http://www.wideopencountry.com/actual-cost-rattlesnake-bite-...
I was a grad student at that time making 18k per year - in retrospect, that bill could have truly messed up my life, and it all hinged on the whims of some anonymous insurance company employee. And that raccoon's poor decision-making, I guess.
> "It has been estimated that 7,000–8,000 people per year receive venomous bites in the United States, and about 5 of those people die."
For a more accurate comparison, you would compare this with the number of injuries and deaths from firearms.
> "In 2013, there were 73,505 nonfatal firearm injuries (23.2 injuries per 100,000 U.S. citizens), and 33,636 deaths due to "injury by firearms" (10.6 deaths per 100,000 U.S. citizens)."
Preferably these would be broken down to separate handgun injuries to be a closer comparison to the stat you provided, but the point stands to illustrate that the comparison you provided muddies more than enlightens.
To bring up statistics like this just muddies the issue, particularly with a hot-button topic like firearm violence. There's a lot more goes into a nuanced discussion than throwing out stats like this.
How many would have died if they weren't treated? Like, to a first approximation, nobody dies of measles any more, but you're not going to see me saying that that means that we don't need to vaccinate against it.
The numbers alone, without a meaningful comparison with what they mean in their relative context only clouds the picture.
Only? Hospitals are increasingly not stocking anti-venom because it expires and it's expensive to replace.
"For a more accurate comparison, you would compare this with the number of injuries and deaths from firearms."
I was explicit in using the term handguns and deaths to avoid ambiguity.
"a hot-button topic like firearm violence."
I did it on purpose. Not many bad events occurring at 6000/320e6 are ever universally present in and shape our American psyche like handgun deaths.
"There's a lot more goes into a nuanced discussion than throwing out stats like this."
Specifically, snake bites aren't rare. Neither are handgun homicides. Or maybe they are both rare. They're both a two in a hundred thousand event.
Perhaps because the cost of something as rare, expensive to produce and perishable as anti-venom is sort of justified, whereas a relatively routine operation like and appendectomy is not?
Ok, that's fine. But it still stands that snake bites cost 150K and that's a lot of money!
99% of them were doing something incredibly stupid and got what was coming to them.
Edit: Why are people downvoting this? Anyone who grew up in an area with snakes should know this is 100% fact. The truth is that there's essentially 0 venomous snake bite danger in the United States whether you're being an idiot or not. You can reduce that even further by simply not being an idiot.
Fewer than 8,000 venomous snake bites are reported annually:
Just because someone was injured or killed does not mean they are a victim.
Most people have not had any such training with regards to hikes and rattlesnakes.
Everyone is going to have a personal list of "really stupid things" others do. You'll find little consensus on these lists, which means they may not be all that stupid.
You don’t need training to know to not get next to a rattlesnake to take a selfie. They come with their own built in warning—- a loud rattle!
What's the chance you're going to get one (or several) expensive surgeries done on you in your lifetime? (Where expensive is something as simple as an appendectomy.) Close to 100%? Now add regular medical expenses.
As a total outsider to US economic status: what's the median wage in the US and how expensive is private healthcare compared to it? Also: can you get kicked out of medical insurance if you're deemed too costly for their business?
Yes, I understand the US is probably the best place in the world to get the best medical care... if you can afford it.
Obamacare removed the ability to get denied over pre-existing conditions. It was a very real problem not too long ago.
This is theft. It goes into the pockets of the parasites who are benefitting from this convoluted system.
Scary stuff.
But at the same time, my friend is living there (Chicago, I think, northwest for sure) and is doing fine with less than 50k gross a year. I don't know what to believe when I'm reading about US. Internet makes it look like a crazy place to live but is it classical "you only remember failures"/ "if you aren't poor it's fine" or something? What would you (US citizens) advise?
1) The US Gov doesn't protect much against extreme cases - that's why health insurance (generally through an employer) is important.
2) America is a very, very hard place to be poor.
3) Living like you see on TV (in NYC, LA, SF, etc, or in a cool downtown loft in an urban neighborhood) is insanely expensive and it's only possible if you design your career and life around it.
