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Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by DoingIsLearning on Monday November 28, 2022 @07:54AM (#33773012)
I think the article paints this as a multi-factor contribution to the yields in the Netherlands. But all the high-tech examples are marginal volume wise.

The major factors in the success of the Netherlands is:

- Insanely fertile clay soil

- Careful water management

- Large square footage of greenhouses,

Everything else in the article is kind of vapourware.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by emrvb on Monday November 28, 2022 @08:16AM (#33773235)
I'm from the Netherlands and I must agree. The entire article reads as a sponsored item.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by radicalbyte on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:08AM (#33774527)
We have the top agri/bio university in the world here too which I assume is a massive plus and an area which is basically Silicon Valley for agri/bio tech (where I live).
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by brodouevencode on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:15AM (#33774607)
What's the name of this university?
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by Jasp3r on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:19AM (#33774659)
Wageningen University
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by brodouevencode on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:14AM (#33774598)
Maybe a sponsored mea culpa for the protests? https://finance.yahoo.com/news/netherlands-buy-farmers-amid-...
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by emrvb on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:54AM (#33775147)
The protests are coming from individual farmers, the article is a feel good story about large(r) companies profiting from those farmers.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by Maarten88 on Monday November 28, 2022 @12:23PM (#33776407)
Those same large agri companies are working behind the scenes to stir up the farmer protests, hiding behind likable small family farmers. See some recent TV commercials to positively frame farmers' image. But many of those farmers are not a small family business anymore, they are very profitable businesses and the owners want to continue making those profits, increasing emissions which are already too high for our very small country.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by whythre on Monday November 28, 2022 @04:04PM (#33779616)
“But many of those farmers are not a small family business anymore, they are very profitable businesses…” My wife is a small business owner and it is rough as hell. Directing shit at the farmers who actually managed to be successful and grow their operations seems really stupid.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by l3uwin on Tuesday November 29, 2022 @01:39AM (#33784378)
Not all small business are farms and not all farms are small businesses
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by anigbrowl on Monday November 28, 2022 @12:54PM (#33776903)
It's clickbait, that's why they don't put 'the Netherlands' in the headline. It's better to edit a headline when submitting an otherwise interesting story to HN than to perpetuate this sort of marketing-speak.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by usrusr on Monday November 28, 2022 @08:21AM (#33773289)
Import of (fossil based) fertilizer and of animal feed that's converted into another form of imported fertilizer by the primary use aren't major factors?
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by DoingIsLearning on Monday November 28, 2022 @08:25AM (#33773334)
No in the sense that they are not diferentiating factors, i.e. everybody else is also doing that and yet don't have surplus of food.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by usrusr on Monday November 28, 2022 @09:43AM (#33774171)
Chances are they are, per capita, importing a lot more than others (haven't looked it up but I'd be surprised if they didn't, happily surprised that is), and if that's the case, "others do it too" (but less of it) doesn't rule out that the nl food surplus is more a form of processing (of other countries agricultural output) than of domestic production, that just hides behind the different classification of imports and exports (one isn't food, the other is). How much agricultural surplus would there still be if they were isolated for a few years?
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by dtech on Monday November 28, 2022 @09:49AM (#33774265)
This is easily researched [1]. While NL exports inflated due to having a large port with a lot of imports, they are still a large net exporter compared to size.

[1] https://www.cbs.nl/en-gb/news/2022/03/agricultural-exports-e.... In monetary values, 28% is re-exports and 72% is exports.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by usrusr on Monday November 28, 2022 @09:58AM (#33774391)
Easily researched? Imports and exports are usually compared in terms of € or USD and sure, if you process feed into meat you will make a surplus or you wouldn't do it. But for agriculture, a more fitting unit would be the nitrogen involved, and I'm pretty sure that imports greatly outweigh what's exported in food.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by cpursley on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:13AM (#33774590)
Not to mention decades of previously cheap natural gas...

Aren't they shutting down greenhouses now fir to exposing energy costs?

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by DoingIsLearning on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:49AM (#33775038)
I think that is mostly flower greenhouses but could be wrong.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by emrvb on Monday November 28, 2022 @11:02AM (#33775263)
No really. The modern greenhouses act as little power plants, burning gas and generate electricity for the grid when demand is high, or act as a sink with electric heat when demand is low.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by cpursley on Tuesday November 29, 2022 @06:20AM (#33786153)
Interesting, didn't know that.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by MonaroVXR on Tuesday November 29, 2022 @11:06PM (#33796904)
Source?
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by cpursley on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:15AM (#33774608)
Not to mention decades of previously cheap natural gas...

