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Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by mushufasa on Thursday January 06, 2022 @05:17PM (#29831172)
> Part of the reason it had taken so long is because I put a substantial amount of work into a part of the project that's no longer necessary due to changing requirements, which I don't think I could have forseen.

One of the things that I've experienced with new grad junior devs is that there's an adjustment needed to change from academic working to business working. In academia, usually the professor gives an assignment and you have to go off and figure it out, without bothering the professor, no matter what. In business, it's much better to 'bother the professor' regularly and check in affirmatively on whether the assignment has changed, or to tell the manager about challenges that arise to re-plan together. As a junior employee, you're not going to know the full business context of what makes sense, and checking in can save weeks of time that would otherwise be spent off on your own.

Not sure if that's the case here, but certainly something you could consider going forwards to prevent similar situations.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by xanaxagoras on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:48PM (#29832417)
I have this junior engineer DM'ing me right now and I've been ignoring it because I don't want to deal with him and I have my own work to do. I'm reading through your comment here thinking "hey, I'm pretty good at walking that line, bothering the professor when appropriate, not waiting too long and not asking him for help too soon"... and then it occurred to me this guy is probably bothering the professor where I'm the professor. Oops. Need to work on being more charitable with my time.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dbcurtis on Thursday January 06, 2022 @08:24PM (#29833436)
I have a theory about why it is so difficult for great IC's to make the jump to being a great manager. As an individual contributor, you need two things most of all: 1. quiet uninterrupted time to focus your mind and get into flow, and 2. quick responses to any blockers or questions that you have so that you can get back into the work. As a manager, a key part of your job now requires you to be infinitely interruptable, so that you can get those answers back to your juniors quickly, and also, you must protect your juniors from as many interruptions as you can. AND THIS IS IMPORTANT: Make sure you are not that interruption. If you want to ask your junior a question, HOLD IT and batch your questions, if at all possible, so that you are not a source of interruptions.

Beyond that, have clear goals, and communicate them clearly. Most people want to do the right thing. The better they understand the goals, the better able they will be to make decisions on their own that don't need adjustment later.

You need to encourage your juniors to ask questions as soon as they need to get clarification or unblocked. To do that, you need to embrace the interruptions, that is your job now. Both the interruptions from your juniors so that they get unblocked, and the interruptions from pesky people that will distract your crew must be short-circuited by you before they get to your team.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by Nbox9 on Friday January 07, 2022 @01:13AM (#29835617)
> I have a theory about why it is so difficult for great IC's to make the jump to being a great manager

I find it very odd that most ICs take the path of management. This seems like an unnatural transition, like going from being a minister to playing in a death metal band.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by sangnoir on Friday January 07, 2022 @03:00AM (#29836329)
There really isn't a pipeline for for entry-level managers in tech: I've never heard of anyone interning for, or graduating from college and managing ICs as an entry-level job. However, those managers are needed, and have got to come from somewhere, so here we are, looking to start a death metal band at a seminary.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by marcus_holmes on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:14AM (#29836899)
As someone who's done both (dev and dev management), it's more that it's very hard to manage dev teams unless you've been a dev. We have all experienced the clueless non-technical manager who doesn't understand why any of this has to be this way and keeps pushing for "common sense" things like accurate estimates for project development.

There's also nothing stopping a good dev from being a great manager, or vice versa. A good dev learns to listen well, which is also a key skill as a manager. A dev creates working systems out of conceptual components, a manager creates working teams out of actual people. The biggest difference is that there's no Stack Overflow for management - every situation has to be treated as unique and you can't just copy-paste the solution.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by q-big on Friday January 07, 2022 @05:21AM (#29837412)
> We have all experienced the clueless non-technical manager who doesn't understand why any of this has to be this way and keeps pushing for "common sense" things like accurate estimates for project development.

This is in my opinion actually quite easy to explain to managers: asking for time estimates in software development is like asking for time estimates in proving a deep conjecture in mathematics.

Since every economics major has to take some courses in mathematics (which at least in Germany are often there to weed out bad students), this should not be difficult to understand for managers.

The problem rather is that these clueless non-technical managers insist that this perspective is simply wrong and theirs is right.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by marcus_holmes on Friday January 07, 2022 @09:45AM (#29839656)
Having never had a manager with any clue about maths, I found the golf analogy works better:

"Why can't you hit a hole in one with every golf shot? You know exactly where the hole is, you know how much the ball weighs, you know the length of the club, you know how hard you need to hit it and in what direction. So why isn't every golf shot a hole in one? Because, obviously, you may have miscalculated how hard and at what angle you should hit the ball, you may not have the skill to hit the ball exactly right, and any amount of random factors can affect the ball between you hitting it and it arriving at the green. Same for software development"

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by q-big on Friday January 07, 2022 @09:59AM (#29839820)
> Having never had a manager with any clue about maths,

