News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by stevecalifornia on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:04PM (#11330828)
I am shocked by Apple's lack of commitment to making an actual productivity oriented computer in the form factor of a tablet.

The iPad Pro is likely a reaction to the success of the Microsoft Surface-- but the reaction is not much more than a name change and split screen. The Surface on the other hand actually is a productivity machine. Why isn't Apple diving fully into this area?

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by mythz on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:19PM (#11330979)
What success? iPad destroyed Surface sales by an order of magnitude last quarter 16.1M to 1.6M.

Even the iPad Pro alone outsold all MS Surface products despite only being introduced midway through the holiday quarter.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by Someone1234 on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:43PM (#11331218)
According to IDC:

> We believe Apple sold just over two million iPad Pros while Microsoft sold around 1.6 million Surface devices

So 2m Vs. 1.6m, the remaining 14.1m devices are an entirely different class at an entirely different price-point.

The iPad Pro did outsell the Surface line in one quarter, but it is worth noting that the Surface Pro 4 was a minor upgrade, whereas the iPad Pro was a brand new class of device for Apple.

Where Microsoft has been making in-roads with the Surface Pro line in particular is corporate/enterprise ultrabooks. The iPad, even the "Pro" doesn't have an answer to that.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by mythz on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:11PM (#11331476)
This is some warped stats findings. You want to divide iPad sales because it's in a different class yet compare them with all Surface tablets and Hybrids combined but still elect not to include MacBooks in this separate class.

Apparently iPad Pro and iPads are in a different price point but the current Surface product lines: Surface 3, Surface Pro 4 and Surface Book which are nearly doubled in cost respectively, are not. Then apparently an iPad with a larger screen is a brand new "entirely different" class, but Surface Tablet and Surface Books are not.

Then you go on about the launch quarter like it's the only reason why iPad Pro outsold all Surfaces, but both iPhone and iPads go on to outsell their launch quarters in the next year - this is what you get when you grow sales.

I'm surprised you didn't top it off by saying that Apple deliberately withheld introducing the iPad Pro to midway through the quarter so they could sell more units in that quarter.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by ultramancool on Monday March 21, 2016 @08:06PM (#11333352)
People buy the Surface to run the desktop Windows apps though - which is something Apple can't offer. If we were talking Surface RT exclusively it'd be different...
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by niels_olson on Tuesday March 22, 2016 @01:57AM (#11334686)
Drop your favorite Windows version into VirtualBox on your macbook.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by randyrand on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:36PM (#11331162)
Bad comparison IMO. The tablet market is distinct from the productivity tablet market. What percentage of those ipad are replacing laptops?
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by Elessar on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:42PM (#11331209)
It's not a bad comparison.

The question is why is Apple not diving into a "productivity machine" like the Surface. The answer is that the iPad Pro is selling better than the Surface. That is: Apple isn't building the Surface because they built something that sells better.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by mythz on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:44PM (#11331228)
> What percentage of those ipad are replacing laptops?

Think about what you're saying, why would replacing laptops be a priority for Apple if they can outsell hybrids 10 to 1 by focusing on making a great consumption device?

Apple and Google are focused on the mobile computing platform of the future which already outsells pcs with the gap widening every year.

Instead Apple uses their OSX product lines to compete in the pc market.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by FussyZeus on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:43PM (#11331222)
Who's talking about laptops? OP brought up that the iPad Pro is a reaction to the Surface, then the reply said that the Pro destroyed the Surface in sales. This has nothing to do with laptops, even if the sales on productivity tablets are pathetic, the Pro still seems to be winning those pathetic sales.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by WayneBro on Wednesday March 23, 2016 @11:13AM (#11345188)
Have all iOS tablets outsold all Windows tablets though, or just the one brand (Surface)?
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by parasubvert on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:29PM (#11331077)
Surface has not been much of a success:

http://www.theverge.com/2016/1/28/10858474/microsoft-earning... http://www.theverge.com/2015/10/22/9599674/microsoft-q1-2016...

Apple fundamentally doesn't believe in a hybrid laptop/tablet "productivity" machine (for good reason, debatably). The iPad Pro is an attempt to bring iOS into the realm of productivity, rather than merging the experiences of iOS and Mac OS X.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by derefr on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:34PM (#11331146)
Or, to put it another way: the iPad Pro is a device that takes the productivity apps already written for iOS, and enhances them by giving them more of what they need (screen real-estate, fine 2D input control, GPU power, etc.)

