News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by Steltek on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @09:08AM (#32564368)
Nope. Resale value is way too forward thinking for a corporation these days, it's all about short term profit. McD's has been chasing modern fashion and trying to distance themselves from your childhood's nascent obesity crisis, with salads on the menu and apple slices instead of fries in happy meals. Hence you get this "McCafe" look so they can camouflage themselves next to the Starbucks next door.

That said, the article is good at highlighting a huge cultural trend. Resale value might be only partially a driver of it. A lot of my monochromatic purchases will never be resold to anyone.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by cowpig on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @09:44AM (#32564816)
> Nope. Resale value is way too forward thinking for a corporation these days, it's all about short term profit.

This kind of blanket statement is almost always wrong about anything in the messy real world.

But it's especially wrong in this case. McDonald's is effectively a real estate company[0] that has been growing over ~80 years.

[0] https://thestrategystory.com/2020/09/24/mcdonalds-real-estat...

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by nickelcitymario on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @10:45AM (#32565664)
> But it's especially wrong in this case. McDonald's is effectively a real estate company[0] that has been growing over ~80 years.

I don't think this contradicts the contention that McDonald's is too short-term in its thinking to be worried about resale value.

Yes, they're a real estate company. But most of that real estate is never sold or rented to anyone other than McDonald's franchisees.

I think they designed the stores this way because they believe -- and probably have troves of data to support them -- that this style of architecture is better for their restaurants too.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by WalterBright on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @11:35AM (#32566449)
> McDonald's is too short-term in its thinking

It's not credible that a corporation that grows from one restaurant into world dominance is guilty of "short-term" thinking.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by sophacles on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @12:27PM (#32567296)
It's equally un-credible to pretend the people who were making decisions 30 years ago are the same people making decisions today. Or to pretend that the type of thinking required to grow a restaurant into a juggernaut is the same type of thinking that maintains the juggernaut. Or that a corporation beholden to the desires of shareholders won't change behavior as the desires of those shareholders change.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by WalterBright on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @03:04PM (#32569676)
Why would the shareholders want short term thinking? Stock valuations are based on future expected profits.

Short term thinking leads to a crashing stock value, followed by bankruptcy.

Investors don't want that.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by nickelcitymario on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @04:40PM (#32571176)
...are you really arguing corporations aren't driven by quarterly and annual results?

If I do something today, and the corporation benefits in 10 years, I don't get the credit for that. Whoever has my role in 10 years gets the credit.

I completely agree that corporations SHOULD think long-term. But I fail to see much evidence of that.

If you want to argue that Ray Kroc had a long-term vision, you'd probably be right. But I very much doubt today's management thinks that far out.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by WalterBright on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @05:09PM (#32571552)
> But I fail to see much evidence of that.

Every large company on the stock exchange is evidence of that.

> are you really arguing corporations aren't driven by quarterly and annual results?

Have you ever seen companies beat their quarterly earnings estimates, and yet their stock drops? That's because the shareholders were suspicious that those results were short term, and the long term outlook didn't look so hot.

Any shareholder that is suspicious that a corporation has sacrificed the long term for short term profits, is going to dump that stock. Wouldn't you?

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by sophacles on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @07:35PM (#32573046)
Investors are not a single unified hive mind. Some people don't care about long term profitability - they are just in a relatively short-term position and want profits now in the form of dividends and increased price. Some people want the valuation and/or price to go down because they hold short positions. Some people want the company to forego dividends in favor of investment into long-term expansion while other people are hoping for those dividends as part of their retirement income. This is true for institutions too - they have all sorts of reasons to prefer short term gain as much as they want long term gain.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by WalterBright on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @11:43PM (#32574747)
Haha, the stock will tank on bad future prospects faster than you can sell. Being a short-termer in a stock only works if the other stockholders are in it for longer than you are, and believe in the long-term prospects.

Dividends are not a sign of short term investing. When the company's profits decline from short term thinking, the dividends disappear.

BTW, if you identify a company that is short-terming, and the other investors haven't caught on and tanked the stock, you can make a mint by shorting the stock. Got any success stories at that? Have you made money shorting McDonald's?

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by queuebert on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @11:20AM (#32566200)
Maybe just cheaper to build and only loses 5% of the brand recognition when the giant arches are still on a sign out front.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by bko on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @09:39AM (#32564764)
> Resale value is way too forward thinking for a corporation these days, it's all about short term profit

This is a commonly repeated trope that is just wrong. Corporations are very forward looking. Consider the price earnings ratio of the S&P500. It's been on a general upward trend since the 80s, only disrupted by recessions and stock market crashes [0]. That means stock holders are willing to invest more money for future earnings. Discount rates are also very low historically which means future earnings are discounted at a lower rate.

Similarly the number of companies that earn no profit is very high:

> Of the largest 1,500 companies by market capitalization today, around 200 weren’t profitable during any of the last three years. But instead of punishing them, investors have rewarded them with a total market value of more than $2.3 trillion. Wall Street hasn’t been willing to attach such high market values to unprofitable companies since the late 1990s (and even then, the total market valuation of the unprofitable companies wasn’t even half of what it is now). [1]

Private R&D spending is also on an upward trend since the 50s as a percentage of GDP, displacing much of federal spending in R&D. [2]

Everywhere you look you'll see long term thinking is rewarded. The only place you hear complaints about "short term profit" is corporate managers that want cover for bad results. They can always say they're "investing for the future" and their investments will take a decade to pan out, but conveniently they won't be around by then.

