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Re:Moto 360 by mikeryan on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @01:34PM (#7423472)
Am I the only one who doesn't wear a watch (even if I wanted to) because I don't like the way it scratches against my MacBook Pro?
Re:Moto 360 by glomph on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:12PM (#7424261)
I find it hilarious that you name the exact model of laptop.
Re:Moto 360 by mikeryan on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:16PM (#7424698)
I appreciate that, I actually went back and forth on mentioning the specific model. It seemed relevant because of the case material (and dimensions of the trackpad/palm area), and I don't remember having the same issue with previous plastic case laptops.
Re:Moto 360 by gnur on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @02:18AM (#7427096)
I had the exact same issue on my 15" mbp, on the 13" rmpb I don't have the issue. It's is most noticeable with watches with metallic bands, but rubber bands also tend to get in the way.
Re:Moto 360 by pavanky on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:24PM (#7424343)
This is anecdotal evidence but I've noticed people using idevices mention the models rather than generic device names.

I wonder why that is.

Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:02PM (#7424614)
Maybe because they have simple and straightforward names that it's reasonable to expect most people will understand. Whereas if you said "my Dell Latitude 3300" most people would have no specific mental image for that.

Like it or not, the simplicity of Apple's product line and naming scheme makes their product names more meaningful.

Re:Moto 360 by tripzilch on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @04:39AM (#7427373)
no it's the other way around. if people who own another brand of device would mention the name every other time, we'd have (or make sure to have) a good mental image for those as well.

Like a William Gibson novel.

I don't know what a "Dell Latitude 3300" looks like because its owners do not mention they own one when they talk about "their laptop". If they did, after a few mentions, I'd have gotten a clearer idea on the type of machine, or have looked it up.

there's nothing more meaningful about "MacBook Pro" than, say, "EeePC Seashell" (which is arguably an even more evocative name).

and especially among computer geeks who care for this kind of thing, adding a series number instead of some word, isn't a problem and actually helps.

Apple laptops have numbers too, right? It's easier for me, even because I don't keep track of all the different kinds of Macbooks out there, at least for iOS I can figure "higher number is newer". Just the term "Macbook Pro" merely tells me it's shiny, probably white or aluminium, expensive and owner is either from the US or in the graphic design/music industry.

Posted from my Asus EeePC 1215B "Seashell", with Linux Mint, hooked up to a Samsung SyncMaster SA350 24" monitor, typed on a Microsoft Comfort Curv--ahh, sod it.

Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @11:41AM (#7429394)
No, because even if users tried to do that, the panopoly of non-Apple PCs out there, and their regular name changes, would counfound any kind of traction.

Apple laptops don't have numbers in the last decade. There's been several generations of the "MacBook Pro". The screen size is a descriptor and not actually part of the product name.

The same effect is evident in cars: if I say "BMW 3-series" or "328i" you have a pretty good idea what I'm talking about, but if I say "Kia Cadenza"... and that's because BMW has maintained that brand for what, 30 years now?

Re:Moto 360 by quadrige on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @12:29PM (#7429783)
Yes but precisely, people are never going to mention their exact laptop name because brands like Dell choose to produce 20 variations of each laptop they create, each one harder to remember than the precedent. Apple has such a little number of portable macs (two actually: air and pro) that everyone remembers it. And they also chose a simple way to tell the difference between each iteration: the production year, as well as the screen size, which are two criterias very understandable to everyone.

It's not about what people choose to say, it's about Apple's clever naming conventions.

Re:Moto 360 by gabriel34 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @07:09PM (#7425707)
What generation is his Macbook Pro? ;)
Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @01:48AM (#7427035)
In terms of what the hand rests look like, it doesn't matter. They've been the same since the introduction in 2006. :)
Re:Moto 360 by w1ntermute on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:32PM (#7424393)
Apple is more a fashion company than a tech company. Those who buy and use its products are primarily concerned with advertising the fact that they use Apple products - conspicuous consumption. It's no different from how Gucci or Prada owners make sure to prominently display the brand of their handbag when they are in public. It's a simple form of signaling your identity, that you belong to a particular group.

