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Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by mimsee on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:19AM (#27939425)
So in essence this is for the people who are in denial, right? Toggling the button doesn't effect what or how Google collects your data, only that you can't see it. "Yes I use Google, let Google collect my info, but under no circumstance do I want to see that info." Like what?

If you don't want Google scanning your emails, don't use Gmail. Don't want Google seeing all your queries, don't send them to Google in the first place. Use Duckduckgo or some other service.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by saurik on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:23AM (#27939436)
I would have guessed this is for people who want to do a "neutral" search query without it being affected by where you are located or your past searches; I am not sure why you would jump to privacy? I guess the options feel a bit like privacy options, looking at it more carefully... but I would still see wanting to turn this off just to avoid ending up in situations where your history pollutes your screen (such as in demos).
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by mimsee on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:40AM (#27939501)
I'm talking about privacy because it's easy for people to not realise that this is not a privacy setting. I don't know if disabling the personal results toggle even puts you in to a "neutral" mode of Google since it clearly states at the bottom that:

"Some Search results may require additional settings, like Web & App Activity or Location History".

Reading more about Web & Web app activity explains it as follows:

"If Web & App Activity is turned on, your searches and activity from other Google services are saved in your Google Account, so you may get more personalized experiences, like faster searches and more helpful app and content recommendations."[1]

[1]: https://support.google.com/websearch/answer/54068?hl=en

Edit: reworded from personalized results to personal results

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by mattowen_uk on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:53AM (#27939543)
I have everything that Google allows me to turn off, turned off. And I rarely search (via Google) when logged in with my Google account, and I still see filtered/tailored results based on my IP location and my interests. I also run uBlock Origin, and Cookie AutoDelete, so Google are going to great lengths here to keep on tracking me.

It's now at a stage where if you don't want to be tracked, you should just stop using the Internet.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Wowfunhappy on Saturday July 24, 2021 @08:50AM (#27940486)
Ironically, the problem may be that you're logged out of your Google account. The privacy settings are saved to your account.

I, like you, have turned everything off. I use Startpage for search, but on Youtube, I find I still get personalized recommendations if and only if I accidentally log out. If I'm logged in, I get a depersonalized Youtube page.

(Yes this is problematic and I'm not suggesting anything, just explaining.)

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by frosted-flakes on Saturday July 24, 2021 @11:36AM (#27941796)
I have YouTube search and watch history turned off. Yet if I watch a video that someone sent me a link to, I will still get that exact video or others related to it in my recommendations afterwards. Normally, only videos that I explicitly save (by upvoting or subscribing to a channel) should alter my recommendations, but clearly Google is still saving something.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Wowfunhappy on Saturday July 24, 2021 @12:08PM (#27942049)
Huh. Since it sounds like you do vote on videos and subscribe to channels, is it possible Google is actually just making (correct) predictions based on that?

I'm just surprised because it really does work for me. But, I make a point of never voting/subscribing/commenting/queuing/etc. And the difference between when I'm logged out and logged in is very stark.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by frosted-flakes on Saturday July 24, 2021 @12:18PM (#27942149)
The videos I'm thinking of that someone sent to me are way outside of what I would normally watch, so seeing that exact video in recommendations and other videos from the same channel immediately afterwards on the home page can't be a coincidence. But most of the time what I watch doesn't affect recommendations, only the odd time.

In addition to curating what I want to see with upvotes/subscriptions, I also use the "Not interested" and "Don't recommend channel" buttons heavily. For some reason YouTube always recommends those stupid "meditation music" videos, even though I have never watched one and I always block those channels. Honestly, YouTube's recommendation engine is shite; even when I tell them exactly what I like, it still recommends absolute tripe, and most of what I discover comes from external (personal) recommendations.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by chupasaurus on Saturday July 24, 2021 @04:18PM (#27944114)
I think they cache everything which was recommended for some time, haven't tested the exact period.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Beaver117 on Saturday July 24, 2021 @01:48PM (#27942983)
Actually, YouTube tracks your likes/dislikes data in a different way and it needs some obscure method to disable the privacy option. I don't remember the link though
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by frosted-flakes on Saturday July 24, 2021 @02:59PM (#27943554)
What do you mean? I want Google to remember my ↑likes and subscriptions, so they can give me recommendations that actually reflect my preferences. I just don't want them to track which videos I watch or search for.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Beaver117 on Saturday July 24, 2021 @03:26PM (#27943734)
You can pause those in the settings under watch and search history. My problem is after I like a video or two, YouTube starts recommending me the same video over and over again. Or very similar videos. I'd rather have just a clean-slate experience.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by frosted-flakes on Saturday July 24, 2021 @03:29PM (#27943759)
I have turned off search amd watch history; see my previous comments.

