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Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by miguelrochefort on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:12AM (#15292816)
Who pays $1,199 for a Chromebook?
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by colemickens on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:39AM (#15293049)
I paid $1600 for a Chromebook Pixel LS because I knew it was great HW with Linux support. I have thousands set aside for a replacement laptop and I have problems with every single device, none of which are present on my two and a half years old Chromebook Pixel.

It runs a mainline kernel with full hardware support. It's the best for me.

Rumor has it, this new "Pixelbook" has a dev friendly keyboard (and checked the leaked shot... You can clearly tell it's not a standard Chromebook keyboard).

edit: I'd echo the comments about build quality. My average laptop life span is 12-18 months, yet I've been running this since it was released. This thing has put up with a lot, and looks like it could've come out of the box a week ago (save for a bright blemish in the screen from a foreign object in my bag, and the rubber strip being slightly ajar after adjusting the write protect screw).

Anyway, I'm not a fan of convertible laptops in general, but between the Linux support, great build quality, satisfaction with the 2015 model etc, I'll probably pick one up and see if I'm happy or want to just settle on the XPS 13.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by tacomonstrous on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:02AM (#15293247)
I've had exactly the same experience (though I only paid $1300 for mine). People keep asking me why I just didn't get a 'real laptop' for that price, and don't realize that they're asking me why I don't choose a worse experience. It's both amusing and annoying.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by pjmlp on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:19AM (#15292869)
I also don't get it, for that price I can get a nice general purpose laptop, with most likely a much better CPU/GPU combo.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by resoluti0n on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:36AM (#15293019)
A traditional GNU/Linux distro can also be installed bare metal on it. It's a much better option for your privacy. This eliminate Google's data mining of the whole desktop experience and give you better customization options at the same time.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by camus2 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:26AM (#15293459)
> A traditional GNU/Linux distro can also be installed bare metal on it

I can do the same on my $200 PC. Surely this isn't the best argument to buy a chrome book. What I don't get is why would people pay a premium for something that basically amount to a web browser? Ease of us? Just install Chrome on whatever PC you have and remove the rest of the apps...

> This eliminate Google's data mining of the whole desktop experience and give you better customization options at the same time.

Yes, by giving more money to Google...

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by pjmlp on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:14AM (#15293345)
I can already do that on a 300 euro laptop, which was sold with Ubuntu installed on it.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by neverminder on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:23AM (#15293419)
It's the same like saying "I don't need S class Mercedes, VW Polo has 4 wheels too.". Compare the specs of that 300 euro laptop and Pixel 2015 LS - that's not even the same league. I have Ubuntu installed on mine and with core i7, 16 GB of RAM it blows most of the laptops out of the water.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by pjmlp on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:51AM (#15293681)
The 8 GB RAM, 500 HDD, dual core CPU, DirectX 11 class GPU are more than enough for what I do with it.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by camus2 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:28AM (#15293476)
Now compare the possibilities of any decent OS versus what basically amounts to a browser... any OS can run a browser, why buy a machine that makes you use a browser exclusively and ties you to Google services for everything?
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by toast0 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @12:51PM (#15295846)
For non power users, a computer that basically just works into a browser, which is where they do most of their computing, and is really hard to mess up is a nice thing. This is great for my young child and my mother in law. I no longer have to fix their computers, because they don't break.

For power users, The intel core processor based chromebooks can run a standard Linux install as well, FreeBSD mostly works, and Windows can work with some effort. So you're not really locked in. There's a decent community of people packaging updated coreboot builds that get better at booting other operating systems over time.

I don't know that that the pixel appeals to me, but the low spec chromebooks are nice because they're cheap and they usually have decently up to date cpus -- I don't want/need a super fast CPU but I want the latest architecture. Most Windows laptops in the prices range are really bulky and have slow spinning drives instead of an SSD (granted, the SSDs are usually tiny in the chromebooks). At the price point of the Chromebook Pixel series, you're getting a higher tier CPU, so you do need to shop around and see if you're getting a good value for the parts, and if you like the system design. Honestly, I don't see why I would pay $1000+ for a laptop that doesn't have the cluster of keys around page up/page down, but I'm a dinosaur and my taste isn't very well reflected in the marketplace. At the $200 price range where I've bought a few chromebooks, I can manage using a keyboard without important keys. :)

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by yathern on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:31AM (#15293508)
It is pricey - but that's kinda the point. The value of the Pixel brand is equally about what it supplies the ecosystem with. Having a Chromebook that is high-end with all the new bells and whistles - and very well designed hardware brings attention to Chromebooks as a whole.

