News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:I/O 2022 by lkxijlewlf on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @02:59PM (#31344276)
I popped in for a few minutes to verify something. I'm ... over this whole annual what's new presentation stuff. I just don't care anymore. And honestly the three presenters I saw didn't even seem like they rehearsed at all. They just read from the prompter and tried to put excitement in their voice at the same time and it just fell flat.
Re:I/O 2022 by izzydata on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:31PM (#31344665)
I think Apple, Samsung and Google should give up on this whole iPhone 13 and Pixel 6 naming and numbering scheme and stop pretending like it is going to be an exciting brand new product every single year.

They should name them more like cars where you can always expect there to be the latest revision each year, but you never expect it to be something completely new that you need to upgrade to.

We need the iPhone (2023) and the Pixel (2023). You would just say you have "an iPhone" and if for whatever reason it is necessary you could say it is a 2023 model.

Re:I/O 2022 by anon23anon on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:43PM (#31344795)
Yea cars have this notion of model years. Everyone knows nothing really changes between model years except the trim. It's the vehicle generation you care about. I think the focus should be on holding press conferences when you genuinely have something new to show off otherwise it's just fluff.
Re:I/O 2022 by magicalist on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:50PM (#31344866)
Car companies do have press events every year for their yearly product updates, it's just that everyone who doesn't care just doesn't pay attention.
Re:I/O 2022 by rrrrrrrrrrrryan on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:27PM (#31346035)
Car companies' annual events where they unveil all their new models are huge. They've been happening every year since forever.

It's likely the tech industry copied them.

Re:I/O 2022 by hobofan on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:52PM (#31344897)
> iPhone 13 and Pixel 6

I think the fact that they are in those high numbers already shows that they "stopped pretending like it is going to be an exciting brand new product every single year". The numbering there is pretty straightforward compared to e.g. the Macbook namings, or the convoluted naming of other brands with stacked variation signifiers, like the "Xiaomi 11 lite 5G NE".

Re:I/O 2022 by Hasu on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:51PM (#31345601)
> The numbering there is pretty straightforward compared to e.g. the Macbook namings

I'm confused, while Apple has silly naming conventions for their operating system, the Macbook line doesn't have that at all. It's just the Macbook (and the Macbook Pro and the Macbook Air), Apple doesn't even give them different names or years.

Am I missing something that isn't incredibly straightforward about the Macbook naming?

Re:I/O 2022 by i2shar on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:04PM (#31345739)
Yes, you are missing the sillier "Late 2014", "Early 2019" naming of MacBook Pros and others :)
Re:I/O 2022 by hobofan on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @06:25PM (#31346714)
> It's just the Macbook (and the Macbook Pro and the Macbook Air)

Just that it isn't. The "(new) MacBook" (without any addition) most recently existed 2015-2019, and I personally found it very confusing, as it was thinner than a MacBook Air and with that breaking the previous expectations that were set up by the product line naming.

Placing all the blame on the naming of the MacBooks is probably overblown, but I feel like the individual lines of MacBooks have had a expectation/consistency problem for 10+ years now and throwing in the "new MacBook" into the mix for some time didn't help it.

Re:I/O 2022 by jl6 on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:25PM (#31346002)
Is there a whole lot of difference between “iPhone 15” and “iPhone (2023)”? Aside from the fact that relegating the version number to parentheses makes it more likely to be omitted and thus more likely to cause confusion for users trying to troubleshoot.

I like the version number being explicit and visible. You know what you’re getting. Pretending versions don’t exist just reminds me of OEMs swapping out components but keeping the same model number, making it impossible to know whether you are buying one built to the original design or to a cheaper design.

Re:I/O 2022 by its_ethan on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @07:51PM (#31347514)
For what it's worth, swapping out material/ updating parts and not changing model numbers already happens a lot in consumer tech. Making changes after launch and initial mass production runs in order to average down cost or fix known issues is a fairly common practice at large hardware companies (Apple/Google/Samsung/Tesla). It's seldom changing the display or battery size or anything immediately customer facing, but there's hundreds of components that each act as a knob for performance and cost that get tweaked over time.
Re:I/O 2022 by bsimpson on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:42PM (#31344790)
I work at Google and I don't always know which phone is which.