This is exactly my point: at least in Germany, the compulsory "mathematics for economists" courses are there to weed out student and are thus feared among the respective students.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dusted on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:34AM (#29836151)
Since I'm both an IC and a death metal connoisseur, I'll argue that it's more like going from playing in a death metal band to being a minister ;)
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by 1_player on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:21AM (#29836962)
Indeed, I got promoted to a managerial position, which seemed a nice career opportunity for me, but my productivity and happiness tanked so much that when I had the opportunity two years later to go back to just being an engineer with no one waiting for my input, I just took it. This is how I learned that while I think I can be a decent manager, the skillset of managing people are totally different than being an engineer and it's very hard, at least for me, to context switch effectively between the two. And in that case I'd rather be an engineer.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by jokethrowaway on Friday January 07, 2022 @12:15PM (#29841727)
I'm fairly sure it's done mainly because if you want to make more you need to become a director of something.

In companies when expensive tech only people are allowed you see less techies among managers.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by benhurmarcel on Friday January 07, 2022 @05:32PM (#29845793)
In many industries that’s the fastest and best way to get paid well.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by biermic on Friday January 07, 2022 @03:15AM (#29836421)
Doesn't have time for junior dev, because has so much own work. Then hangs on hackernews :D
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by OnlyMortal on Thursday January 06, 2022 @07:36PM (#29832939)
If your a senior dev it’s part of your role to help the junior ones out. You should cultivate that behaviour as it brings up the quality of your colleagues and builds work relationships.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by pc86 on Thursday January 06, 2022 @08:29PM (#29833477)
I draw a corollary to how graduate medical education works. You go into residency a fresh doctor with zero applicable skills. You may not even be CPR certified, but you're an MD/DO, and you've matched into a residency. You know less about actually helping people than a nurse who's been on the job for a month. You spend the next 3-7 years working 80-100 hours a week learning your chosen specialty. You become an absolute expert at your specific field. If you're in a surgical field you spend thousands of hours practicing and performing the surgeries you'll be responsible for. You may or may not specialize even further with a fellowship for another 1-4 years.

Then, when you graduate and can start making real money (probably), if you work at a hospital that does resident education, you're almost immediately expected to let the residents do as much as they can safely do, so they can learn. You go from working 80 hours a week performing surgery after surgery at a senior resident to working 30 hours a week watching the senior resident perform surgery.

Similarly (and admittedly it isn't a perfect analogy) as a junior and mid-level you're spending all this time learning how to write real software. Most of it's bad and especially at the junior level you're going to spend a couple years being more trouble than you're worth in terms of productivity. But by the time you're a senior, when you theoretically know what you're doing, you're going to have to spend most or a large portion of your time helping out the juniors in your org.

If you don't want to do that, you shouldn't be accepting senior positions. Or at least, go work somewhere where they don't hire juniors.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by thegrimmest on Thursday January 06, 2022 @10:28PM (#29834467)
What if you just want to write software and not be responsible for mentorship? Why do capable individual contributors always have to be roped into leadership?
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by indigochill on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:14AM (#29836895)
> What if you just want to write software and not be responsible for mentorship?

At a certain point, you probably know considerably more about the work than the people working around you. You might say you develop "seniority". At that point, the balance of value between your individual contributions and the knowledge you can share with others reaches a tipping point.

If you're limiting the value you're bringing to the company to only individual contributions, you're capping the value you can bring the company and by correlation the compensation you're due.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by BurningFrog on Thursday January 06, 2022 @10:45PM (#29834578)
Work at places that don't hire junior devs.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by forty on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:53AM (#29838532)
I think there is a limit of the efficiency of a single person. At some point, helping out others to be more efficient is more efficient than doing it all by yourself.

With that said, I don't see anything wrong with stagnating at your peak IC efficiency if that's what makes you happy.

I agree with sibling which says that mentoring is not leadership. Helping out others is not the same as giving them instructions or evaluating performances for example. However I can understand that someone would like none of that.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by pjerem on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:18AM (#29836934)
As long as you are not your own boss (and even in this case, tbf), you are likely to not do only what you "want", because you are not the one defining what is your job.

Honestly, it's a weird remark. Pretty much all jobs on this planet have aspects you wish you don't have to do. You work for your employer and your employer needs you to train the juniors. If you don't want to do that, change for an employer who only recruit senior engineers, if you can.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by thegrimmest on Friday January 07, 2022 @10:09AM (#29839970)
Employment is a negotiation, always has been. Senior technical staff often negotiate from a position of strength.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by ljm on Friday January 07, 2022 @06:55AM (#29838042)
I'm not sure I see mentoring as leadership as much as I see it as passing the experience along to someone less senior than you. Or did you become a capable IC in a vacuum, without the guidance of more senior engineers?