If it starts recommending the same videos to me I press the Not Interestes button.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by sen on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:52AM (#27939796)
I block all Google and Facebook domains at a router level, and haven’t really had many issues. I’m sure there’s sites that don’t work with those blocked but for whatever reason they’re not sites I visit. I get cloud flare captchas occasionally but barely enough to be annoying.

I also use a VPN 95% of the time, only turning it off for Netflix occasionally.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by tgragnato on Saturday July 24, 2021 @07:11AM (#27939878)
It is the most practical solution to make sure there are no leaks to G.

The most annoying thing is that reCAPTCHA stop working: more website administrator should consider migrating to hCaptcha.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by marricks on Saturday July 24, 2021 @09:59AM (#27940995)
I have an iPhone and don’t use the Gmail app. For a year or two I got a pathetic email from google saying “email is better with the gmail app!” Pretty sure google was sad I don’t have any of their apps on my phone

Point of the story is saying they already won in getting all your data is really what let’s them win.

If you use a VPN, which are getting more common, and stay away from using too many Google/Facebook products you’ll do pretty well.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by hdjjhhvvhga on Saturday July 24, 2021 @07:00AM (#27939831)
No, it's enough to turn off Javascript. Virtually all tracking code is in Javascript.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by zbentley on Saturday July 24, 2021 @12:26PM (#27942237)
Absolutely not.

GP was concerned about:

> filtered/tailored results based on my IP location and my interests

IP location is typically computed server side, based on the originating IP of requests. Your interests are recorded server side, based on what requests were made.

"Tracking" in JavaScript is a big problem, and disabling JS does help prevent third party tools from knowing about you, but the discussion here is about first-party tracking: tracking being by Google, whose site you're using.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by sillysaurusx on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:00AM (#27939588)
I think it's silly that people feel this is related to privacy. No, no one is under any illusion that this reduces google's knowledge of you. But rah rah, bang the privacy drum! Privacy is the only possible reason! The dummies need to be informed that google and privacy don't get along!

Bah, I'm getting cranky tonight. I'll log off. Good luck with the privacy fight. I mean that genuinely; I don't think anyone really cares, beyond posting a few comments on message boards. Duckduckgo is a nice alternative, but how many programmers actually use it to find answers to programming questions? And even if a few do, I really don't get what the privacy crap is all about here.

Google added a feature that we can use to do neutral searches. That's awesome, and they deserve praise for it. But nooooo, the privacy is the ultimate altar.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by the_other on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:25AM (#27939688)
> Duckduckgo is a nice alternative, but how many programmers actually use it to find answers to programming questions?

At least one. I’ve been using DDG exclusively for two or three years now. If I’m really stuck, I go straight to StackOverflow.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Gabrys1 on Saturday July 24, 2021 @09:14AM (#27940667)
Same here. Whenever the results (software related or not) are bad, I try Google search instead, but I can't remember the last time the results from Google were any better (ergo, there's no point in using Google search for me anymore)
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by larusso on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:40AM (#27939743)
Also count me in. I switched 4 or 5 years ago and never had much issues finding answers to my programming questions.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by duncan-donuts on Saturday July 24, 2021 @11:25AM (#27941712)
Yeah this is a tired argument from the early days of ddg. Back in the day it was really bad for programming but these days it’s on par with Google at worst and usually better. I’ve used ddg almost exclusively since 2012/2013.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by erdo on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:00PM (#27944809)
Yep same, maybe 4 years just using ddg. About once or twice a year I'll try a Google search if I'm really getting nowhere (sometimes helps, sometimes doesn't)
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by feanaro on Saturday July 24, 2021 @09:00AM (#27940552)
Your comment is kind of boring in its dismissiveness, but you acknowledged you're getting cranky so I'll take that as the explanation. In any case, there are those that care (I'm one of them) and we would appreciate if you could refrain from cheap dismissals.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by sillysaurusx on Saturday July 24, 2021 @11:13AM (#27941600)
Yeah! I just needed some sleep. I'll try to be a little more self aware in the future.

Nonetheless, the thrust of it is something I feel at my core; "Google did a good thing" here, but "you won't acknowledge any good thing." Personally, I find that lame, especially with privacy arguments that seem very much like strawmen.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by feanaro on Tuesday July 27, 2021 @05:11AM (#27970289)
I really appreciate your response. :)

And yes, I agree good things should be acknowledged regardless of where they are coming from. I think people are generally just jaded with Google because they want something that Google will never be able to offer (that is, to be respectful of their privacy), so they lash out automatically out of frustration.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by NateEag on Saturday July 24, 2021 @08:32AM (#27940351)
I've been using DDG primarily for about two years now.

It mostly works well enough.

