You're just rationalising. You know it's not a defensible position.

Sure it is, you're not even involved in the transaction. Just because someone pays Google to show an ad doesn't mean you have to look at it. USPS is funded by ads going through the mail and I throw them straight in the trash without remorse. I bet you do too. Bet you don't feel guilt about going to the bathroom or fast-forwarding your DVR during commercials either. Ad space is sold on the possibility that someone will see it and you don't owe anyone valuable ad real-estate.

It's wild how many people unironically think "drink verification can" is in any way acceptable.

> Just because someone pays Google to show an ad doesn't mean you have to look at it

Just because someone has an internet connection doesn't mean google has to serve them videos, either.

Such is their prerogative. You'll notice that nowhere are people saying "Google should have to give you a switch to turn off ads for free."

You act like that's a gotcha when "I owe you nothing, you owe me nothing" is the state I'm arguing for.

I’m confused. Google doesn’t serve every internet connection videos. The serve people asking for videos.

At no point did I suggest people should be forced to view ads.

I can't actually remember the last time I got mail-mail.

I think it's somewhat defendable when youtube doesn't give you an option to pay for what you'd be "stealing". Overall i agree with you, but lets not pretend that Youtube doesn't feel exploitative in the corporate behavior here. Especially considering the data they're stealing from me, harvesting and selling, etc.

Ie show me the ads i'm missing, and let me pay for the view. It would be what, $3|5|7/m or w/e in value? Instead they're trying to strongarm you into an upcharge of $14/m for additional services. Show me the data they're harvesting from my viewing patterns and the added revenue they're getting from that. Tie that into my "cost" each month and reducing how much i owe.

But of course they won't do that. Because this isn't an exchange. This isn't a service we're paying for, it's a data harvest where they want to have their cake and eat it too. This is scummy in the same way that my music software, Spotify, is trying to expand revenue streams and shoving more crap (podcasts, audio books, etc) down my throat.

If Youtube isn't going to try and play fair then i'd rather leave (and will) than pay them.

>I think it's somewhat defendable when youtube doesn't give you an option to pay for what you'd be "stealing".

https://www.youtube.com/premium

Not the person you're responding to, but from how they phrased it I suspect they'd be annoyed that they're having to pay for YouTube Music as part of Premium.

Exactly. I want to pay for what i'm supposed to be paying for. Not subscribe to extra services i don't use.

You're not just paying Youtube/Google for the ad, you're paying the content creators as well. You can always buy the music directly from artists if you don't like Spotify's revenue model. Or ditch Spotify and use the free Youtube Music subscription you get with premium, maybe combined it'd be worth the $14 to you.

Youtube music is actually pretty remarkable. I'm a jazz musician. One of the remarkable features of YouTube is that if you're looking for a particular recording of a jazz tune (e.g. Lou Donaldson's The Masquerade Is Over, on the Blues Walk album, 1953), it's just there. The depth of the collection is quite amazing.

And as an added bonus, if you subscribe you get no ads on youtube! :-P

If YT music is so great they could make it optional instead of making me pay for a second music streaming service that I don’t want or need.

I hope they get a big fat EU fine for (illegal here) joint sales.

> You're not just paying Youtube/Google for the ad, you're paying the content creators as well.

That would only be true if Youtube proportionally split my subscription to the videos i watch.

If anything, i'm advocating for exactly what you said - more than Youtube is. Ie show me how much i owe, and then whatever money i give youtube goes to content creators and the service provider. It's proportional to the service i consume, and is ultimately fair.

Instead what we get is something (in my view) massively upcharged. Bundled with service(s) i don't use, and set at a price point that i suspect well exceeds my usage of the service.

It sure is. I'm still watching their ads on every other site, but youtube ads for gambling and soda that interrupt while I'm watching someone talk about Bezier curves ? Na-ah.

All this performative righteousness is only going to end up hurting your cause in the long term. If a major site offers an ad-free option, and people refuse to take it, what does it tell the executives? What does it tell other publishers who are considering their monetization options? How do you think a business should respond to users that neither refuse to watch ads nor pay, can't be bargained with (see above), but nonetheless think they should be entitled to service? Companies aren't owed a viable business model, but consumers aren't owed a free service either.

the amount of ads on youtube has grown exponentially and i highly doubt this was because of profitability issues.

The problem is higher than zero intrest rates the free money dried up where before all the platforms were chasing infinte growth and free money meant they could run deficts as long as they grew they now need to make a profit now that debt costs money plus investor cash got sucked away to Bonds, CDs, and money market accounts giving a safe 5-7%. This is why every service went to shit at the same time in the past year.

In a hypothetical world without adblockers, wouldn't YouTube need to show a lower amount of ads per person to make the same amount of revenue?

No, look at cable. Companies will turn the dial up on ads as much as they can, consumers have shown that they'll tolerate the current level of ads on YouTube, Hulu, Netflix, etc.

It's no different than price points, not showing the amount of ads the market will bear is leaving money on the table.

That trickle down fever dream has been on repeat for ages now but still hasn’t come to fruition.

Has YouTube ever turned a profit?

Profit numbers for YT have never been broken out in financial reports.

They still mine your data…

Are you complaining about ads or data? The only way to avoid giving them data is to not use them, which also lets you avoid their ads and you don’t need a subscription. Simple solution.

i love paying for nebula and support my favorite creators there and blocking everything else on youtube