I'm a Texas native. The temps in Texas are nothing like what California gets.

On the other hand, the rockhounding is far, FAR better out here in Cali. But you aren't doing that in the summer. You could do that in Texas in the summer out in the Llano uplift region.

It’s not just being indoors more but also being uncomfortable indoors. Boo

That must have been expensive!

You had to eat the second six months of a year lease on a house, maybe lost your deposit, too; plus you paid to move an entire family from California to Texas; then paid again to move from Texas to California. Then had to find another place to live in California and pay another deposit there.

Having helped a friend move from California to Texas recently, it sounds like at least a $40,000 mistake.

Probably cost 4K, not 40K.

Actually, it's how many of the leases I've had worked, and I've lived in dozens of states.

Probably cost 4K, not 40K.

It cost my friend $11,000 to move his one bedroom apartment from Southern California to Texas last year using Mayflower. And he was just one person, not a family.

Moving an entire family from California to Texas and back costs a minimum of $20,000; unless you're traveling like the Beverly Hillbillies.

Moving isn't cheap, but on even relatively junior tech salaries, provided some savings or access to credit, it's truly not a life-altering event the way $40k would be.

But it’s easier said than done for those with a sizable family, more possessions than fits in 26’ truck, a lack of time, or lack physical strength.

If you hire someone to do it, it’s expensive.

In comparison I moved Dallas to SF as a single guy in a 26' uhaul truck and I think my costs all-in were $5000 for truck/gas/incidentals plus another $5000 for first and last months rent, utility deposits and all the random stuff that comes with relocation. So $10k to move all-in as a single guy.

In the majority of states, the landlord has a duty to mitigate losses, which means you are only on the hook as long as the landlord is unable, making a reasonable, good-faith effort, to rent the unit.

And usually any part of a deposit not used to pay for damages beyond nornal wear and tear or rent for which the tenant was legally liable must be returned.

(The lease may assert something else, but where these laws are in place such terms have no legal effect.)

Lease - 2K. 3rd party Furniture transport - 2K. 10 day hotel stay 1.5K. 5.5K total cost.

You have already admitted that the 40K was double what it would have supposedly cost your friend. Time for you to divide it by a further 50%. Also, the statement that you would have to pay out your entire lease cost is, frankly speaking, ridiculous.

Congratulations on having signed leases in dozens of states. How many dozen states would that be? 2 dozen? 3 dozen?

At that price point in the city you've got options with, e.g. Travelodge, and you can choose between being right next to the freeway or in the middle of the meth epidemic. For a single occupancy room $150 would potentially get you something comfortable, but for moving a family? Not so much.

Btw, I did manage to find a 180$ per night deal in the bay area at Hyatt house, complete with a kitchenette and utensils recently for a friend.

That easternmost part of the state is the "piney woods" and it's lovely compared to the concrete island that is Dallas. The forests have a mitigating effect on heat.

Or appliance history at least (though we had iceboxes for quite some time!)

Maybe that's why we fought so hard for The Alamo; to clone it's futuristic A/C for later settlements...

There is a gap in the literature though as to whether the Caddos had central air. We can only speculate.

We moved to Austin-adjacent and downsized on the house. We put away about 100$k from the sale of our previous house, and used the rest for downpayment, netting us a <$1000 mortgage payment per month. During the periods of heat or cold, we now just peace out and travel, because we have ample cash to do so and still manage to put away for retirement. Currently chilling in Miami till middle of next week.

The rest of the time, weather is nice, plenty of good food, plenty of things to do.

that's nice but is it a good long term solution? i presume you don't have any kids. i wonder how this approach would work once you have kids and they start school. or maybe you do have kids but they are much older and moved out or no plans for kids idk.

Simple solution: don’t have kids.

That's why I tell disbelieving Californians that we have better weather in Texas than they do: When we have nice days, we appreciate it, whereas when they do, they don't even notice .... :-)

(Source: Spent several years in California long ago.)

Housing isn’t really a “market” that can be efficient at pricing in all information because it’s different for everyone (relatives, taxes, jobs, immigration, race, etc).

The places you listed have milder weather, and far less sunshine than most of the US but they also have hundreds of years of extra history and development. Moving from the US to there has far higher friction cost than moving between states.

Although my perspective is tempered with what I experienced around the gulf, in Mississippi and Florida. The humidity there is so bad I literally don't think it's fit for human settlement.