Since I use Vimium, when it doesn't, redoing the search on Google is just a few keystrokes:

gi<Control-a>!g Enter

That's 'gi' for 'focus text input', Control-a for beginning of line, add the DDG "google this" shortcut, press return.

It's in my spinal cord, and I don't need it that often anyway.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by tidbeck on Saturday July 24, 2021 @11:05AM (#27941532)
Vimium (for Firefox at least) supports custom search engines so you can do:

og<space> my-search<enter>

'o' for open and 'g<space>' to select Google as search engine.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by NateEag on Sunday July 25, 2021 @09:10AM (#27948923)
Oh, thanks! I hadn't realized that was an option.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by JasonFruit on Saturday July 24, 2021 @09:07AM (#27940605)
For the last few years, DDG has been good enough for coding questions and for general use. In fact, it's been better for general use than Google for a while now.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by np_tedious on Saturday July 24, 2021 @10:06AM (#27941043)
I could see wanting this as a toggle on a particular search more than an account-wide setting
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by jonnycomputer on Saturday July 24, 2021 @02:09PM (#27943148)
This.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by qwertox on Saturday July 24, 2021 @07:22AM (#27939928)
This can be better archived by using a second, clean browser profile.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by tirpen on Saturday July 24, 2021 @09:15AM (#27940671)
There's no way it's easier to use a second browser profile every time you want to search and get useable results than just toggling this toggle once.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by peakaboo on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:26AM (#27939446)
Google records where you are and stores your every search result, and you are not sure how it relates to privacy.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by austhrow743 on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:31AM (#27939467)
Clearly they mean how this setting relates to privacy.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by peakaboo on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:37AM (#27939492)
You are correct of course. I'm just really tired of seeing Google act like we have options when it comes to privacy.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by listmaking on Saturday July 24, 2021 @09:27AM (#27940776)
Those are different settings:

- the settings for what data about your Google activity is retained are at https://myaccount.google.com/data-and-personalization — in particular, "Web & App Activity" at https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity (for new accounts, it defaults to all activity being deleted after 18 months).

- the setting for whether your Google activity is used for ad targeting is at https://adssettings.google.com (the checkbox under "Advanced", if you're signed in).

- For non-Google activity, the setting for turning off Google ad cookies on random ad-carrying websites is to block third-party cookies in your browser. For Chrome, it is at chrome://settings/cookies

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Wowfunhappy on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:29AM (#27939456)
I don’t particularly care if Google tracks me, but I don’t want to be put in a filter bubble!
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by mimsee on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:33AM (#27939478)
Does disabling this setting put you in a "neutral" mode of Google or just hide the [Your flight to AMS] boxes it grabs from your Gmail?
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by yosito on Saturday July 24, 2021 @08:40AM (#27940407)
Considering that Google tracks you because you are the product they are selling, or rather, one sheep in the flock they are selling, removing the filter bubble from your search results seems like just a small, superficial fraction of the bubble Google has you in.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by anchpop on Saturday July 24, 2021 @08:44AM (#27940438)
For me, I may be the product Google is selling, but they convince me to use Search anyway because it’s much better than the competition (yes I’ve tried DDG). And I can’t see any way that being tracked negatively affects my life, so it’s a trade I’m happy to make
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Wowfunhappy on Saturday July 24, 2021 @08:45AM (#27940440)
I wrote more here about why personalized results and recommendations really bother me: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27668373

But if Google has the information and doesn't do anything with it... I guess I just don't care? Why should I care? I'm open to being convinced on this.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by ptero on Saturday July 24, 2021 @09:02AM (#27940566)
Google doesn't do anything with your information for this particular search shown to you. It can still be used to skew your other interactions with Google, it's partners and anyone else with whom Google decides to share the data it has on you.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by missedthecue on Saturday July 24, 2021 @02:08PM (#27943141)
Google is renting my eyeballs by paying me with a great search engine. What's the actual harm in that.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by blueflow on Saturday July 24, 2021 @07:48AM (#27940095)
I need such an feature because google always seems to prefer the information that i already know. Sometimes i'm looking for websites i don't know yet because the information is rare...