It signals that Chromebooks aren't just cheap devices for students - but that they can be performance devices as well. Luxury items even.

People see this good looking device - and if they don't like the price, may be interested in other Chromebooks. I wouldn't be surprised if the Samsung flip and C302CA get a surge of popularity because of this.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by cardiffspaceman on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:58PM (#15299747)
Yes the Corvette's importance to GM isn't the number of Corvettes sold, its the number of prospects who buy Camaros etc.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by partisan on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:42AM (#15293069)
I paid ~800 for a Dell Chromebook 13 + SSD upgrade and am very happy with it though I might, in retrospect, get a XPS 13 developer edition instead. I am happy with it all the same.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by coldtea on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:32AM (#15292970)
Those that value what the Chromebook offers over what a regular laptop with Linux does.

For many also $1099 is spare change -- at least when considering what computer they can buy.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by champagnepapi on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:45AM (#15293092)
Hopefully $1099 will be spare change for me soon! However, why can't someone get a cheaper laptop similar specs, perhaps worse design, just install linux on it?
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by tacomonstrous on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:00AM (#15293226)
In my experience, 'just install Linux on it' is only enjoyable till the first piece of hardware that fails to work as you expected it to (usually Bluetooth or the touchpad). Crouton on Chrome OS quite literally 'just works' and is at least as easy to install as Linux on a PC.

Also, why would I want worse specs? I'd rather get the best hardware I can, and if it looks good, even better.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by cat199 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @02:14PM (#15296675)
Definately mixed milage here I agree..

That said on the low end I bought an Acer CloudBook (Win-10 competitor to chromebook) about 2y back and literally everything works, including suspend, wifi, and all the rest.

When a linux install goes right, it's pretty great.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by coldtea on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:07AM (#15293830)
>However, why can't someone get a cheaper laptop similar specs, perhaps worse design, just install linux on it?

Because they want the "all Cloud, all the way" simplicity of a Chromebook as opposed to the "you're on your own" standard Linux operational mode.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by pgeorgi on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:55AM (#15293181)
"Just install Linux on it" means higher return rates due to all those people who didn't bother to read the specs. That might be more expensive to deal with than the $39 OEM Windows 10 Home license.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by jamespo on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:34AM (#15292992)
I'm not sure there's much overlap between your first group and your second group.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by coldtea on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:06AM (#15293825)
Membership in either group is totally orthogonal.

You can want a hassle-free Cloud-based computer whether you are a millionaire or unemployed.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by pjmlp on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:19AM (#15293393)
For me it certainly isn't spare change, and given that I was able to buy an Asus laptop with Ubuntu LTS pre-installed with about 300 euros, I don't really see the appeal.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by coldtea on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:10AM (#15293876)
As if the target audience for Chromebooks is seasoned systems developers with a thing for obscure 60s-90s programming languages?

I mean, let's get real, obviously it wouldn't appeal to you (doesn't appeal to me either).

But at least I can pretend to understand the proposition -- it's about never caring for backups and stuff, and having all your stuff in the Cloud, in a Google curated computing experience.

Not about specs or if one can install fvwm and xmonad on it.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by pjmlp on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:42AM (#15294263)
I just happen to think there are better ways to improve the world than buying expensive laptops to run a browser based OS.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by cat199 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @02:15PM (#15296684)
> obscure 60s-90s programming languages?

care to clarify?

Most of the new languages are written on unix-like systems first..

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by pjmlp on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @03:33PM (#15297411)
It was directed at me, because I am a big fan of strong typed systems programming languages all the way back to Burroughs B5000, and tend to be a bit vocal about it.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by coldtea on Thursday September 21, 2017 @06:11AM (#15301973)
Yep :-)
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by camus2 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:38AM (#15293562)
> Those that value what the Chromebook offers over what a regular laptop with Linux does.

And what does Chromebook offers?

> For many also $1099 is spare change -- at least when considering what computer they can buy.

