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Re:Privacy by trevoranderson on Wednesday September 27, 2017 @11:27PM (#15354324)
Apple is pushing the privacy angle pretty strongly now, and I can't really blame them. It's a key differentiator between them and their chief competitor.

The phones are good on their own, but when choosing between having every action tracked and keeping some things to yourself, unsurprisingly a lot of people want privacy. Here's hoping their marketing can help ordinary people who wouldn't normally care about privacy see why it's important (and maybe score some wins for privacy at the polls in the future!)

Re:Privacy by analogic on Thursday September 28, 2017 @12:01AM (#15354462)
Honestly on verge of switching, despite my deep disdain for the locked down walled garden. Hopefully their privacy stance is a raging success and catches on to every other service that I only minimally use due to the 'surveillance chill' effect. (..goes back to tracking my users)

If only it wasn't for that fscking no headphone jack..

Re:Privacy by photonios on Thursday September 28, 2017 @03:49AM (#15355504)
I was also upset about the lack of a headphone jack. When I got robbed and lost my iPhone 6S, I bought an iPhone 7. Similar to a comment down here, within a week; I was on a bus and I got stuck with my earphones cable. Phone went flying.

I decided I had enough of cables and bought a pair of wireless headphones. I am never going back to cables. The battery of mine lasts for 12 hours when continuously used. I charge it while I sleep. Now I am not missing the headphone jack anymore.

Re:Privacy by jusaduder on Thursday September 28, 2017 @04:52AM (#15355710)
Do you realize you can have both a headphone jack and wireless headphones? Best of both worlds.
Re:Privacy by hmhrex on Thursday September 28, 2017 @08:21AM (#15356547)
I don't believe that's the point he's making here. He's saying that he was annoyed that the iPhone 7 doesn't have a headphone jack, but after an accident (while using an adapter with the iPhone 7), he's convinced that wireless headphones are the best option, regardless of the device having a headphone jack or not.
Re:Privacy by zimpenfish on Thursday September 28, 2017 @11:52AM (#15358084)
I use a Taotronics dongle with non-wireless Etymotics with my 7. Gives about 20 hours between charges. Apart from a couple of ANNOYING UX glitches, it's a magical device. Brilliant on long walks - phone can go in the bag with a battery pack.
Re:Privacy by bigbugbag on Thursday September 28, 2017 @08:18AM (#15356533)
great move towards accelerating climate change and end of limited resources. you're a good obedient consumerist. keep privileging your own comfort over the global good.
Re:Privacy by stefco_ on Thursday September 28, 2017 @12:51AM (#15354718)
This is exactly what's keeping me in Apple's garden... I hate how they're moving core MacOS services away from open source, how they don't document their APIs, how they lock down their phones... and yeah, I miss my headphone jack, too.

Obviously they know damn well that there are people like us who value privacy enough to buy Apple in spite of all of the other unpalatable stuff. I just hope the demand gets high enough that other companies start catering to it as well.

Re:Privacy by JKCalhoun on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:21AM (#15355071)
> I just hope the demand gets high enough that other companies start catering to it as well.

Well, it's kind of the business Google is in though — selling your "privacy".

Re:Privacy by stefco_ on Thursday September 28, 2017 @08:04AM (#15356464)
Yeah, I don't expect anything better from them. I'd love to see some kind of decent open-source linux distro for phones, but I'm not holding my breath for the near-term future.
Re:Privacy by aerotwelve on Thursday September 28, 2017 @12:28AM (#15354604)
I recently bought a new Android phone, not out of any love for Google and their horrendous privacy policies, but out of love for my headphone jack.

Apple, what were you thinking?

Re:Privacy by hkjayakumar on Thursday September 28, 2017 @12:45AM (#15354695)
Apparently Google is also ditching the headphone jack[1] on the new Pixel line

[1] http://bgr.com/2017/07/27/pixel-2-rumors-no-3-5mm-headphone-...

Re:Privacy by guelo on Thursday September 28, 2017 @12:53AM (#15354729)
Luckily for consumers Android is a diverse ecosystem not controlled by one single manufacturer. There are many devices with headphone jacks to choose from.
Re:Privacy by 2muchcoffeeman on Thursday September 28, 2017 @01:21AM (#15354844)
What makes you think the other major manufacturers aren't going to follow suit?

It may just be a matter of time. Especially if 2 major companies normalise it, then all the other companies get to drop a feature and save a few cents on every phone.