The Surface series, meanwhile, creates a new platform; new apps (or at least new major versions of apps) have to be written to truly take advantage of it.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by jrockway on Monday March 21, 2016 @09:23PM (#11333729)
Not true, as far as I can tell. I use mine for the usual tasks (ssh, Chrome) and photo editing (Lightroom and Photoshop). Chrome, Lightroom, and Photoshop are the exact same versions I have on my desktop, and work perfectly on the Surface, including understanding touch and the pen. It's great. Nice screen too.

The iPad has potential, but Lightroom for the iPad is crap. You can connect an SD card with RAW files on it to the iPad... but Lightroom can't read them. Won't even show you a preview (even though Apple's built-in app can). Not good.

The iPad Pro is a way better device on paper than the Surface. But being able to run every Windows program ever is better than being able to maybe get a stripped-down version of the software you're used to.

I imagine sales numbers between iPad Pro and Surface Pro 4 are orders of magnitude in favor of the iPad for two reasons. One, the Surface Pro 4 competes with every Windows laptop ever -- there are many cheaper ways to get all your favorite Windows programs "on the go". Two, I bet a lot of people bought the iPad Pro imagining things like Lightroom would be useful, discovered they aren't, and put the iPad in the drawer two weeks after buying it. I loved my iPad for the first two weeks after I bought it. Now I don't know where it is. Dead in a drawer somewhere, no doubt.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by dangoor on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:02PM (#11331397)
The iPad Pro is a continued drive toward what the iPad has always been intended to be. It's a touch-centric computer that does away with some of the old interaction patterns and problems of the past (creating new problems all its own ;)

Apple is making the bet that people want to use apps that are all designed with touch interfaces in mind and that people prefer a simpler computing model. Microsoft is betting that backwards compatibility is more important.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by Someone on Monday March 21, 2016 @08:29PM (#11333472)
Also notice that this is a repeat of Mac OS vs Windows in the early '90s. Then, part of the reason that true Windows GUI programs replaced DOS as fast as they did, and we didn't have a period of "Windows as a way to show multiple DOS Windows" was that people (Microsoft being an important one) had to learn GUI programming to support the Mac.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by Joeri on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:21PM (#11330989)
Microsoft had to go through an extremely painful and still incomplete transition to make windows suitable for tablets. If apple tries to make a mac tablet then it will be a horrible experience. They can't fix the fact that mac apps are designed for mouse/trackpad interaction and dense UI, not pen/finger and big targets.

And as for making an iOS tablet that's more suitable for productivity, the iPad Pro is that device, and basically as good as it gets.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by deong on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:08PM (#11331451)
I think the current view that iOS takes of file management takes it out of the realm of "good productivity device", full stop. The hardware is there. The software isn't particularly close yet, in my opinion.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by dkonofalski on Monday March 21, 2016 @06:17PM (#11332608)
I never understood this. Who wants to mess around with the file system? 95% of users probably don't care where or how the OS is storing your data. They only care that they can access it when they want to access it. The only people that care to have that granular control over the file system are the people that want full control over the device too and those are not the demographic for iOS. iOS is all about making it simpler for people to do the things they want to do. Manually managing a file system is the opposite of simple.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by JoBrad on Monday March 21, 2016 @06:39PM (#11332775)
Because the convoluted process of getting Application B to work with an item created/edited by Application A is incredibly tedious in the iOS model. In my opinion, while it works well in single-app circumstances, iOS' model is completely backward, from a user standpoint. An app is simply a tool that allows me to accomplish some goal. So it's not that I want to mess with the file system as much as I want to work with some file, and the app-centric model robs you of a lot of productivity when trying to accomplish this - especially if you ever need to switch back and forth between apps to work on a single file.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by dkonofalski on Monday March 21, 2016 @07:11PM (#11332955)
Can you give an example of this? Nearly every app that I've needed to switch between offers some kind of ability to open the file using the share menu. Especially when I can throw Dropbox or iCloud into that mix, I've yet to come across a situation where I couldn't open 1 file in 2 different apps.

Am I missing your point or is there more nuance to your particular situation?

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by SiVal on Monday March 21, 2016 @09:43PM (#11333816)
Power users are people who take multiple software tools and play them like the conductor of an orchestra, crafting from them a powerful metatool with the combined features of all, often with gap fillers and automators, such as shell scripts, AppleScript, cron jobs, Apple Automation, etc.

They tend to apply dynamic subsets of this power tool to "projects", kept in "project folders", containing images downloaded with one tool, edited with another, graphics generated in a third, code edited in another, marketing docs written in yet another, data fetched by a script to be opened by a spreadsheet app, turned into a chart and combined with the marketing doc into a PDF-based presentation....