I doubt you can find any Excel valuation template that's used in business school that does not include resale value. You can bet the people in charge of purchasing McDonald's real estate look very closely at resale value.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclically_adjusted_price-to-e...

[1] https://money.com/stock-market-companies-no-profits/

[2] https://cglife.com/blog/recent-trends-in-rd-spending-the-lan...

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by kelseyfrog on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @11:30AM (#32566377)
> Of the largest 1,500 companies by market capitalization today, around 200 weren’t profitable during any of the last three years. But instead of punishing them, investors have rewarded them with a total market value of more than $2.3 trillion. Wall Street hasn’t been willing to attach such high market values to unprofitable companies since the late 1990s (and even then, the total market valuation of the unprofitable companies wasn’t even half of what it is now).

Please stop posting this. It only makes Marx's falling rate of profit[1] look correct.

1. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tendency_of_the_rate_of_prof...

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by CrazyStat on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @12:12PM (#32567105)
I don't get it. Is this some kind of ideological self-censorship? We're not supposed to talk about this even though it's true because it might make Marxists happy?

What exactly are we supposed to be gaining by burying our heads in the sand and refusing to talk about high-valuation unprofitable companies?

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by fezfight on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:26PM (#32568156)
Dont just open your argument with 'Nope'. It makes you sound like an ass. Like the people who start with 'sorry' and then go on to demonstrate that they're not in fact sorry.

You could say, 'Ive always thought' or 'I have evidence that demonstrates that your point isn't totally correct' or something that respects the original poster a bit more than outward dismissal.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by aeternum on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @02:10PM (#32568810)
Nope is more attention-grabbing, the real question is whether it is better to optimize for civility or attention.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by kidme5 on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:46PM (#32568449)
It's also possible they're both correct.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by BLanen on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @10:12AM (#32565204)
You understand that the operators of the McDonald's don't own the building? The owners of the building have obvious incentives.

It's not even a long-term vs short-term thing.

The boring building increases your capitalization as a holding more, allowing you to financialize it more.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by dmd on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @09:33AM (#32564682)
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by GekkePrutser on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @10:26AM (#32565393)
Here in Spain they've never gone.

The breakfast menu has been cancelled here though since Corona and never returned :'( I miss my sausage and egg muffin.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by bbarn on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @12:31PM (#32567363)
Ah, that explains it. We went to Mallorca last year (from Iceland where I've lived for a few years after leaving the US) and I was SUPER excited about McD's breakfast, only to find they sold nothing but burgers :(
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by GekkePrutser on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:43PM (#32568409)
Yeah it's sad, I agree. Their breakfast is lovely, and it was one of the few places to get something like this, most places serve more Spanish style stuff like a sandwich with a potato omelet in between. In fact McDonald's even had their own version of this one too. But they also did the usual ones.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by rhino369 on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @11:25AM (#32566295)
Gone entirely or just no longer served all day?

In America, Covid killed the "all day breakfast," which is a shame. Sausage and egg muffin is better than all their lunch/dinner food.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by FractalParadigm on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @12:01PM (#32566915)
Meanwhile in Canada we got to keep all-day breakfast, but lost out on a handful of only-at-breakfast items. McGriddles were gone, but came back around January of this year. Breakfast McWraps were also taken away but haven't yet returned (far superior to Tim Horton's farmers wraps, IMO). Otherwise I don't think the lunch/dinner menu changed at all.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by GekkePrutser on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:40PM (#32568368)
Gone entirely. Here in Spain it was never served all day. Until 10:30 or so they served only the breakfast menu and after that only the regular one.

So now it's the regular menu all day. Big mac for breakfast? Hmmm. No.

In fact I've never seen all-day breakfast at any McDonald's in Europe and I've traveled a lot for work (so a lot of hit & run breakfasts at airports)

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by grogenaut on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @11:32AM (#32566403)
We still have all day breakfast out in Seattle, just not the full menu. My go to is sausage patty, round egg, yellow cheese.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by GekkePrutser on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:46PM (#32568452)
Yum yeah... That's the one I miss!

I always wondered how they get the eggs so round but one time I saw them make them.. They fry the egg on the burger plate but in a metal ring. Cool idea.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by helloworld11 on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:12PM (#32567956)
what the hell does COVID have to do with the all-day breakfast though? How does cancelling it in any way mean anything for COVID policies or spread?
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by frosted-flakes on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:23PM (#32568109)
It doesn't. For a while the Mcds near me had a reduced menu, probably because they had less business and a reduced menu was easier to maintain. But it's back to normal now, including all-day breakfast (Canada).
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by aetherson on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @10:45AM (#32565669)
Happy meals have both fries and apple slices. Source: have children.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by swayvil on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @11:59AM (#32566885)
Red Delicious?
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by dathmar on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @12:16PM (#32567153)
I think they are Grannies. Taste pretty good. But there is an option for fries and apples or double fries. So pretty much it's almost always double fries.
Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by swayvil on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @12:18PM (#32567174)
Good.

My friend grew up with a hatred for apples because her school cafeteria served only Red Delicious.

Best apple I ever had was a Pippin.

Re:Color has been disappearing from the world by fmajid on Tuesday August 23, 2022 @01:54PM (#32568575)
Could be worse, they could have been the cardboardy golden delicious.