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Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by karmickoala on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @01:26PM (#50356026)
Somewhat related: did you know that you cannot disable GMail's GenAI usage without disabling the traditional ML powered features, such as smart inbox, which predates LLMs? In this case, Google/Alphabet is conflating GenAI/LLMs with traditional machine learning, so you can't opt out of genai which necessarily requires access to your data by the models, without deactivating the previous non-LLM powered features. Which I get it, they indeed can use LLMs to improve the previous traditional ML pipeline, however I believe bundling these options together shouldn't be legal. When I subscribed, these feature was provided by traditional ML, perhaps BERT, however now I cannot keep that previous functionality if don't wish to grant LLMs access to my data.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by 4chandaily on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @01:40PM (#50356237)
It is absurd. I disabled Gemini for my organization, and Google in return disables tab completion in gmail entirely. They are practically demanding I find an alternative at this point.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by wafflemaker on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @02:42PM (#50357116)
So that's why search got broken lately.

I used to be able to search for parts of names. Or a word that is part of a word in a message. Doesn't work anymore. Only exact matches now, or you don't get anything.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by 4chandaily on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @03:04PM (#50357406)
It is even worse if you commit the offense of searching for something with an unmatched quotation mark. (Like 1-1/2" for example). Zero results, every time. Makes searching for trades related information in my emails a pain.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by Xunie on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @03:20PM (#50357631)
[delayed]
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by 4chandaily on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @03:46PM (#50357933)
You are not wrong there!
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by Kotlopou on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:26PM (#50358415)
Huh? This is not the case for me at all, just tested. Not doubting your experience, but it's weird that such a fundamental aspect of search (not even targettable to anything) would differ from user to user.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by 4chandaily on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:55PM (#50358756)
Just to clarify, we were discussing gmail search and not the main web search. I just tested again, if I search for 1-1/2" (with the quote mark) I get zero results.

This is google-for-business or whatever they call it now.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by sssilver on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:31PM (#50358471)
Thank you for posting this. I thought I was going insane, failing to find something I was 100% sure should be there.

Damn, truly we are the products.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by DANmode on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @10:44PM (#50361282)
Give your (preferably local) LLM-based agent read access to your email.

They’re pretty good at cross-referencing across multiple formats.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by wafflemaker on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @02:02PM (#50370044)
For a complete noob, what tools would you suggest to use? I have a gaming Nvidia GPU with 10GB RAM.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by kcartlidge on Friday November 06, 2026 @05:09PM (#50399156)
For the easy path:

- Serve the model with either Ollama or *LM Studio* (the latter 'hides' their traditional Studio on the download page for the agentic one they are preferring you use).

- For the model, Gemma 4 E4B is a nice combination of performance and speed with a decent context size. Not good enough for complex coding needs, but the Qwen models work okay for that (10GB GPU gets you less than you might think).

- For the interface I'd suggest either OpenCode or Pi.

Personally I run LM Studio and in the UI switch on its built in OpenAI compatible API, then point OpenCode at that and run it alongside (not in) my IDE.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by gessha on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @01:44PM (#50356300)
They can enshittify their product as much as they want, it just makes the case for removing every piece of Google garbage out of my life and never using a single piece of software from them.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by dwroberts on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @02:47PM (#50357167)
I did this (disabled AI features) and lost smart inbox and it honestly improved the experience: it made me realise how much rubbish I was subscribed to that I never read, so I unsubbed and blocked tons of stuff, and now my inbox is clear again
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by duxup on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:42PM (#50358605)
I should try that, i can't ever predict what ends up in some promotions folder or not ... it feels arbitrary.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by NewJazz on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:10PM (#50358967)
[delayed]
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by sethops1 on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @06:08PM (#50359494)
Are you me? I went through the exact same steps a few months ago. My Google experience is 100% AI free now.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by nerdyadventurer on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @04:14AM (#50363080)
What was the clean up process?
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by nothercastle on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @09:06PM (#50360742)
Just did that too
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by boplicity on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @11:53AM (#50368335)
Same. I feel like I have control of my inbox again.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by tortela on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @02:52PM (#50357250)
I'm just glad they haven't shoved AI down Google Tasks yet
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by ocdtrekkie on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:35PM (#50359211)
Don't remind the Googlers in the thread it exists! The only Google services unmolested by garbage are the Google services nobody remembers exists that still just like, live on the servers underneath everyone's attention. When you find some Google website with their 2010-style UI you know you've found one of the last remaining nuggets of gold.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by tortela on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @12:57PM (#50369170)
yea.. I should have kept it shhhh. But if you are looking (GOOGLE): make swiping left and right delete and complete a Task :)
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by netsharc on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @06:32PM (#50359687)
Introducing Google MeeSeeks!
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by Willish42 on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @02:57PM (#50357306)
On a similar note, I recently had to enable GenAI in my Photos app just to be able to search my photos, and the photo search is now worse than I remember it being before! I need to move off Google entirely for backups but I find the cross-device compatibility and convenience of the ecosystem really hard to give up. Lately, I've started using other LLM plans than Gemini just to have some of my personal details separate from the rest of Google, which has all my documents and email, etc.

