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Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by oblio on Friday March 01, 2024 @07:33AM (#39561156)
> However, I also hope that we ask the question, how can we make our society better such that we have to drive less and use less energy? Because what would be even more friendly than a lithium-sulphur battery is no battery at all.

Depending on where you live, forces such as fear, uncertainty, misanthropy have lead to the exact opposite.

We live in insane times where in parts of settlements at peace you can't even WALK to where you need.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by i80and on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:24AM (#39561524)
I live in the most densely populated state in the US.

The car mandate is INSANE. I'll drive somewhere, then figure "the next place I need to go is a five minute walk. I'll walk!"

Then the sidewalk disappears and I'm trudging across lawn next to 60mph traffic.

Another time I wanted to walk to a shop right on the other side of the road. It would have taken 45 minutes.

The cultural hostility towards pedestrians is wild.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by krzyk on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:00AM (#39561817)
Yeah, I still remember that when I was in Texas, there were people that stayed in a hotel very close to the HQ of our company - it was just on the other side of a big road (few lanes) - but as Europeans think, they assumed there is a pedestrian crossing, but there was none, there was no sidewalk, nothing.

The only way to get to the other side of the road was using a vehicle - there were few hired shuttles that were driving people from hotel to work and back, quite insane.

A week before I was in SF and public transport there was decent, but the vehicles were like from 1950s in comparison what I'm used to use in my country, e.g. if I wanted the bus to stop I had to pull a wire (yes, a wire!) to notify the busdriver that he/she should stop on the next bus stop. That's just one of the issues, and the quality of the bus was no where near the current ones we had in Europe.

On the other hand the bus drivers were very friendly and open.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by i80and on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:15AM (#39561958)
I take the bus into my local (INCREDIBLY WEALTHY) downtown out of principle, and I have yet to see a bus where less than half of the seats are ripped and torn and maybe duct taped. The city bus drivers are usually pretty chill, though! The systemic under-funding and under-utilization are certainly not their fault.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by Mountain_Skies on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:28AM (#39562093)
Hate to play the one-up game but this is too crazy not to share. I was doing consulting at Travelocity/SABER, which was in the no man's land between Dallas and Fort Worth. The company put me up in the Marriott on the other side of the highway from their campus. Not only were there no sidewalks for the short distance, there were rough rocks covering the shoulder like you'd find along a seawall, so you couldn't even trudge through the weeds and mud to get over to the campus if you were determined to do so. On the good side of things, Google Street View shows that they are now installing sidewalks, but I have to wonder who decided back then that the rocks were a good idea in the first place? It's a rural area, relatively speaking, and unlikely to have been done for anti-camping reasons. At least two decades of people had to take shuttle buses between the hotel and campus regardless of their desire to walk.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by MisterTea on Friday March 01, 2024 @03:15PM (#39566275)
> if I wanted the bus to stop I had to pull a wire (yes, a wire!) to notify the busdriver that he/she should stop on the next bus stop. That's just one of the issues,

How else do you signal the bus driver to stop? And why is this an issue?

The NYC MTA years ago used these rubber push strips held in an extruded aluminum profile. They were all over the interior next to each window and ran along the edges of the ceiling for standing passengers. They were frequently broken, cut or pulled from their bases by bored school children. This lead to the button circuit being stuck closed preventing more presses from triggering the bell and annunciator lamp at the front of the bus to notify the driver. People would then miss their stops and start yelling or walk to the driver to ask them to stop. The pull cords are old school but insanely easy to fix and maintain.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by oriolid on Friday March 01, 2024 @04:09PM (#39566827)
> How else do you signal the bus driver to stop?

In Europe we have buttons. The pull cords and push strips seem weirdly over- and underengineered at the same time.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by kalleboo on Saturday March 02, 2024 @12:07AM (#39570001)
Where I live in Japan half our trams are from the 60's and even those just use push buttons!
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jjav on Friday March 01, 2024 @03:20PM (#39566340)
> (yes, a wire!)

What's wrong with pulling a wire? Works well, easy to maintain.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by krzyk on Sunday March 03, 2024 @04:20PM (#39584646)
Looked to "analog" for Bay Area - center of advanced tech, and for the US, which from my country perspective was way more advanced.

