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Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by m_mueller on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:18AM (#14957948)
As a Swiss German I think the currency stability argument is moot. Swiss Frank is one of the most stable currencies available and we still have a similar attitude to cash as Germans. IMO it's mainly due to the following reasons:

1) CC is slow, at least in Switzerland. Like in Germany, efficiency is baked into the culture - people hate to wait on someone paying his chocolate bar with credit card. It's also not rare for people to show you that discontempt. This trains people into behaving.

2) Switzerland, as most of Germany, is a mostly urbanized place with good public transport and facilities close to where people live. Meaning, there's way less weekly mall-shopping going on than in less dense countries like the US or France. So, the average total price is lower since shopping trips are more frequent, often about every second or third day after work.

3) Security concerns. For a long time CC were as insecure as the US ones, with a simple swipe of the magnetic stripe being sufficient, and CC fraud was relatively frequent. So, many people have an instinct of only using CC when necessary, and if at all possible not in public places. Debit card on the other hand have always been relatively secure (6-digit pin code, 3 tries), so they are used more often, maybe more so than in the German example since Swiss banks have pushed them since around 20 years ago.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by intsunny on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:42AM (#14958226)
> 1) CC is slow

While the CC may or may not be slow. In the 5+ months I've now been living in Germany, I've noticed that people are very keen to pay with exact change if they can dig it up. This is an even slower process, but also seems to be the norm.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by ballenf on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:48AM (#14958307)
But having exact change on hand is seen as being responsible and prepared, which is another highly valued trait. You came into the shop with the ability to pay the exact amount of the purchase.

That's made easier by the VAT system as opposed to the US sales tax system.

Totals are easy to calculate in your head. I'd say this is a stronger driver of cash use than anything cited in the article.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by samastur on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:59AM (#14958454)
Years ago I collected all change for 6 months without spending any. Afterwards I counted all to see how much of each type of coin I have collected during this time. The idea was to see if it is worth bothering collecting all coins or is there are a cut-off for me as I dislike having carrying really thick and heavy wallet. It turned out that for my pattern of cash use collecting coins bellow 10 cents really wasn't worth it.

A few years ago I visited Berlin again and tried to leave few cents in local supermarket. It was the only time while being there that I can remember people giving me unfriendly looks. Cashier was also visibly unhappy.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by majewsky on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @01:40PM (#14960329)
When I pay with cash and the change would be below 5 cents, I usually say "Stimmt so" (i.e. "keep the change") and just leave. If I forget and the cashier puts change on the counter, I just pick the golden and silver coins and leave the rest lying there.

I don't remember any unfriendly looks. But then again, I'm German, so I probably just didn't notice the looks. :)

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by y4mi on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @02:23PM (#14960905)
Oh youll them if you paid attention.

The cashier's get into trouble if they have an incorrect amount of money in the counter and you're essentially telling them you're too good to bother putting the coins into the donations box sitting centimeters next to you.

If that isnt rude, I don't know what is.

This only applies to big discounters thought. The smallish shops and bakers don't mind at all.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by majewsky on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @05:33PM (#14962983)
If there is a donations box or a tip jar, I'm using that. But that's available in maybe 10% of shops (most drugstores, some bakeries, no supermarkets).
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by samastur on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @02:59PM (#14961302)
To be honest I didn't see donations box nearby, but I would not bet on not being there either. If there was, I would certainly put coins there.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by herbst on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:27PM (#14959478)
People just collect them at home and bring them to the bank when they make holidays or so. Usually I don't see small coins used by anyone except cashiers for return money.

Personally I just throw them in those collection boxes for good things at airports and train stations when I leave the country.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by romanovcode on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:44AM (#14958256)
Also, almost every store accept touch-pay method where you just touch your CC with the terminal and it is payed without entering pin or providing signature.

Only works if the amount is less then 25 EUR but still it is much faster then cash.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by distances on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:51AM (#14958341)
> Also, almost every store accept touch-pay method

Definitely not the case in Berlin where cash is king, German bank cards work often, and credit cards are rarely accepted.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by germanier on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:00PM (#14959206)
Pretty much every national chain, especially supermarkets, accepts credit cards. You won't have as much luck at owner-operated stores or restaurants. Berlin is probably the most card-friendly place in Germany by the way.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by distances on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:33PM (#14959549)
I'm indeed thinking independent stores, family-run restaurants and discount markets such as Netto which only accept the German card; local kiosks and fast-food places take cash only. I can confirm credit card works in upscale markets (like Rewe) and major chains.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by germanier on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @01:06PM (#14959904)
Both Netto with and without a dog in the logo (competing chains with the same name) now accept credit cards, same with other discount markets such as Aldi, Lidl, and Kaufland. Major exceptions in the food sector are most Penny and many Edeka stores (a lot of the latter I would categorize as "upscale"). You are right about independent stores and restaurants. Unless you know for sure all places you plan to go to take cards you should carry enough cash.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by majewsky on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @01:42PM (#14960348)
> both Netto with and without a dog in the logo

I call them "red Netto" and "black Netto" because of the yellow-red and yellow-black color scheme. (The main color is, frustratingly, also the same.)