And Apple builds some hardware that would be great for adding powers to the metatool (quick, finger-drawn sketches turn into useful charts to be merged into some other doc with layout manipulated by hand...) but Apple's position is that their target customers are really far too...limited to be able to understand hard stuff like "folders" or how to even find their files after plugging a thumb drive into a USB port, so no folders, no USB, no confusing "orchestra", just sit back, poke an app button and buy something from one of our nice stores (you understand shopping, don't you? Poke the button), notice how thin it is, poke an app button and watch a nice video, notice what a nice shade of pink, uh, "rose gold" it is, poke an app button and distract yourself with FaceBook, express and opinion about a celebrity and, since we're always adding new ways to buy things, maybe treat yourself and buy something extra....

It has worked wonders for them financially, so I can't fault their logic (bemoan it, yes, but not fault it), but this is no equivalent of a power user OS with a real file system.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by moftz on Monday March 21, 2016 @11:34PM (#11334258)
If a power user needs to do all of these things, chances are they aren't going to even think of trying to do this all on a tablet ala iPad. People use tablets to do simple tasks (check email, browse web, basic photo/doc editing, etc) that don't require something at least as big as a laptop. It's supposed to be a simple environment for doing simple tasks quickly. It's meant for people wanting a device that Just Works (TM) without getting bogged down in trying to get App A working with App B with App C with App D. This really is a non-issue and will always be one.

If you need to do some heavy work, do it on a laptop. You can buy tons of different laptops now that are very thin and don't take up much more room in your backpack than a tablet would. If you need any more power, then rent a compile server. There is always going to be a cost for having a portable device, it's that you won't be able to get all of your work done on it.

The real issue is when OS developers try to push this simple, tablet environment to devices that shouldn't need it.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by SiVal on Tuesday March 22, 2016 @12:39AM (#11334451)
There's no touch, no pen, no direct drawing or manipulation on any Mac laptop or desktop screen, and Apple says there never will be, because nobody wants it.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by mconzen on Tuesday March 22, 2016 @01:16AM (#11334558)
Sure, but Apple also said that no one wanted a stylus on a tablet. If the technology and market exist to do it well and make it a success, they'll make it. Touch and pen manipulation on laptop and desktop screens so far have done little to show that this is something any significant portion of the market actually wants.

Personally, I have two touch-enabled laptops and the only time I interact with the touch screen is when I try to point at something in conversation and am unpleasantly surprised when it moves the cursor.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by dkonofalski on Tuesday March 22, 2016 @02:41PM (#11338853)
Then I guess I just disagree with you. I'm a web developer/designer. I'm very familiar with having different tools, workflows, and project folders. That's not the kind of thing that's useful on a tablet device. Can I probably do some development (or similar work) on a tablet? Sure. Is that really the best place to be doing a multi-tool, multi-pronged task? Definitely no.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by drivingmenuts on Tuesday March 22, 2016 @11:56AM (#11337455)
If you have to rely on a third-party service for something as basic as sharing a file between two apps on the same device, then that is a major failure on the part of the device maker.

The idea of sand boxing is a good one, but there needs to be an option for those of us who know what they are doing, or are willing to take a risk. I shouldn't have to rely on cloud availability constantly.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by dkonofalski on Tuesday March 22, 2016 @02:40PM (#11338836)
The Share/Action menus in iOS are global for the OS. What do you mean by third-party service? If you can open a filetype in an app on iOS, it'll show up on the action menu for that type of file.

I don't understand what you're trying to say. There's no failure of the device here that requires a third party app.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by drivingmenuts on Tuesday March 22, 2016 @04:05PM (#11339580)
I was responding to the idea that you have to have iCloud and/or Dropbox sometimes to exchange files with another app on the same device.

Sure, if you want to exchange with another device - but not an app.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by JoBrad on Monday March 21, 2016 @08:50PM (#11333583)
Well, my point was that the share menu is an app-centric model that is horribly inefficient - not that it can't be done. Unless all of the apps you are using have incorporated Dropbox or iCloud into their model, those don't help you without an exposed file system. I think it's telling that one of the most successful portions of iOS has been Photos - which has an (in effect) exposed file system.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by TheOtherHobbes on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:58PM (#11331969)
>If apple tries to make a mac tablet then it will be a horrible experience.

The Microsoft solution was painful because it was based on the insane premise that all software could run on all devices - as if anyone really needs the full version of Adobe CS or Visual Studio on a mobile, or wants Candy Crush taking up all the available pixels on a 30" monitor.

Apple will do something less insane. There's already overlap between the OS X and iOS touch classes.

