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Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by chasebank on Sunday February 04, 2024 @03:28PM (#39254085)
Do you really need an extra bedroom? Do you really need a car? Do you really need that extra pair of socks? Do you really need that coca-cola? Of course not. People obviously want it. Quite the slippery slope you're walking.
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by latentcall on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:00PM (#39254417)
Are you comparing a car with a straw? Really? Trust me you will be perfectly fine without a straw! Try it sometime.
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by chasebank on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:13PM (#39254545)
If everything has an inherent carbon footprint, ie. harmful to the environment, then yes, we can compare a straw to a car.

Have you ever gone on a vacation? I'd wager that flight you took is 10000x worse for the environment than whatever reduction in your lifetime straws. Trust me you will be perfectly fine without going on vacation!

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by latentcall on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:24PM (#39254637)
I really underestimated how passionate people are about straws. Do you have a blog per chance where you compare different straws and their manufacturers? Would you rate them on thickness, quality of plastic, how quickly liquid travels from beverage to mouth? Do you prefer straws wrapped in plastic or not? Can you describe the different subtle mouth feels?
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by prepend on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:42PM (#39254794)
I’m not passionate about straws. I’m just passionate about stupidity and critical thinking.

It seems odd to me that someone would question whether straws are essential, but have no problem with vacations.

I also am offended when people expressing any interest are deflected into “why don’t care about this so much?” It’s not important how passionate GP is about straws. Address the content of their message, not whether they are super interested in a topic or not.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by chasebank on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:46PM (#39254829)
I'm not sure where I wrote I like straws. It's more of a "I don't like the logic regarding straw bans".
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by the_doctah on Sunday February 04, 2024 @05:47PM (#39255322)
>Can you describe the different subtle mouth feels?

Yes, paper feels way worse to drink out of, objectively.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by the_doctah on Sunday February 04, 2024 @05:46PM (#39255315)
Do celebrities really need private jets? No, the regular folk need to use shitty straws.
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by PlunderBunny on Sunday February 04, 2024 @06:04PM (#39255450)
You can buy a reusable metal straw if you want to.
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by AngryData on Sunday February 04, 2024 @09:22PM (#39256581)
I liked the idea of metal straws but ive about busted out a tooth or two with them more than once since I got them and never use them now.
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by triceratops on Monday February 05, 2024 @01:27AM (#39257992)
We should ban private jets too.
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by inglor_cz on Monday February 05, 2024 @07:27AM (#39260512)
"Trust me you will be perfectly fine without a straw!"

You can be fine without a lot of things. In the early 1950s, after the war, my grandpa raised a 5-head family in a single room. Two of the kids went to a university, no serious diseases etc.

The average living standard can be reduced surprisingly low before you run into any issues. Once the city you live in has good sewage system, enough doctors, enough food and not a major problem with drugs, the life expectancy will be reasonably high even with five people per room and one car per twenty families.

Another thing is that people won't vote for that.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by Ekaros on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:05PM (#39254474)
Isn't that private bedroom quite a big luxury, and many groups perfectly manage to survive living multiple persons per room... So why not force everyone to give up their private bedrooms?
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by grecy on Sunday February 04, 2024 @03:35PM (#39254161)
We are at a point in society where we can't simply keep doing what those before us did. We are killing the planet, and every plant and animal on it, including ourselves.

Yes, life is about to get less convenient and we have to give up some luxuries.

It doesn't matter if you don't like it, it a fact.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by chasebank on Sunday February 04, 2024 @03:56PM (#39254372)
"We are at a point in society where we can't simply keep doing what those before us did."

Sure we can. And we will. The choices of most of the world's population surely disagrees with this.

"Yes, life is about to get less convenient and we have to give up some luxuries."

I don't think that's the case, but we will see.

For the record, ideologically, I'm on your side. Realistically, I just don't see a world where the majority of people change.

The stop using the plastic straw argument applies to people who don't like straws. Tell the same anti-straw folks to stop traveling, stop having pets, no more children. You see where this goes - It just doesn't work.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by grecy on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:25PM (#39254649)
There are laws against plastic straws and plastic bags.

