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Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by cheeze on Thursday May 25, 2023 @11:58PM (#36079685)
As a cyclist, there isn't any car on the road that scares me more than these. The drivers are worse than aggressive truck drivers.

Given that it's the best selling car, maybe it's just that people are generally horrible at driving? At least in my area the drivers of these seem an order of magnitude more clueless than any others.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by a1371 on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:05AM (#36079749)
I have noticed this too and I feel it's because of the higher acceleration. It may give the drivers the feeling that they can insert themselves in even closer encounters because the car is more responsive.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by mertd on Friday May 26, 2023 @01:18AM (#36080268)
Ever notice how some minivan drivers go way too fast for the size of their vehicle? Some think it is because the good forward visibility gives the drivers too much confidence. 3 and Y may have the same good visibility "problem" due to the sloping hood and the non existing dashboard.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by asdff on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:04AM (#36079738)
Big fast car with an automatic transmission is a recipe for you getting forced out of your lane by someone in over 5000lbs of metal who thinks their time is more important than considering your life by changing lanes to pass. O-60 entirely silently in 3 seconds, you won't even realize you are going fast enough to kill someone instantly.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by soperj on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:05AM (#36079747)
They're definitely not silent at 60.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by pengaru on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:16AM (#36079834)
Relatively speaking an EVs 3s 0-60 is ~silent compared to any ICE doing the same 0-60 time.

That level of acceleration generally requires a pretty rowdy ICE with the taps wide open.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by buildbot on Friday May 26, 2023 @01:28AM (#36080334)
Yup, an Audi RS3 for example, is not quite when doing that at all...
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by soperj on Friday May 26, 2023 @11:50AM (#36085767)
Honestly, as someone who bikes all the time, there's very little difference at 50km/h from the amount of sound coming from an EV vs an ICE.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by pengaru on Friday May 26, 2023 @01:13PM (#36086973)
> Honestly, as someone who bikes all the time, there's very little difference at 50km/h from the amount of sound coming from an EV vs an ICE.

This is about the acceleration from 0-60 in 3 seconds.

Because of how quietly a fast EV can perform this feat, the argument is that it's encouraging bad/antisocial driving behavior in general.

When an ICE does that sort of 0-60 time the whole neighborhood hears about it. That alone has a moderating effect on most drivers behavior even if their ICE vehicle is capable of it.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by soperj on Friday May 26, 2023 @07:04PM (#36090478)
you're not silent by the time you hit 60 even if it feels that way in the car. It makes a significant amount of noise at 30mph
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by pengaru on Friday May 26, 2023 @08:13PM (#36090904)
> you're not silent by the time you hit 60 even if it feels that way in the car. It makes a significant amount of noise at 30mph

Everything's relative, and relative to an ICE automobile executing a 3-second 0-60 time, an EV doing the same is silent.

Silent enough to make the driver far more likely to do it and convince themselves they're doing it without being antisocial.

But at this point you're just willfully ignoring the correctness of that statement and I'm basically talking to a piece of sheetrock.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by soperj on Saturday May 27, 2023 @11:45AM (#36095669)
and relative to actual silence, it's not silent.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by asdff on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:08AM (#36079770)
https://youtu.be/ZTrfpahATpc?t=82

Seems pretty quiet in the cabin getting to 60 in under 2 seconds with the plaid.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by Lndlrd on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:27AM (#36079919)
You realize the cabin audio is background audio in that video -- edited to be much lower volume than the foreground narrator, right?

Like, how about I share a video of a hellcat 0-60 but turn down the audio to 1% and call it quiet?

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by oittaa on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:20AM (#36079862)
Outside the car the tires make quite a lot noise.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by sen on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:01AM (#36079706)
Purely anecdata but I spend a lot of time walking and cycling, and I couldn’t agree with you more. Tesla Y/3 drivers are up there with BMW (higher end newer model) drivers as the most arrogant and oblivious drivers on the road. It’s actually kind of impressive how those cars have so many driver aids, yet they still manage to drive like drunk 16yr old learners.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by anonporridge on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:03AM (#36079722)
It's interesting because there used to be a similar cliche about Prius drivers being terrible when they were a new sensation.

Maybe there's something about people who are first adopters of "environmentally friendly" cars feeling a sense of moral license, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-licensing, and end up being less conscientious on the road as a result.