This is also why Apple's profit margins are sky high. Consumer electronics is an industry with razor thin margins, but with fashion, the sky is the limit (given that you can effectively manipulate the minds of consumers, which Apple is excellent at). An iDevice cannot be commoditized, no matter how hard Apple's competitors try.

Re:Moto 360 by psychometry on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:58PM (#7424590)
Either you're a troll or you're delusional. Which is it?

>Apple is more a fashion company than a tech company.

Not even remotely accurate for possible definitions of either of those terms.

>Those who buy and use its products are primarily concerned with advertising the fact that they use Apple products - conspicuous consumption.

Oh really? You don't think it has anything to do with their excellent track record of hardware design, software design, reliability and usability?

>It's no different from how Gucci or Prada owners make sure to prominently display the brand of their handbag when they are in public.

Yes, because Dell and HP laptops are completely devoid of physical branding...

>It's a simple form of signaling your identity, that you belong to a particular group.

Or it's because Apple products let productive people be productive.

Re:Moto 360 by tripzilch on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @05:14AM (#7427440)
> You don't think it has anything to do with their excellent track record of hardware design, software design, reliability and usability?

Of course. It has to do with Apple's branding of "hardware design, software design, reliability and usability".

Just like G-Star advertises their clothing as "raw", while their jeans are actually quite flimsy and rip or tear easily.

Sure, they look pretty and well-fitted. Just like I would recommend my grandmother an iPad because I know it's well-designed and she'd have less trouble using it.

> >It's no different from how Gucci or Prada owners make sure to prominently display the brand of their handbag when they are in public.

> Yes, because Dell and HP laptops are completely devoid of physical branding...

You're proving his point here: It's not like other brands of handbags (or shoes) are completely devoid of physical branding either. Yet it's not like their owners are even aware of its brand, half the time.

In this context I'd sooner compare Apple products to Nike shoes, rather than the fashion "I have money to spend" signalling Gucci/Prada handbags.

Come on, the evolution of "brands as lifestyle + identity" has been around for at least 30 years now. You should know a thing or two about how it works. It's not really a disputed theory.

And you can't seriously deny that Apple isn't fighting along in the Big Brand mindshare arena just as much as Coca-Cola, Nike, Red Bull and Calvin Klein, in a sense that Dell, Asus or Lenovo are very much not. A quick litmus-test is whether they have a significant brand-identity that can be separated from their products (sometimes even more prominent than their actual core product, especially in the case of Coca-Cola or Red Bull).

> >It's a simple form of signaling your identity, that you belong to a particular group.

> Or it's because Apple products let productive people be productive.

See what you just did? Put Apple product users in the group of "productive people being productive"? :) Would you ever say something as generic about a Lenovo laptop? (which has excellent hardware and lets productive people be very productive) That's because Apple is a brand identity, over just being a brand of laptops. As if they're charged with a kind of "soul".

You don't have to consider it a bad thing, but I think it's important to at least be aware of these very real differences, because they do influence the way people act, behave and feel about their stuff. And it's nothing new, and it's nothing you can or should prevent, everyone is affected by these ideas to some extent, which is again why it's so important to be aware of it. Just don't deny it.

Re:Moto 360 by makomk on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @09:14AM (#7428384)
Exactly! Discussions on HN (and elsewhere) have been full of Apple users bemoaning problems that, if they happened on Android, would be held up as proof that it was inherently crap. Because Apple have successfully branded themselves as the usable, well-designed option these issues get treated as a temporary aberration - even though from what I can tell they've always been the norm for Apple.
Re:Moto 360 by seanmcdirmid on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @05:42PM (#7425209)
He always makes this same stale argument when Apple is mentioned. Check his comment hostory.
Re:Moto 360 by swamp40 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @05:51PM (#7425282)
I think you both are describing different parts of the same elephant.
Re:Moto 360 by edanm on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:52PM (#7424546)
"Those who buy and use its products are primarily concerned with advertising the fact that they use Apple products - conspicuous consumption."