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by Semaphor on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @11:01AM (#14958484)
> Only works if the amount is less then 25 EUR but still it is much faster then cash.

For my card (N26) I can still use the feature but I'll have to enter my pin. Still faster than sticking it into the slot.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by herbst on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:29PM (#14959505)
This is only true for big chain things. Pretty much everywhere in Europe I've been.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by herbst on Friday August 11, 2017 @04:53AM (#14987783)
Was giving it a try in Salzburg AT for 2 days now. Haven't found a single machine that takes contact less chips so far. Not even big chains
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by herbst on Wednesday August 09, 2017 @10:41AM (#14969445)
Now failed to buy anything in the linz, AT trainstation where I checked a few selectors and smaller stores.

Whatever you think. This is central Europe and visible Badly supported

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by herbst on Wednesday August 09, 2017 @07:41AM (#14967570)
Just gave it a try in budweis, CZ. Only big chains in the supermarkets had these readers.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by herbst on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:25PM (#14959452)
I lived in Austria and Switzerland. I never really experienced this. For me this is as rare as faulty credit cards which have the same annoyance levels.

In Austria people often just hand over more and say 'bast scho' (tip). Or otherwise pay a little bigger and take the change. In switzerland it's only the latter and less tipping but again nobody even looks at their own small coins.

Nearly everyone I know just has a glass at home where they throw the small coins in but never would really use them.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by _up on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @11:46AM (#14959023)
Another big aspect is, German people like having control over their spending. Checking my Credit Card is unnecessary frustrating. While you have a pretty good overview of how much you are spending if you always get about the same amount from the ATM.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by CamelCaseName on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @02:16PM (#14960817)
Huh? You don't have to check your CC if you feel you have a good grasp of how much you are spending.

If anything, the CC statement gives you an objective summary of your spending, in case you want to recall something 10 months later, or budget for the future. When you pay only in cash, it will be a burden to keep the receipts, organized and readable, for that long.

Plus, isn't it less hassle to use a credit card rather than visit the ATM every so often?

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by herbst on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:21PM (#14959410)
This is the comment I was waiting for the whole thread. I don't want to have to check a huge list of random stupid payments, half of which I can't remember anyway, the other half with obscure names. Just to have a little control and be sure to not be frauded
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by nxc18 on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:47AM (#14958294)
Interesting. At least in my experience in the us, people paying cash is much, much slower than using credit or debit. All it takes is one customer paying cash to turn a fast register into a storefront-filling queue.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by usrusr on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:29PM (#14959497)
Hardly surprising that a rare form of payment isn't terribly fast. When you have cashiers who work with actual cash all day, and customers who know the process of taking a quick inventory of their change reservoir while their goods are being scanned so that they can very quickly decide between giving precise change (in addition to the uprounded sum in paper) or not once the final sum is known. Mirror picture in Germany, many people are still wasting time engaging in some kind of mini-negotiation with the cashier before paying in plastic (usually a debit card, which is quickly taking over most cash transactions that happen at a register).

Also, American banknotes with their identical size and color over all denominations are just incredibly impractical for anything but building those nice tidy stacks of drug money depicted in the movies. Cash payments in the United States are a terrible benchmark.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by bittercynic on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @11:52AM (#14959111)
In my US experience, the variation from customer to customer is much larger than the difference between cash and card. You can be pretty fast or very slow with either method.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by jdboyd on Wednesday August 09, 2017 @09:02AM (#14968269)
In my experience (in the US) it is the one person paying with a check that does that. And checks are extremely common in grocery and other big box stores here. Cash is usually not a significant slow down compared to debit or credit, possibly in part because of time spent fussing with PINs or signing receipts.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by Semaphor on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:59AM (#14958446)
> CC is slow, at least in Switzerland. Like in Germany, efficiency is baked into the culture - people hate to wait on someone paying his chocolate bar with credit card.

I pay with my card faster than the vast majority of people with cash. I also worked as a cashier during school, my favorite people were the older ones who'd just hand me their wallet so I could take the best mix of coins for the payment. Most people are horribly slow when trying to pay optimally.

Anyway, at least here in Germany the whole NFC thing seems to be taking off and card payments are even faster now.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by arethuza on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:53AM (#14958357)
I pay for most purchases here in the UK with a debit card - mostly using contactless payments. There is no doubt to me that this is much faster than mucking about with bits of paper and chunks of metal.

e.g. when buying train or tram tickets the printing of the ticket takes much longer than the payment step.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by lr4444lr on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:57AM (#14958423)
But (3) is exactly why many people do use credit cards: exposing information of your actual cash accounts over and over in transactions increases the risk of fraud. It's much safer to fight for the integrity of your credit account because it's someone else's (the bank's) money. They are far better equipped to handle the case, which would sap not only more of your own money, but a lot of time. Waiting for a replacement card is far less painful.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by calvinbhai on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @12:50PM (#14959733)
I wonder how this is true "people hate to wait on someone paying his chocolate bar with credit card".