Re:Privacy by dragonwriter on Thursday September 28, 2017 @03:15AM (#15355338)
Samsung's still making a flagship line with a stylistic after pretty much everyone else dropped smartphone styluses; and they brought back external SD cards, too, which a number of manufacturers (themselves included) dropped from flagship lines.

It's possible that dropping headphone jacks could become universal, but I don't see any reason to expect it's likely.

Re:Privacy by 2muchcoffeeman on Thursday September 28, 2017 @08:38AM (#15356626)
I can see wireless charging and waterproof devices becoming the norm.

Most people also buy headphones from popular brands rather than attempt to discern on sound quality.

I see quite a few AirPods and Bluetooth headphones these days. I don't think you can discount the possibility.

Re:Privacy by pebers on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:37AM (#15355151)
If there are enough customers that really want a headphone jack and everyone else was ditching them, it'd be a point of differentiation and hence worth those few cents for some manufacturer to offer one. I suspect that won't happen though because it'll transpire that most customers don't really care that much.
Re:Privacy by pjmlp on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:58AM (#15355253)
Which usually don't have OS upgrades beyond what they were sold with, and Project Treble won't change that, because OEMs are the ones expected to ship OS updates.

So headphone jacks without updates, hurray!

Re:Privacy by dragonwriter on Thursday September 28, 2017 @03:09AM (#15355304)
> Which usually don't have OS upgrades beyond what they were sold with

Flagships usually do (Samsung flagships, and numerous phones lower in their line, tend to get two major version updates.)

> and Project Treble won't change that

If update practices are something a worthwhile market segment looks to in buying decisions, and Trello makes it easier on OEMs because their is a cleaner isolation of the device-specific pieces, then, I'd expect it to make more OS updates happen.

Re:Privacy by pjmlp on Thursday September 28, 2017 @03:35AM (#15355434)
On my home country the minimum wage is around 400 euros, not many people can afford two month salaries for the privilege of getting OS updates.
Re:Privacy by la_oveja on Thursday September 28, 2017 @03:44AM (#15355478)
Good thing I can compile my own Android builds.
Re:Privacy by pjmlp on Thursday September 28, 2017 @05:01AM (#15355744)
99% of regular consumers don't.
Re:Privacy by wingworks on Thursday September 28, 2017 @01:37AM (#15354904)
I hope so, I never use my headphone jack. Wouldn't miss it for a second. Would much rather have a more waterproof and thinner phone.
Re:Privacy by piyush_soni on Thursday September 28, 2017 @12:50AM (#15354715)
All the more reason to curse Apple for its "courageous" step :(
Re:Privacy by callumlocke on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:58AM (#15355254)
I used to think that was a huge issue. But my friend bought an iPhone 7 and he says it's just not a problem in practice. He keeps the adaptor permanently attached to his (non-Apple) headphones. It's not like you have to fiddle around with the adaptor every time you use your headphones.

Obviously I'd prefer to keep the jack socket on my phone, I'm just saying it's a minor issue. I think people like to focus on it because it feels like the prototypical Apple dick-move, but it's not that big a deal e.g. compared to the walled garden thing.

Re:Privacy by cjsuk on Thursday September 28, 2017 @03:00AM (#15355265)
I’m going to be honest, I bought a 6s instead of a 7 because of the 3.5 jack and within a week managed to shut the earphones in a car door. This lead to a trip to my local electronics retailer to get some replacements. They only had lightning ones so I reluctantly bought them.

So far, this isn’t really crippling. I use some sennheisers when at home with the mac and use the earphones when I’m out. If they remove the 3.5 jack from the Mac I’ll be more pissed.

Re:Privacy by JumpCrisscross on Thursday September 28, 2017 @03:35AM (#15355436)
> Apple, what were you thinking?

Reasonable steps towards a waterproof phone?

Re:Privacy by AndrewDucker on Thursday September 28, 2017 @06:36AM (#15356088)
Sony has no problems making a waterproof phone with a headphone jack.

(Although you do have to give it a shake when you take it out of the water)

https://support.sonymobile.com/global-en/dm/water-and-dust-r...

Re:Privacy by threeseed on Thursday September 28, 2017 @12:46AM (#15354699)
> Apple, what were you thinking?

They were thinking that AirPods and similar are the future of audio.

And for those who have more discerning needs they ship a dongle with the phone that you can leave permanently attached to your wired headphones.