Yeah, you're going to need at least some form of evidence for that claim.

Needless to say, I disagree that that's the reason I use a Mac.

Re:Moto 360 by droopyEyelids on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:40PM (#7424836)
I know. In the tech field my macbook is embarrassingly generic.

It feels weird to know that it cost more than many people's cars, but if you work in the privileged person startup bubble it's a weak shibboleth, not a luxury item that draws attention.

Re:Moto 360 by pm90 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @06:18PM (#7425447)
>it cost more than many people's cars,

sorry, what? I thought macboook cost $2-3k? Is that how much a car costs in your country?

Re:Moto 360 by gavinflud on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @06:40PM (#7425555)
My first car cost me €1000. My latest car that I bought in November cost just north of €3000.
Re:Moto 360 by kayoone on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @06:38PM (#7425548)
many people are driving <3k beater cars, maybe thats what he is referring too.
Re:Moto 360 by piyush_soni on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @09:49PM (#7426359)
Some of my friends are driving used cars which range from $1200 to $1700.
Re:Moto 360 by factotvm on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:56PM (#7424569)
I choose Apple because I want good hardware with a *nix operating system. End of story. Show me an alternative, and you'll pique my interest. In the meantime, you should keep your ridiculous comments about conspicuous consumption to yourself.
Re:Moto 360 by xmonkee on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @02:42AM (#7427141)
Goddamn this. I have been a linuxer all my life but getting older somehow really makes patching drivers all the time quite unattractive. Bought my first mac this year... good decision.
Re:Moto 360 by krrrh on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @09:19AM (#7428413)
Amen. It was a bit of a compromise having to deal with mac ports or fink for so long, but since homebrew became so usable as a package manager a couple if years ago, the argument has only gotten stronger.
Re:Moto 360 by Touche on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @03:04PM (#7430920)
You seriously have had to regularly patch drivers?
Re:Moto 360 by lewaldman on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @07:05PM (#7425685)
Lenovo Series W + Linux?
Re:Moto 360 by megablast on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @08:33PM (#7426098)
Yes, there are other options.
Re:Moto 360 by jey on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:21PM (#7424731)
No, what's incredible is that they're simultaneously a tech company and a fashion company. Perhaps it would be most accurate to say they are a design company in the consumer electronics market. Calling them a "design-oriented company" is inclusive of their multiple facets, including usability, fashion, and performance.
Re:Moto 360 by tripzilch on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @05:19AM (#7427455)
And it's incredible that Coca-Cola is simultaneously mass-producing chemical sludge, selling it to the masses and is a fashion company!
Re:Moto 360 by knowaveragejoe on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:50PM (#7424536)
The reason Apple laptops are so popular is hardly that they are a status symbol and more the fact that they're so damn comfortable to use. I agree about other Apple products, however.
Re:Moto 360 by tripzilch on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @05:27AM (#7427478)
People say (or said) the same about Nike shoes and Levis jeans. It's not the point. Yes they are high quality, but Wintermute wasn't commenting on that fact, the point is the brand identity of "Apple is high quality and comfortable to use", it's the first part where it says Apple Apple Apple.

I am wearing a pair of very cheap no-brand jeans, they are extremely durable and comfortable (the label also ironically reads "Unsigned", which I admit made me smile a bit, but it's not a brand, in a few years that store chain (Scapino) will have different labels, and nobody will notice one bit). I'm not going around saying "Unsigned has great durable comfy jeans"--also because they're not, extremely varying quality, you just have to try on at least 5 different ones that are ostensibly the same size (which they are also not). They're cheap though and this makes me very happy with them :)