Or maybe the rest of us just notice these bad drivers more because the cars stick out on the road as new and unusual.

Or maybe the drivers tend to just be rich, distracted assholes.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by ashtonbaker on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:14AM (#36079819)
It’s definitely related to the moral license thing in my opinion. As a cyclist there are a lot of bad drivers out there, but I’ve learned to treat every Tesla like I do lifted trucks. I think they feel that they are at the top of the moral hierarchy and forget about pedestrians and cyclists completely.

Not all of them, obviously, but enough.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by bsder on Friday May 26, 2023 @02:05AM (#36080597)
The main irritant about initial Prius drivers was that they were a pain in the ass for going so goddamn slow--a LOT of them were "hypermiling".

This is different from the Tesla drivers who think that their acceleration always lets them cut in front of people.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by simondotau on Friday May 26, 2023 @04:12AM (#36081431)
Or maybe drivers are like that exist in similar amounts across brands and models, but human nature means we only think to attach a driver's behaviour to the brand/class of vehicle when we're primed to do so.

I've noticed that with taxis. In my city, taxi drivers have a reputation for driving like arseholes. I thought this too, but I started paying more attention and I realised that the vast majority of taxi drivers were driving entirely unremarkably. Before when I saw something which confirmed a prejudice, I thought it was more evidence in favour of that prejudice; now I realise that it was the Texas sharpshooter fallacy all along.

It seems to be true for just about every prejudice I've ever been told about. BMW drivers use their indicators just as often as anyone else. Owners of cheap Toyotas are just as likely to drive unreasonably fast as owners of high powered sports cars.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by doktorhladnjak on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:21AM (#36079870)
The car is a giant smartphone with a distracted driver
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by blindriver on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:02AM (#36079715)
People said the same thing about the Prius when it was the most popular car.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by asdff on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:05AM (#36079748)
Except that prius took 10 seconds to go to 60mph and this tesla takes 3. Lead foot + silent car + crazy fast 0-60 = people driving like a GTA game.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by borissk on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:28AM (#36079923)
And don't forget the lack of control knobs. The stupid touch interface takes drivers attention away from the road.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by Shekelphile on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:20AM (#36079857)
There's plenty of people driving like it's GTA in their dog-slow base model nissan altimas and ram 2500s, more BEVs isn't gonna change the fact that a large chunk of society are selfish and antisocial.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by asdff on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:32AM (#36079957)
Having a fast car like that also makes road diets less effective, if a car can get up to 60mph in an instant after a speed bump. The altima would take say 10 seconds of the engine sounding like its very angry with you, there wouldn't be time to get up to 60mph before the next speed bump perhaps, and if you drove like that everywhere you went you'd get like 10mpg maybe.

It truly makes no sense why the NHTSA seemingly works so hard with crash testing, yet they see no problems with a 5000lb family sedan that goes faster than a Ferrari F40.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by Mawr on Friday May 26, 2023 @01:06AM (#36080188)
From what I've heard, most crash testing focuses on car-on-car crashes, instead of car-on-pedestrian. The inevitable result is big and fast cars efficient at killing pedestrians.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by nawgz on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:05AM (#36079745)
People are generally horrible at driving. But then giving them a big, fast SUV with absurd levels of acceleration available is a horrible choice, and so hearing that this is the best seller should definitely strike fear into our hearts.

Corollas are tiny and like a relic of a bygone era. These new vehicles shouldn’t be more agile on top of being way bigger.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by Pxtl on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:23AM (#36079884)
Imho it's just culturally taken the place of the Beamer for the same kind of drivers.

You know, the old "despite its good brakes, the BMW will usually stop with a jerk".

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by ck2 on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:04AM (#36079737)
I've often wished there was some kind of tiny beacon cyclists and pedestrians could carry to electronically alert those kinds of cars/drivers.

Yeah it's incorrectly shifting the responsibility to the victim but at this point whatever prevents injury/death/stress.

The problem is it would be abused to trick drivers.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by wilg on Friday May 26, 2023 @01:20AM (#36080282)
No need, the cars already see cyclists and pedestrians and have emergency braking.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by ck2 on Saturday May 27, 2023 @11:08PM (#36100796)
The cars don't see cyclists and pedestrians consistently or in time or interpret them correctly.

