News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by Groxx on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @02:42AM (#17957614)
Per item? Sure. For small numbers of items, counting time spent waiting? Heck no, I regularly get through self-checkout much faster than people who get into a regular queue, in no small part because there's often a few times more self-checkout scanners than there are open checkouts.

When you have a full cart or two, the speedier scanning at a traditional checkout pays off. But usually both are available, not just self checkout, so you're free to choose when that isn't the case.

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by NeedMoreTea on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @08:54AM (#17959262)
Not round here.

The big Tesco nearby has a single combined queue for all the 20 or so self-scan checkouts. They are rarely all in service. With a few items it is now always faster to go to an operator checkout unless you go in at 4am. The express lanes of "under 10 items" or "cash only" are a memory of a former, much faster time.

There is often an employee aggressively marshalling people to the self-scan checkouts at every available opportunity and trying to pull them away from the staffed lines.

In the local Pound shop they tried replacing all checkouts with self-scan, getting rid of all others. They had to reverse this a month or two later and put back half a dozen, now brand new, staff operated tills - ripping out a few weeks-old self-scanners to make space. They are again slower thanks to rarely having staff nearby to handle the steady stream of staff authorisations and errors, so there's a big delay every time someone wanders over from the back of the store to wave their bar code and immediately disappear again.

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by tim333 on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @05:41PM (#17963628)
Sometimes it works though. At the Kings Cross Waitrose off peak there isn't a queue and the whole process is pretty quick. The good ones don't even bother weighing the stuff which speeds things.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by Spooky23 on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @09:35AM (#17959558)
Checkout queue optimization at a supermarket is pretty easy. It's all about time per scan. A good cashier (60-70 scans per minute) can be something like 50% more productive due to scan time savings. A slow cashier (10 scans per minute) is a drag.

Self-checkout is all about cutting labor hours, period. It is both slower and leads to much higher shrink (as much as 150% more) than a manned casher. Stores hope to make more money by keeping the store open longer. The hacks around the slowness of checkout without cashiers is for people optimizing for time is online ordering or shopping at midnight.

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by hospes on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @10:42AM (#17960124)
>> Self-checkout is all about cutting labor hours, period.

That is exactly the case. If you pay 10$ an hour for 3 shifts 8 hours each, this makes 3x8x10 = $240 a day. That is $7200 in 30 days per one checkout spot. To setup equipment for self-checkout and maintain it order of magnitude cheaper compared to self checkout. Another factor is eliminating managerial overhead while dealing with human beings, as one store manager told me referring to self-checkouts: "They are never sick, they do not have an attitude, they do not quit and they can't be rude to customers".

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by JoeAltmaier on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @10:43AM (#17960135)
Oh they can be rude to customers all right! And their attitude - push this button! Scan again! Put that item back on the scale! Alert! Alert! I despise them with every fibre of my being.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by Groxx on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @07:38PM (#17964375)
Yeah, I think the "rude to customers" thing (I've heard it too) is far too focused on the act of rudeness rather than the effects (unhappiness / lower retention).

Self-checkouts trade one kind of unhappiness for another, and many (most?) are horrifying experiences. There are a few that are reasonably quick and user-friendly, but certainly not all. Most seem to be scraping the bottom of the barrel in an effort to squeeze a few more $ off the purchase price.

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by ambicapter on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @11:05AM (#17960375)
60-70 scans per minute? A scan per second? Yeah I'm not buying it.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by Spooky23 on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @11:58AM (#17960901)
When I was a front-end supervisor at a market in high school, about 10% of the cashiers hit that. IIRC, they got a $0.15/hr bonus.

If you scanned less than 20/minute you had about a month to get to 30 before you were either canned or lost hours.

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by joecool1029 on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @12:52PM (#17961372)
I’m guessing you’ve never been to an Aldi. They seem to have worked out high speed scanning.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by ambicapter on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @01:09PM (#17961505)
I have in fact never been to an Aldi.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by jtbayly on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @09:27AM (#17959512)
That’s not the right comparison. What you want to compare is how long it takes at a staffed queue vs an unstaffed one once you get to the front of the line (for the same purchase).

Things might be faster now with the unmanned ones, but the contention is that that’s only because they opened more checkout terminals. Granted, they wouldnt have done that with staffed ones because of the increased expense, but let’s not get confused about the real cause.

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by mdorazio on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @09:36AM (#17959568)
This seems like a faulty comparison. Space for registers is naturally limited. A single traditional register is replaced by 3 self-checkouts at my local grocery stores. Usually they opt for 6x self checkout replacing two traditional registers, manned by a single employee who can help with problems. In these cases it's not a question of staffing, but of space and the increase in space efficiency.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by rtkwe on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @09:44AM (#17959614)
As always it depends on what you want to measure. Comparing total checkout time including queuing though for 'speed (items/s)' is going to naturally favor the self-checkout because the choice between normal and self checkout is heavily weighted by the number of items a particular person has. Anecdotally I've never seen anyone go through self checkout with a full cart but see it all the time with the normal registers. Additionally there's rarely the same number of traditional registers actually staffed compared to the number of self checkouts.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by mdorazio on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @11:14AM (#17960470)
I agree. I would say that a better measure than items/s would be customers/hr (closer to throughput rather than speed) averaged across an entire store with and without self-checkouts. As you said, the optimal setup will depend heavily on the mix of customer types ("express" vs. full cart) a particular store gets. There's probably a good ratio for most stores between the two and I think that's what they're all converging on now.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by jtbayly on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @04:28PM (#17963057)
Agreed that space is a part of the comparison, but what I've seen is that although they put 3 checkouts in the y-axis space of a single staffed lane, they end up having to use up almost 3 times as much space in the x-axis to allow people to pass each other, which simply isn't necessary to allow in a staffed lane. So I don't believe the amount of space is that different.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by grkvlt on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @10:42PM (#17965218)
No, there really is a huge difference. It's more like 1.5 times the y-axis space in your example, they could get 6 self service checkouts in the space of 2 staffed ones:

    >|1|   |2|   <    >|1|      |4|<
     | |   | |         |2|      |5|
     | |   | |         |3|      |6|
Or similar. What does slow things down is elderly or people apprehensive of technology, and tourists or others encountering them for the first time...
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by phkahler on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @10:39AM (#17960098)
Space comes with a price too. If you ignore all costs, a traditional checkout that is read when you walk up is probably faster most of the time vs an available self-checkout.
Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by Groxx on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @09:16PM (#17964840)
>What you want to compare is how long it takes at a staffed queue vs an unstaffed one once you get to the front of the line (for the same purchase).

Maybe if you're selling a checkout system. Personally I care how fast I can go from "got things" to "left building". (or maybe more accurately: left home -> returned home, but that has a lot more variables)

Re:Dulles Airport Surprises Passengers with Facial-Recogniti... by base698 on Tuesday September 11, 2018 @08:58AM (#17959284)
Even a small number of produce items takes a long time because of the time to look up the number or find the sticker to enter and then weigh.