Re:Moto 360 by knowaveragejoe on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @08:28PM (#7432960)
When I say that Apple laptops are damn comfortable, it has nothing to do with the brand. I can't speak for other people though. If Sony were making these, I'd own a Sony. But the fact of the matter is that it is Apple that has the lion's share of the laptop market because they've got a killer combination of hardware and software(being a closed platform and all). They've sunk untold amounts of money into ergonomics, the "little things", and it's paid off with a superior laptop experience. If you ever sit on a couch with a laptop all day, you'd quickly notice the difference between an Apple laptop and most OEM offerings out there. That's not to say that some OEMs aren't getting pretty close though. I have my eye on the Lenovo X1 Carbon lineup, maybe next year they'll have something superior at a better price point.
Re:Moto 360 by tluyben2 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:19PM (#7424716)
I'll say it again; please advice me what non-Apple laptop to buy which can compete with my 11 inch Air. I tried many and all are more expensive than my 'status fashion Air' and they all feel/work like crap compared. Wobbly/shaky and expensive. But tell me what is better for the same price, I'll get one tomorrow and let's see if what kind of fashion we are talking about.
Re:Moto 360 by TimJRobinson on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @10:03PM (#7426402)
I quite like my vaio z 13" though they've stopped selling them now I believe. Higher spec than the best airs, lighter too and feels great to work on http://youtu.be/OWkG6wVWGds
Re:Moto 360 by lemieux on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @11:04PM (#7426582)
I must say that my Dell XPS 13 is a pretty good machine for development. I can take it anywhere without any problems. Sure it is 13", but I can go below 13".

On the plus side, it has a Ubuntu logo on it instead of that crappy Windows logo.

Re:Moto 360 by mongol on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:23PM (#7424747)
Lenovo Carbon? Maybe it is bigger
Re:Moto 360 by tluyben2 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @05:54PM (#7425296)
I love how the X1 feels/looks, but 14 inch is too large. I find 13 inch actually on the big side. 10-12 inch for a laptop is what I consider perfect. But yes, good one; the X1 is a great machine. So we have one contender :)
Re:Moto 360 by commandar on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @10:42PM (#7426522)
The Lenovo Yoga line is pretty great in general. I've been eyeing them pretty hard recently.
Re:Moto 360 by tluyben2 on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @04:59AM (#7427414)
I eyed them a while ago, but read a bunch of not very favourable reviews; anyone have hands-on experience for at least a month?
Re:Moto 360 by Aeolus98 on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @10:53AM (#7428958)
I'm typing this on the top spec Yoga 2 Pro, it's amazing. The main complaints from reviewers were as follows; - yellow tint on screen - Flimsy hinge - low battery life - backlight bleed

I'll address them in order. 1. there was a marked discoloration when i saw pictures on the forums, and i almost returned it due to bing scared. When i got it, nothing. Absolutely nothing, though it looked a bit over saturated, which i kinda like on a non-workstation device.

2. The flimsy hinge is not a problem, end of story. Its stiffer than a MBA or MBP,m and only wobbles significantly if you tap it real hard.

3. Battery life is a problem, but if you're like me, i use it in multiple short spurts, coupled with a few long ones. It lasts all day, and while i do wish for a bit more, as for waht it is, it's good. Not great, but good.

4. No backlight bleed, nuff' said.

Furthermore i have found myself using the touchscreen far more than i anticipated. It's hands down, IMHO, the best laptop availible today thats an ultraportable. Go get one.

Re:Moto 360 by SomeoneWeird on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @05:15PM (#7425042)
The 2012(3?) X1 is lighter than the latest mba
Re:Moto 360 by scott_karana on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @02:44AM (#7427144)
I was given a new Macbook Air for work. My primary history with good laptops is the IBM/Lenovo Thinkpad lineup.

I don't parade around with the laptop: it's a desk job, with as few dashes over to the datacentre as possible. I work in a highly diverse Windows/Mac/Linux environment.

I've been very satisfied with it, except for the slight lack of ports. The speed, solid/useful construction, 16:10 screen, battery life, reasonable OS, et cetera, all suit me well. A Macbook Pro, which has lots more ports and a better screen besides, would likely satisfy me 100%.

