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Re:The woes of Windows 10 by cm2187 on Thursday February 02, 2017 @05:11PM (#13555298)
There are plenty of bad parts too. The start menu keeps freezing regularly for me on multiple machines. Searching in the start menu returns random results. Settings scattered across multiple control panels is just absurd. In-OS advertising is a complete no go to me. The nagging to use edge too. The frequent forced reboots and full screen notifications are a nuisance. And it makes it really difficult to change default apps, on purpose I suspect.

I just don't like it. It's not about visual design. I couldn't care less about flat design vs windows 7 menus, etc. But it is functionally really bad.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Nition on Thursday February 02, 2017 @06:34PM (#13556075)
The dual control panels are ridiculous. I shouldn't have to go through two totally different interfaces just to change the mouse pointer speed. Type 'mouse' in the start menu, click the result, option isn't there, click 'Additional mouse options', totally different interface appears, go to the Pointer Options tab, drag the slider.

And I know this one has been done to death, but the privacy issue really is a major one - it seems to have expanded so much since the Win 7 days. There are several pages of scary privacy things to untick when installing Win 10, and then some optional ones are still enabled after you untick everything, so you've then got 16 (sixteen!) pages of privacy options in the control panel to check after install.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by scholia on Thursday February 02, 2017 @06:49PM (#13556207)
There's a lot in the Control Panel. The more you move to the new Settings app, the more complicated Settings gets. And if Microsoft didn't provide all those settings, or dropped the whole Control Panel, there would be a tornado of criticism.

Life is hard when you have 1.5 billion users, especially when a lot of them resist attempts to modernise or even update the system.

Do it all at once, they'll complain bitterly. Do it gradually, they'll complain bitterly. Don't do it at all, they'll complain bitterly. Which complaint would you like to make today> ;-)

On the good side, ordinary users have few problems with the Settings app, and it seems to do all they need -- or at least it comes close.

And the people who are resistant to change and are already familiar with the Control Panel can still use it.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Silhouette on Thursday February 02, 2017 @07:20PM (#13556431)
Life is hard when you have 1.5 billion users, especially when a lot of them resist attempts to modernise or even update the system.

That's true, but it's probably a lot harder when you've proven to be untrustworthy in what you include under "modernisation" or "updates".

Plenty of techie people warned that user-hostile behaviour like the GWX campaign or including non-security things in updates advertised as security patches would damage that trust and come back to bite them later. I think a lot of people didn't really believe that would be the case at the time, but as the article here notes, the adoption rates suggest otherwise.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by seanp2k2 on Thursday February 02, 2017 @11:56PM (#13557788)
Not to mention all the dark patterns around pushing the Win10 "upgrade" in the first place.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by scholia on Friday February 03, 2017 @02:08PM (#13562318)
True. They pushed their luck, and got more than 400 million users onto a new OS. Not only that, it's a much better OS.

The only people who actually suffered were the OEMs, who didn't get to sell new PCs to all those people whose old PCs got a new lease of life.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Silhouette on Friday February 03, 2017 @09:43PM (#13565331)
I'm pretty sure all the people who were complaining about being tricked into upgrading don't agree with you.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by scholia on Monday February 06, 2017 @12:15AM (#13576689)
I'm pretty sure that was a small minority of more than 400 million users. It didn't happen on any of my Windows PCs, nor to anyone I know personally.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Silhouette on Friday February 03, 2017 @01:24AM (#13558141)
Yes. (GWX = common shorthand for those "Get Windows 10" updates.)
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by SeanDav on Friday February 03, 2017 @01:15AM (#13558108)
> "... especially when a lot of them resist attempts to modernise or even update the system."

I am one of those holdouts, however I would have upgraded a long time ago if Windows 10 had allowed me control over upgrades/updates and had better privacy. After the tricks that Microsoft pulled, trying to force me to upgrade to Windows 10, I do not trust Windows 10 and you cannot feel that about an OS and install it.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by NTripleOne on Friday February 03, 2017 @06:44AM (#13559133)
Disable the windows update service and now you have manual control over updates (enable when you want to update).

