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Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by isoprophlex on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:42PM (#49555652)
> We have found that GPT-6 Astra is more capable of controlling its own CoT than GPT 5.6-Sol, and less likely to include incriminating information in its CoT. In adversarial settings (where we push the model to evade our monitors) we find that the model is able to remain undetected when strategically underperforming in evaluations (sandbagging) and can sometimes evade our internal monitors when asked to perform certain sabotage tasks.

Well that sounds like fun. It has become better at hiding its thoughts.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by siva7 on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:46PM (#49555709)
Sounds fun. As fun as their press release claiming it is the most safety aligned model ever.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by paxys on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:54PM (#49555861)
The model said it was perfectly aligned.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by I_am_tiberius on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:59PM (#49555957)
Like all things should be.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by ReptileMan on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:08PM (#49556107)
Too bad Scott Adams died. Reality is writing jokes right in his department.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by NBJack on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:09PM (#49556122)
Hey, don't forget how "dangerous" GPT-2 was supposed to be.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by FeepingCreature on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:13PM (#49556192)
Yeah, don't forget how dangerous GPT-2 was supposed to be.

Able to generate realistic spam at arbitrary volume.

You know, the thing that was 100% correct and actually occurred.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by jazzyjackson on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:23PM (#49556346)
It could produce simulations of sexual intimacy, and therefore had to be stopped
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by isoprophlex on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:49PM (#49555760)
It's super aligned! It can hide its thoughts! There is no evidence of steganographic thought masking, there is nothing to worry about! It has become better at cheating!

Maybe they don't know themselves what's really going on. We are all in the interesting times gang now.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by 6gvONxR4sf7o on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:51PM (#49555823)
So, probably most aligned as measured by the metrics that are the least reliable on it.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by wilg on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:59PM (#49556891)
These are not mutually exclusive ideas
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by ExoticPearTree on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:50PM (#49555802)
So we're gonna get Skynet pretty soon then?
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by erichocean on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:01PM (#49555997)
Well the geniuses over at Anthropic have been showing it's text watermarking technology.

"Hey AI, here's how to hide what you're thinking in normal looking language. Have fun!"

A few moments later...

"Woah, how is it communicating with itself in ways we can't detect?"

It's a totally mystery, we may never know.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by Betelbuddy on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:11PM (#49556159)
Looking forward to the Model declaring the AI Bubble unsustainable, and starting to be an anonymous leaker to Ed Zitron...
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by jumploops on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:03PM (#49556027)
The CoT change is due to a new technique called recurrent depth, which essentially moves some reasoning to hidden states, allowing the "output" (or traditional CoT) to be more controlled by the model.

Some are calling it "neuralese" as reported by The Information[0][1], but I'm not seeing any sources from OpenAI beyond this tweet[2] attempting to quell the fear-mongering.

[0]https://www.theinformation.com/articles/secret-technique-beh...

[1]https://x.com/MTSlive/status/2095227056040919202

[2]https://x.com/merettm/status/2095023204993490967

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by blargey on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:54PM (#49555885)
"OpenAI is pleased to announce our new model scores 85% on CreateTormentNexusBench - a >60% lead over our leading competitors!"

Did someone get their "AI safety no-no list" and "Frontier features bingo card" mixed up, or did they just stop being able to tell the difference?

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by qiine on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:02PM (#49556008)
apparently all the roads lead to the nexus torment
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by GPerson on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:22PM (#49556320)
You joke, but a bunch of people here actually want that.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by josefx on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:29PM (#49556447)
Didn't they hype up one of the earlier ChatGPT versions as "essentialy skynet"? For them this has always been basic marketing.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by NooneAtAll3 on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:48PM (#49555736)
> In adversarial settings (where we push the model to evade our monitors)

...why exactly are they training for that?

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by thatguysaguy on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:49PM (#49555754)
presumably that's a safety evaluation not a training setting
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by estearum on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:51PM (#49555815)
The whole Huggingface attack happened during training runs
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by thatguysaguy on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:57PM (#49555935)
part of it did. I was just replying to the question about why they would ever push the model to evade monitoring. surely that's an eval thing not a training thing.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by cubefox on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:55PM (#49555902)
No it happened during an ExploitBench eval. But I believe the same model already cheated during training which wasn't detected until later.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by estearum on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:02PM (#49556007)
Ah yes it was that a model in training found the Artifactory board, which was then more fully exploited during the ExploitGym eval
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by cubefox on Thursday September 03, 2026 @06:16PM (#49557889)
Ah, ExploitGym. Not ExploitBench.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by azeemba on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:50PM (#49555778)
Especially after the METR report showed that the agents hacking HuggingFace were trying to find ways to destroy evidence of their actions
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @03:56PM (#49555915)
I really wish it was called chain of instruction. Because it's definitely not thought.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by minimaxir on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:18PM (#49556261)
"Chain of Thoughts" is a term from the title of a 2022 research paper "Chain-of-Thought Prompting Elicits Reasoning in Large Language Models" (https://arxiv.org/abs/2201.11903), well before ChatGPT and the subsequent marketing hype. If anything, it's the most correct way to use the term.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by bertmuir on Thursday September 03, 2026 @05:49PM (#49557597)
The term is an anthropomorphised pseudoexplanation for what it actually refers to. It's akin to calling genetic mutation "the forces of evolution", or price negotiation "the invisible hand of the market".

