> last me a year or two being frugal

Word of advice.

Get a part time job where you can keep your skills up-to-date because from personal experience personal projects on GitHub will not be enough to land a job in two years. Make sure for every penny you spend you are earning equal.

The two years are going to fly by.

EDIT: I'm not joking about taking this serious. You want to be working when people start losing their jobs to AI. Most likely this is going to end with society rethinking distribution but you are going to need to be able to survive the changes and 2 - 3 years is not enough wealth.

Seconded, though from a different angle. In my experience, it's surprisingly hard to live frugally when you don't have a job; my spending actually went up at first because I had all of this free time for activities I didn't have before. Started doing more hobbies, going for trips around town, generally participated in the economy more than I could when 8 hours of my day were spoken for. What I thought was a year of runway was probably closer to 3-6 months.

My solution was getting a part-time job (non tech) but also had to significantly change my spending habits which was not easy.

On the other end, I live very frugally and when I spent six months without work I calculated how much my savings would last with my no job level of spending and it was 21 years. So anyone who wants to learn to live frugally would be wise to start doing so while still working, because that's when it's the easiest.

It's very possible in 2 or 3 years there won't be much of a job market remaining and the best thing you can do now is something you own.

I imagine politically it will be like during the pandemic. The government goes full socialist to prevent riots and revolution -- they are going to print lots of money. It is going to be chaotic period. It is already starting and the best thing people can do is make sure they are employed, developing skills, and not spending savings. You want to make it to the other side of this.

I have a very niche set of skills so I could up until 6 months ago pick up contract work anytime I needed. Despite being one of the best in the world at what I did, I can't compete anyone with $400 in tokens using Codex or Claude Code. I'm pivoting quickly but the sentiment is "Oh, shit, this is coming fast and heavy!"

Nothing like retiring with only 3 years worth of savings and no plan on what to do after that.

If you don't need to support a family and are unhappy otherwise, why not?

Sure it's not 'the smart thing to do' but if it makes you happy and you're still not far worse of than most people...

Because if you are unhappy now, just wait until you are homeless

there are in fact plenty of ways to earn enough money to get by on a simple lifestyle

People in tech, especially from US, are so accustomed to spending $5,000/mo just to survive, that they cannot fathom one is able to live without having a tech job in San Francisco. It's a pretty sad state of affairs.

I live in a first-world European country where the average salary is about €25,000 per year. My mortgage estimate is less than €300/mo. I'm not that afraid of having to supplement my income if I need to. The world will still need cheap and experienced software engineers for a while.

> People in tech, especially from US, are so accustomed to spending $5,000/mo just to survive, that they cannot fathom one is able to live without having a tech job in San Francisco. It's a pretty sad state of affairs.

Quality of life in suburban America is incredibly high relative to a "first world" country with such a low average income. From what I have seen, most families in the "European periphery" still live in small Soviet-era apartment buildings, own one small car or no car at all, and are far from enjoying many other things taken for granted in America.

First time I heard Northern Italy compared to Soviet Russia, but my fault for discussing this stuff with Americans, trying to pass people as poor because they only have one car.

Did you know that life expectancy in US is 5-7 years lower than Western Europe? But sure, do go on about "first world" countries.

plenty of people in Prague living on that income without car, I would really like to see how is suburban America quality of life incredibly higher than Prague LOL

enjoy your museums, hospitals, free schools and playgrounds in walking distance, almost free public transport, tons of supermarkets in walking distance, etc. in suburban America

Living in a cookie-cutter suburb full of parking lots and strip malls is not, in fact, a higher standard of life than living in a small town in Europe. The fact that we've somehow convinced ourselves that it is says absolutely nothing good about American postwar culture.

25000€ a year is basically Czech average salary

I would really like to hear how is quality of life in suburban America incredibly higher ROFL

owning a car certainly isn't tied to income, quite the opposite, poorer the person more cars they own in their junkyard

It's quite simple really. In a place where $5,000+ monthly incomes are common, people can afford more things, and this generally means a higher quality of life. Granted, many necessities like housing are also more expensive in high income areas, but keep in mind that American homes are generally much larger than in Europe. And things like AC and clothes dryers are taken for granted.

got it - for you quality of life = house full of useless things

for other people it's usually - lots of green, clean air, museums, cultural events, activities, accessible healthcare, accessible education, playgrounds/supermarkets/schools in walking distance, great public transport, no need to drive everywhere in empty metal box, etc.