The extremely similar Lenovo X1 Carbon that I also use in the office is not unfortunately quite as enjoyable, though it's equally utilitarian. The price-point is virtually identical, at least with how we specced them. I had had high hopes for it, because I was considering one to replace my X220.

At what point is fashion involved in this equation? Where is the bragging? Where is the fanboyism?

Re:Moto 360 by Camillo on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @09:46PM (#7426350)
I'm just going to leave this here: https://twitter.com/asymco/status/396253597551570944
Re:Moto 360 by theon144 on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @01:51AM (#7427044)
I'm not sure what's the informational value of absolute numbers in this case. It might come out with the same results, but both Microsoft and Samsung have a hell lot more to advertise.
Re:Moto 360 by andyhmltn on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @06:46AM (#7427759)
>Apple is more a fashion company than a tech company

That's completely false. They make good looking products sure but they aren't just pretty little bricks.

Re:Moto 360 by ZoFreX on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:26PM (#7424765)
One possible reason is fragmentation: Apple have a small number of ranges with persistent names, whereas their competitors have a lot of models and constantly invent new names for them. Even if everyone name-dropped their kit with equal frequency, a given Apple model would be mentioned far more frequently than any single model from another manufacturer.
Re:Moto 360 by MBCook on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:32PM (#7424398)
It says "MacBook Pro" right under the screen so that's what I think of it as. I also know that the terms are common enough that people will know what I'm talking about (as opposed to my old Inspiron 8000).
Re:Moto 360 by Touche on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:38PM (#7424449)
I think of it as a computer, or a laptop if I want to be specific that it's portable.
Re:Moto 360 by anfedorov on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:52PM (#7424547)
I think that it wouldn't be a problem with a plastic laptop, so specifying that it was a MBP makes sense. "Aluminum laptop" might have sufficed, as well, but that sounds a little weird.
Re:Moto 360 by sliverstorm on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:47PM (#7424519)
Or maybe "mac"
Re:Moto 360 by seanmcdirmid on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @05:44PM (#7425228)
MBP would be more appropriate.
Re:Moto 360 by prawn on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @09:50PM (#7426363)
Same reason that people are more likely to namedrop the make of their car (when it's not particularly relevant) if it's a premium brand.
Re:Moto 360 by jasonkester on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @07:21PM (#7425772)
I have a Macbook Air that gets referred to as "the skinny computer" around the house. (as in, "I hate this f'ng skinny computer. Why won't it let me copy a f'ng photo???).

It would never occur to me to refer to it by its model name.

My wife has an iPhone 5s. As in, "Hey, toss me your phone. It has a better camera". Guess we're safe there too.

Re:Moto 360 by piyush_soni on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @09:58PM (#7426378)
The post was an advertisement itself.
Re:Moto 360 by easytiger on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @09:09AM (#7428356)
can't have people assuming you use an acer. what might they think of you
Re:Moto 360 by lewww on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:38PM (#7424445)
A Macbook Pro is made from aluminium. Most other laptops are plastic. Metal-on-metal scratching would be quite different to metal-on-plastic, so I'd say it's relevant.
Re:Moto 360 by hahainternet on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:41PM (#7424477)
Why is it quite different? Is it that aluminium is a poor material for a surface likely to suffer repeated abrasions?
Re:Moto 360 by jfoutz on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:01PM (#7424611)
I think it's the fingernails on chalkboard effect of similar hardness. Soft plastic against hard metal doesn't quite screech the same way.
Re:Moto 360 by smegel on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:57PM (#7424575)
Maybe he doesn't like the noise it makes...
Re:Moto 360 by ghshephard on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:11PM (#7424672)
That wasn't the exact laptop model, just a general laptop description. The Model name is usually something like, "MacBookPro11,1", and an exact model would be, "ME864xx/A","ME865xx/A", or "ME866xx/A".

