My Ioniq 5 has been a godsend. No, it can't power the house without dorking around with my electrical panel. But we can run the fridge, dishwasher, a few standing lights and keep phones and computers full charged.
I used a similar setup to Alex's but with the outlet in the rear seat instead of the V2X connector. I will probably by the V2X connector since it supposedly hanldles higher power draw.
Also, since when are electric water heaters common in the USA? Every home I’ve ever lived in here has used gas for heating water.
But if it's hooked up to hot water, add in the 4 gallons of water it used and the 1.5 kWh to heat that.
The difference is mostly to use as little water as possible - just enough to wet the surface of the dishes not to soak them, and heat only the wash water not the 2 sets of rinse water or the prewash water.
There are some neat tricks to do this - for example there is no water level sensor - you aren't aiming to fill the bottom of the machine - instead you run the pump at full speed and keep adding water slowly till the pump electrically feels like it doesn't have many air bubbles in it.
You're probably right about that. A lot of people grew up without dishwashers and don't have a way to economically install one outside of a major kitchen remodel even if they have the space which many in cities don't have. They're also not the, for lack of a better term, necessities that washers, stoves, and ovens are. And, of course, dishwashers don't eliminate the need for any handwashing and if you aren't cooking or doing a lot of entertaining a lot, they may not be all that useful. I do cook but still probably only run my dishwasher 2 or 3 times per week.
I have a rule that every single item in the kitchen goes into the dishwasher. If it doesn’t survive oh well - survival of the fittest.
The only thing exception outside of size that I can think of are the fancy knives. But we have an everyday set I don’t mind dulling and just sharpening once a month with a basic sharpener.
Everything used immediately goes into the dishwasher during the day, then before bed it gets ran full or not. Dishes put away with morning coffee and the cycle repeats. No dirty dishes cluttering up the kitchen, and no wasteful (water and time) hand washing required.
Source: I did that dishwashing job in school, to pay for my lunches.
Don’t get me wrong, I love a good dishwasher. But we need to recognize the difference in the jobs here.
And bad dishwashers? Well, let me just say that we will never, ever have another Bosch dishwasher in our house.
Anyway I agree that in emergency conditions it can go a looong way for a house.
It's 30kW for one hour.
(Or 1.25kW for 24 hours, or however you prefer).
30kW is a rate.
30kWh is a measure of energy, about 100MJ.
30kWh/day is a rate again, 100MJ/day.
It seems clunky, but it's a way energy usage in a house is typically measured.
I said the time period matters when you're talking about it relative to generation. 30kWh over the course of a day is very different to 30kWh over ten minutes.
Except that GP (pmontra) had asked "Is that 30 kW each hour of the day?"
Clearly someone asking that doesn't understand what kWh/day means, and since you were backing GP, it seemed reasonable to guess that you might not understand either.
If you want a "better than nothing" but imperfect analogy, Wh is how much water you have in a bottle, and W is how quickly you can get the water out.
This discussion seems super silly, considering he's just using the measurement that the industry adopted decades ago...
Are y'all just coming out of a time travel device from the 70s or something?
I'll put aside the two-bit attitude and that you don't know that power (W) and energy (Wh) were measured in the exact same way in the "70s or something" (just ask your grandparents).
> the world decided to use kWh as the thing to measure
> kw per day, kw per week, kw per month, kw per year.
You switched between units from one sentence to the next? The indeed world measures kWh per day, not kW per day. There is no such thing as "kw per day". The wrong usage is common because a lot of people don't understand the concepts and just parrot a common mistake. When they say "kW per day" what they should actually say is "kWh per day". It's where the unintuitive part comes in, they omit the "hour" or assume it's kW/h, like km/h, instead of kW times h.
> This discussion seems super silly, considering he's just using the measurement that the industry adopted decades ago...
The industry adopted the correct measurement units decades before your grandparents were born. You just have a hard time understanding because it's easier to do cheap snark.
Unlike those people from the 70s or something, you live in a world with all the information you could want at your fingertips, you even have machines (AI) that digest it for you, and you even had me bothering to give an explanation a kid could process. To be unapologetically ignorant today is the same as being intellectually incompetent.
30kWh is 1.25kW for 24 hours or 30kW for one hour.
30kW every hour means 720kWh per day. 30kW all day is also 720kWh per day.
The comment is nonsense.
