The AppleTV+ video is easily the highest quality video of all the services.

Their bitrate is roughly double the other popular services.

For example a 1 hour 4K TV show is about 9-11GB on AppleTV+. On Disney and Netflix and Amazon, it's about 4-6GB. On HBO MAX it's about 7-9GB.

The audio is the same across them all more or less. Most using 768K DD+ with Atmos these days.

> On Disney and Netflix and Amazon, it's about 4-6GB. On HBO MAX it's about 7-9GB.

Netflix 4K subscription will get you high bitrates, even for 1080p. I'm surprised MAX is that high; it used to be the worst.

To be fair, I am getting these numbers from the pirate downloads. So losslessly downloaded copies of the highest quality copies available from each service.

AppleTV device has a dev option that will display video bitrates.

> Their bitrate is roughly double the other popular services.

Just curious: Is this comparing the same codec? x264 vs AV1 will have a massively different bitrate. So, if a service is using AV1, that could actually be better for the consumer.

Yes, this is comparing the 4K UHD HDR stream, HEVC vs HEVC.

And despite using Atmos, I still have so many issues with audio mixing for SFX and dialog tracks.

How is this so hard to get right?

I have a Apple TV 4K (and Roku doesn't do much better, to be clear), connected to a Marantz Cinema 70s (8K, Dolby Atmos, 7.2), and little to nothing that is done either on the receiver, ATV, or playback source does anything to alleviate the huge frustration that is "being able to hear dialog cleanly without rupturing a speaker, eardrum or both when there's an explosion".

As for Roku... I have the Roku Ultra hooked up to the same... but, since Plex released an ATV app, I don't really need it...

Well, Atmos adds significant complexity to the accurate reproduction of an audio mix because it has so many additional variables to control for.

However, you’re in luck. The center channel is reserved almost exclusively for the dialogue track in film and TV, so you should be able to turn it up and hear it more clearly without affecting anything else.

> and little to nothing that is done either on the receiver, ATV, or playback source

Well of course, it's nothing indeed -- they're simply passing through the audio as it was originally mastered, as they're meant to.

All your equipment is doing it right, assuming it's all configured correctly. And I assume it's not that the Roku "doesn't do much better", but does it exactly and precisely the same.

If you have an issue, it's presumably with the mastering standards, not with any of your equipment. Which is a whole other conversation around relative decibel levels in mixing, but it has nothing to do with technology.

I've read that Apple TV+'s higher than average bitrate can cause a lot of streaming boxes to struggle, not sure if that's what's happening here though.

It's been solid for me, to the point that I subscribe to other services through the built-in channels feature in order to be able to avoid generally worse streaming apps (like Paramount+) but I always watch using Apple stuff.

It's the experience on Roku. We have a cheap Roku, and it is awful.

On my WebOS TV's, AppleTV works exceptionally well, only Hulu and Netflix beat it in terms of reliability.

Paramount+ on the other hand. Total POS.

I struggled through having a cheap Roku for a while last year, until I finally got frustrated and looked up what they cost to replace. Without me, and perhaps others who read this, noticing, they dropped to basically "disposable" levels of price. A new modern one is $27 for the normal HD and $40 for the HD. Well below the price of the frustration I experienced trying to keep one from a few generations back going, and I'm generally relatively conservative by local standards.

Don't struggle through a slow old Roku.

And, of course, I'm not really pitching Roku, if you've got another solution or want to switch companies, that's fine too. I'm just saying, anyone reading this who has a Roku a few generations back and having simply never thought about what to do about it, have a look at replacing it. Or any other streaming box that is generally choking. I remember getting into TiVos when they cost the modern equivalent of about $350-$400 and I still haven't fully internalized that streaming boxes can cost, well, more than "a coffee at starbucks" but at this point "less than a full meal for my family at a fast food joint".

As a counter point, you can buy a Apple TV and mine lasted maybe a decade. The cheapest one I see is $130ish. Why don't we try and keep electronic waste to a minimum by buying long lasting stuff. I know not everyone can afford a device that's a few times more expensive but it really isn't if you take the long view and it will be better for the planet.