Beyond that, you could go into contracting. Do the work, point to your contract whenever someone asks something else of you, move on after 3-6 months, rinse and repeat.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by thegrimmest on Friday January 07, 2022 @10:08AM (#29839946)
I mean, actually, mostly yes. I've usually been the last stop for technical help since school. There hasn't been anyone I can go to, so I've had to figure everything out on my own. I guess I'm wanting to work with senior peers more so than constantly dealing with juniors who seem to get lazy because they know I can solve their problems for them, often trivially.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by sylphaenos on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:53PM (#29847292)
Not wanting to help juniors so they're left to struggle the way you did seems incredibly devoid of empathy. I could describe my career the same way you have, but mentoring juniors is now my favorite part of the job. When you were a junior, would you have been satisfied regurgitating a senior's answer without understanding it, or would you have wanted to learn? If you were into learning, why assume nobody else will be?

When pairing with juniors, I avoid directly solving problems for them as much as possible–lessons tend to stick better when you ask leading questions and let them discover solutions for themselves. Perhaps this technique would also work to filter out "lazy" questions.

Working with a mix of super competent developers at all levels has really driven home for me that everyone is better at something, and worse at something, than you are. I've learned lots of new things from developers with less experience than me. I've also worked with many devs with senior titles who were worse off than most juniors.

Ultimately it's okay to find mentoring unenjoyable, but if this describes you, please stick to teams with most/all seniors and don't agree to mentor even if pressured. Attitudes like this can really exacerbate imposter syndrome for juniors, and I've seen it damage several careers.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by thegrimmest on Friday January 07, 2022 @11:13PM (#29848560)
I'm not sure how not wanting to deal with juniors is devoid of empathy, much like not wanting to look after children isn't either. In either case, I don't see how a high degree of empathy is a prerequisite for technical excellence at any level. Leave the feelings at home.

When I was a junior, I would have been greatly satisfied by more time and attention from seniors, as I would be today grateful for more time and attention from people in differing specialities, where I am quite junior. We do however live in the real world, where these people's time is extremely valuable, and I wouldn't dare disrespect it by asking them trivial questions. I would value 10mins of their time and the context switch they pay to help me on the order of days of my own. And if I do resort to bothering them, I do so with an attitude of utmost humility, akin to digital dogeza.

I get frustrated when folks fail to do any of this. I regard is a breach of professional etiquette that unfortunately seems all too common. I've found myself responding "Try harder" or "LMGTFY" to these sorts of inquiries, which is about as polite as I can muster.

> everyone is better at something

It seems that this would be trivially easy to prove false, and very difficult to prove true. I've certainly met developers with nothing uniquely useful to contribute, in spite of best attempts at coaching them.

> imposter syndrome

I'd like to note that I'm actually extremely forgiving of mistakes, even very expensive ones, so long as they're honest. We all make them, and it's really on me to ensure that processes are in place and enforced to prevent the most critical sorts of them. But you don't know what you don't know. It's more the "I'm a baby, please hold my hand" attitude that I'm frankly somewhat disgusted by. If that describes (hypothetical) you, then perhaps some imposter syndrome is in good order.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by alsetmusic on Saturday January 08, 2022 @03:07PM (#29855620)
> I'm frankly somewhat disgusted

I wouldn’t want to work on a team with someone who has such an attitude. I’m very grateful to work in an environment where we all want to help one another. This really reminds me how good I’ve got it.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by thegrimmest on Saturday January 08, 2022 @05:20PM (#29857065)
Do you really work in a team where people are not at all expected to try to help themselves?
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by Nbox9 on Friday January 07, 2022 @01:16AM (#29835641)
> Why do capable individual contributors always have to be roped into leadership?

Training your replacement is how the cogs in the machine reproduce.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by wanderingmind on Thursday January 06, 2022 @10:15PM (#29834394)
And yet a junior dev who LCd for a few months will get paid way more than a MD in residency. It might be interesting to see if the quality of people (measured with IQ) or some other simple metrics who pursue medicine relative to other fields have gone down over the past decade.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by Communitivity on Friday January 07, 2022 @10:52AM (#29840534)
Let's say you are the cryptid 10x engineer/tech lead, supervising a team of 8 junior engineers. You can spend 4 hours, the equivalent of a 40hr week of lesser mortals (this math is almost never true in my experience), or spend a half hour of time on each of your junior engineers. The problem you help each of them solve is solved in 30m as opposed to the 3-4h they might have tried solving it themselves, and they've learned something that maybe saves them an hour a day. You do this twice during the week.

You've 'lost' 80h effectively of productivity for the company (remember, mythical 10x), but you've gained 104h (32h+32h+81h/day5days) from your team, for a net 24h gain.

Of course, numbers are exaggerated, but the point remains the same: if you are a tech lead helping your team succeed is your primary job, not coding/design. You are the person who connects the lines of communication, removes obstacles, mentors the team on coding and design, and gets the team moving in one direction that aligns with the customer needs.

