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Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by remarkEon on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:02PM (#34661316)
Sidestepping the geopolitical issues with this for a moment ...

What advantage is there to using a high altitude balloon for surveillance? I have to imagine there are some - like longer loiter time over a specific point, maybe better optics because you are still in atmosphere, it's obviously cheaper than launching a satellite - but I don't really know enough about this kind of hardware to say.

Or maybe the point wasn't to actually look at anything, but instead see how the US would respond?

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by ttul on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:08PM (#34661359)
One of the most technically challenging things about reconnaissance satellites is dealing with the high speed at which the satellite moves over the target. A balloon flies much lower and vastly more slowly. It can loiter over an area, sucking in electronic signals and taking photographs with extremely high fidelity.

I don’t think the Chinese meant for this balloon to cross the United States. I believe they were testing it for use over other countries or perhaps for use during wartime. Their apology was way too quick for this to have been anything other than a genuine accident.

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by remarkEon on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:22PM (#34661463)
Did they actually apologize? I thought all they said is that it was a weather balloon. Regardless, I'm very interested in what hardware was actually on this thing. Hopefully the public gets a summary of what USN pulls up during recovery.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by ttul on Saturday February 04, 2023 @11:15PM (#34661779)
“… the uncharacteristic speed and contrition of China’s statement as indications that it was probably a genuine error…”

https://www.economist.com/china/2023/02/03/how-a-balloon-bur...

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by khuey on Saturday February 04, 2023 @11:39PM (#34661933)
They put out a statement a few hours ago whining that it was shot down so I wouldn't take that "apology" for much.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by Choco31415 on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:13AM (#34662445)
Can you share a link to the statement?
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by T-A on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:38AM (#34662556)
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by barbariangrunge on Sunday February 05, 2023 @12:48AM (#34662318)
The "how we use data" popup, on the article about surveillance, was awkward
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by moneywoes on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:49PM (#34661637)
The route is almost impossible to be a coincidence though
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by seanmcdirmid on Sunday February 05, 2023 @12:23AM (#34662197)
It has to be along a jet stream, so you would be correct. It isn’t coincidentally along that jet stream, since it’s a balloon, and maneuverability is extreme limited to going up and down to catch different streams.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by nomay on Saturday February 04, 2023 @11:23PM (#34661838)
Wouldn't that be much more convenient to just use those passenger planes?
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by KennyBlanken on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:37AM (#34662794)
...but a satellite is a stable platform, and a balloon is anything but.

After your "weighing paint" comment I think you should probably stop talking.

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by geysersam on Sunday February 05, 2023 @03:28AM (#34663021)
But according to some comment in this thread, it has happened several times before.

If true, that's unlikely to be a mistake.

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by sandworm101 on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:06PM (#34661347)
Turnaround/prototyping. Getting a sensor onto a spy sat is a multi-year process of testing and validating. But a new balloon can probably be built and flown in a matter of weeks. So any country trying to learn how to spy from above might want to build up the relevant corporate knowledge using balloons.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by SpicyP on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:51AM (#34662611)
Why did they need to test it over the United States though? If the purpose was prototyping you’d think they could have done that locally
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by prox on Sunday February 05, 2023 @04:16AM (#34663264)
Who is to say they already have? And they felt it was time to put the thing to use.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by psychphysic on Sunday February 05, 2023 @11:19AM (#34666079)
Testing acceptability?

Probably also why such a dramatic response from the US.

Before satillites flew over enemies no one was too sure if they'd be attacked immediately (they weren't).

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by vineyardmike on Sunday February 05, 2023 @04:43AM (#34663398)
Chinese doesn't need to learn how to spy or build up knowledge, and they surely have plenty of satellites at this point.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by fbdab103 on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:05PM (#34661338)
Significantly closer to the ground, so can capture better resolution pictures. If browsing Google Earth, the high-resolution data around cities originates from airplanes, not satellites.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by rkagerer on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:08AM (#34662413)
Hey does that mean we can soon buy high-res, balloon-altitude imagery at low-priced China-rates?
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by cuteboy19 on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:49AM (#34662605)
We can already do it better with drones, but those don't fly high enough to be used this way
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by citboin on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:09PM (#34661367)
LiDAR, plus it could be a dry run for more advanced balloons with offensive capabilities.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by idlewords on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:49PM (#34661631)
The precursor to a strategic balloon arms race that it chills the blood to contemplate. All it takes is one push of the button and, 14 days later, death comes drifting in from above.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by sitkack on Sunday February 05, 2023 @12:21AM (#34662187)
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by throwaway313313 on Sunday February 05, 2023 @08:41AM (#34664802)
I know it's a joke and I laughed, however now consider that large balloons are very cheap compared to anything that can reach 60,000 feet, or even a single TOW anti-tank missile provided to Ukraine.

Now imagine having to deal with 10 million balloons launched at the same time with various capabilities.

Imagine 9 million decoy balloons, 900,000 cheap instrumented balloons, 100,000 weaponized balloons. Mix in some differing sizes. Go nuts with it.

Good luck defending.

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by bpodgursky on Saturday February 04, 2023 @10:06PM (#34661349)
It's 11 miles vs 350+ miles. Certainly you have the ability to get dramatically better imaging than from a satellite.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by defrost on Saturday February 04, 2023 @11:09PM (#34661750)
Radiometrics - being closer than orbit and having a much longer linger time drastically increases the signal count to any gamma spectrum gear that might be on board.

Whether or not that reveals any non usual background signal of interest is an interesting ponder.

Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by noodleman on Sunday February 05, 2023 @05:44AM (#34663737)
It can pick up other strategically useful info than just photographs such as radio comms and relay it back to home via satelite.
Re:U.S. military shoots down suspected Chinese surveillance ... by mlindner on Sunday February 05, 2023 @06:20AM (#34663947)
The one advantage it really has over satellites is how long it can stay on station and still be relatively near to the target. I'd personally guess it's a signals intelligence platform rather than anything telescopic.