Re:Privacy by cyphar on Thursday September 28, 2017 @01:35AM (#15354895)
Have they solved the "I want to charge my phone but also listen to music" problem yet? Or does it still require ridiculous amounts of daisy-chaining?
Re:Privacy by veidr on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:07AM (#15355018)
The Apple way to solve that is: you pay them a $159.00 wire removal fee, they will eliminate the wire part of your headphones.

https://www.apple.com/airpods/

Re:Privacy by rorykoehler on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:11AM (#15355034)
So we pay a ton of money for good headphones. Invest in high quality audio services. Then buy a new phone, are forced to buy shitty ear pods that pipe audio via a lossy audio codec.
Re:Privacy by LeoPanthera on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:42AM (#15355170)
Or you can use wireless charging which leaves the lightning connector free.
Re:Privacy by usaphp on Thursday September 28, 2017 @01:47AM (#15354941)
I guess with wireless charging you can now do so.
Re:Privacy by Tehnix on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:21AM (#15355072)
> > Have they solved the "I want to charge my phone but also listen to music" problem yet? Or does it still require ridiculous amounts of daisy-chaining?

> I guess with wireless charging you can now do so.

Guess that settles that debate then, glad we can put that to rest going forward. (...I realise this sounds weirdly sarcastic?, but it's actually not)

Re:Privacy by mlnj on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:55AM (#15355230)
"Paired with wireless earphones, you don't need a headphone jack or a charging port"

(facepalm)

Re:Privacy by jeffhuys on Thursday September 28, 2017 @06:38AM (#15356096)
Exactly, awesome right? I would love a future without ANY cables.
Re:Privacy by piyush_soni on Thursday September 28, 2017 @02:49AM (#15355199)
> And for those who have more discerning needs they ship a dongle with the phone that you can leave permanently attached to your wired headphones.

But only one at a time - charger, or your dongle connected wired headphone. At some point, that phone's going to run out of battery. My normal use case is that I go on long drives with the phone getting charged using the car charger, while the audio output being sent to the car stereo. This change breaks my workflow even with their free included accessories.

Re:Privacy by piyush_soni on Thursday September 28, 2017 @01:38PM (#15359165)
I am seeing a strange trend on HN. Whenever someone writes something even remotely critical of Apple, it's downvoted, even if it's a fact. I neither wrote an opinion here, neither something insulting to anyone, it's still downvoted. I never thought I'd have to write the term 'fanboy' on HN, but that's what looks like the case.
Re:Privacy by piyush_soni on Friday September 29, 2017 @12:09AM (#15362650)
Yay fanboys!! :)
Re:Privacy by frik on Thursday September 28, 2017 @01:54AM (#15354962)
"iOS 11: toggling wifi and Bluetooth in Control Centre doesn't actually turn them off"

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/sep/21/ios-11-ap...

"Quick switch simply disconnects phone from access points and devices rather than turning off the radios, in move criticised by security researchers."

"On iOS 11, pressing the wifi toggle immediately disconnects the iPhone or iPad from any wifi networks, but leaves the wireless radio available for use by location services, scanning for the names of nearby wifi access points. The Bluetooth toggle operates in a similar fashion."

"To actually turn off Bluetooth and wifi users will need to head into the Settings app and manually turn them off, which deactivates them until 5am the next morning"

"But security researchers warn that having either wifi or Bluetooth active when not in use puts users at risk of attack, calling the change “stupid” and “not clear for the user”. Only recently researchers demonstrated that, due to a weakness in the implementation of Bluetooth in some smartphones and tablets, hackers could wirelessly hijack a device without the user having to accept a connection or download anything."

Re:Privacy by adamlett on Sunday October 01, 2017 @03:21AM (#15376789)
But security researchers warn that having either wifi or Bluetooth active when not in use puts users at risk of attack, calling the change “stupid” and “not clear for the user”

Let’s be clear. Leaving WiFi or Bluetooth active puts users at risk of attack in the same way that leaving your house to go anywhere puts you at risk of getting in a traffic accident.

Re:Privacy by Brotkrumen on Thursday September 28, 2017 @06:23AM (#15356036)
>which deactivates them until 5am the next morning

How cynical can you get? Jeez...

Re:Privacy by forapurpose on Thursday September 28, 2017 @01:03AM (#15354778)
> when choosing between having every action tracked and keeping some things to yourself, unsurprisingly a lot of people want privacy

Do they? I hope that's true, but the fact that Apple is selling it doesn't mean people are buying. Most people I talk to still have zero concern for privacy, unfortunately.