You probably will code, to fill in gaps and help out, but personally I find it's split around 5/2/2/1 - 5 parts are working with your team to guide them and help them overcome obstacles, 2 parts communicating with management and customers, 2 parts coding/design, and 1 part administrivia/training.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by jokethrowaway on Saturday January 08, 2022 @03:07AM (#29849690)
This requires an environment where long term productivity is more important than short term productivity, it doesn't account for juniors who won't get it, no matter how hard they try, it doesn't account for juniors who will leave the company after becoming more proficient because they can't get an adequate payrise.

10x engineers can be a good match for startups where shipping now is essential and for big businesses who need something done quickly (for a change, the bigger the company, the slower everything else).

The only cons of 10x engineers is that they will burn out and that they're incredibly rare. Advising 10x engineers to help out other and collaborate is also nice to give them a bit of down time so they don't burn out and leave for the next startup with a 50% raise.

That said, it's not like HR managers are able to distinguish between senior low productivity engineers and 10x engineers, so it doesn't matter. No company will have a strategy around employees productivity.

I disagree the 10x engineer is a myth, as an hiring manager, I can easily tell you who is a 10x engineer after working with them for a year or so.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by quantified on Saturday January 08, 2022 @01:56PM (#29854873)
You may well be right. +1 karma for the adjustment. Mentoring/helping the juniors is part of the un-tracked/unplanned workload of the seniors.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by _trampeltier on Friday January 07, 2022 @06:45AM (#29837959)
I have no trouble if somebody with less experience ask me anything, but I expect at least one or two ideas how the person thinks she would solve the problem.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by i_like_waiting on Thursday January 06, 2022 @05:54PM (#29831714)
Definitely, I remember as well, that everything they hated me for in school was super beneficial in business. Copying other work? Amazing. Telling boss that I don't have time to do the new task? Trendemous. Solving issue without using latest tech that I just learnt? Incredible. Compaining that some parts of task are harder than anticipated? Brilliant.

The only hard part is to bring fake absences into this mindset, so I can be praised for them.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by HomeDeLaPot on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:02PM (#29831841)
You called in sick yesterday and went to the beach with your buddies? I'm glad you did! We all need a mental health day once in a while. Being happy actually makes you more productive in the long term.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by PragmaticPulp on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:48PM (#29832422)
> You called in sick yesterday and went to the beach with your buddies? I'm glad you did! We all need a mental health day once in a while. Being happy actually makes you more productive in the long term.

Not quite. It's great when employees take care of themselves and make a point to enjoy their time outside of the office.

However, it's not really cool if you commit to be somewhere on a certain day, no-show, and then lie about being sick.

If you want to take a day off, that's perfectly fine. Please just communicate about it honestly. Don't lie. Reputation and trust are hard to build but easy to destroy.

Also keep your coworkers in mind in these situations. It's rare that engineering work exists in a vacuum without connections to other people's work. If your team mates have to fill in the gaps because you disappeared for a day without warning, that's not really great for the rest of the team.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by xedrac on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:38AM (#29836180)
> However, it's not really cool if you commit to be somewhere on a certain day, no-show, and then lie about being sick. If you want to take a day off, that's perfectly fine. Please just communicate about it honestly. Don't lie. Reputation and trust are hard to build but easy to destroy.

People sometimes take "sick" days because the culture is such that they aren't allowed to be more honest about it. Many places I've worked operate in a never-ending cycle of extreme urgency. Taking days off usually must be approved far in advance, making it useless for those times when you wake up and simply cannot be productive. This leads to burnout pretty quickly. I have no issue with saying "I'm not feeling well" when I know I've hit a wall mentally and need to separate myself from my work. This makes me much more productive for the weeks following.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by pc86 on Thursday January 06, 2022 @08:31PM (#29833501)
"No showing" and "calling in sick" are two very different things.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by rendall on Thursday January 06, 2022 @11:37PM (#29834912)
Cross-cultural programmer here, and I can help.

In Europe, calling in sick when you're not actually, recognizably ill is a pretty serious breach of trust. No cutesy "mental health break" exceptions. That said, you likely have at least 20 days of paid vacation, plus holidays.

In the US, where 10 days paid vacation is the norm and you're often punished in some way for actually taking it, the occasional "mental health break" of calling in sick is winked at.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by Veen on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:43AM (#29837118)
A company I work with was recently acquired by a US company (I'm British). I was quite confused when, in a meeting, all of the Americans suggested that the company should implement mental health days several times a month. My thought was: isn't that what the weekends and holidays are for? It would be quite unusual for British employees to demand mental health days. Perhaps the lack of paid vacation explains the difference (Although, I haven't had a full week off since 2014 because I'm a freelancer, so maybe they have a point).
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by confidantlake on Friday January 07, 2022 @11:58AM (#29841536)
I can assure you there is nothing "cutesy" about mental health. Feeling severely depressed/suicidal is much more serious than some minor cold. Thank god the US is moving in the direction where mental health is recognized as a serious issue. Comments like this show that we still have a long way to go.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by rendall on Friday January 07, 2022 @03:15PM (#29844148)
> I can assure you there is nothing "cutesy" about mental health

You misread what I wrote, and then got angry about what you imagined I wrote. Usually I don't explain myself to strangers on the internet, since people who angrily misread also usually angrily double down, but here goes.

