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Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by idle_zealot on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:08PM (#36448828)
This is a mandatory install on macOS for me (one of many). The suite of extra software utilities required to make the base OS usable is ridiculous, but I'm glad to see open source maintainers working to keep my mouse working.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ahstilde on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:19PM (#36448982)
what are your other mandatory installs?
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ajdude on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:22PM (#36449022)
Not the parent, but one of the first things I usually install on new Mac is Karabiner-Elements. Absolutely needed if you're using a non-mac keyboard.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by c-hendricks on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:40PM (#36449246)
What do you use it for? I use a non-Apple keyboard and just switched the options / command key in System Settings.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by sharikous on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:44PM (#36449307)
Say you have a laptop and a PC keyboard and want to have different settings for the internal and the external keyboard
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by lobstrosity420 on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:00PM (#36449509)
It already lets you have different settings for the internal en external keyboards by default. I use it just like that - vanilla settings on my MacBook built in and for the external keyboard I switch command and option, since it’s a windows keyboard.

I don’t want to be inflammatory, but the amount of baby duck syndrome when people say MacOS and Linux are unusable is crazy. Just try to go vanilla for 2 weeks before you install two dozen utilities.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by klausa on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:58PM (#36449485)
The settings in System Settings.app are per-keyboard, so you don't need anything external for that.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by spectre3d on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:21PM (#36449754)
I use it to map caps lock to a hyper key[1], whether it’s an Apple keyboard or not.

[1] When I hold caps lock, the computer responds as if I’m holding Command + Option + Control + Shift.

In the “Complex modifications” tab, choose “Add rule” and enable “Change caps_lock to command+control+option+shift.”

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by programmertote on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:34PM (#36449919)
Newbie Mac user here. I just did what you suggested (I believe it's basically what's suggested in this article: https://9to5mac.com/2016/03/17/how-to-remap-windows-keyboard...), but I don't think Ctrl+C and Ctrl+V works on browsers; I still have to use Alt+C and Alt+V to copy paste when using Chrome/Firefox browsers whereas Ctrl+C and Ctrl+V works in PyCharm.

What am I missing? Thank you in advance for your suggestion/reply!

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by majormajor on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:08PM (#36451621)
If you run through that guide I think the intended result is that "Alt-C" is going to be your copypaste. E.g. the keys work in the Mac order: CTRL / OPT (ALT) / COMMAND instead of the Windows order (CTRL / WINDOWS / ALT). So using Alt-C should trigger Copy, matching Mac-user muscle memory.

Perhaps PyCharm is set to Windows keymappings or such?

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by cpleppert on Monday June 26, 2023 @02:18AM (#36476335)
The mac doesn't use ctrl modifiers to use copy paste. If you remapped Alt/option and windows/command keys on a windows keyboard alt-c & alt-v (i.e. the keys to the right/left of the spacebar) would be recognized as cmd-c and cmd-v on the mac. PyCharm supports a windows and linux keybinding that lets you use ctrl-c and ctrl-v to copy paste but the mac generally uses the cmd key as opposed to the ctrl key. If you want to use ctrl-c and ctrl-v you can remap both of those pretty easily using karabiner elements to cmd-c and cmd-v.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by sorahn on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:58PM (#36450196)
right-option to forward delete on the internal laptop keyboard.

I used to use it to remap capslock to control, but apple has since added that to macOS itself.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by hibbelig on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:14PM (#36450375)
I use it to have hybrid modifier and regular keys: if I hold down caps lock like a modifier key and strike another key then it behaves like control. If I tap caps lock like I would a letter key then it behaves like escape.

Return is another hybrid between itself and control (my keyboard does not have a right control key).

Space is another hybrid with a whole lot of bindings when held down. With s it generates space so that I can have key repeat for space (don’t need that often). With hjkl it generates the cursor keys.

Does this help?