You mean it's an expensive gadget for rich hipsters to use as a vulgar display of wealth? that's what Chromebook offers over a regular laptop? then by all means...

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by coldtea on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:12AM (#15293896)
>And what does Chromebook offers?

A Google-curated, hassle-free computing experience. Those that don't want one can always, I dunno, not buy it.

>You mean it's an expensive gadget for rich hipsters to use as a vulgar display of wealth?

No, I mean that if you're pinching pennies, you can always buy something else, even if you'd really like a Chromebook.

A Pixelbook is for those wanting such an experience, AND being able to afford one (And of course there are much cheaper Chromebooks out there).

If you don't like yourself a Chromebook, on the other hand, why are you even discussing this?

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by disconnected on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:16AM (#15293363)
And what, exactly, does a Chromebook offer?

Take this $1K device.

Hardware-wise, for that kind of price you can get a nice laptop. Heck, for $200 extra, you can even get a MacBook pro if you wanted.

Software wise, the value proposition looks even worse. Apple can justify that price tag because you are buying into the Mac ecosystem. Windows laptops can justify the price tag because, well, Windows is what people expect.

Chromebooks, however, have a "mobile-OS-pretending-to-be-a-desktop-OS" OS, irrevocably tied to the cloud and Google's services that runs "apps" and web applications disguised as desktop applications. Barf.

It's so bad that most people that cheer for these devices say "just put Linux on it".

Yeah, you know where else I can stuff Linux onto? Nearly every other Laptop in existence. Last 3 laptops in which I stuffed Linux Mint "just worked". WiFi, Bluetooth, suspend, everything. I'm either a fantastically lucky bastard, or maybe things aren't shit anymore (hint: I suck at poker).

Chromebooks made sense in their niche, as the next iteration of a netbook. One step above tablet (has a keyboard), but several steps (and dollars) below a full blown laptop. Once you cross that threshold, the value proposition looks like crap, because you can generally get a much better device.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by gangstead on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @11:49AM (#15295082)
I think you are confusing the benefits of Chromebooks in general with Google's Pixel Chromebooks. Aside from the Pixel line of > $1k Chromebooks are usually $150-$300 with a couple "premium" $500 models.

Chromebook's being tied to Google's services is a great feature for the easily replaceable vast majority of Chromebooks that are given to students, grandparents, children. They turn on in seconds and take basically zero management. Every time I open my wife's mac there are 5 updates waiting to install because she can't be bothered to click on the notification.

I take the Pixelbook (and earlier Chromebook Pixels) to be Google's attempt to do what people are criticizing Apple of forgetting to do: remember the power users. They don't plan to sell many of them but they want the option to be out there for a developer who might install linux on it anyways but also might take a stab at packaging their app on the Chromestore, or put it on the Canary channel and submit early bug reports. If a couple especially price insensitive casual users buy them that's just a bonus.

It might also have the effect of catching people's attention who then go on to buy a lower price Chromebook. Imagine a casual laptop shopper wants a small nice laptop. They look for a Macbook / Air because they are small seem pretty capable and have nice commercials. They also notice this Pixel because it's in the same price range and other search filters, so it must be similar, right? They find it runs this strange "ChromeOS" which is really just a browser. Come to think of it that's all they really need, what other Chromebooks are there? Ohh look here's one that does everything I was planning on doing with the Macbook for $300. This is not the typical HN reader, but I'd wager a good many laptop purchases work like this.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by Touche on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:54AM (#15293707)
I disagree, I find Chromebook's software to be superior. The fact that it boots up directly to a browser is a plus for me, that's where I spend 85% of my time anyways. That I don't have to worry about borking some system file is another plus.
Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by coldtea on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:04AM (#15293803)
>And what, exactly, does a Chromebook offer?

Not having to care about software and hardware specs like those you've mentioned.

Those people value closed OS that's irrevocably tied to the Cloud (as a good thing).

And I shouldn't even have to point it out. That's literally the marketing proposition behind Chromebooks from the start.

>It's so bad that most people that cheer for these devices say "just put Linux on it".

You'd be surprised.

Re:Google Pixelbook Is Google’s New Chromebook by 83457 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:34AM (#15292991)
Can you provide some examples and/or point us at related info elsewhere? Thanks!