I hope that enshitification calms down a bit whenever the dust has settled on frontier AI companies and we no longer have to force this into every product imaginable. Google used to be pretty good relative to the rest of the big ad tech companies (looking at Meta/Facebook with a scowl...) at giving opt-outs and settings to personalize privacy stuff. This has been a disappointing change to see

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by pvab3 on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @09:53AM (#50366344)
That's rough that you cant search for photos without having AI enabled. I would switch to Apple but its so hard to leave again and get your data out.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by LoganDark on Saturday November 07, 2026 @04:59AM (#50403143)
It's hard to get your data in too. I had to disable Advanced Data Protection (that's the E2E !!!) and then enable access from the web before I could import from Google Photos. It worked fairly well from that point and I could re-encrypt, but I'd rather not ever decrypt if I can help it.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by Willish42 on Monday November 09, 2026 @07:38PM (#50434543)
Immich is supposed to be really good. I'm considering moving to that but mostly struggling with hard drive self-hosting and remote hosting costs, and the fact that it'd be potentially painful to maintain. The ignorant bliss and convenience of the walled garden are strong and effective motivators :/
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by whimsicalism on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @03:09PM (#50357473)
BERT is an LLM. I don't see why Google needs to cater to increasingly fine parsing of politically acceptable vs. not ML workflows, because that is really what this is about.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by deepsun on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @03:30PM (#50357751)
To me the distinction is in whether model trained on my data can return it almost verbatim. Any statistical model, even linear regression can expose some of my data and preferences, but the difference is whether they can compromise the data they've been trained.

And frankly I see the distinction in only number of model parameters vs number of people in cohort it was trained. So 50k-param model trained on 1b emails from 1 million people is ok, encoding/compression loses anything personal. But huge LLMs are closer to lossless compressors that can just spew all my passwords, prescriptions etc verbatim.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by whimsicalism on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:25PM (#50359120)
thank you for the reply, it is a good grounding distinction and i will think more on this perspective.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by karmickoala on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:50PM (#50358685)
I know. I mentioned because there's a category of models that I'd be okay with, but I can't exactly name it. I thought the difference lied in the encoder/decoder distinction. As a sibling comment mentioned, generative models do make the capabilities riskier.

The model size also plays a role, since they've become bigger since 2022 (let's use chatgpt as the cutoff date, but it could be around 2020/2021). Modern BERT trained nowadays will keep their lossy compression nature? Or could there be a privacy risk such as it's clear with generative model?

Thus, what are the characteristics of privacy-friendly models? So far, I listed discriminative vs. generative, size, and a lossy transforms (related to size).

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by whimsicalism on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:27PM (#50359137)
Model size, definitely. Not so sure about the discriminative vs. generative distinction (technically 'generative' models are discriminators as well) - I suspect the data is extractable if you have access to the weights, although easier to extract from inferencing in a decoder model.

My guess is that the pairing of all of these things is due to the fact that Google has likely consolidated everything under the same style of decoder model.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by pertique on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @03:27PM (#50357711)
You need to do this to continue to use Google Assistant for some features as well! One day I try to set a timer on my phone, which is basically all I use the voice features for, and it forced me into Gemini AND data collection. It's truly maddening.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by netsharc on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @06:31PM (#50359673)
Indeed, instead of simple speech recognition and word parsing to set a timer, now they throw it into slower AI.

I can still use Google Assistant, I did get an email from Google that they're going to kill it off (the assassination date is 2 months ago, IIRC), but so far Google Assistant still works for me, although it's getting dumber, it failed today when I asked it for "local time in (some city)".

Google's Android Studio Editor has nice enough AI integration, I managed to start vibe-coding a replacement Assistant, that uses on-device speech-to-text, and then I had fun human-coding a parser to understand "set alarm for 8:00" (e.g. if it's 7PM, I want the alarm for 8PM, if it's 10 PM I want it for the next day of course).

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by sigmar on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:15PM (#50358294)
>Google/Alphabet is conflating GenAI/LLMs with traditional machine learning

I see people try so hard to make this distinction when it really doesn't exist. Transformers are only a little different than long short-term-memory architecture (parallelized, with attention mechanism and no recurrance).