I think it's reasonably to say, "Macbook Pro" as a generic reference. Nothing is really gained/lost by saying, "Mac Laptop". And, you do need to distinguish it's your unibody mac laptop, not a dell laptop, which likely doesn't mind being scratched by a watch that much. This is a Point for Dell! - My Latitude 2120 has been all over the planet in all sorts of rough conditions, doesn't have a visible scratch, unlike my macbook air - which is pretty ugly (but still working) shape after the same two years.

Re:Moto 360 by kbutler on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:57PM (#7424582)
On the surface, I agree - but in my case, it's a behavior specific to that particular device.

I wear/wore a watch while typing on my chromebook, my Dell laptop, my Lenovo laptop, my old white macbook, and various external keyboards, but when I type on my macbook pro, the watch comes off almost immediately.

The watch clasp grating on the wide aluminum bezel quickly drives me to remove the watch.

Re:Moto 360 by tlrobinson on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @09:10PM (#7426213)
Hacker News: where you can find a 40+ comment thread debating the use of generic vs specific device names.
Re:Moto 360 by herpy on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:37PM (#7424436)
It's relevant information for the comment. They'd otherwise have to describe the case material of the laptop. "Scratches the 'patterned aluminum finish' of my laptop," is a bit more verbose in conveying the same information.
Re:Moto 360 by knowaveragejoe on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:52PM (#7424544)
I find it hilarious that someone actually took the time to point out this incredibly inane detail.
Re:Moto 360 by Cthulhu_ on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @06:01PM (#7425334)
idk, I make a clear distinction between laptops and macbooks myself; the last laptops I remember using are quite different from macbooks (OS, (perceived) speed/performance, form factor).
Re:Moto 360 by robmcm on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @05:56AM (#7427572)
Relevant due to the fact it has a metal case.
Re:Moto 360 by nodata on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:40PM (#7424468)
I don't like how my Rolex Oyster Perpetual taps against the table.
Re:Moto 360 by ngoldbaum on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:20PM (#7423861)
Try a NATO watchstrap. The buckle bit ends up sort of on the side of your wrist rather than right on the bottom. That how it works out on my tiny wrists anyway.
Re:Moto 360 by dmnd on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:38PM (#7423985)
I have a Nato watchstrap but it scratches anyway. The buckle is more to the side than a normal strap, but it's still on the bottom of my wrist and still makes contact with the laptop. Maybe my wrists are even tinier than yours.
Re:Moto 360 by t__r on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @01:38PM (#7423516)
I'm sure the iWatch will have a MacBook friendly strap.
Re:Moto 360 by pearjuice on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:37PM (#7423978)
Starting at $299. iWatch not included.
Re:Moto 360 by kellyhclay on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:36PM (#7423977)
I actually take my Fitbit Flex off when I'm writing (typing) for extending periods of time on my Macbook Air. The edge of the Macbook presses into the rubber at just the right angle and annoys me enough I have to remove it. I don't know how this isn't more of a problem for all wrist-wearables, honestly.
Re:Moto 360 by pasbesoin on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:02PM (#7423728)
When the band on my last Casio broke due to my taking it off and putting it back on so often, in order to type comfortably while either using a wrist rest or putting up with the increasingly large palm area on laptops... (Phfew! Time for a new sentence.) When that happened, I stopped wearing a watch.

Until the battery died, that Casio, sans wristband, served as a sort of pocket watch. Now, I just look at my phone -- when I don't already have a clock on-screen somewhere.

Aside: I'd prefer a URL that didn't necessitate dynamic content in order to get a basic idea of what the product is. Call me old-fashioned... or paranoid (exploits); take your pick.