In the US, it is frowned upon to take a scheduled day off just to relax, outside of your annual 2 weeks of vacation. So you call in "sick". Since you're not really sick, but want to relax, you call your reason for illness a "mental health day". I characterized this practice as cutesy, because it's a cutsey repurpose of the concept of sick day for self-care. It's not a mental health crisis, it's relaxing. But as long as you characterize it that way, it gets a nod and a wink from anyone who cares.

In Europe, by contrast, if you need time off because work is stressful, you plan ahead, take the day off and be cheerfully honest that you spent the day at the beach or whatever. But if you tell people you were sick, and then spend the day at the beach, people will at best think you are odd, but probably will think you're a liar. Telling people it was a "mental health break" to call in sick in order to go to the beach will not get the same cozy reception it gets in the US.

Clear?

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by confidantlake on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:18PM (#29844962)
Apologize for misreading you and getting frustrated. I appreciate the explanation. I hope you can understand where I am coming from.

If I am anxious or depressed, going outside into nature or to the beach would help me tremendously. Much more so than sitting at home. How anxious and depressed do I have to be before it flips from "relaxing" to "legit"?

At my job I get x vacation days and y sick days. If I feel I unwell mentally I am going to use a sick day. Why is it anyone's business why I am sick or what I did on my sick day?

If my coworker said they were feeling terrible yesterday so they took the day off to go to the beach I would understand and encourage that. I would also admire them being brave enough to admit that rather than pretend they had a virus.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by unionpivo on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:49PM (#29845304)
You get as many sick day's as you need, but if it longer than 2 (or maybe 3 I forgot) days, you need note from doctor.

> If I am anxious or depressed, going outside into nature or to the beach would help me tremendously.

If you are feeling that semi regularly, you might be on your way to a burnout or actually experiencing one.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by confidantlake on Friday January 07, 2022 @05:48PM (#29845968)
Oh yeah absolutely feeling that. 2 weeks of vacation for years on end has done that to me. Planning on interviewing and trying to get a start date as far out as I can. (maybe 3 months or even 6 months if they are ok with that).
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by rendall on Friday January 07, 2022 @05:27PM (#29845738)
I agree, confidentlake. You should be able to take time off of work to relax if you need. And, if the only outlet the US culture allows is to call in sick, then there's nothing wrong with doing that!
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by bluehatbrit on Friday January 07, 2022 @06:57AM (#29838057)
Slight tangent, I've been seeing a lot of companies from the US advertising remote roles in the UK and advertising "20 days paid vaccation + public holidays" as one of their "amazing benefits". I often wonder if they realise it's a legal entitlement over here and not seen as all that amazing.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by rogy on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:49AM (#29838501)
its also.. actually quite bad, I can't remember the last 'professional' job listing I saw that wasn't at least 25+holidays
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by bluehatbrit on Friday January 07, 2022 @08:39AM (#29838944)
I agree, my last role was 25+ public holidays. They also offered holiday trading, which is a real "benefit" that should be advertised in my eyes. That allowed me to go up to 30 days annual leave + public holidays which was great. Current job is setup as unlimited with a minimum of 20 + public holidays, all in all I take about the same as I did at my last place but it's a bit less hassle to track.

Advertising 20 days + public holidays in the UK is basically advertising that you give people the minimum the law will let you.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by literallyWTF on Friday January 07, 2022 @01:00AM (#29835544)
Uh, or you have allotted hours that you can use and will use? My boss isn’t my mother, they don’t need to know the “real” reason why I’m calling in sick.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by DangitBobby on Friday January 07, 2022 @12:33AM (#29835368)
So far the companies I've worked at don't have "vacation" or "sick" days, they have "paid time off" (which is really great if you're healthy and really shitty if you're not).
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by arka2147483647 on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:24AM (#29836980)
Atleast in Finland there is a clear, legal, distiction between vacation and sick days. They are not exchangeable in any way.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by rendall on Friday January 07, 2022 @05:34PM (#29845826)
Exactly. You can be out legitimately sick for 2 weeks, and then take a full vacation!

That's why it's such a breach of trust here to take a sick day in order to relax. A sick day is to recover from illness.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by hkolk on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:14PM (#29831991)
if your manager is ok with it, don't register it as a sick day. Makes it potentially more complicated with the company doctor. Just consider it a workday spend on ...whatever. Manager being ok with it means you deserved it though :) (EU based engineering manager speaking)
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by tunesmith on Thursday January 06, 2022 @07:25PM (#29832832)
company doctor?
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by tomcooks on Friday January 07, 2022 @01:22AM (#29835676)
In EU companies have to appoint a medical expert that checks worker's health (for free) upon joining the company, and routinely (1-2 times a year, depends on country I guess). Edit: Could be something that only companies whose workers have to do physical labour ("blue collar" jerbs)

If you call in sick for more than three days you usually go through your own doctor, so that you get a certification that you're taking X days off in order to cure yourself

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by antman on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:05AM (#29835967)
It is compulsory at least for all companies over 50 people. There is a three level risk profile of the work the team does that assigns the respective doctor hours to the team. That is mostly for work related incidents or prevention as per the EU legislation.

