"Oh, you want safety and comfort features X, Y, and Z? We've got them, exclusively available in our EX model. And you even get leather seats!"

But I don't want leather seats, and I will never buy a car with them. I wear shorts in the summer and I hate it when my legs stick to the seat.

If I can get a car with X, Y, Z and cloth seats, I'm in. But that can be hard to find.

In my current car, I really wanted the adaptive cruise control, but opted out because of the mandatory leather seats in that trim.

My current car has it, it is great. It was also option named sport seats.

That said, you should have the choice of what you want.

Really? Because I thought of three just while reading your comment, and I don't even work in manufacturing. Reduced SKUs, ease of manufacturing scheduling, and some package options might exclude the options of other packages (you can't get heated seats and cloth seat coverings as one example). I'd even argue that they could be good reasons, as creating the packages you'd like add expense and it has been (hypothetically) found that customers won't pay the extra.

OTOH, though I don't spend a lot of time perusing automotive options packages, of the ones I've looked it appears that the packages are additive. You can have package A, with X, Y and Z. You can have package B, which has X, Y, Z, and the addition of W and X for an additional $900.

As a result, I don't buy package B, or even don't buy the car at all and go to another comparable model.

I had no opportunity to explain why I didn't buy package B to the manufacturer, so do they even realize they're missing out because of that? I'm sure I'm not the only one.

It's been ages since we've purchased a new car, but can't you just check the box for "$FOOBAR" after checking the box for Package A? Our Leaf was pretty much pre-built with few choices outside of packages, but we did that with our Scion. Additionally, though my BMW motorcycle came with a "package", I could still get stuff a la carte. I'd just have to wait for BMW to build it and ship it, instead of riding it home that day. (Or in my case, the dealer has the a la carte items on the shelf. They sent me home with the taller windshield in a box, for example, and I bolted it on myself.)

OTOH, I'm using a motorcycle, an early-adopter electric car, and a quirky little off-brand Toyota as examples. Probably not the best examples for sussing the average car buying experience.

Is this example supposed to be a true fact? I have cloth seats that are heated.

Car manufacturers are idiots. I want a small car because I live in a city, but I will never buy a small car with a sunroof, because I am tall and that space comes out of the inside of the car. So many features are bundled with sunroofs it is absurd. I would have probably spent 5 grand more on my car if I could have gotten features without getting a sunroof.

They literally could have charged me the price of a car with a sunroof and given me one without a sunroof and I would have been pretty happy.

So, yeah, my example might be dated.

I drive a 2015 Chevy Volt with the non-premium package (i.e. no backup camera, etc.) because the premium-package comes with a shiny white center console which is downright blinding in the sunlight.

The premium package also comes with leather seats which, when it's in the severe negative degrees, you really REALLY don't want.

People don't sit around just waiting to switch to the model that has more of what they want. They only change their situation every few years or in response to things like collisions or whatnot. And purchasing a car is quite a maniacal process in 2017. Car manufacturers seem to have hired web designers that have profound mental problems and who never attempt to use their own sites. They fight you at every step of the way, making even something simple like finding out what cars the automaker sells a tremendous challenge. And once you do know exactly what you want, it still takes hours and hours of experimentation with the site before you can accurately navigate to find it. I was often reduced to screaming laughter at how stupendously bad the sites were.

And that doesn't even begin to tackle the antiquated dealership system which is just ludicrous at this point. Luckily I didn't need to nickle and dime the dealership and was willing to just walk in and ask them if they were willing to do a grand or so over the TrueCar average price for the car for the region and so I didn't have to fight them. I can't even imagine what the experience is like overall for someone who is looking to save money. I'm single and have no kids. My prior car worked well for over a decade. I was able to approach car buying as 'I want to find something that I like the looks of and is dripping with gadgets and whose payment won't be more than my mortgate'. Even being that open to various possibilities, they still managed to make it an exercise of pain.

I'm certainly not going to considering undergoing that pain again any time soon, even if they do come out with a model that gets 5% better gas mileage or whatever.

Sure they do. Tons of people do.

There are tons of people that upgrade their iPhone the day the new one comes out not because their old one suddenly broke that day, but because they want new things.

There's an entire side of the industry - leasing - that specifically caters to people that just want to get a new car every few years.

Lots of people will be looking at the new cars with CarPlay and Android Auto and be seriously considering an upgrade.

Most consumers don't have strong preferences in vehicles and will sacrifice a lot in order to get a good deal on something they can drive off the lot today.

Correction: Something they perceive as being a good deal.

Virtually nobody goes to a car dealership and leaves with the vehicle they want at the price they wanted to pay and a large percentage of people are probably confused about what exactly they end up with and how much they ended up paying for it.

I did! I was buying a very slightly used 2015 model, the 2016 models had just gone deep discount (9k off sticker price), I was able to use that to drop another 2k off the price of my 2015.

Good car buying experiences do happen, admittedly not that often. Having correct timing (knowing when models go on clearance) and being willing to comparison shop across all dealers around the state (and neighboring states) is key to getting a good deal.

I could have bought showroom cars (or pre-built cars) at a discount, but none had the options I wanted.

When it came time to sell the car, the salesman was right :-) When you buy an unpopular mix, you pay twice - once for the options, and again when you have to sell the car at a discount because of those options.

The cars on the lot tend to be the most popular option combinations, meaning the most sellable cars at the most profit. The dealers aren't fools.