A button press is something we use.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by chihuahua on Monday March 04, 2024 @12:41PM (#39593344)
How is a button press significantly better than pulling on a wire? Can you explain how it makes a difference to the person riding on the bus?
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jjav on Monday March 04, 2024 @06:56PM (#39597725)
I think the answer to this is the same as what leads to terrible things like internet-connected microwaves. Techification for the sake of it because we can, not because it's a good idea.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by oblio on Wednesday March 06, 2024 @07:58AM (#39615457)
It's a push button. We've "technified" our homes with light switches 150 years ago. The roof hasn't fallen down, I'm fairly sure a lowly bus can handle buttons.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by oblio on Wednesday March 06, 2024 @07:57AM (#39615448)
I'm European. A wire looks archaic :-)

Hardly the kind of thing I was expecting in SF. Same for BART, looks like something straight out of the 70s. Or those huge concrete slabs cut with saws, used for sidewalks. In Europe they generally use asphalt.

American infrastructure generally lacks... panache, style, IMHO.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jacobgorm on Saturday March 02, 2024 @06:11PM (#39576669)
I remember visiting AMD in Austin for a XenSummit in pre-smartphone and pre-Uber days and staying at a hotel that advertised itself as "just around the corner from AMD". About half an hour before my meeting there I asked the hotel staff for walking directions, and they said "it is only about 3 miles on the highway". I didn't have a car and got stubborn, so I walked, which was one of the craziest experiences of my life, as it involved running across freeway ramps busy with morning traffic and navigating by the randomly cached state of Google Maps on my laptop.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by marliechiller on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:40AM (#39561651)
Thanks for this anecdote. It really made me realise I take a lot of infrastructure for pedestrians for granted here in the UK
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by kwhitefoot on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:48AM (#39561711)
Not just the UK. The US really is an outlier. Pedestrian infrastructure is better almost everywhere else. Certainly in every country I have visited from Canada to China and a dozen others in between.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by alephnerd on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:02AM (#39562393)
In my experience, Canada is similar.

We couldn't afford a car when I was younger so we had to subsist on Translink and Skytrain, and those systems were roughly on par with Muni and VTA. Outside of the Vancouver core, pedestrian infrastructure was weak to nonexistent in suburbs like Richmond, Surrey, South Vancouver, etc or towns/cities like Nanaimo or Abbotsford.

Calgary and Edmonton were worse.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by ponector on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:58AM (#39561808)
Why not to use a bicycle? I've spent a summer in Fairbanks, AK and it was totally fine to navigate anywhere around the city and suburbs by bike. Almost no bike lanes there, of course.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by i80and on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:09AM (#39561909)
Safety.

Friends have lost friends cycling on mixed-mode roads. Drivers don't expect to see cyclists, and the normal traffic speeds involved leave little room for the kind of error that even benevolent humans make all the time, to speak nothing of the many hostile drivers.

I would love to cycle. I love bicycling, and am glad it was an option for you! But I don't believe it's viable where I am without significant structural changes.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by stetrain on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:13AM (#39561944)
Cycling on 45mph+ roads (really stroads, or in-town highways) with no separated bike lanes or sidewalk is pretty dangerous. This kind of road is kind of the normal in most American suburban towns or even bigger cities outside the actual downtown area.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by whaleofatw2022 on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:42AM (#39562218)
In some cities/counties you can't even ride a bike on a road where the speed limit is over 35 (unless it is a county road with implicit limits)

Detroit comes to mind, not sure if the rule is still on the books tho.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by pengaru on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:29AM (#39562664)
> The cultural hostility towards pedestrians is wild.

This is one of the major factors I appreciate about the places I've lived in California; for the US it's an exceptionally good environment for pedestrians and cyclists.

Still not great by any means. But whenever I visit friends/fam back in IL where I grew up, I'm teleported back to that cultural hostility in a big way. It doesn't end there though, even as a driver there's rampant aggressive hostility/road-rage behavior to contend with.

It feels like the entire region is full of people fighting for scraps on the streets, just without getting out of their cars. Pedestrians/cyclists are basically just bystander casualties to the mess without infrastructure to isolate them from it.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by fyrn_ on Friday March 01, 2024 @02:00PM (#39565422)
Many parts of California are very bike hostile. From personal expirence it's way worse then Portland or Seattle. A lot of it is cultural though, there in the bay area many drivers dislike bikes and blame them for traffic, etc.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by swayvil on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:30AM (#39561572)
It's dominance by business that's to blame.

Business says "put money in the hole. Deliver money to hole with fast wheeled box."