For long term absence each country has different rules and paperwork.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dusted on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:37AM (#29836170)
EU citizen here, never heard of that, what country is that?
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by Fiahil on Friday January 07, 2022 @05:12AM (#29837359)
It's similar to what I see in France
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by bmn__ on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:09AM (#29838147)
.at .de .it .nl .no .pt .se for certain
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dusted on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:36AM (#29838376)
interesting, we don't have it in dk, never heard of a company doctor or anything like it
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by ralferoo on Friday January 07, 2022 @05:28AM (#29837461)
I know the UK isn't EU any more, but I've never seen that before we left and I've worked in lots of companies in the UK, big and small.

In theory you should get a sick note after 3 days, because the government pays SSP (statutory sick pay) if you're ill, but in practice most companies pay you at your normal salary rate (if you're permanent, not per hour) and don't bother asking for sick note as the SSP is little more than minimum wage. Of course, this is in tech, I know that there are a lot of crappier jobs where employers trust their staff less, and I suspect in those industries the sick note is very much required.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by quantified on Saturday January 08, 2022 @01:58PM (#29854896)
My first manager would call these “health days”, and they were always supported. He would declare random “sun” days, when it was an especially nice New England day.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by FalconSensei on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:07PM (#29831912)
> Copying other work? Amazing. [...] Solving issue without using latest tech that I just learnt? Incredible.

The business goal is usually to have a new product, feature, a/b test deployed to make money/validate an idea. If there's code ready for that, it's not a great idea to write it again.

Also, _latest tech_ is only meaningful for the devs, and usually not even helpful, since the shine new things might have new problems that you (and other people) still don't know and will have a rough time trying to find a solution to.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by onphonenow on Thursday January 06, 2022 @07:14PM (#29832711)
Wow - this is the best advice on HN (top comment to while I write) in a while.

For junior folks I REPEATEDLY say, if you find yourself getting stuck / slowing down touch base. Or keep me in the loop, let's check in regularly when you have a good moment to chat, I'd love to hear how its going.

Here's the other thing I noticed. I work with someone who is is my peer. Ie, 15 years+ experience etc. THEY check in with me proactively 5x as much as the folks who really need to be checking in.

I also like that they don't schedule a call, they just zoom me. I know this seems rude, but it actually saves time. If I'm busy I don't answer, but usually I can. This is a personal preference. For junior folks if you schedule some time for early next day that works well (my calendar auto-accepts).

Also, not end of world to socialize / connect with 1-2 other devs below your managers level to share tips / get help, just be sure to pass it on to the next FNG.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by stef25 on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:15AM (#29836902)
> For junior folks I REPEATEDLY say, if you find yourself getting stuck / slowing down touch base. Or keep me in the loop, let's check in regularly when you have a good moment to chat, I'd love to hear how its going.

Sometimes work goes in such small incremental steps, full of unknown unknowns that there's so many occasions you can get bogged down. Even if you apply the rule of "touch base if you get stuck for more than an hour", you can still end up interrupting the senior guy 5x / day.

And when they're obviously annoyed and provide too short an explanation it becomes very uncomfortable to interrupt them again. Often it's not even their fault, they have a high workload and supporting the new guy isn't foreseen. Or, they're good devs but just incapable of explaining things.

I had this experience at a fintech company that didn't have a single page of internal documentation and you'd have 8 point Jira tickets that consisted of one bullet point - figure out the rest (everyone remote).

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by onphonenow on Friday January 07, 2022 @11:18AM (#29840917)
One issue is turnover, it's annoying to spend time training someone who you won't be working with a long time. I've only had that really happen once.

So a tip for junior's might be to look at places where folks have a bit of tenure and stick around (I know some places cycle folks between teams like crazy - that makes this hard).

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by acbart on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:17AM (#29836041)
> without bothering the professor

What the hell kind of academic culture is this? Maybe in graduate research, if I expected a research assistant to know how to do a task... but certainly not true in an undergraduate course! If they can't do the assignment, that is the perfect time for them to come to me and learn from me how to do the assignment. That's like, the whole point of my job as a teacher is to help people learn. Yes, I make assignments too, and people underestimate how difficult that part of the job is, but helping people figure things out is like my #1 job. It's sad to hear that your experiences (and apparently many other commenters) are something very different?

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by barry-cotter on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:21AM (#29836072)
> That's like, the whole point of my job as a teacher is to help people learn.