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by c-hendricks on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:06PM (#36450940)
Okay that's a great suggestion. I didn't mention it but I do also change my caps lock to an extra escape key.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by reboot81 on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:16PM (#36451702)
I use Caps lock as backspace. Go back a webpage, delete last character. Use it all the time. WHO NEEDS TO SHOUT?
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by siriusfeynman on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:34PM (#36451247)
for some reason apple think that the backslash and backtick keys are the opposite of what they actually are on british pc keyboards
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by faitswulff on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:33PM (#36449170)
Rectangle for window management
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by biomcgary on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:51PM (#36449399)
Rectangle is the only way I can make reasonable use of my external monitor on MacOS.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by hugi on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:22PM (#36449765)
Yes! I regret the time I spent without Rectangle. Effortlessly managing windows, just throwing them around or between monitors without ever touching the mouse is absolutely priceless.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by baq on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:49PM (#36449380)
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by pantulis on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:12PM (#36449669)
- BetterTouchTool - Folder Peek
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by AlexSW on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:19PM (#36449732)
+1 to BetterTouchTool! I'm mostly a keyboard person (typical 'vim' user etc.) but being able to switch tabs using a two-finger tap left and right on the touchpad is so pleasant that I find it worth the investment for BetterTouchTool alone. Configuring this for the different keybindings of different programs flexibly is really great. And it's a one-time payment including fixes and improvements - I've had it for years.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by guiambros on Friday June 23, 2023 @07:54PM (#36453826)
+1, I can't live without BTT on Mac. From keyboard shortcuts, window management, controlling apps, overall customizations, HUD messages, and much, much more.

I wish BTT were multi-OS, so I could just copy the configuration across platforms, instead of having to recreate from scratch (Linux), or not at all (ChromeOS).

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by wdb on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:55PM (#36450173)
Cleanshot X and Swish [2] I really like the gestures that Swish adds.

[1] https://cleanshot.com [2] https://highlyopinionated.co/swish/

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by nicwolff on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:16PM (#36451055)
Zooom/2 even though it's abandonware.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by billbrown on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:46PM (#36451392)
Alfred, Karabiner-Elements (for the hyper key functionality), Shortcat, TextSniper, Moom, Sublime Text, iTerm 2, my .bash_profile.

These are all apps for which I have long-standing muscle memory. If I use a new computer, I'm still pressing the keys but nothing happens and I have to remember how to do the things the normal way.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by thehigherlife on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:45PM (#36451975)
Never heard of Shortcat before, it reminds me of that vim shortcut that used to be popular for firefox back in the day. I can see how that would be really powerful.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by gergi on Friday June 23, 2023 @07:56PM (#36453841)
Each of the features provided by the above apps would also require an app to be installed for Windows, too. Not sure how this can be leveled as an OSX criticism.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by bluSCALE4 on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:54PM (#36452043)
I use SizeUp which gives keyboard shortcuts for what Win key + arrow keys accomplishes. There's probably something better but I'm used to it.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by oidar on Friday June 23, 2023 @05:03PM (#36452127)
There is an open source version of this Rectangle. https://rectangleapp.com
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by bluSCALE4 on Saturday June 24, 2023 @02:01AM (#36455991)
Thanks, prefer this much more to SizeUp.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by idle_zealot on Friday June 23, 2023 @09:32PM (#36454545)
- Karabiner-Elements, primarily to map caps lock to ctrl when pressed with other keys and escape when pressed alone, although I also like to bind right command + asdfhjkl to cursor movement keys home pgdown pgup end left down up right respectively.

- yabai/skhd for window management

- brew/mas for package management

- linearmouse to disable cursor acceleration, scroll acceleration, and inverted scroll direction for mice while keeping all those things on for trackpads.

There are other things that I install on my Macs, but these are the programs that I use to fix behavior that I find unacceptable. Additionally I maintain a script of about 50 `defaults write ...` commands so that I don't have to dig around in the settings menus of system applications to configure them to behave sanely (show file extensions and paths, don't reorder Spaces, disable autocorrect, etc).

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by fatboy on Saturday June 24, 2023 @03:35AM (#36456454)
Could you post that script somewhere for us? I'd be interested to see if there are annoyances I'm just living with in there.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by idle_zealot on Saturday June 24, 2023 @06:29AM (#36457368)
Sure. It's definitely opinionated, but perhaps our opinions align!

https://gist.github.com/idle-z/7fc3d3950b02c441ab522a094e5f4...