Everything else is disposable, sacrificial.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by cyberlurker on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:20AM (#39561488)
I enjoy my car but I think the same way we have the ADA for public buildings, there should be some level of walkable areas nearly everywhere. I’m currently frustrated in my new location that there are random sidewalks that aren’t connected to each other and I have to walk on the street with traffic for a few hundred meters at a time.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by vouaobrasil on Friday March 01, 2024 @07:35AM (#39561176)
Yes, that is true. Suburbia and cars make it cheaper for people to live in the short-term, but it then leads to even more dependence on mass industry that they are slaving away to keep afloat, while their hard-earned money is taken away in part by taxes to provide subsidies to hide the true unsustainability of it all.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by bilsbie on Friday March 01, 2024 @07:39AM (#39561196)
Suburbia done well can be great. Not everyone wants to be crowded into cities with noise and crime and no access to nature.

Suburbia can still have mixed use areas. We had a shopping center in our development for all the basic needs. We had parks and nature preserves and even areas with condos for cheaper housing.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by dukeyukey on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:07AM (#39561395)
> Not everyone wants to be crowded into cities with noise and crime and no access to nature.

Good Christ, I lived for years in small towns in the most rural area of the UK without a car! Your towns aren't built for walkers and public transport and that sucks, but there's no need to project that to everywhere else!

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by eropple on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:40AM (#39561649)
It's not even true in the United States. In the Boston area, there are still plenty of those "strong towns" the bloggists go on about. I live in one. My car gets used to go to Home Depot, to drive to visit my parents four hours away, and if I need to go to my doctor who's just a little too far off the beaten path to drive to. The rest of the time, I walk, and I'm within a mile of a commuter rail station to get to Boston proper.

Of course, we have not here decided that Government Is The Problem, so we tend to wield it a little better. A number of my neighbors want to change that, being as afraid as they are of "Transit-Oriented Development" (you can guess what that means), but hey--democracy isn't free, we need to push that nonsense back.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by tw04 on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:27AM (#39562083)
>Your towns aren't built for walkers and public transport and that sucks, but there's no need to project that to everywhere else!

And I'd say you're grossly mischaracterizing the US. Every small town I've lived in has ample sidewalks, crosswalks, and is easily walkable. Where my children go to school I can walk from one end of town to the other without ever having to risk life and limb. Heck a few of the sidewalks extend a mile out into the country just in anticipation of the city eventually growing. The town I grew up in was the same. The entire US isn't small-town Texas.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by dukeyukey on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:36AM (#39562722)
I wasn't characterising the US at all, I have no idea where the parent commentor lives.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by Turing_Machine on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:45AM (#39562820)
> Good Christ, I lived for years in small towns in the most rural area of the UK without a car!

The UK is smaller than the US state of Oregon, which is the 9th largest state in terms of area.

There is literally nowhere in the UK that counts as "rural" by US standards. The UK has a population density of 277/km^2, while the United States as a whole has only 35/km^2. The comparison is much worse if you look at western/northern states like North Dakota (4/km^2) or Alaska (0.5/km^2). Even California (widely considered a very crowded state) has only 250/km^2, still considerably less than the UK. In fact, there are only 4 states of 50 which have a greater population density than the UK.

The old saying that Americans consider a hundred years a long time, while the British consider a hundred miles a long distance seems to be accurate even in the long term.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by dukeyukey on Friday March 01, 2024 @11:04AM (#39563042)
Why do you think I was talking about the US? I don't know where the parent poster lives.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by Turing_Machine on Friday March 01, 2024 @11:48AM (#39563615)
Because this is a US-based website?

In any case, the UK is 52nd worldwide in terms of population density, meaning that it is more dense than 197 other regions and dependencies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependen...

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by dukeyukey on Friday March 01, 2024 @02:51PM (#39566027)
An American website by ownership - the actual users are pretty international. And anyway, the county I lived in was about 100 people per square mile, it about 184th in that list. Around the same as Alabama.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by moffkalast on Friday March 01, 2024 @07:51AM (#39561266)
As much as the implementation usually leaves much to be desired, soviet-style microdistricts with a few apartment blocks, a park and playground, and a handful of local shops is a pretty decent option. Put a few of these around a primary school and a shopping mall and you have a really decent suburban area where everything you might need is in a 10 min walking distance, and kids can be left alone in that microcosm until they leave for high school.

Western individualism doesn't really play with that collectivist setup though, everyone needs their own private building, their own private micro park, etc.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by JKCalhoun on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:42AM (#39561661)
See Japan also, the mamachari....
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by bashmelek on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:47AM (#39562268)
I don’t want to point any fingers at western culture on the whole, and the idea of individualism. At this point it feels more like fragmentation. Community pools were really popular in the States some decades ago, and then when segregation ended you start seeing a lot of pools in backyards, and white flight to the suburbs. Even in today’s less racist society we just plain hate our neighbors. Their decorations, messy lawn, or loud baby. It is almost as if we forgot how to live with others.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by Turing_Machine on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:51AM (#39562885)
> soviet-style microdistricts with a few apartment blocks, a park and playground, and a handful of local shops is a pretty decent option.