Many professors see teaching as a distraction from their real job, research, not an adjunct to it.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by bluehatbrit on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:05AM (#29838123)
This resonates with me, I had a real mixed bag when I was doing my undegrad degree. There were some incredible professors who wanted to teach, were very approachable, and would always make time and reply to emails with good detail. Then there were other professors who clearly only had their open office hours because they had to, would rarely reply to emails, and the moment you stepped into their office it was clear their top priority was getting you to leave.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dagw on Friday January 07, 2022 @10:23AM (#29840143)
This is getting off topic, but I'd love to see a fundamental rethink in how 'teachers' for undergrad courses are hired. Certainly for year 1 and 2 courses the 'teachers' should be selected and hired ~100% based on their pedagogical skills and passion and ~0% based on the impact of their publications. Universities also need to start recognizing, valuing and rewarding teaching ability.

The best first year math lecturer I had at university (and the person that is the reason I ended up majoring in math) didn't get tenure and ended up taking a job a smaller 'unprestigious' local college. The by far the worst lecturer I had is now at MIT.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by ponow on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:43AM (#29836218)
Could it be because you lose your professor job is in peril if you don't get research funding? Survival explains so much.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by Claude_Shannon on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:32AM (#29838339)
In my uni in Poland, had I asked teacher for help, I'd be at best laughed at. Homework/assignment is graded and it is fully expected that student does it all by themself.

And if you have questions, it is fully expected of you to just study harder and check for the question in books.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dazeandconfuse on Thursday January 06, 2022 @05:26PM (#29831303)
Thanks. I definitely will take that into consideration in the future. I'm not sure if it would have helped in this specific case but I can definitely think of other situations at work where taking your advice would have helped me.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by sdenton4 on Thursday January 06, 2022 @05:48PM (#29831637)
Pushing back on changing requirements is also a good skill to pick up. Part of it is getting a really clear agreement on what you're actually doing - what's the real scope of work - and actively changing the agreed plan when requirements change. I also find it helpful to highlight that changing requirements will have a cost in time, etc.

There's also a an art to getting together a good MVP efficiently. You can treat lots of added requirements as shiny feature requests, and prioritize them below getting the MVP working. Having an MVP that people can try out and see it working at all goes a long way towards building belief in your work. At the same time, you want to build flexibly enough that the MVP can expand rationally to take on those added feature requests... without writing in SO MUCH generality that nothing ever gets done. Doing this well is a skill learned on the back of many failures and tedious refactors... But efficiently getting a demo+MVP is golden, even if you build up some tech debt to get it.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by btown on Thursday January 06, 2022 @08:47PM (#29833660)
I'll add here that there's a ton of nuance to "pushing back on changing requirements." My rule of thumb is this: program managers should understand the expected and worst-case consequences (including baseline time, switching costs, stepping on other team members' toes, etc.) of any proposals to expand scope, and as an individual contributor it is vitally important to be vocal to ensure they understand the full dynamics.

But if and once they do understand and acknowledge the consequences, and still say a scope increase is justified, it's highly highly likely that they have more business context than you. Document the decision, of course, but fundamentally trust your team.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by s17n on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:46PM (#29832394)
It really is the solution to everything. A shitty coder who communicates well will do better in a corporate setting than a good coder who doesn't communicate.

My advice to you: 1. Put serious effort into Slack (or whatever your company uses). It is just as much a part of the job as writing code 2. "You don't get a second chance to make a first impression." I'm not saying you should definitely change companies, but you should seriously consider it, as you are now going to have to put in a ton of effort to regain trust. There is a good chance that you'll have a better ROI just putting in that effort at a new job instead - if you kick ass in your first 6 months to a year, you will enter into a flywheel of being well regarded which makes you more effective, which makes you more well regarded.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by DrNuke on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:37PM (#29832260)
I’m afraid the boss’ boss was talking with the wrong part of your team, in that his criticism really seems made for your boss, not you? That said, you were not treated like a novice at all, being given a fair share of high-level feedback. Take it as a nudge to improve and do better, without thinking too much: it will be your manager’s job to assess your output fairly.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by r00fus on Thursday January 06, 2022 @06:40PM (#29832308)
The 'bother the professor' part is key. With new teammates, I want them to reach out if they're on a project I'm leading. If things look like they're going well - then it's great to get positive feedback. If not, better to change direction early (lost work due to changing requirements).

Do you have a weekly 1:1 with your manager?

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dazeandconfuse on Thursday January 06, 2022 @09:49PM (#29834162)
No, I don't, is this something you think it'd make sense for me to request?
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by NortySpock on Thursday January 06, 2022 @11:13PM (#29834738)
Yes, or just schedule the one-on-one yourself. You have Outlook, same as them.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by kuhewa on Thursday January 06, 2022 @11:24PM (#29834813)
While changing requirements are outside of your control, clearly the consequences affect you, however unfairly. It's a skill to predict what might change and which parts of the project could end up being wasted time, and you will develop it with experience. I think being in continuing regular communication with your manager and team members as others are suggesting is also a good idea and partially for indirect reasons, because you might pick up on some clues of what these things outside your control may end up affecting how your performance is perceived.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by resonious on Thursday January 06, 2022 @09:49PM (#29834163)
I agree 100% that learning from the people around you is paramount.