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by fatboy on Sunday June 25, 2023 @04:38AM (#36466128)
Thanks!
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ris58h on Saturday June 24, 2023 @02:06AM (#36456022)
- MiddleClick to middle click with 3 fingers.

- Touch-Tab to switch apps with 3 fingers.

Both are free and open source.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by insin on Saturday June 24, 2023 @06:31AM (#36457377)
Easy Move+Resize for moving and resizing windows from anywhere in the window
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:37PM (#36449216)
>The suite of extra software utilities required to make the base OS usable is ridiculous

Use Windows or Linux. Good luck and have fun!

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by LoganDark on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:49PM (#36449358)
Windows isn't Unix, which is one of macOS's biggest selling points for developers and hackers (remember which website you're on).

WSL is no substitute, especially ever since they gave up adding support to the actual Windows kernel and just used a virtual machine.

I shouldn't have to wait for all my software to add support for putting the WSL wrapper around all of their commands. I should be able to just run them on bare metal. This is why JetBrains IDEs can do profiling, valgrind etc on macOS but not Windows.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:10PM (#36449644)
It's tiring to read almost everyday on HN: “the amount of work required to make this circle into a square is ridiculous”.

Some of us enjoy circles. Use whatever you like, but complaining A is not B is annoying.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by WastingMyTime89 on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:16PM (#36449705)
No one is complaining A is not B. Everyone is complaining that macOS lacks some fairly basic UX options and is being neglected by Apple which corrects these flaws at a glacial pace.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:26PM (#36449816)
Oh, but they are. I'm extremely productive on stock macOS, way more than on Windows. I just don't keep complaining that Windows is broken. Some people obviously love it.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by LoganDark on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:33PM (#36449897)
> complaining that Windows is broken

You literally brought it up when you told someone facing issues with macOS to use Windows instead. Explaining why people don't do this is not a complaint.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by LoganDark on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:17PM (#36449721)
They're talking about my comment that says Windows is not Unix. I think that's a perfectly valid response given the context, but they don't seem to understand why I made it.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by threatofrain on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:10PM (#36450350)
On a tangent, I don't see what's wrong with complaining that A ≠ B. Complaining is just the precursor to voting with your feet, and having more or less than competitor offerings is a natural point of comparison in a customer's mind.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Friday June 23, 2023 @05:54PM (#36452664)
Sure, but there’s a limit. You wouldn’t complain that there’s no beef on a vegan restaurant.

The Mac’s thing has always been resizable overlapping windows with a menu bar at the top of the screen. If you’re hoping for a great tiling window manager, you’ll be disappointed. You can kind of get a poor man’s tiling setup with some hacks, but it’s not what the platform is about.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by troupo on Saturday June 24, 2023 @01:56AM (#36455970)
> Everyone is complaining that macOS lacks some fairly basic UX options

What you call "basic UX options" are highly opinionated personal views. I've used Macs since 2007 and haven't used a single one of the dozen or so "basic UX" tools people listed in the discussion.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by LoganDark on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:13PM (#36449684)
You clearly missed the point of my comment, which is not to say that Windows should be Unix, but that the fact that it is not means that you probably should not be recommending it as a universal cure-all to people who probably use macOS for a reason.

In other words, it only sounds "annoying" because you seem to not understand why people would use a Unix operating system, and why Windows is not a suitable substitute.

(This is assuming they use macOS for its Unixness, but enough people use it for that reason that you probably shouldn't be telling people to just use Windows and "have fun". To your credit, you did also list Linux.)

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:34PM (#36449915)
I use a Mac, always have. My complaint is that people jump to criticize a way of working, saying it's unusable, when there are plenty of others that have enjoyed working this way for 40 years and are extremely productive that way.

Perhaps question if your old habits don't apply in a new context? And just because it's a WIMP UI you shouldn't expect it to work exactly like your former? That it's a new paradigm, with different metaphors, advantages and trade-offs?

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by LoganDark on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:51PM (#36450128)
> My complaint is that people jump to criticize a way of working, saying it's unusable, when there are plenty of others that have enjoyed working this way for 40 years and are extremely productive that way.

Well, I didn't do that. I said Windows misses a desirable quality that macOS has, which makes it unacceptable as a substitute for macOS, specifically, if one relies on this desirable quality.