To add to this, the first-gen Apple TV 4K I use, which was first released back in 2017, still runs the latest tvOS and works great. The A10X Fusion SoC in it is still a great deal more powerful than what's built into most streaming boxes in 2024. The current-gen Apple TV has an A15 Bionic which is much another huge step up in power.

They're not the cheapest thing out there, but you get a lot of muscle (and longevity) for your money.

My $30 second gen chromecast is still going strong, and I prefer it's "just a dumb box that runs special apps your phone apps tell it to" system, such that I never have to interact with it.

I may be misunderstanding, but don’t this involve an intermediary re-encoding when casting video from phone → dongle? If so that’s unavoidable quality loss which isn’t great and runs down phone battery unnecessarily. If it works for you though, that’s what’s important!

Aside from that, having a little extra power available can be nice for being able to smoothly play back video formats that the hardware doesn’t have acceleration for, obviating need for transcoding (via Plex or similar).

Phone is only a remote that tells the chromecast/fire/roku etc where to get the stream.

Meanwhile the 3rd Gen AppleTV was released in 2013 and was obsolete by 2015 when they released tvOS.

I owned the 1st gen (used) and 3rd gen. Terrible investments (imo).

I have a 4K Chromecast w/ Google TV (Android TV?), and Apple TV is my favorite app to use on it. It doesn't have any ads or technical issues that the other streaming services have, it just works. HBO Max is the only other app that comes close. Everything else is only in the "usable" category.

> Apple TV is my favorite app to use on it. It doesn't have any ads

jFYI, lots of other services also have no-ads plans. E.g. Netflix.

What are you watching on? I have an Apple TV 4k and it's the best experience I've ever seen. I had Roku's for a long time and just got tired of them (bad performance, glitches).

I think it's more of a Roku-issue. I have issues with Peacock, Paramount+, and Hulu on Roku. Getting a more expensive Roku stick instead of the TV default helped.

It might be the Roku? Works fine for me on Chromecast with TV, and also previously on my Apple TV.

I use Apple TV through the website (laptop driving the TV). They are the worst with bugs and UI design choices, at least on Chrome. Will the space bar pause the movie when I press it? Maybe!

For me Apple TV (one with ethernet) works very well

Apple TV+ is something completely different. Think "Netflix supplied by Apple".

Apple TV is your physical device (or software loaded on your TV).

Right, and the app on that device with very similar names work great. The app may not work well on other devices is the point. The issue with buttons as described sounds very much like an app on another device issue. That issue does not exist on the device by the same name as the app.

My personal anecdote. My Roku just started running like trash on everything. It is older, maybe 4+ years old. If I bought a newer one, maybe it would be better. Instead I just bought the Apple TV box and it runs well. Of course the Apple TV has, I am pretty sure, a lot more processing power since it runs the A-series of processors.

Old Roku here (the new one, bought when the old one kept telling me I needed an SD card when switching providers is still sitting in its box several years later) and no issues with Apple TV.

I never tried Apple TV on my Roku. It was mostly Netflix and Hulu that were choking hard on mine. But also like I said, it could be because it was older hardware and definitely an older chipset on it. I imagine the newer ones have better chips which run better.

Works well for me on a Fire TV 4k Max. Not so great on the Apple TV app built into my Android Smart TV.

Only Netflix appears to work consistently well on all my devices. Kudos to that team.

I had a pretty similar experience with Apple TV+ on my Roku; so you're not alone. Maybe their player app is better on their platform or other non Roku platforms, but I'm not likely to look.

I routinely had issues with Apple TV and Roku, where content would freeze or the audio would stutter. It was stochastic but ultimately unwacheable.

All of Apple software is awful glitchy broken mess on non Apple platforms.

My experience has been very good.

It was fine on my 1st generation Amazon Fire TV 4K. That's nearly 6 year old hardware.