It's a phone. It does phone things.

Re:I/O 2022 by The_Colonel on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:28PM (#31346046)
I wish. Pixel 6 (Pro) often has trouble doing "phone things", like making calls or transmitting data.
Re:I/O 2022 by disillusioned on Thursday May 12, 2022 @02:20AM (#31349916)
It's really astonishing to me how deeply bad the radio in the P6Pro is. It's such a huge step back from the Pixel 5, likely owing to them moving off of the Qualcomm radio and on to... Tensor? Some Tensor/Samsung Exynos hybrid? Either way it's misery salad. Drops calls. Can't handle wifi transition. Can't manage low-signal 5G, so just... stops working instead of falling back to LTE properly. Can't handle the UWB transition. Hot as hell when it's actually backing up anything large. Awful all around on that front.
Re:I/O 2022 by AnimalMuppet on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:56PM (#31345670)
And, really, how many more phone things do you need it to do? Will doing more phone things make it noticeably better?
Re:I/O 2022 by MarkSweep on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:10PM (#31345112)
I believe Samsung has started to do this with their Galaxy S series of phones, starting with the S20 in 2020. This years phone is the S22 for 2022.
Re:I/O 2022 by lkxijlewlf on Thursday May 12, 2022 @08:07AM (#31352772)
That numbering makes a lot more sense now.
Re:I/O 2022 by whywhywhywhy on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:42PM (#31344787)
>You would just say you have "an iPhone"

They tried this with the iPad 3 IIRC. Was just "The New iPad" but they then reverted back the next year.

Re:I/O 2022 by wlesieutre on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:59PM (#31344977)
They didn't really go back though, it's iPad (9th generation) instead of iPad 9. Not quite versionless naming like they use for Macs, but it's less versioned than the iPhone naming.
Re:I/O 2022 by saghm on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:00PM (#31344989)
The problem with calling something "The New X" is that you basically can't come out with _another_ model after without making it confusing to differentiate between the "new" one and the "New" one. I think the main reason they felt they could try that is that they new they were not going to come out with any more "generic" iPads and instead have the Pro and Air models like they have for Macbooks.
Re:I/O 2022 by CydeWeys on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:14PM (#31344446)
Fwiw, I gave a much less important I/O presentation than this four years ago and I had to go through endless hours of prep/review/practice. I can't imagine they didn't rehearse it. Maybe they're just not great speakers? I doubt I am either.
Re:I/O 2022 by cogman10 on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:13PM (#31344430)
They've become really disappointing.

When Google IO started it was a nice fun tech presentation with a lot of side classes showing devs how to work with these new google technologies.

Now, it's mostly just google introducing new products to the press.

Re:I/O 2022 by akira_f on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:47PM (#31344828)
For that dev part they have the developer keynote. Google just gave away many online training classes for free, which includes many many hands on coding labs.
Re:I/O 2022 by akomtu on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:09PM (#31345103)
I doubt it's press who is the audience. People behind these projects want to be seen by SVPs and above, so they get those 5 minutes of attention, get their promos and immediately switch teams to chase the next promo.
Re:I/O 2022 by karmakaze on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @09:53PM (#31348313)
Okay so it wasn't just me. The I/O event in the past always had much interesting content. I was surprised to find that not a single one made me even consider reading about it.
Re:I/O 2022 by oofbey on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:01PM (#31345002)
When they introduce new products, do they say "and really we won't abandon this in 2 years" and keep a straight face, or do they just not even bother?
Re:I/O 2022 by pjmlp on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:49PM (#31345575)
They push as if they firmly believe in it and then let it drop, see Project Tango, Sceneform, NDK packages,...
Re:I/O 2022 by simonebrunozzi on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:50PM (#31346325)
I used to be a professional speaker (Amazon, VMware, etc), and presented at more than 600 events. They said I was pretty good. Point is, after years of perfecting my craft, I can instantly spot the difference between a good presenter and a "fake" / bad one.