What is the point at which is departed from tradition machine learning? Seems more like people retrofitting a moral decision to not like LLMs and trying to dress it up as a technical distinction.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by thin_carapace on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:16PM (#50358315)
determinism
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by monocasa on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:19PM (#50358350)
Transformers are plenty deterministic. We just decide to run an rng against their output to get the final token in most cases.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by thin_carapace on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:54PM (#50358742)
when concept A applies to concept B in practice, a lack of theoretical connection between A and B is basically irrelevant to me as a lay person. this perspective applies to the other responders argument too.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by karmickoala on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:35PM (#50359215)
Non-associativeness of floating point arithmetic plays a major role as well.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by creato on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:21PM (#50358366)
This is not inherently a property of either LLMs or "classical" ML.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by thin_carapace on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:11PM (#50358974)
I can run a linear regression and get the same result every time or I can go to chat.com and get A/B tested upon. yes these are cherry picked examples. they're also the ones that apply to me personally. for a higher level version of this argument please see my response to the other responder.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by whimsicalism on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:58PM (#50359414)
linear regression on commodity hardware is generally not going to be truly deterministic delta implementation details
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by owiejr on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:34PM (#50358510)
I just abandoned my 22yo gmail account. I feel liberated and empowered!

I found all of the new LLM features to be utterly pointless and incredibly annoying, but the last straw was when my account was abruptly locked recently. For a week I couldn't access mail, maps, photos, digital picture frames for my extended family all went dark, my personal blog ... all shut down with no reason given. No customer support available to contact to resolve google's mistake. A week later, it was suddenly unlocked again. Still no reason given.

Fuck google. You are not their customer; you are their product. Google doesn't care about you any more than Tyson cares about the chickens it sells.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by modagent1 on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:43PM (#50358619)
I've also just deleted my personal account and plan to move my business account. I just refuse to deal with their BS. Agreed..extremely liberating!
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by direwolf20 on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @07:02PM (#50359937)
You're not the first and you're lucky it got unlocked. Usually random Google account locks persist forever. It's good to move things away before it happens.

Google has zero customer support even for companies that pay them millions of dollars - their attitude is take it or leave it.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by Miraste on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @04:40PM (#50358586)
Why didn't you expect Google to employ dark patterns? They're pioneers of dark patterns in software. They've probably done more than any other company except Meta to spread and advance these techniques.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by tremon on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @06:13PM (#50359535)
We can still call out bad behaviour even if it's fully expected. The alternative is silent acquiescence.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by llljk on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @05:16PM (#50359035)
TIL you can turn off ai features!

for those who didn't know how to do it:

1. https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/#settings/general

2. under "Smart features:", toggle off "Turn on smart features in Gmail, Chat, and Meet"

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by pvab3 on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @09:49AM (#50366305)
its funny how you are never asked whether you want to enable them, they just do it secretly and you have to investigate how to disable it
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by garrisonj on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @06:30PM (#50359668)
It might seem simple in the current moment to separate the two, but all of these features are going to start merging. Google isn't going to maintain "old" ML features.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by YeGoblynQueenne on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @08:15PM (#50360414)
>> When I subscribed, these features were provided by traditional ML, perhaps some BERT-like encoder architecture at most, however now I cannot keep that previous functionality if I don't wish to grant LLMs access to my data.

Sorry for the sidetrack, but why is it so common to consider BERT something else than an LLM? It is one of the earliest LLMs so it's nowhere near the size of more recent ones, but even wikipedia classifies it as an LLM:

  Bidirectional encoder representations from transformers (BERT)
  Original author Google AI
  Release October 31, 2018[1]
  Type 

    Large language model
    Transformer
    Foundation model

  License Apache 2.0
  Website arxiv.org/abs/1810.04805 
  Repository github.com/google-research/bert
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BERT_(language_model)

And in any case it's an autoregressively-trained Transformer, albeit encoder-only. If it's not an LLM, then what is it?

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by karmickoala on Friday November 06, 2026 @10:29AM (#50393526)
Thank you for bringing it up. I added BERT intentionally to draw attention on this fact that I'm unable to convey properly yet: I was okay with the use of previous generation of models, so it's not that I'm against LLMs since BERT-like architectures were indeed used previously.

What worries me about the current generation of models is privacy. In another comment, I tried to draw the line where models start to worry me regarding it and discussing it with whimsicalism, we noticed that it's not the generative aspect in particular; model size is probably the main factor. For instance, a larger encoder could make its transform almost lossless and thus more prone to data leakage again, although a decoder-like makes it more susceptible.

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by dwaite on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @09:03PM (#50360728)
I blame the European regulations that drove the featureset. The problem with the legal department being the primary feature stakeholder is that usability will always be crap.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by jhhh on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @10:00PM (#50361048)
Glad they did this change. It forced me to make actual filters rather than relying on gmail to filter to broad categories. Much better in the long run. Also I finally unsubscribed from things I would let go into promos and social but never read.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by DANmode on Tuesday November 03, 2026 @10:42PM (#50361277)
Turning all of their features off is the only way I achieved Inbox 0.

Your mileage may vary!

Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by satvikpendem on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @07:36AM (#50364726)
It's more likely that they replaced the traditional ML models with generative AI ones so there's not really a way to go back and disable only one part so to speak.
Re:Google Will Turn Off Search for Schools That Reject A.I by everdrive on Wednesday November 04, 2026 @09:58AM (#50366449)
Services want you to behave a certain way. You can only work around them for so long. The solution is to abstain or acquiesce.