All Tesla sensors have been reduced to just cameras which can fail in weather, fog, rain, snow.

Remember Musk outsources safety for savings/profit as someone else's expensive problem.

A beacon could save lives for those who are active and willing to carry it as one extra level of protection.

But like I said the problem is spoofing for those that want to be an irritant.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by artursapek on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:00AM (#36079693)
it’s because Tesla drivers know the AI will save them from making any mistakes /s
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by anonporridge on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:09AM (#36079774)
I have heard second hand accounts from friends who have been hit by Teslas whose drivers tried to claim innocence because they were convinced their car would definitely have told them if they hit something and it didn't.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by jdminhbg on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:22AM (#36079876)
I have also heard urban legends.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by jackmott42 on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:00AM (#36079698)
As a cyclist, I haven't noticed anything like that. I suspect some internal bias towards EVs or against Elon or something is making you notice a pattern that isn't there.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by skellington on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:13AM (#36079811)
Tesla drivers statistically have significantly less accidents than other vehicles. So, by the data, they can't be worse than other drivers.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by Hamuko on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:26AM (#36079906)
How are the cars compared?
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by jimjimjim on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:23AM (#36079886)
yeah of course. because as we all know, accidents are the only indicator of bad driving
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by ETH_start on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:32AM (#36079956)
It seems like they would be a reliable indicator of bad driving, and moreover, the primary one.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by garte on Friday May 26, 2023 @02:02AM (#36080570)
If you're being cut off or they are not using their indicators or if they park in your lane or they drive really close behind you or they use too much space when turning a corner or they simply don't see you because they're looking left rather than right or they are using their mobile device or they take your right of way or they change lanes without looking...

they are bad drivers without accidents because everyone else is watching out for them.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by dazc on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:19AM (#36079854)
It may be just a UK thing but I find Tesla drivers the least aggressive of all expensive car drivers.

If I see a Range Rover, Mercedes, Audi, BMW or any large pick-up in my rear view mirror I expect to be aggressively tailgated and I'm generally correct. This has not happened to me with a Tesla, that I can recall.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by rcpt on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:22AM (#36079872)
Yeah. I assume teslas are using the lane following thing most of the time.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by KerrAvon on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:09AM (#36079773)
Yeah, but the spontaneous battery fires really help light the way at night in areas where the streetlights are poor.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by influxmoment on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:20AM (#36079860)
Maybe watch less sensational news and go outside more. I wouldn't feel so immune in your combustion car. You know what combustion means? You'd be surprised to know they also combust unexpectedly and on impact
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by dzhiurgis on Friday May 26, 2023 @12:53AM (#36080106)
Given Tesla and truck hate Cybertruck is going to be ultimate. Lucky they are making it from a solid steel.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by renewiltord on Friday May 26, 2023 @01:45AM (#36080457)
I have a GoPro 360 and ride every day to work and back in SF. I curate my video afterwards for interesting scenes. Nothing notable about car makes. "Keep Tahoe Blue" Ancient Subaru? Signal free lane change into bike lane. G Wagon with no licence plate on the front? Signal free lane change into bike lane.

When I used to ride my motorcycle the vehicle that put me in the hospital was a Prius. Tesla Model S cars are wide and annoying to lane split against but the drivers are just drivers.

Ultimately, this appears to be purely a cultural thing. People want to say that someone else is not better than them. So they will find some way to attach some unlikeable attribute to them.

Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by jillesvangurp on Friday May 26, 2023 @03:18AM (#36081063)
I cycle a lot in Berlin. My observation is that EVs are far safer to be around because the car will hit the breaks before the driver gets into any trouble. Big ICE cars on the other hand are the worst. SUVs are the worst. I constantly get cut off by obnoxious drivers aggressively driving from traffic light to traffic light, cutting off people, breaking the speed limit, running red lights, double parking, or slamming their door in your face because they can't bothered to look around then. German traffic rule enforcement is very hands off so there is a lot of this going on. I deal with this on a daily basis.
Re:Tesla Model Y overtakes Corolla to be world’s best-sellin... by globular-toast on Friday May 26, 2023 @07:20AM (#36082677)
I stopped cycling a few years ago. It just isn't fun or safe any more. It's been getting worse and worse. I would go out and literally every single ride would involve a near-death experience.

Cars were a huge mistake.