Most people are bad. Really. Sorry to be blunt, but it is what it is. A bit of training and a bit of rehearsal would go a long way. I am shocked that big events like this one do not try to invest more in preparing the speakers. It wouldn't take much.

Re:I/O 2022 by tsunamifury on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @06:22PM (#31346682)
The audience is also able to detect professional speakers like yourself, with calculated hand movements and inauthentic voice pitch calibration and is equally turned off -- its just that professional speakers so rarely admit that since they make money off saying otherwise. The problem here is just that the topics aren't compelling enough. And you rarely get a good speaker who also knows the topic well so as to be perceived as authentic.

Look at Elon's keynotes, they are TERRIBLE from a public speaking perspective, but excellent content that generally is interesting. Also no one perceives them as inauthentic, just off-hand-ish. It works.

Re:I/O 2022 by simonebrunozzi on Thursday May 12, 2022 @08:02AM (#31352722)
> inauthentic voice pitch

That would be a "wannabe" professional speaker, not an actual one, imho.

Re:I/O 2022 by tsunamifury on Thursday May 12, 2022 @10:16AM (#31354561)
Sure. No true Scotsman and all.

the pros are cheesy as hell.

Re:I/O 2022 by hintymad on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:19PM (#31344506)
It's probably because the new products are really incremental improvements over some niche. There's nothing wrong with that either. I don't expect that a company would churn out groundbreaking products year over year -- I certainly wish so, though, as it means new problems to tackle, more meaningful projects to work on, and more demand of engineers in the industry.
Re:I/O 2022 by natly on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:18PM (#31344495)
I think tech in general is kinda stagnating at this point. We've plucked all the low hanging fruit, to get new revolutionary things will be much more slow going from here.
Re:I/O 2022 by lkxijlewlf on Thursday May 12, 2022 @08:11AM (#31352828)
I think that's fine. Let's slow down and catch our breath.
Re:I/O 2022 by jonas21 on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:40PM (#31345470)
Yeah, 90% of it was boring, but the Immersive View in Google Maps looks pretty cool:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qfp8TAg9tg

Re:I/O 2022 by dudus on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:14PM (#31345874)
Yo me it just seems like everyone is following a playbook for presentations based on some bullshit science and pairing that with the best Steve Jobs impersonation you can.
Re:I/O 2022 by pjmlp on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:45PM (#31345542)
Same here, I used to care, but since Google has never seriously pushed for updates (Treble doesn't require OEMs to actually care to update), gave up on keeping Java support up to date, I lost interest.

As long as Chrome and the NDK stay around, I am good and don't care anymore whatever version I can only use 5 years from now with already deprecated APIs.

Re:I/O 2022 by azangru on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:06PM (#31345064)
> And honestly the three presenters I saw didn't even seem like they rehearsed at all. They just read from the prompter and tried to put excitement in their voice at the same time and it just fell flat.

Yes. I haven't yet watched talks from this IO, but it was exactly my impression from last year's IO and Chrome Dev Summit. There are some speakers, mostly dev rels, who clearly love speaking and are great at it; but most of the speakers were just woodenly reading from the screen. As if they are unaware that written language is different from spoken language, and it takes rare skills to write a speech and then read it back to the audience in such a way that would sound natural and engaging.

Re:I/O 2022 by dbbk on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @07:09PM (#31347158)
I've watched a lot of tech presentations and though I don't care for their products, Panos Panay when he talks about Surface stuff is the gold standard. That guy just exudes charisma and you can tell that he's genuinely passionate about it.
Re:I/O 2022 by rvz on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:26PM (#31344601)
Yes. It is always about what they don't tell you in these keynotes that is more interesting rather than what they are already announcing on stage.

