailer called Presto that annotate their stock with the different endorsements too - they sell digital files as well, if you’re not in the UK. Then it’s really about learning what you like. Personally, I’d start by period: broadly, Baroque (Bach, Vivaldi etc), Classical (Beethoven, Mozart etc), Romantic (Debussy, Ravel). The periods have identifiable styles and can be a good way to introduce yourself to the nuance of the compositions. Finally, there’s a question of instrumentation: whether you prefer orchestral, vocal, chamber, solo etc.

Sounds like a lot of work, but remember it should be fun! It’s new music, a bunch of which you’ve probably never heard before. Have an open mind and dive in!

Also, assuming you have access where you live and the means, live music doesn’t have to be prohibitively expensive. Check out the programs at your local concert halls and go down to hear some music.

Presto is fabulous, CDs, SACDs, mp3s; 30s samples for most of the stock, if you order the CD you get immediate access to the mp3 ...

Not affiliated with them at all, but they were a lifesaver during the lockdown (without Schoenberg to get drunk to, who knows how I would have made it through)

If you have an iPad, Deutsche Grammophon's apps are a great intro to the intellectual and emotional complexity and nuance of some key classical works. They have apps for Beethoven's 9th, Vivaldi's Four Seasons, and Liszt's Sonata.

https://apps.apple.com/us/app/beethovens-9th-symphony/id6019...

With Beethoven's 9th, while you are listening it visually syncs the original manuscript and score, a visualization of where in the orchestra different instruments are playing, and includes analysis of the performance and intention of the parts. It also lets you switch between four different performances of the 9th by the Berliner Philharmoniker, so you can compare and contrast interpretations over the years.

Highly recommended!

Seek out any Bach played by Glenn Gould. The incredible thing here is that Bach left sheet music but sheet music of the age did not include time, so the music has to be interpreted. The "Goldberg Variations" are this interpretation by Glenn Gould (a pianist).

I'd throw in Beethoven's 3rd and 5th Symphonies.

I'd also throw in something like Verdi's Rigoletto and Rossini's Barber of Seville.

In my past I owned a record label which specialised in pop, rock and folk music. I had to learn classical like I had to learn jazz. But the thing that made this easier for me was the realisation that there is far far more rock / pop than there is classical or jazz. It can be intimidating but you only need an entry point to get you started. Whatever that is will be personal to you, but the best advice anyone can give is to just listen.

> so the music has to be interpreted

Just to extend this point: My understanding of the topic might be far off as I haven't ever learned music under a teacher. But to me there's great deal of interpretation even with tempi marks that even good students just aren't thinking.

I sometimes enjoy watching masterclasses of players with wealth of experience. Andres Schiff is one of the most famous ones. Also Maxim Vengerov the violinist. Anyone that hasn't seen one masterclass should look up on youtube if that sound remotely interesting.

Besides tempo, at Bach's time, dynamics (loudness) weren't usually written down.

But there's always a lot of interpretation involved, even today. The score is a very rough model of the music, akin to jotted down notes outlining a novel. Or like a manuscript for a film.

I had great success with Robert Greenberg's series on music and music history. I started with How to Listen to and Understand Opera which is available on his site (https://robertgreenbergmusic.com/download/how-to-listen-unde...) and The Great Courses as well. If you want a preview shoot me an email.

He adds lots of fun history to go with it. Bach's Goldberg Variations was his greatest financial success "The Count presented him with a golden goblet filled with 100 louis-d'or." and he was obsessed with coffee. Coffee cantana by him as well.

I’ll second his courses. Went through his Listen to and Understand Great Music course on The Great Courses through Audible.

If you like Bach you might want to learn to listen to polyphony: the form of music in which multiple melodies are played simultaneously while forming an harmonious whole. I recommend looking & listening to videos of Stephen Malinowsky (smalin on youtube), particularly his older videos with less visual clutter. Each color is a separate melody. Initially and you should try to focus on just one melody, then see if you can easily switch your focus to an other one. Then see if you can listen/focus on two melodies at the same time, then three... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL81D26D4A47388279

In general I would not worry to much about the performer, but it might be interesting to listen to different interpretations of the same piece, particularly from composers with very idiosyncratic styles. On youtube, Ashish Xiangyi Kumar (https://www.youtube.com/c/AshishXiangyiKumar) has videos of pieces (mainly piano solo) interpreted by different artist.