In the US, I always wish they had non-cash lanes at grocery stores (especially at Costco, Walmart) because paying cash is almost always a super slow process.

Do prices and taxes in Germany for stuff usually end up in whole numbers? I think in that case it's easy to calculate total owed and be ready with the exact amount of cash.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by kuschku on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @01:17PM (#14960020)
Almost all prices end in .99 or .95, and are with tax included.

So you add the numbers up, pay that much, and get 0.0x back, where x is the number of articles you bought, usually.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by petard on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:23AM (#14958007)
on 1) Recent touch-based CC terminals are really fast, and often don't require a PIN if the amount is less than 10€. I've stopped using cash since with these terminals CC are faster than paying in cash.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by Cyph0n on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:41AM (#14958208)
Android/Apple Pay (using NFC) is even faster from my experience. On top of that, the merchant never gets your CC data, so it's much more secure. It's still not widespread, but I make sure to use it whenever I get the chance.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by foepys on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:59AM (#14958447)
Is this really true for Android? I know Apple hides your CC number but I'm unsure about Android.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by mohlerm on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @11:45AM (#14959004)
Yes, it's true even for android. From: https://www.android.com/pay/

Your card info stays safe When you use your phone to pay in stores, Android Pay doesn’t send your actual credit or debit card number with your payment. Instead we use a virtual account number to represent your account info – so your card details stay safe and secure.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by majewsky on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @01:44PM (#14960376)
> virtual account number

So, just as trackable as a credit card number. Or are virtual account numbers unique per transaction?

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by smcgaw on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @01:58PM (#14960592)
I believe Apple Pay works the same in this respect so the virtual account number is not cycled per transaction. I can't remember if it's cycled per vendor or just unique per device.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by usrusr on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @11:09AM (#14958575)
Once a certain cultural trait is established, inertia can keep it alive for a long time after the original reason is gone.

As a cash-paying German I think that the main appeal to me is that cash payments are a process you can easily understand in its entirety, whereas everything else comes with an infinite supply of unknowns big and small. Sure, it's easy to grasp the basic and get adequate working knowledge, but there will always be lines in the fine print, lines in the code and lines in the physical specs of the hardware that you never read and even if you did you may not have understood correctly. You don't have to worry about these things, but you could, and that seems to be enough for many to stick to what they know.

Also, not paying cash feels lazy, some stereotypes might apply. (Now I wonder about the possibility of a correlation between cash and the protestant/catholic divide still present as a cultural shadow of the past even amongst decidedly atheist Germans - payment customs in the nordics suggest otherwise though)

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by MrBuddyCasino on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:44AM (#14958247)
Same here. The limit is 25€, very convenient.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by michaelhoffman on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:50AM (#14958327)
In Canada the usual limit is CAD 100 (about EUR 67). Tapping to pay is way faster than a cash transaction.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by louisswiss on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @10:51AM (#14958339)
Have been living on and off in Switzerland for the last 7 years(Zurich mainly). Your post describes my experience in Switzerland when I first moved here, however for the past year or two (since contactless payments and NFC took off) I would say that your first point has completely reversed - it is now much faster to pay with card unless you have the exact change ready.

Also regarding your third point, anecdotally I have heard that many smaller shops/restaurants are now pushing for non-cash payments as it is more difficult for employees to steal that way.

In Sweden and Denmark there are many places where cash isn't accepted. Come to think of it, I was on a business trip to Frankfurt last week and the restaurant we ate at only accepted cards.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by m_mueller on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @06:45PM (#14963675)
Interesting point about contactless, I've been living abroad thr last 3 years ;)
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by chrisper on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @03:19PM (#14961509)
CC is slow? I can nearly pay everywhere with Visa NFC. Don't see how that is slow. Maybe it is just me after having lived in the US where CC is really slow.

In fact, it is way faster than me trying to find the right coins for the chocolate bar.

Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by TheArcane on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @11:14AM (#14958653)
Here in the Netherlands, paying by contactless card is bar far the fastest. Even with PIN, I'm pretty sure cash will be as fast (if not slower) given the change and handling of coins.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by bathory on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @05:01PM (#14962658)
2.) I think this applies to the Netherlands as well, but there debit-card payments are the de facto standard. Some supermarkets even have tills which only accept debit cards.
Re:Why Germans pay cash for almost everything by briandear on Tuesday August 08, 2017 @01:55PM (#14960535)
Regarding credit card security. In Europe, liability is on the person, in the U.S., it’s on the bank. So the “insecurity” of a U.S. credit card is misty irrelevant to the consumer.