The only exception is the last announcement which is them trying to re-enter the race for AR/XR glasses which again some thought they gave up.

This acquisition is the reason why they are trying again: [0]

[0] https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/30/google-acquires-north-augmen...

Re:I/O 2022 by reaperducer on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:44PM (#31346247)
AR/XR glasses

Is "XR" a typo for VR, or is there another new R that I should learn about?

Re:I/O 2022 by easrng on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @06:54PM (#31347010)
XR = catchall for VR and AR
Re:I/O 2022 by systemvoltage on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:18PM (#31344494)
I miss Steve Jobs era of keynotes. All keynotes are just so dull today.

What went wrong?

Re:I/O 2022 by izzydata on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:36PM (#31344708)
Technology was advancing more rapidly so there were actually new and exciting things to show you. We seem to be hitting diminishing returns and most of the low hanging fruit and almost all the high hanging fruit problems that we have in our day to day lives have been solved that can be solved with a computer.

Now since they have run out of problems to solve they are inventing problems so they can solve them.

Re:I/O 2022 by reaperducer on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:48PM (#31345565)
most of the low hanging fruit and almost all the high hanging fruit problems that we have in our day to day lives have been solved that can be solved with a computer.

I don't watch the Google presentations, but I'm an avid consumer of Apple's.

That said, even I'm disappointed with the state of technology today. There's still plenty of fruit to be harvested at all levels.

But all I ever see from Apple and Google is variations on "How do I get together with a bunch of people I already know for Thai food in an area that I can walk to?" Or "How do I get through my morning, which is completely predictable and never varies in even the slightest way from one day to the next?"

Here's a softball for both of them:

Using their maps app, allow me to choose a starting point, a destination, and a departure time. Then show me all of the coffee shops within x distance of that route that will still be open for one hour when I pass that location.

Re:I/O 2022 by akomtu on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:18PM (#31345195)
Robotics is the obvious high hanging fruit: autonomous lawn movers and such. But nothing is going to happen when the best minds work on reshuffling some UI that's better be left alone.
Re:I/O 2022 by fumar on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:21PM (#31345954)
Should we look to biotech and robotics? I would love to live a life where my genetics don’t hinder everyday living or outsource labor like laundry to machines.
Re:I/O 2022 by kadoban on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:21PM (#31344536)
They're a bit low on charismatic bullshitters right now, and the tech got better enough that gains are small.
Re:I/O 2022 by CydeWeys on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:08PM (#31345085)
This is a mature industry; each company simply doesn't have a lot of new groundbreaking stuff to announce every year. It's iterative.

And a lot of the seemingly groundbreaking announcements then don't go on to pan out either (I'm thinking of Magic Leap here). If you don't care about realism/follow-through, then you have very exciting announcements; just don't expect anything announced to ever pan out.

Re:I/O 2022 by vincentmarle on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:00PM (#31344993)
Surely you've missed out on the "biggest change to Airbnb in a decade": https://twitter.com/bchesky/status/1524372742048718848

(Spoiler alert: it's not)

Re:I/O 2022 by sidibe on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:23PM (#31344570)
If you like to gush over exciting announcements there's still Musk. Unfortunately it's been many years since his company actually built anything he announces
Re:I/O 2022 by staunch on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:28PM (#31344622)
It's not merely "gushing" to be excited about new technology breakthroughs. And Musk, through his companies, is actively delivering today on Starlink, Tesla, Dragon, and Starship to name a few big ones. This meme that he's "all talk" is easily disproved for any honest observer.
Re:I/O 2022 by ben_w on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:14PM (#31345158)
Yes, although: while the Starship project is incredibly impressive, it can’t really be said to have delivered until it’s actually reached orbit.

Until then, it’s like the stuff Boeing, Lockheed, ULA etc. have spent even longer developing and have also not reached orbit with.

Re:I/O 2022 by webmaven on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:34PM (#31346128)
> Yes, although: while the Starship project is incredibly impressive, it can’t really be said to have delivered until it’s actually reached orbit.