I wouldn't be surprised to see a future iPad sold as the next Mac keyboard/remote display a few generations from now, when the tactility is a little better.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by dkonofalski on Monday March 21, 2016 @06:24PM (#11332664)
It's not that we need the full version of those things on there, it's that we have the ability to have them. /s

It's the same situation when people pretend like the Play App Store is better than Apple's App Stores because anyone can put anything on there without having to go through Apple first. In theory, yes, it's great that you have the freedom to do that and that Google doesn't act as the arbiter of your precious apps. In reality, though, the Play Store is a cesspool of crappy apps. When I got my Nexus 7, I tried to install the Netflix app from the Play Store. There's multiple Netflix apps (all called "Netflix") that claim to be from Netflix, Inc. I don't know if they've fixed that now, but just the fact that something like that can happen is crazy.

Everyone's so caught up on whether or not they could [do something] that they never stopped to think about whether they should [be able to].

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by Maarten88 on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:27PM (#11331053)
> Why isn't Apple diving fully into this area?

Because it is very hard? It cost Microsoft a disastrous version of Windows and lots of pushback by customers before they got their productivity OS working both on a tablet and desktop.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by seanp2k2 on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:21PM (#11330997)
Because it doesn't make sense to get any "real" work done on a tablet OS / touchscreen for many people. They have the MacBook if you want a small productivity machine.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by rayiner on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:45PM (#11331239)
A fiddly add-on keyboard is never going to make for a good productivity experience. I'd rather use a proper laptop with mittens than try and get anything done on a Surface that isn't the Surface Book. What's the point of making an OS X machine in tablet form factor when a MacBook is almost as thin and light and has a real keyboard and touchpad?
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by BinaryIdiot on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:12PM (#11331477)
> A fiddly add-on keyboard is never going to make for a good productivity experience.

I would suggesting trying a "fiddly add-on keyboard" first before saying that :). Maybe the iPad Pro's keyboard is like that and I certainly thought that about the surface pro 4 until I decided to spend some time playing with it. Coming from only Macs for the past 6 years I gave in and bought a surface pro 4. Then I did the launch hackathon with it where I coded for 48 straight hours.

It's a FANTASTIC productivity device. Granted it may not be the best fit for everyone but I wouldn't cast absolute doubt on it without spending some time playing with it.

> What's the point of making an OS X machine in tablet form factor

I don't think anyone specifically said it had to be OS X but it would be nice to have a touch screen and have access to iOS apps at the same time at you have access to "real" apps to get work done. I had an iPad before giving it to one of my kids because I couldn't do very much on it productivity wise. As a programmer who doesn't work on games: 99% of my code could run, without issue, on an iPhone 4's processor. I wanted something portable that I could read with, play casual games on but also get real work done. iOS just can't do that for many professions.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by rayiner on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:31PM (#11331689)
My dad uses a Surface 2 as his primary computer. Using the TypeCover drives me up the wall. The newer ones on the Surface Pro 4 don't seem much better. It might work in a pinch, but I don't understand why you'd actually prefer to use it over something with a real keyboard.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by BinaryIdiot on Monday March 21, 2016 @05:56PM (#11332456)
I wouldn't say it's preferable to a real keyboard but as far as foldable, portable keyboards go I'd say it's the best (especially since it's USB and not bluetooth based; bluetooth are just too prone to interference, repeating character issues, etc (at least I've yet to use a good one)).

It's a pretty good compromise, in my opinion, for someone looking for a full fledge computer that can also have the portability and usability of a tablet.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by Zoon on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:23PM (#11331020)
To be fair it is a great productivity computer for all fields other than IT.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by nkw on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:32PM (#11331112)
I disagree. I work in a law office. Almost everyone is issued a laptop, desktop, and, if they want, an iPad. iPad is fine for reading documents or e-mail, but awful for actually creating anything. Our office has found the keyboard is terrible, cut and paste is a pain, and people prefer a real filesystem. Nobody in our office does any real work (i.e. writing) with the iPad except reviewing documents while sitting in court or an airplane seat. Everybody I know just treats it like a giant phone.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by chmars on Monday March 21, 2016 @05:41PM (#11332345)
I'm with you. A major pain is that mails cannot be added to be iOS version of our CRM … on the Mac, we have Mail.app integration.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by derefr on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:35PM (#11331157)
Has anyone in your office tried using an iPad with a bluetooth keyboard? In my experience, it's far less painful. There's a reason Apple Stores carry these[1]: it's just one more (light) bit of padded plastic to drop in your bag, and then you can work on the plane and so on. (If you're at home, I'd recommend using an actual Magic Keyboard if you've got one, but those aren't quite as convenient in portability terms.)