> Perhaps question if your old habits don't apply in a new context? And just because it's a WIMP UI you shouldn't expect it to work exactly like your former? That it's a new paradigm, with different metaphors, advantages and trade-offs?

Do you see how you just proved my point? According to your argument the answer would be "Well just don't desire that quality then." and, gee, I sure wish the whole tech world could just do that, it sounds so easy.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by detourdog on Saturday June 24, 2023 @06:00AM (#36457232)
I see the comments the same way and half the time they seem misinformed. How many Mac users are looking to move windows with the keyboard because the mouse is too much of a burden.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eviks on Saturday June 24, 2023 @01:41AM (#36455899)
Now try to go beyond a shallow dismissive analogy and explain specifically in the case of linear mouse why disabling acceleration is trying to make a circle into a square?

(and consider the fact that your circle company has added that square peg into their latest oval OS)

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Saturday June 24, 2023 @08:12AM (#36458015)
“My circle company” is cute.

What I’m trying to convey here is that, while I hate Windows' mouse acceleration, to the point of being almost unusable to me, I don’t go on forums ranting about how ridiculous the amount of tweaking the OS requires to be usable.

There are fortunately other choices that fit my sensibilities much better. Why try to bend Microsoft to my particularities, especially when there are billions of perfectly happy users?

Ideally you’d want every OS to feature every possible preference setting. In practice, every feature increases the surface for bugs, loses focus on limited resources, puts the burden of choice on the user, etc. There needs to be a vision, an opinion, a personality to a product. You can either share that or look for a different platform.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eviks on Saturday June 24, 2023 @08:27AM (#36458110)
But you're doing even worse - you go on forums ranting about people criticizing legitimate OS deficiencies!

> Why try to bend Microsoft to my particularities

Many reasons, but specific to this conversation: because it's not a square! Tweakability of these things is part of "essence" of a general purpose OS, so that's the flaw of your analogy, and why you have to resort to generic analogies instead of explaining how a specific tweak is bad

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Saturday June 24, 2023 @01:49PM (#36460945)
>…legitimate OS deficiencies!

That’s where we differ.

>…instead of explaining how a specific tweak is bad

I have, but I’ll try one last time. Could Apple build an industry leading tiling window manager? Perhaps. Would that please most of its users? Probably not. Would it delay other more pressing demands? Surely.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eviks on Saturday June 24, 2023 @11:24PM (#36464893)
You haven't tried the first time, you've just again ignored the tweak in question, which was mouse acceleration

And you ignored that Apple fixed that deficiency, so you also differ with the company, whose bad choices you're defending

And of course you wouldn't be be able to explain what other pressings demands for most users such a simple tweak would block

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Sunday June 25, 2023 @10:03AM (#36468282)
I wasn’t discussing mouse acceleration, but it’s just the same. The acceleration curve hasn't changed since 1984, to the best of my knowledge. I don’t see Mac users complaining. Should Apple expend effort to accommodate ex-Windows users? It’s not my call, but I don’t think they should.

Regarding the pressing demands, how about a notification system that’s not a compete UX joke or a reliable and simple file sharing solution that doesn’t require the user to be aware of the SMB or SSH protocols? I could spend the whole day listing lower hanging fruits than meeting the particularities of ex-Windows users.

The number of system developers with deep knowledge of macOS, Swift/ObjC and willing to live in Cupertino is surprisingly small. It’s a very limited resource and it shows, given the number of years some glaring bugs survive in macOS every release.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eviks on Monday June 26, 2023 @12:17AM (#36475685)
You see Mac users complaining, they are right here in this thread, you just choose to dismiss the complaints. Just like you again ignored that Apple also disagrees with you since they fixed this bug

And you haven't explained the most important thing- the blocking part, "resources are limited" gives you nothing of substance at this level, you actually need to know the amount of effort involved. How much time is needed to expose a different mouse curve? Would a better notification system be developed within that time?

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tambourine_man on Monday June 26, 2023 @07:37AM (#36478380)
Ask those Mac users if they're using the platform because their job requires them. You may be surprised.

