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Re:An Accident at SpaceX by fayalargeau on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:32PM (#33251842)
> The company’s silence on the incident is a particularly dramatic reflection of a core dynamic in America’s new space race: The unspoken truth that human lives are at play at every level.

???? Does a company need to make an announcement or public statement for every incident that occurs at work?

There are risks at every job. How is this even an article-worthy?

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by TylerE on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:37PM (#33251901)
Maybe they should?

Already most companies do the absolute least OSHA lets them get away with (and often not even that...)

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by FL410 on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:38PM (#33251929)
What do you expect them to do, especially considering legal and healthcare/PHI constraints?
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by heavyset_go on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:48PM (#33252876)
SpaceX is not a covered entity under HIPAA, they are under no PHI constraints that healthcare providers are under.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by formerkrogemp on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:54PM (#33252169)
Over the decade I worked in retail and warehouses prior to becoming an accountant, I never once saw an OSHA inspector.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by dghlsakjg on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:20PM (#33252517)
My impression is that OSHA tends to be reactive.

Unless there was an incident or a report of unsafe activity you aren't going to see OSHA.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by fdgsdfogijq on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:36PM (#33251892)
It gets clicks!
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by limaoscarjuliet on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:37PM (#33251912)
And karma votes :-)
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by johndfsgdgdfg on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:23PM (#33252545)
And satisfaction that you are one of those few people who not only care about human lives, also actively fights a billions of dollar worth megacorp.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by MichaelZuo on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:42PM (#33251988)
Agree, it makes it sound suspiciously like a submarine article.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by trollied on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:42PM (#33251995)
I'd imagine they're silent regarding it because 1) it's an active safety investigation 2) legal will be involved 3) it's frankly nobody else's business, seeing as it's a private business
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by tptacek on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:25PM (#33252585)
OSHA incidents probably don't fit the "nobody's business" pattern, in the same way major breaches like the one that happened at Uber don't.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by shortstuffsushi on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:51PM (#33252908)
Is this meant to say, if it's an OSHA involved incident, it should be made public knowledge?
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by tptacek on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:56PM (#33252975)
I'd remove the word "should". OSHA incidents create public records. They are, by definition, our business.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by shortstuffsushi on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @05:08PM (#33253988)
I was not actually aware these incidents were made public record, so TIL. For this specific instance, here is a link for any interested. https://www.osha.gov/pls/imis/establishment.inspection_detai...
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by tptacek on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @05:33PM (#33254313)
Essentially all public functions that create records create, by definition, public records. There are exceptions, but they're much narrower than you'd expect. You're entitled to demand copies of the records that federal agencies collect, and those records are created with the expectation that they can be produced on demand. Most agencies do a reasonable job of making things overtly public, so you can just download them. But even if they don't, you can just FOIA them.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by BuyMyBitcoins on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:24PM (#33252563)
>”2) legal will be involved”

In court, an apology, even something as simple as saying “sorry”, can be used as an admission of guilt. It behooves them to say as little as possible.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by fasthands9 on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:45PM (#33252046)
I mean #2 is obviously correct but that shouldn't make the public feel any better. Precisely because there are downsides (including legal and political) for announcing incidents they will only do so if they have to.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by JumpCrisscross on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:48PM (#33252090)
> that shouldn't make the public feel any better

The incident was reported to a federal agency. I’m not sure I’d want my medical history publicly aired if I were injured at work.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by fasthands9 on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @04:57PM (#33253819)
https://www.gofundme.com/f/help-the-cabadas-during-this-diff...

The family started a public GoFundme page. I think its clear that it is in the interest of both the family and labor at large to get stories about workplace injuries to the public.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by elsonrodriguez on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @06:03PM (#33254647)
It's interesting to note that the family has changed the main picture to remove any overt SpaceX references.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by giarc on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:48PM (#33252091)
>3) it's frankly nobody else's business, seeing as it's a private business

It is however a private business taking public money. If a government was pumping millions of dollars into a company that was producing an unsafe work environment resulting in injury and death (not saying that is the case) but I think the public has a right to know.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by googlryas on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:56PM (#33252191)
That's OSHA's job, not SpaceX's. And I don't think you can take a single incident and use that to determine if a workplace is safe or not. Especially considering the context of it being a rocket factory.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by BurningFrog on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:58PM (#33252218)
I pump money into a lot of local businesses, and yet they never send me workplace safety reports.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by KennyBlanken on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @04:43PM (#33253608)
Workplace safety violations are absolutely society's "business."
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by p1necone on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @05:21PM (#33254172)
> frankly nobody else's business, seeing as it's a private business

Uhh, wut? How many people have to die inside a private business before it does become other peoples business. And how do you know if you've got your blinders on.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by bell-cot on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @02:52PM (#33252147)
> There are risks at every job. How is this even an article-worthy?

A sadly large % of the people reading news on-line have nearly forgotten that hazardous real-world jobs still exist. (Vs. office jobs where "fell and sprained wrist while getting out of an extra-comfy wheely chair" is just about the worst workplace injury they can imagine.)

Also, it's SpaceX. Loads of construction, roofing, etc. workers get maimed & killed every year, and are barely worth a passing mention in the local paper.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by croes on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @04:00PM (#33253022)
It's not about the number but about the reason.

There is a difference if a job is dangerous and somebody gets hurt or dies despite compliance with all safety measures or if an accident happens because of safety violations.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by bell-cot on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @04:24PM (#33253367)
Reasonable Assumption: A whole lot of the barely-covered injuries and deaths at various little tree-trimming, construction, roofing, etc. firms also involve safety violations.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by mabbo on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:30PM (#33252633)
Because openness about failure is indicative of willingness to accept criticism. Doesn't mean they need to accept fault.

Being completely silent on the matter gives the appearance that they are pretending it didn't happen, that they want no one asking questions about it.

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by lazide on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:42PM (#33252813)
Or don’t want to provide meat for the legal meat grinder.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by foverzar on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:45PM (#33252843)
So, this basically serves no real purpose, other than keeping appearances and sending proper signals to bored strangers on the internet, affecting nothing at all.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by s1artibartfast on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @05:07PM (#33253983)
What would be sufficient openness? What do you think they should be saying and to whom? Who should they be seeking and accepting criticism from?

Should Space X proactive issue notice to the media and request for public feedback?

Should they be emailing all employees details?

Should Elon be posting on twitter for feedback?

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by dredmorbius on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @08:34PM (#33255965)
Among other standards, OSHA reporting requirements:

<https://www.hseblog.com/osha-accident-reporting-requirements...>

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by s1artibartfast on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @10:07PM (#33256585)
Are you seriously implying that they didn't?

Someone claimed that they were insufficiently open and I'm asking what they should have done that they did not

Re:An Accident at SpaceX by tester756 on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @03:41PM (#33252788)
If NASA would, then why SpaceX no?
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by yreg on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @04:38PM (#33253541)
Internally they definitely should.
Re:An Accident at SpaceX by chinabot on Tuesday October 18, 2022 @05:15PM (#33254093)
The other dozen poor soles who probably died in work related accidents today don't count as they have nothing to do with Elon Musk.