Sucks that it needs an Google Account (which is no option for me), but i can have a similar effect by using duckduckgo.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by PetahNZ on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:27AM (#27939450)
If only DDG was any good at local results.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by mda on Saturday July 24, 2021 @10:07AM (#27941052)
Well, maybe Bing team is reading the complaints and improve stuff a little for ddg users.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by mimsee on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:30AM (#27939459)
Yeah, I guess. I wonder if there was a private way for DDG to implement that.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by ForHackernews on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:40AM (#27939748)
It works pretty well for me to just include <name of town> in my search query if I want local results.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by AlotOfReading on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:57AM (#27939818)
That fails without personalization. Take the example of Dublin. My IP is in Europe, but DDG returns a bunch of results about Dublin, Ohio when I look for "Dublin McDonald's" before eventually linking McDonald's Ireland. Imagine how bad it'd be in Dublin or Pittsburgh, CA or worse, large cities that share a name like San Jose or Ontario.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by boomboomsubban on Saturday July 24, 2021 @07:35AM (#27940008)
Try "Dublin ie McDonald's".
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by AlotOfReading on Saturday July 24, 2021 @08:04AM (#27940184)
That still doesn't resolve the ambiguity of Ontario, which is in both California (CA) and Canada (CA). Moreover, the search is getting a bit unwieldy.

The point wasn't to illustrate that there's no way to produce the information without personalization, it's to illustrate that search queries can become much more relevant and straightforward with it in particular, common scenarios.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by boomboomsubban on Saturday July 24, 2021 @08:39AM (#27940397)
>That still doesn't resolve the ambiguity of Ontario, which is in both California (CA) and Canada (CA). Moreover, the search is getting a bit unwieldy

"ON" or "CAN." And adding 2-4 letters is hardly unwieldy.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by DrLindemann on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:16AM (#27939660)
This are indeed separate effects of surveillance. For most people surveillance does not affect them, if they are not consciously aware of it all the time. They might know it, or remember it, from time to time. But they fade it out.

It is like the backrest of your chair. You just recognize it, if you focus on it. Most of the time, you don't. So the question is, do you sense it all the time, just not being aware of it?

But after all, just because Google will not turn the collected data against you at the moment, it does not mean, they won't in the future. Or some of their contractors. Or some third party instrumenting google. Or some regulator ...

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by jackson1442 on Saturday July 24, 2021 @06:15PM (#27944883)
I know Google will occasionally bring literal personal information into your search results- for example if I search "directions home" it will show my home address in the search results. If you're frequently using Search in a location where you don't want these things to appear on your screen, I can definitely see it being useful. I know it's brought up contact information and random crap from emails up in Search before for me.
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by spansoa on Saturday July 24, 2021 @10:58AM (#27941467)
> Use Duckduckgo or some other service

DDG is not a silver bullet. I use it, but only when combining it with a VPN or sometimes Tor for ultra private searches. DDG is a US company and the US doesn't have a good track record for spying and human rights. DDG's servers are all Amazon based too meaning the data is probably tapped and being spied upon. There's no way of knowing, so combine DDG with an anonymous proxy if you can.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by brundolf on Saturday July 24, 2021 @12:28PM (#27942255)
On top of that: personalized search is the only thing I miss from when I used Google services. It's the only case I can point to where data collection actually benefitted the product in some small way. If I'm going to give them my data anyway, there's no way I'm turning that off.

I think most likely this is a sham "privacy" feature that Google is shipping solely for PR reasons

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by sharikone on Saturday July 24, 2021 @07:34AM (#27939999)
It can be also for people who plan on occasionally sharing their PC. It could be a bit embarrassing to let your friend/family member fo a search and get tailored results
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by Lio on Saturday July 24, 2021 @05:56AM (#27939563)
Haha yeah, this is me and I am indeed ridiculous. :D

I try my hardest not to use Google products because I don't like tracking. Occasionally though I'm forced to use things like YouTube as it's the only source for certain information.

I turn off the personalised ads not because I think it stops them tracking me but because of the vague hope that if I still see the ads and they don't need to be personalised then just maybe Google would see the subservience as an unnecessary overhead.

...which is still just wishful thinking on my part.

For the record I would happily accept personalised adverts based on context if they would just packing in the forced tracking.

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by amelius on Saturday July 24, 2021 @04:29PM (#27944206)
Maybe these people don't want others to see their search history when they look over their shoulders?
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by froh on Saturday July 24, 2021 @02:00PM (#27943066)
google doesn't "scan emails for ads", since ca 2017.

https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6603?hl=en

duckduckgo is powered by bing search, no?

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by valleyjo on Saturday July 24, 2021 @11:08AM (#27941553)
If you pay for google workspace do they still scan your emails?
Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by froh on Saturday July 24, 2021 @02:01PM (#27943083)
they don't scan your emails for ads.

https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6603?hl=en

Re:Choose whether Search can show you personal results based... by mrAnon218 on Saturday July 24, 2021 @11:01AM (#27941495)
Honestly DDG is not much better than google, hosted in Amazon and got caught selling data from their users, in the matter of search engines we're pm screwed, the ones that are really private like YacY, SearX and MetaGer don't provide results as good as google simply because they don't track the user.

About not using Google, well they're even crawling data from Telegram Groups, they're everywhere pretty hard to escape.