I haven't ignored that Apple disagrees with me, that's a fact, since they shipped the toggle. I'm arguing how they should spend their developer's time.

>Would a better notification system be developed within that time?

How about basic functionality, like being able to close a notification without some serious mouse gymnastic? That bug is 3 years old.

Or having your music player display how much of the song has been played without requiring a hover, like any sensible music player has done since forever, iTunes included.

Or a System Preferences/Settings that's not a flabbergasting disaster.

Priorities.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by jonny_eh on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:46PM (#36449339)
> This is a mandatory install on macOS for me

Would you mind expanding on that? I'm not sure what I'd improve about my touchpad experience on my Mac.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by thesuitonym on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:10PM (#36449650)
Not the OP, but for one thing, natural scrolling is just an awful idea for mouse users, it was designed for touch screens, and translates pretty well to trackpads (Although it broke with over a decade of user experience), but it's completely unnatural on a mouse. Unfortunately, if you're a user who switches between a mouse and the trackpad, Mac OS only let's you pick one.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by Toutouxc on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:15PM (#36450392)
> natural scrolling is just an awful idea for mouse

IMO there’s no objective reason why. Natural scrolling is not what a lot of people are used to with a mouse, but it’s perfectly usable and even more consistent if you’re using the Magic Mouse, which uses a touch surface instead of a mechanical wheel. I, for example, always make my Windows and Linux machine use natural scrolling like I’m used to from my Mac and my life isn’t any better or worse because of it.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by arghwhat on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:46PM (#36450735)
Unlike for touch devices, it is no better or worse - but as scroll wheel operation already is incredibly well established, most already have an intuitive assumption of behavior and switching forcing the user to switch only annoys them.

It is even part of our language: you "scroll down".

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by joshspankit on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:16PM (#36451049)
As an “ambidextrous” scroller, it’s just a matter what you’re scrolling: Are you scrolling the scrollbar down, or the content of the window?

I think regardless of the direction you move your fingers, “scroll down” means the same thing: “scroll to a lower part”

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by rendaw on Saturday June 24, 2023 @12:48AM (#36455678)
"Scroll down" could refer to the motion of the wheel or the motion of the viewport.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by detourdog on Saturday June 24, 2023 @05:45AM (#36457155)
When I scroll down I’’m referring to the active window’s motion. Right now I couldn’t tell you what motion I use. I use a trackpad and mouse.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by BeFlatXIII on Saturday June 24, 2023 @09:59AM (#36458757)
I thought the same as you until I once got a new Mac and forgot to switch off natural scrolling during the initial setup. You scroll down on a page far more often than you scroll up, at least in my day-to-day. Natural scrolling on the mouse wheel makes scrolling down an easier motion on my right middle finger than with classic scrolling. It's easier to push out than to pull in.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by furyofantares on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:00PM (#36450890)
> natural scrolling is just an awful idea for mouse users

I'm the opposite - I was surprised by how much of an improvement I found natural scrolling after decades of computer use. I now use an autohotkey script when on windows to get the same behavior as I get on macOS.

I can certainly see the switching cost not being worth it and wanting a setting that applies to the mouse and not the touchpad, but I'm failing to see how it's anything other than a switching cost.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by horsawlarway on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:24PM (#36451131)
> I now use an autohotkey script when on windows to get the same behavior as I get on macOS.

Is there something specific here that's not just toggling the scroll direction to the right value in window's settings menu? It's had it for years at this point.

> I can certainly see the switching cost not being worth it and wanting a setting that applies to the mouse and not the touchpad, but I'm failing to see how it's anything other than a switching cost.

For me at least, you're fighting against decades of habitual usage. I have a mental model for how I expect my controls to work. I could switch - but I see zero value in doing so (what's the upside?) and a whole lot of wasted effort.

It's like a controller - Inverted exists. I understand that some folks like it. There are rare cases (usually when controlling an aircraft) in games when I might choose to use it. But by far and large... I just do not want an inverted controller. It's making me think harder for zero net benefit (and much worse in game results...).