Youtube used to be a treasure trove for discovering classical music. Listen to a piece/composer you like and you'd get quite good suggestions to go from there, often from lesser known composers and rare recordings.

These days those have mostly been scrubbed from Youtube and if they're still they're they're pretty undiscoverable since the suggestion algorithm is so bad now.

I've made an opinionated playlist for some friends that you may enjoy. It includes my favorites from the past few years, and has a semi-decent range of composers/time periods. I will keep adding to it.

https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5iXkMfXJPsaqcAgZBu6eAU

It's very much a personal thing. As time goes by, we discover composers and pieces we want to return to over and over. At that point, you'll probably prefer some performances of particular pieces (conductor, orchestra, soloists, tempos, tame or wild-eyed) better than others. For example, some conductors will rush through something (to get it over with?) while others will work hard to make you feel every phrase, hear each instrumental solo.

This all takes time ... and will probably change over time for you. Try to make mental (or paper) notes when you really like a performance. Some conductors are really good in certain periods, but are flat in others.

In the past few years, I most enjoyed Christian Thielemann's conducting of the Beethoven symphonies. Pretty hard to go wrong with the Vienna Philharmonic ... before Brahms, that is. OTOH, Karajan ruins everything. ;->

Fwiw, I have learned a lot by listening to classical radio in the background every day.

Some of the great stations (imho -- KDFC in SF, CPR Classical Colorado, King FM in Seattle, Portland's station) have outstanding DJs who talk about the composers, soloists, conductors, orchestras, time period, etc.

I recommend BBC Radio 3 for the same reasons.

IDK if this makes it more approachable, but one of my favorite things to listen to of all time is Vivaldi Recomposed (Max Richter). It's the four seasons, still a mini-orchestra but with modern sound techniques. I find it haunting and beautiful and I listen it all the time when I'm working. Has good pacing ups and downs, reminds me of the old Sim City building music

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oYWfJuMGMA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ebm69gW9UlI

When I want to find new things I listen to Classical King FM (they stream online here). I find they have really good taste.

https://www.king.org/

Whenever I hear something I like, I write down the piece and the conductor/orchestra.

They helped me find all sorts of good recordings and compositions that I otherwise wouldn't have listened to. For some reason, for my whole life I thought I didn't like Brahms. But the third time that I heard some breathtaking piece, thinking "what is this??", and then finding out it was Brahms, I realized my mind had been changed.

For modern performances Stefan Jackiw soloing for Max Bruch’s Scottish Fantasy is my favorite piece of music. And you can fortunately watch it on YouTube. I’ve listened to a number of recordings and no others compare, not even Heifetz’s. I’d listen to Stefan Jackiw perform just about anything though, with any orchestra - something about his playing enchants me.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3aVET-CDRWk

Learning a bit of music history will give you a roadmap. By placing a composer in the time line of the evolution of western music, you will have a scaffold to frame your listening and other learning. When you hear something you like (or don’t like) look at when the composer was working and who they studied under. Then explore a bit about that time period and the artistic aims of the composers of that period. Listen to what you enjoy and to music adjacent (by time and school) to what you enjoy.

This show: Exploring music with Bill McGlaughlin

https://www.wfmt.com/programs/exploring-music/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exploring_Music

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_McGlaughlin

This might not be what you are looking for (and, indeed, it doesn't quite answer your question), but it has had a meaningful impact on my quality of life

https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/how-to-listen-to-and...

It can be had for cheap via audible.

May I recommend Leonard Bernstein’s series Omnibus.

> Whenever I’ve asked HN for help, I’ve ended up with new favourite recordings of all time.