4) By trading commute time, "coolness"/novelty of neighborhood, and/or school district, and metro area, you can live well on a very reasonable middle class income. Living in Chicago, Charlotte, Minneapolis, Indianapolis, Pittsburgh, any big city in Texas or Ohio, avoids the super high cost of coastal cities.
IANAL, but as far as getting into the US, if you can have an employer sponsor you, I believe it's much easier than applying on your own. This ... may not be the easiest time to get into the USA.
By the way, when I was talking about going bankrupt I meant despite having health insurance but often you see cases where the insurance only covers accidents that happened 'while on a red or green bus going no more that 30mph at night, full moon required'. Reductio ad absurdum obviously but I think you know what I mean (probably yet another stereotype I have about US).
The crap insurance with lots of exceptions come a) if you're choosing it yourself and paying low premiums, or b) if your employer is less profitable per employee or you're in a low status job (e.g. Wal-Mart offers worse coverage than Google)
My mother is German. I have lived in Europe. I will suggest that the fact that you are European will likely inoculate you against a lot of worst case scenarios because normal American practices that promote disease and injury simply are not part of your culture.
Diet plays a very large role in disease. Immigrants don't typically start living off of fast food burgers. They continue eating largely like they did at home.
Europeans tend to drink responsibly. They have wine with dinner or drinks with friends at a pub. The US has rampant addiction problems killing people.
If you don't plan to abandon your current healthy lifestyle habits, suddenly start drinking and driving just because you set foot on US soil and otherwise abandoning all common sense as you have known it for your entire life, you probably don't need to fear that taking an American job will trap you in American medical poverty hell with no hope of escape.
You can email me if you want to talk further.
Yes, healthcare and homes/apartments can be expensive, but there are alternatives for healthcare[0], and you can get cheaper housing if you're outside of big cities.
The flip side is everything else is cheap. Groceries are cheap. Clothes are cheap. Restaurants are cheap. (For lunch today, I had a hearty lunch for $5. And I could go cheaper if I had to.) Home goods are cheap. Cars are cheap.
It's a great place to live. Most of the negative stuff you hear are us wrestling with our problems, when on the whole we're actually extremely fortunate and blessed[1].
[0]: https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2017/11/05/when-your-shitty-...
[1]: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/455920/2018-great-time...
Personally I'm not sure I could live on US cheap "food". As far as i know it's so fried and full of chemicals that my liver would explode.
Isn't the US the country where you can call 'chocolate' a product that doesn't contain any cocoa?
If you're healthy and you make a lot of money, America is a great place.
It's a very unforgiving place to be poor and sick, however. When you fall, you go all the way down to the bottom. If you can't make money, you're worthless.
I live off of a relatively small amount, less than 30k per year. I pay my insurance bills and I pay my taxes. Average rent for a studio where I am is ~$900/mo, and I live in a major east coast city.
I get my teeth cleaned every 6 months at the dentist. I have yearly physicals. I was in a car accident and had to go to the ER. That was covered by my auto insurance as well as health insurance.
I never have thought about bankruptcy as an outcome of breaking my leg... how on earth would that happen with insurance?
The US is a wonderful place to live. Yes, the US does have unique problems that other countries don't, but overall, I would still choose to live her over most other countries (having visited a ton of them).
BTW, tech is far from immune at charging high process. I paid for 30K for a buggy website.
My uncle had emergency heart surgery. Bill over half a million. They "reduced" it in half. He installed flooring, only making 30K a year... and his doctor told him if he did his work, he could die. Hospital said there was nothing else they could do if he couldn't meet what they said were minimum monthly payments (I think they wanted it paid in less than a year). He filed bankruptcy because of it.
This is a common story where I was (Indiana).
Edit due to forgotten information.
To give an example from the UK I was on dislaysis for about a year before I had a transplant did not pay anything.
There are even services that will help you negotiate it down. (Half the reason for insurance isn't even their coverage - it's the negotiated rates.) Hope this helps you.