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by furyofantares on Friday June 23, 2023 @07:27PM (#36453630)
I've just had the script for over a decade, I didn't know they added it to Windows finally.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by pimlottc on Friday June 23, 2023 @08:06PM (#36453914)
On Windows 11, you can’t toggle the scroll wheel direction without registry edit permission. And for USB devices, there’s a unique key for every possible USB port it’s connected to.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by Toutouxc on Saturday June 24, 2023 @12:41AM (#36455648)
> toggling the scroll direction to the right value in window's settings menu? It's had it for years at this point

Are you sure about that? I had to edit some registry values on my gaming machine to get natural scrolling.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by guiambros on Friday June 23, 2023 @08:10PM (#36453955)
The issue happens when you're not "switching", but co-existing across multiple platforms.

For work, I use a Mac as my daily computer, but also use Linux at home, and a ChromeOS for travel. My Mac is heavily customized to behave like my Linux desktop, but there's little hope for ChromeOS, which means all my muscle memory is gone.

I wish we'd have better standards, and at least a universal way to customize keyboard shortcuts. Unfortunately we're far away from that. Even on Mac and Linux.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by taude on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:05PM (#36451596)
you can override natural scrolling in default OS X System settings, though.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by hoistbypetard on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:42PM (#36451945)
Not per-device. I like "natural scrolling" on my trackpads, but dislike it with mouse wheels. It's a PITA to visit system settings every time I switch; I've been low-key looking for something like this for some time.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by bentcorner on Saturday June 24, 2023 @01:07AM (#36455745)
I use this tool to keep natural scrolling on trackpad and normal scrolling on my wheely mouse: https://github.com/ther0n/UnnaturalScrollWheels
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ktosobcy on Friday June 23, 2023 @05:19PM (#36452287)
Why would you need a mouse when using macOS trackpads? Before switching to MBP (about 10 years ago) I couldn't fathom using trackpad but then after a couple of days of usage I was so hooked up and it _felt_ so natural than I can't imagine using mouse nowadays...
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by copperx on Friday June 23, 2023 @07:09PM (#36453476)
While I agree that Mac trackpads are fantastic, there's still a need for variety. For some reason, I don't feel at home using a trackpad in certain programs, such as Photoshop. The Magic Mouse feels better in that scenario, like I have a little more control.

For general computer use and coding, I prefer the trackpad.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ktosobcy on Saturday June 24, 2023 @01:22PM (#36460697)
Ah, YMMV. I don't do any graphics/precise movement - mostly coding/shell/typing) and in this case trackpad is simply excellent - movement is precise and it's perfectly handy/accessible.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eyelidlessness on Friday June 23, 2023 @07:36PM (#36453690)
I generally prefer the trackpad for productive tasks, but I never got the hang of using it for my weird Minesweeper obsession. A mouse has a lot of non-input leverage and physical control that’s very hard to replicate (for me, others swear by trackpads even for high pace, high accuracy pointer input like this).
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by phire on Friday June 23, 2023 @07:48PM (#36453778)
Sometimes I'm using it as a laptop, the touchpad is absolutely great, I wouldn't do it any other way.

Other times, I have it plugged into a monitor and a desktop keyboard. In those cases, I want a real mouse plugged in.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eviks on Saturday June 24, 2023 @12:09AM (#36455460)
Because mouse has more buttons and can use better gestures and rocking clicks to go back and forth
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ktosobcy on Saturday June 24, 2023 @01:24PM (#36460708)
I did use a lot of gestures (especially in browsers, Opera from 10-15 years ago?) but with trackpad you have virtually the same? Single tap=left click, two-fingers tap = right click, cmd+tap = middle click. Two fingers swipe left/right = navigate forward/backward?
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eviks on Saturday June 24, 2023 @11:13PM (#36464845)
What about 2-4 side mouse buttons? What about wheel left/ right motion? What about optional infinite scroll?
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ktosobcy on Sunday June 25, 2023 @08:22PM (#36474133)
I never used those? I usually preferred keyboard shortcuts so laptop (MPB) with hands on the keyboard + occasional use of touchpad for "movement" was more than enough?
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by eviks on Monday June 26, 2023 @03:06AM (#36476630)
> I never used those?