There are laws against chemicals that are known to cause environmental harm.

There are laws against vehicles that pollute too much. Soon there will be laws against cars vehicles that pollute at all.

All we have to do is make laws, and more and more of them are coming.

Again, it doesn't matter what an individual wants.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by JackSlateur on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:53PM (#39254897)
Your trust in laws is fascinating

For humans, laws and rules are meant to be overstepped : this is how our species got so far : by considering rules, laws and traditions, and say "well, whatever, I will try it my way and see how it goes"

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by grecy on Sunday February 04, 2024 @05:28PM (#39255177)
And how is that working out?

In recent months dozens of shops got multi-million dollar fines from the EPA for "deleting " diesel emission equipment. Now it's unheard of in the US.

It works.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by Lanolderen on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:27PM (#39254658)
We can though. There's a lot of fearmongering but the reality is climate change won't kill us for longer than we'll live.

There's also a lot of gradient in the effect of environmental laws. As an example my family still has tons of plastic bags that get reused over and over again until they become unusable or land as a trash bag. I don't know the math of it all but considering we buy plastic trash bags anyway we might as well get them from shopping instead of buying them separately. I have no idea what the global impact has been on plastic bag production but it could be interesting to see, assuming such a statistic exists.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by willsmith72 on Sunday February 04, 2024 @07:44PM (#39256102)
> There's a lot of fearmongering but the reality is climate change won't kill us for longer than we'll live.

I really don't like this take when I see it.

Do you care about just the next 50 years, or the next hundreds+? Do you have children/grandchildren? Do you care about an increase in the quantity and impact of natural disasters? The resulting increase in death, suffering, insurance premiums? What about more unpleasantly hot days? Less snow on the ski slopes?

All of that stuff is important to me, even though it almost certainly won't kill me personally. It's just such a no-brainer that the environment and climate is something to cherish and protect. Even if you're generally pro-environment, referring to environment-protection measures as fearmongering only makes it harder to enact them and increase their scale.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by Lanolderen on Monday February 05, 2024 @01:24PM (#39264728)
I don't mind environmentalism and I also see why people prefer to portray a picture of "you will die" instead of "your grand grand grand kids will die" but I also personally dislike it when people skew the picture to push their agenda, even if it is good and pushed entirely out of their love and care for others.

It might be due to me being surrounded by automotive enthusiasts but the general view of recent environmental laws in my circles is that they exist mostly to motivate spending and move some local pollution somewhere else. It's kind of the combination of nonsensical laws and short term effect exaggeration that offends people, making them stubborn/resistant to accepting things that actually make sense. It's probably offset by people who get a sense of urgency out of it but I withhold my right to dislike it.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by willsmith72 on Monday February 05, 2024 @03:58PM (#39267069)
we're just in different cultures/societies/circles then. around me, no one's portraying "you will die", and I don't feel at all surrounded by nonsensical environmental laws. if anything, it's the opposite. why aren't builders in my city taxed more for using materials with worse environmental effects? why aren't extremely inefficient vehicles taxed more highly? why such little investment in bike lanes?

those are the nonsensical laws i see

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by grecy on Sunday February 04, 2024 @04:51PM (#39254880)
> the reality is climate change won't kill us for longer than we'll live.

That depends heavily on where you live.

3.6 billion people live in areas that are at a very high risk from climate change.

https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/climate-cha...

> There's a lot of fearmongering

If you have better credentials than the WHO and leading climatologists around the world then I'd love to hear about them.

Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by the_doctah on Sunday February 04, 2024 @05:49PM (#39255336)
Generalizations and platitudes, you can't even argue with this pie in the sky nonsense.
Re:Plastic bans work. Billions of plastic bags were avoided ... by gregable on Sunday February 04, 2024 @05:09PM (#39255038)
It slips both ways though. I suspect banning incandescent bulbs is probably a good change, even though there were people who obviously wanted them.