True, but it isn't as if SpaceX doesn't have a track record for hiring some pretty ambitious targets with their progression of Falcon 1 →Falcon 9 →Falcon Heavy. Admittedly, Starship's planned use of the new Raptor engines seems risky, but the DOD did fund a prototype-and-test contract that presumably concluded successfully a few years ago. While the results of those tests aren't public, there have been no leaks to the contrary, at any rate, and no changes in the planned use of Raptor have been announced (and SpaceX hasn't generally been at all shy about announcing changes to their plans).

I think it's a pretty safe bet right now that Starship will launch and that they will get it working reliably, and that they will have to blow up a few along the way to make those things happen.

Re:I/O 2022 by staunch on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:07PM (#31345785)
The claim was that Musk's companies haven't "built" anything. Versions of Starship have clearly been built and launched, even if the project is still in development. It's a very real project and anyone can watch its developmental progress live: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhJRzQsLZGg

I doubt you or anyone else would bet significant money that Starship won't reach orbit. If so, I'd be happy to accept.

For the record, I don't think you can point to any project even remotely equivalent in terms of capability or progress from Boeing, Lockheed, or ULA. I'd be happy if they were doing nearly as well as SpaceX.

My other examples: Starlink, Tesla, and Dragon have clearly been "built" and shipped. Starlink is the hands of consumers, is actively helping Ukraine for military and humanitarian purposes, Tesla has shipped millions of vehicles, and Dragon Crew had another successful rendezvous with ISS days ago.

I could spend a lot more time providing examples but consider these to be more than sufficient to disprove the claim that Elon Musk's companies haven't "actually built anything he announces" in "years".

Re:I/O 2022 by systemvoltage on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:26PM (#31344602)
I don’t like to gush over any leader and stop stuffing words in my mouth. I’m stating the “era” (2000-2010) keynotes were super fun, original and exciting. W̶h̶a̶t̶’̶s̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶ ̶s̶o̶ ̶m̶u̶c̶h̶ ̶h̶o̶s̶t̶i̶l̶i̶t̶y̶? (You've edited your comment, thanks).
Re:I/O 2022 by staunch on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:30PM (#31344653)
> What’s with so much hostility?

There's a popular and cynical meme that people like Steve Jobs and Elon Musk are just marketing bullshitters that don't actually do anything useful. It's laughably false and easily disproved. And yet it seems to comfort cynical/pessimistic/unhappy/ignorant people, of which many exist, and so it prevails.

Re:I/O 2022 by Hasu on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:03PM (#31345030)
"There's a popular and cynical meme" is another way of phrasing, "There are people who evaluate these people's contributions differently than I do"

> It's laughably false and easily disproved.

Then disprove it, instead of relying on an ad hominem assumption of what's going on inside someone else's brain. As it stands all you've done is claim that a criticism exists and that the people who state that criticism have moral failings, which does not make them wrong.

Re:I/O 2022 by staunch on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @04:59PM (#31345695)
> "There are people who evaluate these people's contributions differently than I do"

That would presume we're talking about people with approximately equivalent knowledge that simply come to different, but reasonable, conclusions.

But this is not the case. What I see in this meme is people betraying their ignorance and motivated reasoning at every turn. There's nothing knowledgeable or reasonable about their assertions. It's always highly vitriolic and dismissive toxicity. It's not that they're simply mistaken about certain facts, and can be corrected, it's that they're transparently ignorant and/or acting in bad faith.

For example, it's extremely uncommon, maybe even unheard of, for someone with a deep knowledge of technology history to agree with these kinds of dismissals of Steve Jobs or Elon Musk. I've never seen someone able to discuss the topic at a high level that won't readily acknowledge their contributions, even if they can be very critical of them in certain ways. As one example among many: historian and professor Walter Isaacson wrote well respected books about Benjamin Franklin, Albert Einstein, and Steve Jobs. He is currently writing one about Elon Musk.