Porsche just throws a massive options sheet at you and lets you go to town. You get the exact car you want on a granular level. On the other hand, that's also a disadvantage. If you have deviated stitching everywhere else and tick off the "Steering Column Casing in Leather" option instead of "Steering Column Casing in Leather with Stitching in Deviated Thread" the steering column, Porsche will accept the order but won't substitute the stitching for you. You get exactly what you order, good or bad. And there have been some pretty ugly combinations ordered in the past. Want a Miami Blue exterior, matching wheels in the same, a bright red leather with acid green stitching, wood trim, a carbon fiber shifter, etc.? You can order it. You really, really shouldn't. But you can. You'll also pay for it. The average customer will order something like $10-15k in options, and more Porsche buyers special order compared to other brands. Porsche dealers tend to have less inventory on hand as a result as well.

that was bwm of hawthorne

Did they at least have the decency to refund your $1000?

I really wish the laws were such that I could more easily get the car directly from the factory like Tesla, no middleman. I know with BMW you can actually order a car, pick it up in Germany at the factory , drive it around Europe and they'll then ship it to the USA for you. No idea how much extra it would cost and not sure I want to drive in Europe vs taking public transit but at least I'd get my car

https://www.bmwusa.com/european-delivery.html

I thought the "European delivery" scheme's attraction was that it is cheaper than buying the same car in the US - because you are driving it around Europe, it's imported as an used car.

We picked up our 328 wagon in Munich, great experience.

Having been unlucky enough (twice) to have experienced sidewall tire damage, the one deal breaker for me on a new car is the absence of a spare tire and/or a well in the trunk and the option to buy one.

Every year, the number of automobiles that have a spare tire or the option to even have one in the car shrinks. I'm assuming this de-contenting has to do with making the car lighter to improve fuel economy?

In my mind, a "tire inflation kit" (aka an aerosol can) or expensive-to-replace run-flats have limited benefits in general and absolutely zero benefits when it comes to sidewall damage. I would not want to be in the middle of nowhere with the wrong kind of flat in a car without a spare.

Correct.

Of course the spare tire well has some weight to it, but pictures I've seen of the delete do make the car appear more aerodynamic from beneath.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Mondeo

That's why you get trims, and then packages within those trims.

Tesla is the largest exception, but even they limit options.

The things that they make you choose between are ridiculous. It's like they put all the features on lottery balls, spin the bucket and pick 6 at random for each package and that's what you get. At least make the feature packages make sense

Generally what I find is that they make a point of scattering the desirable features across packages in order to make you upgrade to the superset.

For eg. Honda Accord 2018 with all bells and whistles starts at $33.8K while the lowest one starts at $23.5K. There's a good chance that a 40% increase over the base price will put that car out of the budget of a lot of people.

From their perspective it should be setup like cable subscriptions. So, different segments buy the same package for different reasons.

You are standing in the maze of twisty little options, all of which suck.

Acura TLX has the option for automatic cruse control, lane followings, and automatic breaking. It has a second option for blind spot detection and several other things. Want both? They have a third option that includes both plus some other stuff but it costs even more.

I mean why blind spot detection as part of the safty package when you can charge 3x as much to include it.

And as much as I like Tesla, I don't think they are yet at a stage where they can be used as an example of what is possible in the manufacturing world at scale. And they hardly offer any many options. AND, some of their options are just software switches that can be flipped whenever you want the upgrade. That's possible for the model S because it's a very high margin car.

Car companies love to have things like "All season floor mats" that can be quickly swapped out at the dealership and sold with a high markup.

I get it. It's easier to shift vehicles if they all conform to some common spec because then there's nothing that makes worlds different. You pick this spec or that spec, end of story.

But I've played this game too many times with dealers and I just can't be bothered any more, which is why I drive an 8 year old Volvo that is good enough. Would I like a new car? Of course, I'd love a spanking new truck, but the glory of driving off the lot with a brand new vehicle that's not quite exactly what I wanted just isn't worth the loss of the 30% of value as I leave the lot and certainly not the tediousness of talking to car sales people for a day while they fuck around upstairs trying to stress me out.

I'll bring my laptop and use your WiFi to work. I'm quite comfortable helping myself to your endless tea or water from your service department waiting room while I'm in your showroom. No, I'm not giving you the keys to my vehicle which is parked outside your lot on the street so you can't box me in, and here's a photocopy of my driver's license which is plenty adequate for your needs, the original stays in my wallet. Now fuck off and do your job and if you're not back here with the keys, ownership papers and plates to a new car matching the spec I specified by the time I'm finished this user story, you won't find me still sitting here. You wanna play games, play them with someone else.

German cars in the US have option packages, you can only choose from what they offer. Sure, if it's not on the lot you can order it or request an allocation or something, but you cannot specify the precise options you want if they're package-only.

Many Subaru options are dealer-installed so the only option you'll have beyond what comes bundled with your trim package is things like roof racks and fog lights that can be installed by a dealership employee.

In Europe (for European brands I mean) you don't have such an issue, as long as you are willing to wait a long time to have it delivered, ( I know people that have waited 9-10 months for their VW only because they wanted a specific color) ).

I think, over the years, shoppers in the US have shown time and time again that they simply don't care, so these choices have been taken away from those of us who DO care.

Eh, the brand probably died for a lot of reasons. I think primarily because Toyota missed the demographic mark. Initially the brand was the less expensive, "hip" brand for the younger crowd (because a Toyota owner's club meeting would look about as gray as a Grateful Dead concert). We saw one before they were available to purchase in the U. S., and placed an order with the local dealer while the Scion-specific showroom was still being built. A few months go by and ours comes in. We, of course, look for other drivers who bought the quirky little box. Ya know what? The other drivers looked a lot like us, with a little gray in their muzzle. Didn't pay much attention to the xAs and xDs (conventional compact cars), but it looked like all Toyota did with the xBs was shift the market from Camrys to xBs.

But then, you pay for that freedom...