Why stop there? Build communal cafeterias and dormitories that you can hot-bunk 3 shifts per day. Quality of life is totally a thing, mang.

Weirdly, for a "decent option" these only seem to exist as the norm in areas where people are forced into them by totalitarian governments.

In the United States the few setups like this that have existed were called "The Projects".

To put it mildly, they were not widely considered to be desirable places to live.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by Turing_Machine on Friday March 01, 2024 @05:06PM (#39567355)
Y'all do understand that people move to the suburbs voluntarily, right? That they aren't forced to move there at gunpoint or something like that?

Have you ever considered that your "collective anthill" housing ideas might actually, you know, suck ass?

And that the basic idea has wound up sucking ass every single time it's been put into practice?

Whether it's called "The Projects" or "Housing Estates" or "Collective Worker Housing Blocks", it just plain sucks,

Essentially no one (very likely not even you, if it came down to it) would, or ever has, moved into one of these human zoos voluntarily.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by oblio on Wednesday March 06, 2024 @08:00AM (#39615477)
Dude. A huge percentage of the US is ZONED for single family homes. If those are SOOO attractive, why don't they remove that zoning and let competition win out?

There's SOOO much legislation in the US that freezes everything in place (when zoning doesn't cut it they just add 100 rules like minimum parking and achieve the same thing) and then someone like you points to the result and says: "see, everyone wants it".

The US basically has 2 types of housing, overwhelmingly: single family homes and residential skyscrapers. The stuff in the middle is low digit percentages.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by panick21_ on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:43PM (#39569604)
Soviet-style micro-districs aren't that great. Its just modernist ideas done cheaply.

Soviet-style certainly is better then US style suberbia but its not actually good compared to real urbanism.

What you actually want is not a bunch of identical blocks spaced far apart. You want proper streets with connected blocks with commercial in the lower floors to frame a real urban feeling. That has many advantages. You can still provide real public parks and open spaces in such a structure (see Oslo for example).

There is a reason tons of tourist go to places that are beautiful urbanism and almost nobody goes even to the best Soviet microdistrics to look at them. And nicer building wouldn't change that.

> Western individualism doesn't really play with that collectivist setup though, everyone needs their own private building, their own private micro park, etc.

And yet somehow the capitalist west has built amazing cities and towns for 100s of years.

And places like the Netherlands, Austria, Denmark are very much on the forefront of modern example of these things.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by prmoustache on Friday March 01, 2024 @08:38AM (#39561625)
> Suburbia done well can be great. Not everyone wants to be crowded into cities with noise and crime and no access to nature.

Which you can answer that cities done well can also be great.

Noise, crime and no access to nature is not a common denominator of cities. While my city is noisy, mostly due to the overuse of vehicles, I am 15 minutes by foot / 5 minutes by bicycle from the nature[1] and crime is not a something of concern here.

If you want an example of a city that does well in all 3 areas I think Utrecht is a good example.

> Suburbia can still have mixed use areas. We had a shopping center in our development for all the basic needs. We had parks and nature preserves and even areas with condos for cheaper housing.

Also, isn't that getting close to the definition of a small town...which is itself kind of a small city?

[1] And I don't mean a park.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jsight on Friday March 01, 2024 @09:04AM (#39561850)
> Also, isn't that getting close to the definition of a small town...which is itself kind of a small city?

Kind of? A large master-planned community might have thousands of homes and its own commercial district. They've always reminded me a bit of historic small towns.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by panick21_ on Friday March 01, 2024 @12:26PM (#39564143)
Having 1000 single family homes and a small commercial area is not at all how historic small towns actually operated.
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jsight on Friday March 01, 2024 @12:30PM (#39564205)
Care to enlighten us? :rofl
Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by panick21_ on Thursday March 07, 2024 @06:16AM (#39627623)
Pretty much ever town started the same way. A main street, quite often leading to a train station.

http://www.crowwinghistory.org/brainerd_street_views.html

Along that main street you had mix buildings where people lived and did their business out of. There was no separation between living and commercial.

Farmers lived further out, not directly connected to the city.