To that point though, most of the neighborhoods I have lived in have had little to no fog. Russian Hill being the exception. I’m not sure how much of a difference that makes in indoor relative humidity or chance of mold.

I've lived in Louisiana, Mississippi, and Georgia and mold has never not been a problem in those states. I have never lived in San Francisco though so I can't compare.

The AC is appreciated, but you get acclimated to the heat. And anecdata of one, but I really miss the heat / humidity.

Texas civilization does predate AC after all for at least a couple centuries ;)

Yes, but its neither particularly hot (so it doesn't tend to be muggy), nor particularly cold (its cold for the densely populated parts of California, but that's not saying much), so the humidity isn't much of a problem.

Hence one of the reasons it waa attractive before it was a center of the tech industry.

I feel like most of the people that leave for Texas will end up feeling the same.

We left after almost 10 years. We're in NH now. There are still people who won't stop talking about their personal politics but it's a lot fewer. There are signs during voting season but that's most of it. People here seem to be genuinely friendly and not Bless Your Heart "friendly."

I wouldn't go back to CA without a major change in the economics and I'd never go back to TX because it's just going to get hotter and people will likely just keep getting worse.

The maybes are places that were nice to visit but I don't know very well.

Republicans move to Arizona, Texas and Florida

Outspoken racists tend to be "republican". Really just some flavor of extreme conservative, but republican has become a catchall term for right wing.

More subtle, closeted racists, come from all over the political spectrum through.

No, I did it and there is a big stink about us showing up in Boulder or Denver in large numbers and driving up the price of real estate enough to know we are persona non-grata amongst 'natives'--which is to say those who moved there in the late 90s or early 2000s and reaped the most benefits from said real estate spikes. It's a trope, and if you lived there or spent time there you'd know that.

I personally moved back to EU, after living in various countries for four years, and was way better received than most of the US--I'm Californian and lived in HI and CO. Granted, I was well welcomed by my local community in the startup World, but outside of that it was clear you were the scapegoat for all that was going wrong.

Personally I think the crux is that housing is less constrained in the EU and lower salaries keep things from getting completely out of hand, and their aging population coupled with significant Covid deaths meant their was an excess in vacancy and several of them sought to attract digital nomads (albeit with lengthy and tiresome processes) with attractive visa programs in order to cash in the WFH diaspora.

Feel like the cultural center of gravity has left CA and it's in the early stages of a long decline. Detroit once had similar prominence in industry as the valley did for the past few decades. Motor City was a booming hub of manufacturing and music. And over the course of a few decades, it deteriorated. Jobs left. Local government got dysfunctional. Manufacturing left. Crime soared. Houses abandoned. Property values fell on relative and absolute basis.

At any rate, CA is running on the fumes of its former self, when it was younger, more agile, less burdened by dysfunctional politics, had more opportunities for young people and young families.

CA is a naturally beautiful state. But it's got deep-seated issues and there's almost a sense of an unfixable malaise, living there.

The fact that people are paying the rents being asked is more or less tautological proof of this.

Low temperatures? Heating.

High humidity? Dehumidifiers.

Low humidity? Humidifiers.

Particulate matter? Air filters.

Bugs? Pest control. Bug screens. Traps. Mosquito treatments.

High energy use? Solar.

Lack of density? Sign me up. More privacy, less noise, lower crime rate, and fewer problems in general. No jerks constantly in a hurry with no time to be social.

The stuff there are no solutions for: hurricanes, tornadoes, floods, and natural disasters in general. Except for insurance, that is.

Which US state doesn't have problems with bugs though? I know none hold a candle to Australia but it seems like each has its own unique problem with bugs.

Texas is no Australia when it comes to dangerous critters, but of all the American states, it's in the top 2, and gives Florida a run for its money.

The entire western coast of the US (cali to Washington) has far less bugs than the east or Midwest. I assumed it was the drier climate but Seattle area doesn’t have a lot of bugs either.

After moving west, I found in identical weather conditions, the west is better to be outside because it will have less bugs.

The south is cheaper for a reason, and CA is expensive for a reason. You get what you pay for. Red State governance is truly abysmal, the climate is terrible, and there is precious little BLM land to explore.

If enough people leave CA to reduce the price (or enough people move to the south to raise the price here) I'd gladly move to the west coast.