I wonder why European cities are winning always charts of best places to live and not some generic US suburb??

> And things like AC and clothes dryers are taken for granted.

Not sure where you get your impression of Europe, but if you feel amenities like these are not standard, it’s a few decades out of date.

North Europeans traditionally didn’t need AC, but everywhere where it gets hot - which is everywhere now - they got them installed. Very few buildings with integrated HVAC systems for the entire buildings tho, mostly independent units.

yeah it's funny, actually in poor Bulgaria pretty much every apartment has AC, so AC is certainly not anything to brag about, even the poorest people have it

clothes dryers are just plain stupid waste of space, consume lot of energy/money, I've had washing machine with dryer, pretty much never used dryer after seeing how long it takes to dry the clothes while wasting electricity, new washing machine I bought without dryer

I do not own a car.

I (/we) own outright a small home.

I am happy that I do not need to own a car (in a London UK suburb).

I am happy that I do not need to heat or maintain a large building.

Our outgoings are low. One child is already at university and the other will be soon.

My perception of a common US notion of a 'good' life only intersects somewhat with mine, and I have spent a reasonable amount of time in various US locations from SF to NYC via the midwest, etc.

European here. Yes, houses are smaller, apartments can be comparatively tiny. Street parking can be a challenge.

However: I got stores, cinemas, cafes, restaurants within walking distance. My kids can roam around in the neighbourhood without someone calling social service on me. I can walk anywhere in the city at any hour day or night without someone robbing me. I can cheaply purchase free range eggs and organic vegetables. Tap water is fine, actually excellent. 30hour commute is considered too long. Coast is mere 3h away, people come from all over the planet to enjoy it, I spend 5 weeks a year there, just chillin and enjoying life. I get fast, cheap internet, and order groceries, do my taxes and doctors appointment online.

Tell me again how I’m suffering without poorly insulated detached houses, HSA, spam calls, an SUV to drive myself to the bakery, school shooting drills, healthcare bills, homeless people rejected by society, and that circus you have for a government right now?

Agree with you. Americans have been brainwashed in thinking they absolutely need a 3000 sqft house, 2 SUVs and pay for the absolute best private schools for kids. It's the ultimate rat race.

As someone that has lived in both Europe and America, the quality of life you get in America for the amount of money you spend is hilariously bad. It is easy to make money though.

In Europe the quality of life you get for cheap is by default excellent. It is so difficult to make money though,

> In Europe the quality of life you get for cheap is by default excellent.

I am been to Europe on many occasions and homes (actual homes, not cramped apartments) are not cheap at all relative to incomes. I am sure the peace of mind provided by universal healthcare and generous welfare programs is nice, but that's not how you build a strong economy. Incentives are distorted when you don't need a (good) job to live well enough. You get mediocrity, lacluster growth, poor customer service, and the other things Europe is known for. That's why you see people from all over the world come to America to build their businesses.

Europe definitely has a lot of problems! Some are similar, others are different than in the US.

Just comparing income, even on purchasing-parity basis, doesn't cut it.

Yeah, I was just living off $1k/month in Brazil just to see if it was possible. It definitely is. And was in a beautiful, safe area.

Of course you felt amazing living off US$1k/mo in Brazil - the average per capita household income in Brazil is less than US$450/mo and a salary of $700/mo puts you in the top 10% [0].

Basically, you enjoyed feeling rich in a country where the vast majority are getting screwed.

And this is what I as well as my SO's family (middle and working class Vietnamese in VN) hate about digital nomads - y'all don't realize that you end up perpetuating the same inequality you try to run away from, and feels deeply colonial in nature as the countries y'all end up in had histories of being colonized and stratified.

You get to travel everywhere because you have a strong passport. They don't because their passport is weak and their salaries are low.

You will always be promoted to the top of the social pecking order thanks to your passport. They will always be relegated to the bottom and attacked by politicans as "stealing jobs" or "changing demographics" thanks to their passport.

[0] - https://g1.globo.com/economia/noticia/2026/05/08/veja-quanto...

oh please, get over it. I supported a local old lady who airbnb'd out her guest house. I shopped at the local grocery store. and I left.

you would drop that buzzword 'colonial', as though Brazil isn't a former European colony, just like the US. And they... gasp... used slaves for much longer.

I was in the southern cone of the country, first world lifestyles there. Brazilians are proud, they'd be insulted by your savior attitude.