There's also a billion and one "one click privacy fix" tools like TRONscript, etc.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by scholia on Friday February 03, 2017 @02:03PM (#13562270)
Your loss. I trust Windows 10 a lot more than Android, and I use that as well ;-)

The future is more-or-less-continuous updates based on telemetry. That's how Google and Facebook work as well. Microsoft will never go back to a 3-year upgrade cycle, and no business should want to do that either.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Nition on Thursday February 02, 2017 @07:05PM (#13556333)
I'd understand that more if it was all esoteric power-user type stuff that was missing in the new system. But stuff like mouse pointer speed?

Apparently Misrosoft has said that they do want to drop the old-style control panel eventually. I realise it's a huge job, but it feels very like a half-finished feature right now.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by grogenaut on Friday February 03, 2017 @12:17AM (#13557860)
Mouse speed IS power user stuff. Poll the general populace, what percent actually know about mouse pointer speed or that you can adjust it.

back in 2002 I went around bumping everyone's screen resolution from vga in college because it hurt my sole. at least 20% of people got pissed at me for "fucking up their settings". Almost all eventually came back and said "I can't read my whole doc, show me that thing again."

Point being they didn't even know it was broke or that they could change it. Thus you have iOS where apple's defaults are the whole OS and literally millions upon millions of people are completely happy with it.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Nition on Friday February 03, 2017 @03:07AM (#13558476)
You'd also have to make the case that the things that did make the cut to get into the new-style interface are less Power User-y than pointer speed though. Admittedly they're usually simple stuff, but is e.g. switching the mouse wheel option between "several lines" and "whole screen" really less of a power option than pointer speed?
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Retra on Friday February 03, 2017 @12:59AM (#13558045)
Everything you are saying is only true because Microsoft has done a poor job making easy to follow settings menus.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by lloeki on Friday February 03, 2017 @01:25AM (#13558144)
Everything he says is true because most people don't even fscking care the very least, even if the option were right in their face. Think BOFH dummy mode. People just want a zero-knob appliance for shit to get done. We are the damn exception to the rule.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by herbst on Friday February 03, 2017 @02:11AM (#13558295)
My mum learned that if she did not like something she can just press the super button and start typing whatever the annoyance is related to. I am sometimes surprised by the specific settings she goes for. Based on this i think users at least check the options when they are easily available. (Linux obviously)
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by scholia on Friday February 03, 2017 @02:15PM (#13562385)
That works in Windows 10 too.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by herbst on Saturday February 04, 2017 @01:19AM (#13565903)
"works" Windows configurations are highly confusing if you dont know what you are doing. Windows 10 might got better but they are way to stripped down as well.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by NTripleOne on Friday February 03, 2017 @06:47AM (#13559141)
Not to mention that it's not preferable to be adjusting mouse speed in windows anyway, 6/11 on the slider is basically the only setting that should be used, as every other option is no longer true 1:1 input.

(disabling "enhanced pointer precision" is preferable, but optional)

If your cursor is too fast you need a mouse with a lower DPI, and vice versa.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by nikanj on Thursday February 02, 2017 @09:53PM (#13557273)
In my Mouse panel, there's an additional tab created by the Trackpad drivers.

I can only guess how many proprietary extensions have been built to rely on the old Control Panel interfaces, and how few of them will ever be updated to Windows 10.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by thirdsun on Friday February 03, 2017 @01:12AM (#13558094)
To me that sounds like a good thing - I don't like it when drivers need to "inject" themselves into OS level settings.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by computerex on Thursday February 02, 2017 @10:19PM (#13557392)
Totally agree, it's very half-baked atm.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by Jaruzel on Friday February 03, 2017 @02:50AM (#13558429)
> The dual control panels are ridiculous.

MS's roadmap is to migrate everything out of Control Panel into Settings at some point, so there are not two.

For total control, activate 'GodeMode'...