Re:Moto 360 by untog on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:04PM (#7423741)
How on earth does your watch scratch your laptop?
Re:Moto 360 by rickyc091 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:04PM (#7424200)
Your wrist lies to the left / right of the track pad area. When you wear a watch or a fitness band, you are constantly rubbing those areas as you type.
Re:Moto 360 by untog on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:12PM (#7424266)
Your wrists shouldn't be touching your laptop if you care about ergonomics.
Re:Moto 360 by Karunamon on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:48PM (#7424523)
You really don't have an option if you're on a macbook - the keyboard rests a good sixish inches behind the front of the machine.
Re:Moto 360 by cwp on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @10:14PM (#7426438)
He means that your wrists shouldn't be touching anything. They should be hovering a couple of centimetres above the flat area in front of the keyboard.
Re:Moto 360 by TeMPOraL on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @10:13AM (#7428719)
Am I supposed to hold my hands in the air for hours straight? Because I can't do that, or at least it's far, far from feeling comfortable.
Re:Moto 360 by daurnimator on Thursday March 20, 2014 @01:46AM (#7434095)
Yes you are... doing otherwise leads to carpal tunnel syndrome
Re:Moto 360 by bane on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @01:53PM (#7423658)
I'm left handed when I write, so I should put a watch on my right hand. But I mouse with my right hand so I should put it on my left hand.

After years of getting irritated with watches and leaving them off half the day, I just stopped wearing them and I've very rarely ever regretted it.

Re:Moto 360 by sg47 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @05:56PM (#7425305)
Nope. I haven't been able to wear a watch ever since I got the latest Macbook Pro. Even I wear one to work by mistake, the first thing I do is remove it. Maybe the keyboard is a bit deeper in the newer models?
Re:Moto 360 by sliverstorm on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @01:36PM (#7423492)
Why do you rest your wrists on your MacBook Pro while you type?
Re:Moto 360 by wffurr on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:10PM (#7423796)
Who doesn't rest their wrists on the palm rest of the laptop when they type?
Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @04:13PM (#7424676)
You're not supposed to - but most of us do it. In theory, you're only suppose to rest your wrists downwards when not typing, because doing so takes them out a neutral position. I'm not saying you should change, just trying to discourage the notion that's a healthy habit. (http://www.webmd.com/back-pain/proper-sitting-posture-for-ty...)
Re:Moto 360 by qq66 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @05:07PM (#7424977)
The specific model is relevant here as Apple laptops have a much deeper palm rest area than tiger machines.
Re:Moto 360 by Zhenya on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:49PM (#7424079)
I rest the bottom of my palms & the edge of my wrist. Maybe you're wearing your watch too loose and its sliding down your arm? My watch generally doesn't touch the top of the MBP 15" surface as i type.
Re:Moto 360 by shitlord on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:59PM (#7424599)
I rest my wrists on my laptop whenever I'm not typing. But I type using 4 of my fingers though, lol.
Re:Moto 360 by NDizzle on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:08PM (#7423785)
I rest my wrists on my MBP as well.

I've been typing this way since like '94 and I've yet to have any carpal tunnel issues.

Attempting to type this line with elevated wrists feels very strange and something that I couldn't do for long periods of time.

Re:Moto 360 by delgaudm on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:11PM (#7423806)
I rest my wrists on the MPB when I type also, and I've been typing the same way since the late 80's.
Re:Moto 360 by VLM on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:47PM (#7424515)
I looked at the pix, I looked at the junk on my desk and compared my deskware and wrist vs the pix, and assuming I have a male model physique, that watch is a bit bigger than a sigg water bottle but a cm or so smaller than my large coffee (tea) cup. Its huge.

So... yeah, strap a couple pound weight to your arm, and until you bulk up, there's going to be some sagging by the end of the day.

Re:Moto 360 by makr17 on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @06:38PM (#7425543)
I wore a watch in high school. Playing volleyball the summer after I graduated I went up for a block and came down minus the watch. When I showed up at college, there was a clock tower that chimed the quarter hour, and it turned out that was more than enough, so I never replaced the watch.

Now I've got a computer in front of me a majority of my waking hours, and a smartphone in my pocket for the times when I don't; _really_ no need for a watch.