> I was in the southern cone of the country

Even in São Paulo the average household income is around $550/mo [0]. That said, I assume you live in Florianopolis but even then the average household income is around $520/mo [1].

> you would drop that buzzword 'colonial', as though Brazil isn't a former European colony, just like the US. And they... gasp... used slaves for much longer

I know. And clearly you're a bit thick in the head if you don't realize the ongoing political and social fissures in Brazil as a result of this.

There's a reason Lula retains such a cult following.

> I supported a local old lady who airbnb'd out her guest house

To even own a house that is Airbnb-able in a digital nomad hub in the south cone means they were better off socially and economically during the dictatorship and the messy transition back to democracy.

Nothing wrong with that, but assuming you are living a normal life there and not recognizing that your lifestyle is much better off than most people is douchey.

---

Alternatively, don't complain [2] when it's people like us or our parents who left, succeeded in the West, and are blamed for making life expensive for your types in America or Germany ;)

Being anti-immigrant yet being on an immigrant visa yourself (yes, a digital nomad is an immigrant), and while Brazilians are barred from getting a visa to the US.

Talk about hypocrisy.

[0] - https://www.metropoles.com/negocios/sp-tem-2a-maior-renda-do...

[1] - https://estado.sc.gov.br/noticias/renda-das-familias-de-sant...

[2] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45158497

Uh, ok, guess I'll keep my dirty American dollars out of poor economies. That should really help them out.

> That should really help them out

Yeah, it does if you're a tourist.

It's been documented [0] for [1] decades [2] how tourism induces a form of Dutch Disease [3].

Tourism dollars are inherently extractive, as that is foreign capital that is not redeployed into capacity building and also leads to premature inflation which prices out less extractive industries. Additonally, most tourist led economies lead to additonal economic stratification, as most countries tourism industries are deeply regulated and tend to be captured by pre-existing economic players (eg. Thailand, Brazil) which only exacerbates social stratification and economic inequality.

A great example of this is Thailand versus Malaysia and Vietnam - overtourism in Thailand led to an inflation in low skill services jobs associated with the tourism industry at the expense of manufacturing, which left for fellow ASEAN members Malaysia and Vietnam, both of which limited tourism and strategically targeted foreign capital to manufacturing and high value services (BPO, Software) despite Thailand historically being a peer and significantly more developed than Malaysia and Vietnam respectively.

No developing country has made the leap to becoming developed due to a tourism-led industrial policy, and the developed states that did adopt such a policy (eg. Puerto Rico, Portugal, Greece, Italy) only did so after their industrial growth spurts in the 1970s-2000s ended.

[0] - https://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/lup/publication/1334498

[1] - https://wiiw.ac.at/tourism-and-economic-development-the-beac...

[2] - https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3648158

[3] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_disease

He said he was quitting tech, not retiring from work forever. I would assume if you're fed up with tech you could instead do carpentry jobs, work part time at a store, be a tour guide or whatever. Is it fair to say that he has 2 years to find a way to earn $50,000 per year? Sounds like that would be doable if you're smart and ambitious, no?

Definitely not my first rodeo, but feel free to gloat.

I'm probably being overly charitable, but I would have said the same thing except in a positive context, because I've wanted to do the same thing at times.

They didn't say that they are retiring, just that they are ending their career as a software engineer.

Feels like an unfair judgment of someone else's values, which have no obligation to match yours.

I think it's not a moral, but financial judgement. Unless an alternate income is achieved before that deadline, becoming destitute except for a small cottage is not a great prospect.

Anyone willingly making that choice has a massive safety net protecting them (almost always family money)

Good luck to you. I did something similar, with a big list of projects on my backlog (including a game) and just burned out in a totally different way after 8 months. I found for me, I cannot do things in a vacuum, it has no meaning. There needs to be a deadline, an urgency, a customer problem... otherwise it all just felt pointless.

I ended up coming back as a contractor, but have repeated the cycle 3-4 times since then. It's a strange one.

Maybe I know what you mean: after burning out 6 years ago, I have managed to dedicate 3-4h per day to work, and I didn’t know what to do with all the free time I had. It was excruciating. It made my recovery longer than it had to be. After reading a lot of philosophy and being patient with myself, I have found a source of creativity within me that regular office hours had completely eradicated in my adult years.

All this to say, a person trained to work for someone else 40 hours a week for all their adult life is not able to self-direct and find meaning without a lot of introspection and readjusting.