But I disagree with the idea that you can't/shouldn't do that in an academic setting. During my undergrad, a lot of the more driven students were always bothering the professors for help. Those students often brought back gold nuggets of information while working on a team with them. It made me regret not doing so more myself.

Though to be fair, the assignment doesn't really change in academia - that's true. Those students aren't asking the professor if the requirements changed; they're bouncing ideas, and asking for further explanation.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by trynewideas on Thursday January 06, 2022 @11:18PM (#29834774)
I'd go one step further and log my work and blockers in a place that's visible to everyone internally, like a company wiki if there's one. Still check in frequently but have that already written up and ready to share with anyone else who might be able to help.

The biggest problem I've had being new at a company is knowing everyone else's skillset, and many people have a history at the company that gives them a unique voice or perspective that's especially valuable to someone new.

(A big example: people who transferred between departments over time and can contrast how things are similar and different between them, what the connections between them are like, and the history and changes over time in them.)

Having something easily sharable and already public can make it trivial for your manager or boss to track your progress — managers LOVE focusing their meetings on actions with context already in hand — and also make it easy for your boss to point you in the direction of someone else who can help with specific issues or blockers.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by bumby on Friday January 07, 2022 @09:41AM (#29839604)
Also, related to the OPs comment:

>"he says I probably just misinterpreted an offhand comment of hers as a hard requirement."

It's sometimes helpful to explicitly reiterate your understanding of tacit/implied direction, especially when in a junior position. For example, a short email of "my understanding is that you want me to do X".

A lot of this stuff boils down to communication. In academia, it's not as much of an issue because professors assign well-formulated problems with a definite solution. In business, a lot of the work is fleshing out those details and building a consensus about the right approach. Plus, it creates a trail to CYA (although that shouldn't be your primary goal)

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by vivekv on Thursday January 06, 2022 @08:26PM (#29833452)
This is a mind shift for the new hires. I typically ping them after a few days asking if they need any help understanding the problem or just a friendly chat on why we are doing that particular project and how it will make relevance to the business. The good ones quickly understand if the path they are choosing makes sense and most of the times opens them up to ask questions.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by alfor on Thursday January 06, 2022 @09:29PM (#29834018)
Definitely agree, I would say, if you think about something we might have fallen short (likely) go ahead and say it, the abilities to see your own shortcoming is gold for a manager.

They should be expecting rough edges with a junior dev, but if you are willing to talk about your weakness real or imagined you will grow fast.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by alsetmusic on Thursday January 06, 2022 @09:54PM (#29834219)
> if you are willing to talk about your weakness real or imagined you will grow fast.

Similarly, owning up to mistakes (rather than making excuses) is gold. It wins respect and trust when you really weren't at fault.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by Claude_Shannon on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:35AM (#29838366)
I just don't understand that part. Where I live, admitting to making a mistake would be equal to admitting to your incompentence, and I'd be shown the door on my way out.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by laserlight on Friday January 07, 2022 @04:47AM (#29837152)
> In business, it's much better to 'bother the professor' regularly and check in affirmatively on whether the assignment has changed

This is definitely management's responsibility. If they assign a task and let it continue after it has become obsolete, what kind of management is that?

> As a junior employee, you're not going to know the full business context of what makes sense

Agreed. I would add that explaining enough business context is also management's responsibility.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by dagw on Friday January 07, 2022 @10:26AM (#29840191)
This is definitely management's responsibility.

Ideally yes. But the truth is that you will often find yourself in situations where management is less than ideal, and no matter how unfair you will end up looking bad if you fail to navigate that.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by laserlight on Friday January 07, 2022 @03:44PM (#29844556)
Definitely. I argued the same in a top-level comment.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by forty on Friday January 07, 2022 @07:44AM (#29838464)
Yes! I'm trying to convince junior devs to bother me more.

Some do (did) a lot, and are very efficient as a result, they learn fast and become more autonomous quickly.

Then I feel it's also part of my job to evaluate when the bothering was not needed and to let them find on their own for a while.

After a while, they adjust and ask only good questions.

Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by taternuts on Friday January 07, 2022 @02:18PM (#29843462)
I often find myself falling into this trap of not reaching out for help quick enough and I've been a dev for a decade. It really is a super bad habit and I've made some strides recently to get better at it.
Re:Ask HN: My boss doesn't think I'm doing good work, how to... by abfan1127 on Thursday January 06, 2022 @05:57PM (#29831761)
this is really good advice. To go further, sometimes the homework changes, sometimes its not really necessary and can be delayed or ignored. Sometimes other unassigned work is more important. All of these are important discussions to have with co-workers, mentors, and managers.