Re:Moto 360 by Cthulhu_ on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @06:02PM (#7425338)
The last time I wore a watch was when I realized I always took it off while using my computer and sort of the point where I had a cell phone with me at all times; of course, simultaneously I started developing RSI symptoms, :p.
Re:Moto 360 by devindotcom on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:08PM (#7423784)
Unless you wore your watch with the face inwards, a leather strap ought to fix this.
Re:Moto 360 by Domenic_S on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:11PM (#7423801)
Leather straps have buckles.
Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @02:45PM (#7424048)
Just because a strap has a buckle doesn't mean it will ever hit your computer. I wear a Timex Expedition with a leather and fabric strap, and it's almost impossible to make the buckle touch my Macbook because it's too high up on the inside of my wrist - my hand would have to be almost perpendicular to the keyboard, with the backside of my thumb rotated down towards the keys.
Re:Moto 360 by nknighthb on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @07:26PM (#7425793)
You may have smaller wrists than some of us.

Have some fat wrist porn: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kjed7wq0p23l42h/RbCpiuaGjH

I don't usually work directly on my MBP, being of the one true religion (external keyboard/mouse/monitor), but when I do, the first is approximately how my left wrist normally rests, and the second is with my Pebble on, showing the buckle in contact with the MBP.

It was hard to get the angle right on the second picture, so the position of my wrist is slightly off, but you get the idea.

When actually typing (especially for more than a couple words, like I am now), my wrist isn't usually resting so heavily on the surface, but the buckle is still in contact with the laptop.

The scratching is annoying, as is the pressure on my wrist. This has been the case for every watch I've owned with several different straps, so I almost always take them off when using any laptop without an external keyboard.

Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @01:52AM (#7427048)
At least in the position on the right, that's not good form. You can see the intent on the top of the wrist, which means you're not in a neutral position for typing. I can't tell what's up on the left.

Personally, I find my watch tends to sit above my wrist, so it's not over the palm rest at all.

Re:Moto 360 by nknighthb on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @01:58AM (#7427059)
I'm aware of that. I'm also aware that if I use "good form", I can't type for long before my arms fall off, like I'm aware that I never see anyone actually type in what is supposedly "good form" unless they're demonstrating what they claim you should do, but fail to do themselves.

In other words: This is how reality works. And here in reality, the buckle is annoying. Speculation as to its annoyance in an alternate reality is beside the point.

Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @12:01PM (#7429567)
It's worth talking to an ergo specialist, but if you can't easily keep your wrists up it often means your broader setup isn't right - your chair is too low or your keyboard is too high (common on desks based on old designs.)

I've had carpal and nerve issues in the past, so I watch this a lot... generally you can drive the better habits simply by reconfiguring the work setup.

Re:Moto 360 by nknighthb on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @08:18PM (#7432918)
Been there, done that, sent the "specialist" on her way as soon as she started rambling about my aura. My issues went away with a switch to Dvorak years ago anyway.

But all of this is quite irrelevant when one is talking about the inherently non-ergonomic use of a laptop that only happens in meetings and hotel rooms.

Re:Moto 360 by tomkarlo on Wednesday March 19, 2014 @11:43PM (#7433709)
If your ergo expert is talking about auras instead of measuring your dimensions and evaluating your posture, you need to find a real ergo expert. Even for ad-hoc use in meeting rooms and hotel rooms, a good expert can help you do a better job and protect your nerves. Anyone who works at a computer all day should probably go at least once a year, just like an annual physical.

http://mindfulmotionphysicaltherapy.com/what-is-an-ergonomic... (For info purposes - not endorsing this particular practitioner.)

Re:Moto 360 by lewaldman on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @03:33PM (#7424409)
I usually take it out and put on the table.

One thing that I learned after years of scratching the glass on several watches is that you should take it off often.

Sleep with watch, and bath with watch are just two of the no-go. :)

Re:Moto 360 by sytelus on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @09:01PM (#7426183)
No, you are one of the two.
Re:Moto 360 by megablast on Tuesday March 18, 2014 @08:32PM (#7426093)
Yes, you are the only one.