From there cities cities grow incrementally up and incrementally out. At some point they stop. Brainerd now has the same amount of people as they did 70 years ago. Other cities, like New York sustained that phase much longer.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by panick21_ on Friday March 01, 2024 @12:25PM (#39564128)
> Suburbia done well can be great. Not everyone wants to be crowded into cities with noise and crime and no access to nature.

That such a hilarious understanding of 'nature' and 'cities'. I live in a city and I can be in nature very quickly.

In fact, the sprawling nature of suberbia is what destroys the most amount of nature and makes it harder for everybody to access nature.

> Suburbia can still have mixed use areas.

The term 'Suberbia' talkes specifically about US style subburbs and just based on facts, 99% of it simple doesn't allow commercial usage.

Sometimes you have commercial zones next to the R1 zones, but usually the ratio is very small and the distance to the commercial zone is very far for the majority of people. Thus commercial areas are often reached mostly by car.

Mixed use zoning is almost nowhere to be found in most of the US.

The term 'Suberbia' refers to that.

> We had parks and nature preserves and even areas with condos for cheaper housing.

Then it isn't really what is called 'subberbia' at all. Subburbs can be done well, but not subberbia.

And in most places in the US where there is a massive lack of alternative housing options with a vanishingly small part of the total land area allowing anything but low-density residential zoning.

So yes, subburbs can be done well, but if its done well its not called 'subburbia' anymore. And the amount of places where it was done well is incredibly small.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jjav on Friday March 01, 2024 @04:02PM (#39566763)
> That such a hilarious understanding of 'nature' and 'cities'. I live in a city and I can be in nature very quickly.

Which city? It's always helpful to look at google maps to see if people are using terms in a different way.

A city by definition is surrounded by suburb (sub-urbe) and neither is forest, so if you live in the city you need to get to the suburbs and the cross the suburbs before you can get to a forest (or desert/etc).

I'm sure there's some city somewhere where the highrise apartment building transition immediately to forest, but I'm not sure where. Not common, for sure.

> So yes, subburbs can be done well, but if its done well its not called 'subburbia' anymore.

This is a circular claim. So if a suburb works well it's not a suburb?

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by panick21_ on Tuesday March 05, 2024 @04:50AM (#39601310)
Its just a very American views. I know its crazy to think but not every city in the world is surrounded by endless suburban sprawl.

And if you have a good train connection, you can go out of a city very fast an efficiently.

Zürich, you have forest 1.6km from the downtown train station. Or 9min with public transport to an even larger forest.

To small? Ok, lets look at Berlin. From main train-station, you have a gigantic park only a few minutes away. If that isn't nature enough for you, its a 7.5km distance to a forest outside of the city.

Amsterdam, less then 5km to be in the surrounding country side.

Vienna, 4km to country side, 7km to a nature reserve.

I have not been in any European city where going into to country side isn't trivially easy. Even my 80+ year old grandmother who lived in the cities former industrial area would go for daywalks in nature.

> This is a circular claim. So if a suburb works well it's not a suburb?

No its not 'suberbia'. 'Suberbia' has a particular definition.

This video gives some perspective of what I am talking about:$

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztpcWUqVpIg

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jjav on Tuesday March 05, 2024 @03:38PM (#39608879)
> 'Suberbia' has a particular definition.

Suberbia is not a word in English, reference:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/suberbia

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by panick21_ on Friday March 01, 2024 @12:18PM (#39564017)
Suburbia is not cheap at all, not even in the short run.

The reality is that it is very expensive and heavily, heavily subsidized. US style Suberbia is a result of the US government massive policies in encouraging suburbia style housing and highway building during the New Deal and then in the Post-WW2 boom, plus of course the Red-Lining and destruction of city centers.

These places never ever pay for themselves. You can look at the data gathered by 'Strong Towns' and 'Urban3'.

In fact the poorer parts of the city/state and of course the town center are subsidizing the richer suberbia. Its a fucking travisty of epic proportion.

Suberbia is expensive to set up initially, needs massive infrastructure backing to be viable and is horrible energy inefficient.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by jjav on Friday March 01, 2024 @04:05PM (#39566796)
> Suburbia is not cheap at all, not even in the short run.

Cheap for who, though?

As an individual I can't change society but I can choose where to live. So if rent in the city is 4K for 1 bedroom and in the suburb it's 2K for 3 bedrooms, suburb is cheaper.

Re:The Lithium-Ion Battery May Not Be the Best Bet for EVs by panick21_ on Tuesday March 05, 2024 @04:52AM (#39601327)
We are talking about the system not the cost for the individual. The whole point is that hidden subsidies (and explicit rules) distort the system.