Sure, but presumably your original question wasn't addressed to yourself? With a better external keyboard you don't have a trackpad, and even with the internal one sometimes it's more convenient to use the more capable tool

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by misnome on Saturday June 24, 2023 @06:38AM (#36457415)
Do people really have that much of an issue with it? In my brain it is much like left-vs-right-side-driving; just a mode in my brain.

The first couple of seconds using it differently are confusing, then _click_, brain switches over.

Maybe this only happens if you regularly need to use different machines.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by Tagbert on Saturday June 24, 2023 @01:09PM (#36460588)
I was still using a mouse when natural scrolling came out and it was a huge improvement. My brain immediately connected the scroll wheel to the content and it made a lot more sense. The unnatural scroll always seemed backwards and focuses too much on the particular mechanics of moving a scroll bar button instead of directly manipulating the content.

When I use someone else’s computer that uses the old scroll direction it just seems clunky and artificial.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by mrpf1ster on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:12PM (#36449666)
The Mac touchpad is great, but using an external mouse is awful feeling without this tool
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by arghwhat on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:47PM (#36450754)
Last I checked it can be set independently for mouse and touchpad in the settings without this tool.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by Toutouxc on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:41PM (#36451327)
(If you’re taking about the scroll behavior) It can be set in two different places, but it’s the same setting underneath. Either you get natural everywhere or the other behavior everywhere.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by joshspankit on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:16PM (#36451058)
You can’t disable acceleration without a third-party tool
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by kiririn on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:55PM (#36450837)
Disabling acceleration is the main thing for me

Acceleration doesn’t really have a place on touchpads since they became ‘perfect’ with near-zero deadzone ~10 years ago. Especially on a nice big touchpad with equal click pressure like MacBooks have

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by nerdponx on Friday June 23, 2023 @09:16PM (#36454439)
The touchpad is probably the single best thing about Macs since ~2015. I remember going to the Apple Store and messing around with the Macbook Pro I was hooked on how responsive and useful the touchpad felt, and led me to buy one.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by detourdog on Saturday June 24, 2023 @05:40AM (#36457126)
Much less all the things to make it useful.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ayemel on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:49PM (#36449370)
On the flip side, this is exactly how I feel with Windows in order to get the base OS usable.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by theon144 on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:31PM (#36450579)
Not sure what you mean; Windows doesn't force mouse acceleration.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by tredre3 on Friday June 23, 2023 @02:48PM (#36450761)
Windows (without additional utilities) allows you to disable mouse acceleration, change scrolling direction, change scrolling speed, and even invert buttons.

Sure MacOS' stock behavior might be fine for you, but that's a different conversation, we're talking about giving the user choice without resorting to hacks here.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by ayemel on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:59PM (#36452089)
> Windows allows you to…change scrolling direction

Within the last 5 years this wasn’t always the case since that’s when I last setup a Windows machine and this definitely was not a setting and I had to edit the registry. Trust me that was not my first choice—I would have much rather used a setting like you can on macOS for scroll direction.

Of course that’s not to say macOS is perfect either. Sounds like they are just now getting around to adding a setting for mouse acceleration. Now, this has always been possible with a “simple” (when compared to the multiple registry edits I had to do on Windows) terminal command—no need to resort to a an additional utility as you imply. Obviously both of these “hacks” as you say are not anything regular consumers are going to be able to do.

With all that said, macOS is closer aligned to how I would do an OS “out of the box”.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by kitsunesoba on Friday June 23, 2023 @03:12PM (#36451006)
Linux too. None of the DEs are all that close to what I'm looking for, and of course building my own desktop from scratch with a window manager, bars, takes as much work as adjusting a DE and then a bunch more.
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by frou_dh on Friday June 23, 2023 @12:52PM (#36449413)
Funnily enough, they've just added a toggle to disable pointer acceleration in this year's macOS Sonoma: https://i.redd.it/rezxi3gfwf4b1.png
Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by nntwozz on Friday June 23, 2023 @01:05PM (#36449574)
Yep finally!

Linearmouse utilizes the new API introduced in macOS Sonoma to disable pointer acceleration.

Re:An Open Source Mouse and Trackpad Utility for Mac by karmakaze on Friday June 23, 2023 @04:55PM (#36452061)
Wow, I can play StarCraft2 (non-competitively) on the Mac now.