The only way you can steel man it is by saying he isn't concerned about the 1.25kW, he is concerned by the swings, but the said 30kW twice for two different time spans so that can't be it either.
That’s why whole-home generators are typically sized at 24kW, unless there are some circuits you’re not going to power while you are operating on generator.
Now, most homes don’t use that much power 24x7. Most homes use a lot less than that. But, they need to provide that much power, in case all the electric devices inside the house are all running at the same time. And in Texas, newer homes usually come with 200 amp service, because HVAC draws so much, plus electric hot water, electric cooktops, etc….
So, to get a real idea of the amount of power you need from batteries, you need to look at how much power your house actually requires on those critical circuits, on the worst day. If you can’t deliver that much peak power, then you need to increase the size of your inverter stack, or you need to reduce the number of critical circuits you’re powering. Most battery solutions for powering a house will give you some options here, and then combine all the output power from each stack into a smart breaker box.
Then you also need to look at how much total power you pull over a full day. That’s your minimum kWh rating that you need from the battery pack. And again, most whole-home type battery solutions will give you multiple options here. These are companies like Bluetti, Anker, EcoFlow, etc….
For example, the Anker SOLIX E10 Power Dock can do a max of 7.6kW sustained and 10kW turbo output with 12kWh-90kWh storage, depending on how many battery units you connect to that inverter. But to get 20kW total turbo output, you’d need two inverter stacks, each with their own chain of batteries. And you would need their Smart Power Dock to combine those two stacks. Each power dock can handle a total of three input stacks, for a total maximum of 22.8kW combined max sustained output, with 30kW combined turbo output. That gets you their 200-amp equivalent service.
In comparison a Tesla Powerwall does about 11.5kW maximum output for one unit, but has much less battery capacity per unit (only 13.5kWh). And you would either need to trim down your critical loads to get under that 11.5kW maximum output, or have a pair of such units that each talk to their gateway device. And the Tesla Powerwall doesn’t have any additional battery units that I know of that you can connect to that same inverter. So, you would end up buying a lot more inverters if you want longer runtimes with Tesla.
Either way, you can pair these with solar panels on your roof, to get either total or partial fill of these units from the sun, and the rest from the grid. The same is true for all of the major whole-house battery backup units I know of.
Now, if the batteries in your car can sustain 100kWh of power, and you’re using 30kWh per day, that would last you just over three days before you’re completely drained. Then you would have to look at the maximum amount of instantaneous power that the vehicle can provide. Is that just 10kW? Can it do 20kW? 30kW? Note that this number is usually a lot lower than the rate that the vehicle can charge at, when it is at a supercharger facility. Usually, they can suck down the power a lot faster than they can push it up. And many BEVs today are still pretty slow at being charged up.
I look forward to the day when all BEVs can charge quickly at high voltage, and also discharge V2L and V2H at high rates of speed, with large battery capacities. But I think it’s going to be a while before we get there.
Meanwhile, I feel like I need to have the power service at my house upgraded to 200 amp, before I can realistically buy a BEV. We just don’t have the spare power capacity available to us to be able to charge the vehicle at reasonable speeds, which would require a level 2 charger at home.
The value of the same, repurposed to a "powerwall" - $10k per 10 KWh
The value of it once attached to a "movable powerwall" - :) add a few more zeros
Clearly, I am in the wrong business...
When we got solar we asked for quotes, but ‘No Tesla’. The sales rep said ‘We get that a lot’.
I wasn’t interested in hearing any advantages of a Tesla Powerwall, that brand is toxic to me now.
There’s plenty of good alternatives that don’t fund criminals like Tommy Robinson and Russell Brand.
We have Sigenergy. Are they better than Teslas? Unsure, but at least I have no idea what the owner(s) think.
I want a system that doesn't need to be connected to the cloud.
It was also really hard to work with them to even get the bid.
It was quite the premium.
If you have a string inverter setup, I’m not aware of anything good that is cheaper. If you have micro inverters then sure, but otherwise you have additional hardware cost.
Best practice would be to build a separate structure and physically separate the battery from your house.
And you got a budget opensorce powerwall
> Most of the disasters I'm aware of people either get their power back in a short enough amount of time that they can use a normal generator for the gap
TBF an EV car has an absolutely massive battery relative to the electric consumption of a house, unless you're using resistive heating all around. Especially if you ration use.