In the UK we're protected on two levels: firstly the "Distance Selling Regulation" means we have the right to cancel many contracts/purchases made not-in-person within 14 days of delivery.

And secondly, if a good is faulty, not as described, or unfit for purpose then we have a right to a refund under those terms also.

Probably because of these already strong rights, Amazon UK (and most retailers) go beyond that and simply offer a 30 day "no questions asked" return policy in most cases.

I didn't realise until now how much I took it for granted!

First of all, the Consumer Contracts Directive replaced that in 2014, no?

Second, how exactly would this have protected the buyer? Maybe no restocking fee and only difference between free and basic shipping? In EU, does seller HAVE to pay for return shipping?

Third, you know that "protection" isn't free, right? You're paying for that in terms of higher prices and lost economic opportunities.

Finally, the pro-EU, anti-US condescension laced with pity is so tiresome and ignorant. We get it, things work differently there. Some are better, some worse. It's hardly paradise.

(For the record, I've lived in the US and the EU.)

Buying from an independent seller on Amazon is similar to buying on eBay. You're taking the risk of not having the customer service that large corporations can afford.

Plus, Amazon customer support will often help out with claims where the seller is in the wrong (e.g. item does not match description).

No, that would be rather dull. But in terms of returning stuff you bought on the Internet, it pretty much is: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Rights_Directive_20...

"The current varying lengths of the withdrawal periods both between the Member States and for distance and off-premises contracts cause legal uncertainty and compliance costs. The same withdrawal period should apply to all distance and off-premises contracts. In the case of service contracts, the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the conclusion of the contract. In the case of sales contracts, the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the day on which the consumer or a third party other than the carrier and indicated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods."

Never had a problem returning anything ordered online. Ok one should nonetheless read the terms before ordering.

I'm glad Amazon changed their policy.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=...

Still shop at Amazon, but I definitely think more before buying bigger ticket items and I comparison shop now. Even though this policy change is great, I don't feel that I can revert back to my previous behavior of just mindlessly buying stuff at Amazon because of faith that they'll take care of you.

I am still especially wary of buying from 3rd parties on Amazon unless it's a throwaway item, and we refuse to buy anything that isn't Prime.

> Your request meets one of our A-to-z Guarantee conditions below: [...] You want to return an item internationally and the Seller does not (1) provide a return address within the UK, (2) provide a pre-paid return label, or (3) offer a full refund without requesting the item be returned.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeI...

A lot of sellers will try to strong-arm you but if you just do the chargeback/claim they have no option but to eat the loss. Creditcard companies and PayPal thankfully nearly always back buyers, tilting the power balance back to the consumers' side :)

Do you really think "I bought something sight unseen and now I don't like it, waah" gets you special snowflake protection? There is no hint that the item is faulty or not as described.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/pdfs/ukpga_20150...

"I bought something sight unseen and now I don't like it, waah" will indeed entitle you to a full refund within 14 days under most circumstances.

I'd rather purchase stuff without being able to return it than pay a price that includes my statistical risk of returning things.

> And secondly, if a good is faulty, not as described, or unfit for purpose then we have a right to a refund under those terms also.

None of this applies here, OP simply wasn't happy with their purchase. Does it really make sense for the seller to have to pay out of pocket for round-trip shipping on a heavy iron pan because OP didn't bother reading the listing or looking at the pictures?

I didn't realize how great that was compared to the UK!

30 minimum required by law. Not maximum.

REI is unusually customer-friendly, because it's a consuner cooperative. Most US stores do not offer anything like a year no-questions-asked return policy (30 days, many-questions-asked is more typical.)

Whether the UK will keep those protections is something we'll see.

In your view, how much should you have paid for shipping for an item that you didn't want? Nothing?

Should the seller be responsible for shipping the item both ways?

There is already very little margin in selling commodity goods, especially when you consider Amazon takes 15% of gross value as a fee. Shipping in many cases changes the order from profitable to money-losing. If you try and price it in, you can't compete on cost which begs the question of why bother selling on Amazon in the first place.

The crux of the issue is this, though: Amazon doesn't give a shit about 3rd party sellers, nor can the 3rd party sellers provide the same level of customer service as Amazon can, mostly due to economies of scale. The whole 3rd party seller program is a testbed for Amazon, a research program to see how they operate and how Amazon can do it better and as soon as they realize how - the 3rd party sellers either get priced out by a race to the bottom with Amazon itself (they go directly to suppliers and cut everyone out) or by policies like these, which are ripe for abuse or eat further into seller margins to the point of operating at break-even or slightly in the red.

As a last note: Whenever I buy on Amazon, I buy Prime. The incentives of customers and 3rd party sellers are incompatible. If I were a customer for the goods that we are selling, I would never buy from our company.

Instead, I'll either avoid the independent sellers, or just to to Sur le Table. So how do these sellers win?

It's more of a platform to see what works and what doesn't, at the expense of small businesses who wanted to sell on Amazon. At least that's my perspective. A 3-5% margin may be fine when you run a 100B business, have economies of scale and a world-class brand, but the same will spell disaster for a small business.

There are also a lot of dishonest 3rd party sellers who come and go like a swarm of locusts. Maybe they "win" in the short run by selling counterfeit goods and not honoring Amazon policies, but in the end they will lose also when Amazon bans non-prime fulfillment of orders (that day is coming sooner rather than later, my guess is before 2020)

The majority of 3rd party sellers by volume own their own websites outside of Amazon. The ones you described are tiny mom&pop stores that come and go by the thousand every year.

These sorts of shipping policies used to be the norm, until Amazon realized that people value free shipping more than an equivalent discount.

You would buy a ring (looks like a real diamond!), and when it arrived you realize "hey, this is just cheap costume jewelry" and send it back. They'd happily refund the price and express hopes you'd be happier with future items.

And they didn't care about the return, because they were charging you $8 (or whatever) for non-refundable shipping and only paying the shipper $1.20. So in the end they made $6.80 for selling you nothing.

I did this recently with an item I ordered. I paid extra for the non-prime eligible 2nd day shipping. It didn't arrive until after 6 days. I filed a claim, and without having to wait for the claim process, Amazon immediately gave me the option to close the claim and receive a gift card for the amount I paid without returning the item.

If Amazon's purchasing experience was smoother, I'd be doing less paranoid research ahead of time, looking up the company, trying to figure out if the reviews are fake. If only Amazon could shape up how much buyer's disadvantage I'm experiencing on their store, I'd be buying more often and more confidently, especially from anything other than popularly reviewed items.

Amazon needs to shape up their game because, yes, ordering online is convenient, but you can shop online at Walmart AND get the offline return assurance. And most stores price match Amazon now.

But that's my own subjective feeling, and I imagine others put their range higher or lower based on factors like distance to UPS store or Amazon locker, or how much they logistically have on their plate.

I read carefully, and did not see anything to suggest the item was not as advertised. I saw someone complain that they did not like various aspects. Absent an explicit money-back guarantee of satisfaction, I see no reason why the vendor should have to cater to every buyer's demand.

Maybe the buyer has to have "Prime" though?