Re:I/O 2022 by Hasu on Thursday May 12, 2022 @06:39PM (#31360949)
So you don't have proof, just more ad hominem and appeals to authority.
Re:I/O 2022 by staunch on Friday May 13, 2022 @11:07AM (#31368618)
I did reply in a sibling thread to a similar comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31345710

But c'mon. You're really just playing dumb. We all know what SpaceX/Tesla and Apple have done, and (I think) we all know the role Musk and Jobs played in their success. And the reason we all know these things is precisely because of how important what they've done is. It's self-evident.

So, it seems pretty reasonable to assume that you're not acting in good faith. And that's why I answered indirectly.

But, okay, what "proof" would you find convincing?

Re:I/O 2022 by SemanticStrengh on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:58PM (#31344965)
OK I challenge you to try to engage and bring constructive evidence then. Give a summary of what steve jobs and musk have done to improve the human condition/world.

While Apple has achieved some moderately useful advances you have to divide the amount of progress given by the amount of money captured. Apple has an almost negligible ratio in that regard. Musk has achieved even less.

Re:I/O 2022 by staunch on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @05:01PM (#31345710)
> OK I challenge you to try to engage and bring constructive evidence then

What kind of evidence would convince you? Wikipedia has summaries. Of course, they necessarily lack the context required to deeply understand the topic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs#Innovations_and_des...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elon_Musk#Business_career

> Apple has an almost negligible ratio in that regard. Musk has achieved even less.

I challenge you to give evidence for these assertions. I would be convinced if you explained how you came to this conclusion and explained how you calculated the terms of this ratio.

Re:I/O 2022 by SemanticStrengh on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @06:07PM (#31346501)
Thanks for engaging, I will try to write an answer when I get the motivation
Re:I/O 2022 by systemvoltage on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @03:53PM (#31344906)
Hmm, weird, I find Steve Jobs and Musk truly inspiring.
Re:I/O 2022 by TheRealNGenius on Wednesday May 11, 2022 @11:40PM (#31349024)
Nice to know you find this guy "truly inspiring"

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1517707521343082496?ref_...

Re:I/O 2022 by systemvoltage on Thursday May 12, 2022 @12:55AM (#31349447)
I thought that was pretty hilarious.
Re:I/O 2022 by otterley on Thursday May 12, 2022 @09:52AM (#31354179)
OK, but is that the kind of character you think people should look up to and be inspired by? He’s not a professional comedian; he’s a billionaire businessman with a tremendous amount of power to inspire people to do things. Do we want people to be inspired to do great things or terrible things?

With great power comes great responsibility.

Re:I/O 2022 by systemvoltage on Thursday May 12, 2022 @01:53PM (#31357643)
He is far more inspiring than the rest of business leaders.

I find him genuine, funny, atypical and giving a hard time to people that want him to conform.

Progressives hate him. I’ve never seen any logic behind it. It is just that Elon doesn’t share their vision of scarcity driven, alarmist, stagnant, crime ridden, woke, depopulating, unionized and equal-outcomes based society.

The entire progressive platform has been hijacked, not the Obama era left-wing. Obama was pro-Elon Musk and privatization of Space industry.

IMO there are no leaders that inspire more than Elon and late Steve Jobs.

So here… I laid out the entire problem in plain words why people hate Elon. 100% political.

Re:I/O 2022 by otterley on Thursday May 12, 2022 @01:58PM (#31357717)
You didn't really answer my question at all - you just went off on some side commentary about why you think people dislike him.
Re:I/O 2022 by systemvoltage on Thursday May 12, 2022 @02:53PM (#31358587)
How so? I addressed exactly the points you raised.

Provided you with reasons why I find him inspiring and others don’t.

Re:I/O 2022 by otterley on Thursday May 12, 2022 @03:26PM (#31359095)
Those aren’t the points I raised at all. I was curious to know how you believe a person with tremendous wealth and power should comport him/herself, and whether Elon Musk's behavior is consistent with that.