Your last sentence resonates deeply with my current experience. Would you care to expand a bit more on what helped you find a way to self direct and find meaning within yourself?

I hoped no one asked because I'm not sure I have an easy answer. When I'm saying it's taken me 6 years to get out of burn out, I'm not joking. That, which includes 2 years sabbatical and as many years in therapy.

My only advice is: if you burn out, go through the entire process. You only get one chance to figure out what actually is meaningful to you, and the answer will most likely require you to upend you life (or you wouldn't have burned out in the first place). Read Carl Jung: he did a lot of research on midlife crises, and the enormous significance of middle age (the 30-40 years old range) in our quest for meaning.

In my very personal case, meaning was figuring out I'm meant to build things, on my own, at my own pace, and I owe the world to gift it with the vision that only I possess. Meaning for me happens to be one part about becoming a fully creative person, and one part about being selfless with my work, for I am not entitled to the result (see karma yoga). Your mileage might certainly vary.

Feel free to send me an email if you want to talk more about it.

Thank you for taking the time to answer. I didn't expect an easy answer, I'm quite sure there is none. Glad you found your way, I'll start mine with Jung's books, thanks.

> a Erlang-like microkernel/runtime I have been designing for the past 4 years,

I don't want to step on your design process, but if you want to explore some microkernels to run beam, I can link you to mine and another one that I ran into recently. Asking before linking, because sometimes you'd rather not look.

1. Please do link your microkernel, I'm very curious to learn from other people working in this space

2. I'm not exactly looking to recreate the BEAM. I'm building a message-passing microkernel built on my interpretation of capabilities: they replace PIDs in a way that they basically become akin to object pointers, with all the extensibility and security. It's a pretty wild prototype, with a ring-0 kernel that's less than 2k lines which only deals with paging and interrupts, and the userspace is one-scheduler-per-core and a stackless design on a linear address space. A design goal is MAXIMUM performance and simplicity: in most cases a sending a message to another capability is no heavier than a function call, unless the destination is currently busy.

Processes just export a

    void handle(void *cap_private_state, msg_t message)

entrypoint instead of a main function. I just want to see where I can take this idea.

Your idea sounds fun, too!

Here's my thing: Crazierl https://github.com/russor/crazierl/ demo (desktop recommended) at https://crazierl.org/demo/

Here's the other one: Tyn https://github.com/tyn-os/kernel

I haven't studied Tyn, I think from the high level we both have the same goals; enough kernel to run BEAM, and then BEAM does the rest. I wrote in C because learning Rust and bare metal OS stuff at the same time seemed like too much. Crazierl does much less in my kernel; my kernel handles time keeping, memory paging, interrupts, fallback console output, and a simple read only filesystem. Tyn includes device drivers and tcp/ip in the kernel as well. Crazierl runs BEAM compiled for FreeBSD and Tyn runs BEAM compiled for Linux (musl). Crazierl is x86 32-bit, Tyn is x86 64-bit.

IMHO, regardless of what your eventual target is, I would consider running on x86 with bios boot, because it means you can run in v86, which is handy for sending links to demos.

I think building a multiboot capable OS and relying on other people's loaders is a good step to reduce effort.

Starting with serial console also helps a little. VGA text isn't too bad, but UEFI (or other) framebuffer means you need a font renderer and all that. That might be fun and interesting, but it doesn't need to be in the critical path.

If you want to run on hardware, test frequently. Most of the emulators aren't super accurate in early boot, and let you get away with stuff that won't run on hardware. Serial console helps here, because on a pc, writing to the serial port is easy and your output will stay in the terminal even if the pc reboots.

Fully automated PXE boot is helpful too, if you get into a boot loop, it just keeps pulling the latest, and you can push a new binary and wait for the output without having to touch the device under test. Also handy once you get it working a bit... just reboot to pull in new code.

I built an x86 kernel 25 years ago at this point, this time around I chose RISC-V because it's much simpler to get it running, and speed of iteration is paramount on a prototype. There's less documentation but much less cruft. I eventually would like to try porting it to x86, and also to run the same programs — unmodified — on Linux. My first prototype was on Linux actually, but trying to figure out how to fit userspace preemptive scheduling with async IO/io_uring and the complexities of signal handling was literally more complicated than just writing a kernel.

Thank you for the links! I'll have a look when I have a moment in the next weeks and I might send you an email to discuss this further

this impromptu discussion on a completely random thread is why i love HN.