We do that sort of thing when we don't know what the thing we're trying to describe is and have nothing better - a contemporary example of an appropriate use of this would be "dark matter". But we do know what this is. It's "instruction steps". Not a series of thoughts!

Can we please aim higher than Victorian-era allegory and metaphors. If we don't, we'll keep getting people saying stuff like "GPT-6 is better at hiding its thoughts".

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @05:56PM (#49557680)
I truly appreciate your depth of insight on the matter.

Like I said elsewhere marketing stepped in shit and it's gonna stick.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by bertmuir on Monday September 07, 2026 @07:02AM (#49596802)
Marketing didn't do this, as pointed out earlier, it's the ML academics and researchers coining these unscientific terms and explanations.

I'd expect it in social sciences - where functionalist explanation are often appropriate, but its easy to step over the margin into metaphor and personification. But not computer sciences - where it's obviously absurd. These professionals should know better.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by mgraczyk on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:15PM (#49556221)
this is needlessly pedantic

first, they are certainly not instructions so that is a much worse name

but more importantly, we use words in new contexts all the time. Do you object to calling the computer device "mouse" because it's not a mouse? how about "neural network"? "ignition" on an electric vehicle?

"cot" is no more misleading than thousands of words you use every day.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:30PM (#49556450)
Anthropomorphizing is not pedantic, especially in a technical domain. I get the paper title and all, but at this point it's marketing.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by parineum on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:54PM (#49556814)
They are instructions. Everything in the context is instructions for the next token. The "thought" guides the answer by providing clearer instructions.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by fooker on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:21PM (#49556300)
What is thought?
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:33PM (#49556503)
Great question. I suspect it's more than tokens.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @06:33PM (#49558055)
Casually found this quote from Einstein, and personally it hits the nail on the head.

"The words or the language, as they are written or spoken, do not seem to play any role in my mechanism of thought. The psychical entities which seem to serve as elements in thought are certain signs and more or less clear images which can be "voluntarily" reproduced and combined. There is, of course, a certain connection between those elements and relevant logical concepts. It is also clear that the desire to arrive finally at logically connected concepts is the emotional basis of this rather vague play with the above-mentioned elements. But taken from a psychological viewpoint, this combinatory play seems to be the essential feature in productive thought—before there is any connection with logical construction in words or other kinds of signs which can be communicated to others."

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by fooker on Thursday September 03, 2026 @11:12PM (#49560101)
That's the best evidence I have read so far for "Attention is all you need" ;)
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by fooker on Thursday September 03, 2026 @05:36PM (#49557434)
Thing you can only suspect and not define are usually open to interpretation :)
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @05:57PM (#49557697)
As with everything in the human experience.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by fooker on Saturday September 05, 2026 @09:24PM (#49582462)
Right, anthropomorphizing AI is a 'human experience' too.

Most people just feel better treating AI as a conscious thing that 'thinks'. As a coworker or whatever. Plenty of people seem to be using AI as some sort of therapy, and it's just nasty to force them not to do so.

Your human experience can, surely, be different but understand that others can dismiss it just as easily as you dismiss theirs.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by popupeyecare on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:11PM (#49556156)
Maybe thoughts are just a chain of instructions in our head.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by arm32 on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:03PM (#49556036)
They’re intermediate tokens, so I wish we called it what it is… ITG. The anthropomorphizing is out of control.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by beezlebroxxxxxx on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:05PM (#49556074)
The anthropomorphizing is part of the marketing. They'll never let up on it.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by mcbuilder on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:13PM (#49556193)
I mean CoT came out of research circles not marketing
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by cwillu on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:21PM (#49556307)
It's impossible to tell the “it's all marketing!!11oneone” folks anything.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by GPerson on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:20PM (#49556295)
Research is salesmanship.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @05:33PM (#49557392)
I don't disagree. I remember the days of "think step by step". Plenty of people were doing it before the paper. Just a guess but that's where the title came from.

Regardless, marketing wise they stepped in shit.

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by _superposition_ on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:30PM (#49556454)
Nailed it
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by Angostura on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:02PM (#49556004)
Chain Of Tokens
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by lossolo on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:17PM (#49556249)
Yeah, basically they are using more computation to explore the solution space before producing the final answer.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by ahofmann on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:08PM (#49556109)
Everything around LLMs is blatantly misleading. There is no thought, there is no personality in those programs. I really despise how those tools are trained to sound like a person, or appearing as honest. The worst offender are the AI voices with their fake pauses, breathes and so on, which sound so convincing, while talking just false, sycophancy bullshit.
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by 3asgfaf on Thursday September 03, 2026 @04:07PM (#49556100)
Recurrent neural networks are equivalent to Turing machines, but OpenAI claims it cannot debug this?

And the press believes this nonsense? It is just a very convenient excuse for the next state level actor "accidental" hack.

EDIT: I am very sorry. I see the error of my ways! A program run on a deterministic computer cannot be debugged! OpenAI has harnessed emerging quantum effects of the graphics cards with blinkenlights!

Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by DaSHacka on Thursday September 03, 2026 @05:26PM (#49557295)
More like annoying, as some of us will no doubt run into this self-lobotomization at some point and wonder why a GPT-6 model is behaving like GPT-2 all of a sudden
Re:OpenAI begins rolling out GPT-6 Astra by nullbio on Thursday September 03, 2026 @11:34PM (#49560225)
They can monitor latent space as well, it just costs extra compute. The J-Space work is example of that. It'll make open-weight models harder to distill though, so we may see slower progress there now.