Aren't they shutting down greenhouses now due to exploding energy costs?

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by perihelions on Monday November 28, 2022 @11:20AM (#33775507)
Technically, the Netherlands were a net *exporter* of natural gas for most of modern history (1950's - 2018-ish).

https://www.reuters.com/article/netherlands-gas-imports-idUS...

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by chaoz_ on Monday November 28, 2022 @08:52AM (#33773634)
No, it's square meterage
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by ChuckNorris89 on Monday November 28, 2022 @08:54AM (#33773649)
I have a few issues with this pro Netherlands agriculture piece:

1. Vegetables grown in the Netherlands tend to taste very bland in my experience (personal taste), tough I can't complain for the price as they're usually the cheapest option in local supermarkets. If you want great tasting organic veggies you get them at the farmers market which has higher prices than the supermarkets and is only open on certain times of the day/week making convenience an issue as well.

2. The conditions I witnessed in which animals are farmed in the Netherlands are appalling.

The amount of diseased animals (infected bloody wounds and swollen limbs from puss), overpacked in their own feces, will turn anyone vegetarian.

To be fair, the Netherlands is not alone here but in general, then animal conditions I witnessed in places like Germany, Austria or Switzerland were on average better than in the Netherlands.

Disclaimer: I work in tech for the farming industry

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by emrvb on Monday November 28, 2022 @09:36AM (#33774077)
1. The good stuff is for export.

2. Would you reckon your experience applies to the average animal farm in the Netherlands or does it apply to the farms where your tech gets applied?

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by ChuckNorris89 on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:07AM (#33774510)
1. It was the stuff for export (I'm not based in the Netherlands)

2. My anecdotal evidence is restricted only to the farms I visited which in my opinion tend to represent the typical/average medium to large scale farms catering to the usual meat suppliers you'll find in local supermarket or big butcher/meat chains regardless of country.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by emrvb on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:13AM (#33774589)
1. I guess we're overproducing the bland stuff then.

2. Fair enough. My own anecdotal evidence hasn't been that bad. But then again, I haven't seen an industrialized pigpen yet.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by someotherperson on Monday November 28, 2022 @11:46AM (#33775874)
> Vegetables grown in the Netherlands tend to taste very bland in my experience (personal taste)

I see this raised often. It's almost exclusively because the cultivars used are specifically chosen for yield and hardiness in transport and storage. The "organic" stuff grown in a farm 20km away and only needs to be transported for half an hour, on the other hand, are just cultivars that can be selected for reasons other than hardiness. This type of cultivar can also be mass-produced although it becomes a lot more expensive for the producer and the customer.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by ska on Monday November 28, 2022 @12:59PM (#33776980)
> the cultivars used are specifically chosen for yield and hardiness in transport and storage.

This is the core of the problem, and it's obviously not the Netherlands exclusively, it's a feature of modern agribusiness.

We've spend decades mostly optimizing for things that are not taste and nutrition, and it worked - at the expense of those things.

A lot of this is on consumers of course. Voting with your wallets for bland but uniform-and-pretty has a knock on effect.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by neves on Wednesday November 30, 2022 @09:47AM (#33801443)
A really good book about this is Michael Pollan's: The Omnivore Dillema: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Omnivore%27s_Dilemma

I can't recommend it enough. It really changed my mind about food.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by Jasp3r on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:19AM (#33774652)
Do you have some data to backup this bold claim?
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by DoingIsLearning on Monday November 28, 2022 @10:39AM (#33774915)
Does the Washigton post have any data at all about how robotic arms or seed design are driving the farming yields in the Netherlands?
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by Mistletoe on Monday November 28, 2022 @01:25PM (#33777410)
But it’s almost certain they don’t use the clay soil in the greenhouses, right?

You almost always grow in soilless medium or hydroponics in greenhouses.

Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by bergenty on Monday November 28, 2022 @06:35PM (#33781461)
I’ve never heard of clay soil being referred to as fertile. What exactly grows in clay soil? Generally vegetables don’t grow in clay soil, neither do a lot of fruit trees.
Re:Cutting-edge tech made this tiny country a major exporter... by shellfishgene on Tuesday November 29, 2022 @08:32AM (#33787325)
Also it's second largest exporter by value, not by calories. So they are not exactly "feeding the world".