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Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by rurp on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:14PM (#37511790)
While there are some perverse incentives, I think this is overstating it. Millions of people enter the dating market every year by aging into it or ending a previous relationship. That seems like plenty of space to make a profitable business. Of course there is the temptation to increase the churn rate, but it doesn't have to be exploitative.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by JustinVx on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:37PM (#37512164)
Unless it’s some utopian value-based family company, the goal of any company will ultimately become to maximize profit and/or growth because that is what shareholders want.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by koromak on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:27PM (#37511995)
It literally does, if you're a publicly traded company.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by wpietri on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:37PM (#37512157)
It really doesn't, at least in the legal sense. Managers have wide legal latitude to run the business as they think best. However, in practice corporate boards tend to vote the short-term numbers, which combined with decreasing CEO tenure is a strong incentive for CEOs to do short-term, exploitative things. That's not always the case, though. Bezos, for example, built Amazon to its juggernaut status by ignoring the short terms numbers and doing a lot of long-term investment with a focus on increasing customer value. It's only lately that it's turned to exploiting its customers as well.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by Jensson on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:39PM (#37512186)
Regulations will catch up to it, maybe in 50 years. Look at cars, they started out as cobbled together death traps, but today they are very user friendly and safe (not the software, but the machinery). Those things didn't happen thanks to car companies being nice, but thanks to regulations.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by Karunamon on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:52PM (#37512367)
No it bloody well does not. The "maximize shareholder value" thing has never been read that strictly by a court of law (otherwise, Apple would have been ripe for a suit when they told off an activist investor rep who was upset they were pursuing environmental goals at the expense of better ROI [1]).

Companies hollow out (or enshittify) their products because it is easy and because it guarantees results at least in the short term. There are other ways to grow, and they tend to require imagination and long-term planning. Don't blame the stock market for entirely voluntary choices of taking the easy way out.

[1]: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/03/at-apple-shareholder...

Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by grotorea on Thursday September 14, 2023 @05:16PM (#37514963)
Yes but it doesn't have to be upheld in a court of law. It just has to be what corporate officers are ordered, selected and incentivized around. It doesn't need to be legally required for people to do something.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by collaborative on Thursday September 14, 2023 @07:45PM (#37516314)
For decades now bilionares have bought companies, improved numbers in the short term, and sold them for a profit
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by unmole on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:55PM (#37512402)
This stupid meme needs to die.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by c0balt on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:46PM (#37512292)
It does when one of, if not the only, important metric is growth. And for many publicly traded companies that act in the social/dating space growth tends to be a key metric. After some point the "natural" growth and contraction of the market will be a limiter. It's also arguably easier to handle a recurring user than having to spend time on acquiring new users to a platform.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by phkahler on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:47PM (#37512305)
>> That seems like plenty of space to make a profitable business.

Sure, but VCs and big companies want to maximize profit, not just be profitable. When a profitable startup sells out, that's the founders also saying "profitable isn't enough for me".

Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by rbultje on Thursday September 14, 2023 @03:07PM (#37513343)
> When a profitable startup sells out, that's the founders also saying "profitable isn't enough for me".

Or just "I'm done with this shit". It's remarkably difficult to run a small (software) business in the US. Section 174, multi-state income tax filings. It's a bloody pain if your goal is not just to operate the business and be overhead, but to actually do stuff. Regulatory/tax complexity thresholds depending on business size would be a welcome improvement.

Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by pjerem on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:51PM (#37512360)
The point is, even if it works, if you need 4 months for it to work instead of 1 month, that is 4 times the revenue for them.

So yes, it have to work, at least for their reputation, but it also have to not work that much.

Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by szundi on Thursday September 14, 2023 @01:56PM (#37512425)
Sorry to point out that whatever you could make helping your clients happily leave you forever, you can make 5x that making them suffer. It is simple math.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by imbnwa on Thursday September 14, 2023 @02:00PM (#37512473)
Also you'll be acquired by Match.com
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by HeyLaughingBoy on Thursday September 14, 2023 @04:25PM (#37514381)
This is not a convincing argument. If a dating site can't get people to match, they're likely to stop using it, just like any other product/service you pay for that doesn't work.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by intended on Thursday September 14, 2023 @04:51PM (#37514684)
Casinos are very profitable.

A casino with no physical upkeep ?

Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by grotorea on Thursday September 14, 2023 @05:12PM (#37514911)
Yeah I think this is the missing part. Even if enshittification is more profitable, people should still be able to just change services to a better one.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by skeaker on Thursday September 14, 2023 @06:13PM (#37515523)
Change to what? Another match.com-owned service?
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by grotorea on Thursday September 14, 2023 @06:47PM (#37515822)
Yeah that's the part I haven't figured out. Why isn't there a offering for the market demand for something like old OKCupid? A dating site doesn't seem like an enterprise that needs a lot of startup capital or anything.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by Miraste on Thursday September 14, 2023 @05:35PM (#37515163)
The user won't leave simply because the product doesn't work; they'll leave if they believe it won't work. For dating apps, tricking users is more profitable than trying to match them. Hence all the psychological warfare: fake profiles, new account boosts, fake likes, blurred out likes, paid boosts, swipe stack interface, etc. etc.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by pcthrowaway on Thursday September 14, 2023 @05:41PM (#37515230)
> If a dating site can't get people to match, they're likely to stop using it

And if it succeeds in getting people to match, they definitely stop using it.

"Likely to stop using it" is the better outcome for them in terms of customer retention

Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by HeyLaughingBoy on Thursday September 14, 2023 @09:33PM (#37517106)
Most relationships don't last forever; people come back to what they know worked before.
Re:Tyranny of the Marginal User: why software gets worse, no... by lallysingh on Thursday September 14, 2023 @06:15PM (#37515534)
Unless you have competition.