[1] http://support.logitech.com/en_ca/product/keys-to-go-ipad

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by nkw on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:46PM (#11331247)
I (and others in the office) have. You are right that a bluetooth keyboard does pretty much solve the typing issue, and using the actual Magic Keyboard over the floppy iPad-specific keyboards gets it significantly closer to the feeling people are accustomed to. Definitely necessary if you are going to be working on a document (or replying to an e-mail with more than a sentence), but for myself there was still a huge productivity barrier by having to go from the keyboard to screen for mouse actions (scrolling, selecting text, hitting a button). The keyboard/trackpad combination allows both typing and mouse actions with minimal movement on the same plane. It sounds a bit lazy or silly, but I found having to pick one's hand up and poke something on the screen was pretty disruptive.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by cm2187 on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:09PM (#11331458)
I'm not sure what the point of having a tablet if it must look and be used like a laptop.

The other thing with these keyboards is that when the tablet is held in table mode, you have your fingers on the keys, which is a pain.

I tend to agree with the post above. Good for reading, not the right tool for editing.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by derefr on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:12PM (#11331486)
Because you don't always have to use it like a laptop; most of the time you're not editing, so most of the time you're not using the keyboard.

This is the same as, say, people who prefer to use laptops docked to a large screen with an external keyboard and mouse. Most of the time, they can get away without needing all that, which is why they have a laptop instead of a desktop PC plugged into the same peripherals. But sometimes, for an especially heavy-duty task, it's good to be able to temporarily assume the next form-factor up.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by cm2187 on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:21PM (#11331578)
Yes but then you have your fingers on a keyboard when you revert to tablet mode. Unless they leave the keyboard in a suitcase.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by derefr on Monday March 21, 2016 @05:00PM (#11331988)
Right, that's what I meant. You set aside time as "productivity time" where you get the keyboard out of your bag; once you're done, you pack it away.

Works well for me (fiction writer), but might not work for people whose workflows involve constant distraction.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by massysett on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:26PM (#11331631)
I'm surprised you issue them desktops; why not a laptop with a docking station?
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by chmars on Monday March 21, 2016 @05:42PM (#11332358)
There's no such thing as a docking stations for MacBooks.

(There are USB docks but they cannot really compete with real docks as they are available for PC notebooks. And Apple does not sell an external Retina screen either.)

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by jsjohnst on Monday March 21, 2016 @06:07PM (#11332534)
I disagree. There are a number of options here, but my personal favorite is the Belkin TB2 dock. Plug in two cables (power/TB) and I have three external screens, wired keyboard, multiple USB3 plugs, gigabit Ethernet, and a decent audio line out.

If you prefer something exactly like a dock where no cables are involved being plugged in manually, there are several solutions available. Henge Docks, Landing Zone, and BookEndz are some examples.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by mturmon on Monday March 21, 2016 @06:35PM (#11332739)
A Thunderbolt dock is very functional for a laptop. You can hang a large display, keyboard, backup storage, and wired ethernet off the dock and just plug in two cables -- Thunderbolt and power. Various OS niceties make it work well.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by jsjohnst on Monday March 21, 2016 @06:12PM (#11332566)
Also, Apple may not sell them, but it's definitely possible to connect a 4K external display that's HDPI (aka Retina, minus marking speak).
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by jsjohnst on Monday March 21, 2016 @08:51PM (#11333585)
"marketing" speak.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by mmanfrin on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:21PM (#11330991)
(Complete conjecture)

I think it's because it's in their best interests to not have that form factor be a 'thing'. Apple wants to sell you a macbook and an iPad, not a single Padbook. If they don't enter that arena, then they force Microsoft to do all the work to get the market there (if at all), when they can come up with a me-too form factor device without any real lost headway.

Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by kayoone on Monday March 21, 2016 @04:07PM (#11331437)
If anything, Apple wants the iPad Pros to replace Laptops for most people. They clearly are hardly interested in Macs and power users anymore as most upgrades go without an Event and mac sales are a minor factor in their gigantic revenue.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by ebbv on Monday March 21, 2016 @03:46PM (#11331246)
This is the most delusional response I've ever seen. The Surface is not a success by any measure.
Re:iPad Pro – 9.7-inch by melling on Monday March 21, 2016 @05:01PM (#11332001)
It's not a reaction to the Surface. That probably explains why it doesn't do what a Surface does.

Considering that a Surface can replace a desktop PC, it should sell in the tens of millions annually. It might take another revision or two but this will soon happen.