Create a folder and rename it to this:

  GodMode.{ED7BA470-8E54-465E-825C-99712043E01C}
Then just double click it.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by chris_wot on Friday February 03, 2017 @09:14AM (#13559883)
Doesn't need to be GodMode. Just pop on the dot and the GUID to the end of the folder and it will work.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by kupiakos on Thursday February 02, 2017 @05:38PM (#13555590)
The most frustrating thing for me is the automatic updates that are difficult to turn off. If I leave a Windows 10 VM running on my laptop for too long, it will decide it's "idle" and start consuming my resources. Even if I let the updates finish, it then continues for another week, whenever I leave it "idle", to perform AoT .NET compilation, pegging my CPU. Incredibly annoying.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by mattmanser on Thursday February 02, 2017 @06:05PM (#13555834)
My laptop fan is a bit of a noisy bugger, if I leave windows 10 for 5 mins it thinks idle and the the fan just starts going.

First I found that ngentask was repeatedly running 32-bit ngen and it's practically impossible to debug what's gone wrong so I've replace the ngen with a dummy exe.

But it still does it, now instead of ngen it's simply "System" constantly burning 20% cpu for whatever utterly pointless maintenance task it's decided on that's obviously broken.

It's just really frustrating, I swear that the "idle" mode of win 10 costs me far more money than actively using the laptop. And it's so hard to debug because as soon as the computer activates it stops whatever bullshit it was doing.

On my desktop I tried ripping out all the privacy invasive stuff and have somehow managed to break the start menu search.

I do like it more than Win 7, the startup time's great, but it's still really frustrating at times.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by chris_wot on Friday February 03, 2017 @09:16AM (#13559896)
Try using Process Monitor.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by jjcm on Thursday February 02, 2017 @07:04PM (#13556321)
FWIW, automatic updates took me about 5 minutes of googling to figure out how to turn off. Haven't been nagged once since then. I can go in manually and update as I please.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by tonyedgecombe on Friday February 03, 2017 @10:25AM (#13560370)
I think this is only available in the pro edition, not home.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by flukus on Thursday February 02, 2017 @06:01PM (#13555799)
The start menu tries to connect to the internet when you search. It has an offline mode, but if you have an intermittent connection it will just hang forever. Opening an application should never require a connection.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by cm2187 on Thursday February 02, 2017 @06:09PM (#13555861)
I think it is something else. I disabled all web searches and these machines are connected to the internet with fiber optic.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by mintplant on Thursday February 02, 2017 @09:31PM (#13557157)
Sometimes when I try to rename a folder in my home folder, Windows Explorer will lock up until I forcibly restart it.

Start menu search seems slower and the returned results are worse than in Windows 7, Unity, XFCE, or any alternative I've experienced. Searching "irefox" doesn't find Firefox. Maybe it's because I've disabled a number of privacy-sensitive features in Windows 10, but Windows 7 managed to make this work without spying on me.

The lengths they go through to push Edge irk me quite a bit: tagging it "Microsoft Recommended Browser", adding an extra scare prompt when you switch away from it in the control panel, resetting it to default status as part of automatic updates. I've seen screenshots of a popup appearing on the task bar begging the user to switch to edge, but haven't experienced this myself.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by VintageCool on Thursday February 02, 2017 @10:26PM (#13557422)
The Start Menu search in Windows 10 doesn't search Program Files by default. It only examines Internet Explorer History, the Start Menu, and Users/AppData.

It's super frustrating. When I search for "vlc", it gives me search results for VLC and instructions on how to install VLC, but it doesn't actually return the vlc.exe program that I already have installed damnit.

Re:The woes of Windows 10 by mintplant on Thursday February 02, 2017 @10:33PM (#13557452)
I have Firefox in my Start Menu, and searching "Fir", "Fire", "Firef", etc will turn it up. The search algorithm is just so bad that it ignores partial matches that don't start at the beginning of a word.
Re:The woes of Windows 10 by seanp2k2 on Friday February 03, 2017 @12:02AM (#13557809)
Try https://github.com/Wox-launcher/Wox

or http://alternativeto.net/software/everything/ or https://www.donationcoder.com/Software/Mouser/findrun/ or http://colibri.leetspeak.org/ or http://alternativeto.net/software/listary/?platform=windows or http://www.candylabs.com/approcket or http://www.launchy.net/download.php#windows

This was a popular thing ~10 years ago, not surprising that Windows didn't get it right. FWIW, MacOS also fails at this regularly with Spotlight, but Alfred is sometimes better. Wox seems to be the closest thing for Windows, and Launchy used to be the one the cool kids used.