What are your favorite recordings? I’ve been listening to a lot of Bach myself lately, but I am also a neophyte. I got into Bach via the Modern Jazz Quartet’s John Lewis’ interpretations of the Well Tempered Clavier. Bach has been a trip.

Wow 2nd time I have heard someone talk about Maria Callas in 2 days!

So you must listen to her in Aida and La Traviata.

As far as classical one of the most amazing pieces I can recommend is Scheherazade by Korsakov.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scheherazade_(Rimsky-Korsakov)

I do it this way: Find some piece you really like, then find an interpretation you really like.

I think that's actually the way it should be. People tend to hype this or that conductor or sound, and there is certainly merit to it, but I think it is even more a matter of taste than the actual music. Once you really like a certain symphony, you will listen to it many times. Then, you will have some opinion on how things should be played to excite you, make you happy etc.

Min/maxing composer/performance dyads based on reputation is probably pretty nonsensical, even if it is nerdy fun. For example, there are some pieces I really like, and I acknowledge that Karajan is "the man", but his recording simply doesn't give me the right vibe to enjoy the music compared to some obscure conductor I found somewhere on an old compilation CD.

One last thing: I personally do not enjoy Bach, much of Mozart, Vivaldi or "Classical"/Baroque music. There is a whole world of stuff beyond that, however, and some of it is very different. Bruckner, Mahler, Brahms, Tchaikovsky, Dvorak, Mendelssohn.

In fact, the first thing I recommend is usually Dvorak 9th Symphony "A new World". Its second movement (Largo I think it is called) is eye-wateringly beautiful, but it also doesn't turn off people who get bored by Bach, Mozart, Vivaldi et al (like me).

These kinds of questions are frequently asked and answered in detail on Reddit r/classical music [0]

The FAQ on the right side of the home page has links to introductory pages.

You're starting on a fun journey!

[0] https://www.reddit.com/r/classicalmusic/

As someone with just a touch of classical knowledge from high school band and such, I’ve truly enjoyed and learned a lot from the Classical Classroom podcast (https://classicalclassroomshow.com/).

Listen to a radio station curated by genuine experts, like BBC Radio 3, and learn which curators you like.

The piece that first got me interested in classical music was Arthur Rubinstein playing Beethoven's 5th Piano Concerto (the "Emperor Concerto"). I recommend that piece, but I particularly recommend Rubinstein's performance.

Watch Disney’s Fantasia (both of them). They’re a bit of a who’s who of classical music and a good jumping board to find more stuff. The first one is also an animation tour de force (the second is pretty damn good too, but not as groundbreaking)

i am not sure it's a good beginner piece... the music was playing second fiddle to the animation.

> Many found fault with Stokowski's rearrangements and abridgements of the music. Igor Stravinsky, the only living composer whose music was featured in the film, expressed displeasure at how in Stokowski's arrangement of The Rite of Spring, "the order of the pieces had been shuffled, and the most difficult of them eliminated", and criticized the orchestra's performance, observing that the simplification of the score "did not save the musical performance, which was execrable"

That’s a fair point.

Shostakovich's string quartets by the Pavel Haas Quartet are just really amazing to me.

Nikolai Kasputin wrote a lot of jazz-inspired, but still "classical" pieces. Won't quite sound like much of the rest of what you'll encounter.

If I may add my own recommendation — Ralph Kirschbaum's 1993 recordings of Bach's cello suites (blue cover). My entire Spotify subscription is basically "let me listen to this one album, please. Thanks."

Some great recommendations already here, I'll add another one: https://www.reddit.com/r/classicalresources

This might interest you: https://www.thegreatcourses.com/professors/robert-greenberg

Read Music for Life by Fiona Maddocks: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01HDY2O0E

My favorites:

Baroque / Europa Galante / Fabio Biondi

Ancient music / La Capella Reial de Catalunya / Jordi Saval

I would recommend going to live concerts. Classical music is about emotional communication between humans. A live performance is a much richer human communication channel than a recording. The moment in time is unique and not reproducible. My greatest emotional feelings were while live listening or self playing. I always remember them.