How many kids do you have?

Interests are all well and good, but costs are real. Following passion is for rich people (or people who get unlimited student loans).

> Following passion is for rich people (or people who get unlimited student loans).

I think this is a truism that people want to be false.

But in any developed country, most poor people are pretty rich when compared to the world, and it offers them lots of freedom to choose what field they want to work in, where they want to work (both city and company), etc. There isn't the expectations that sons take their fathers' jobs and that daughters take their mothers' (often being a homemaker).

It still sucks to be relatively poor in a developed country, but most are rich enough that they can follow their passions in ways their grandparents never could and half the world can't today.

Passion doesn't pay the bills. It's good to be passionate about something, but many passions are not marketable.

Many have drowned in student debt following their passions, but this wouldn't be so in many countries that have university education fully covered or significantly subsidized by taxes.

The countries that have "free" university education also steer young people into career paths starting in middle school. If you're not the sort of person who will succeed at university, you get directed into vocational or trade school or apprenticeships, etc.

Exactly! Passions are good hobbies. Many people who take their passion and turn it to make it their source of income regret the decision because it sours the passion —it become a job.

If passion doesn't pay the bills, it certainly can't pay taxes. Why should engineers and plumbers and garbagemen pay taxes to send someone to art school for years?

Once something is paid for with tax money, then the people paying the taxes want a say in how it's spent -- which is not just reasonable, it's a requirement of a liberal democracy.

Of course, countries with tax-funded higher education ration degrees. There are limited slots, and art courses are usually at the bottom of funding considerations.

Giving the benefit of the doubt here, I assumed the push toward trade school is because that makes the most sense for the child in question. College is not for everyone, including a lot of people pushed into attending.

It really baffles me sometimes how readily we assume our conclusions apply to others. Most serious decisions in life require balancing multiple difficult trade-offs. To think that our particular biases, experiences, resources and difficulties are anywhere close to another's is a huge leap.

It's fine to speak from one's experience, but to say that someone else should make the decision one thinks is wise based on a single comment is either ignorant, arrogant or both.

Edit: I replied to you @allenrb, but I'm not directing these thoughts toward you. I'm just pointing out a general behavior I see (but wish I didn't) on the internet and HN.

His grades do not warrant the gamble on the expense, either mine or his. He's very artistically inclined, rather than academically.

Most people desire not being poor over most other things.

There are a lot of ways to make money. Picking a job based on money is a good way to be absolutely miserable. My parents pushed me towards making money my entire life and there is nothing I regret more than following that advice. Every day I wake up dreading going to work and it seeps into every aspect of my life.

Presumably you have enough money now to switch to something that makes you happy?

Personally, if you’re going to be miserable anyway (as most Americans are these days), it’s probably better to be miserable with money than without money, lol

I'm 29 and have 500k saved up (live in Santa Monica which is quite expensive), but yes I think I will quit my next stock vest which is Friday.

And idk. My best friend from high school moved out here with me and he's a waiter making 40k a year and seems totally happy. Works like 30 hours a week, no mental stress, able to work out and work on himself. I think money is highly overrated.

Making 40K a year is only sustainable while you're in good health and don't have a family to support. I remember my carefree twenties as well, but things can change as you get older. There is no retirement plan on that kind of income other than waiting tables till you die. At least you should recognize that your relationship to money is very different than theirs. Having half a mil in savings is a completely different ballgame.

I think both situations are unsustainable. I'm not financially stable because I hate my job and might quit at any time and he doesn't make enough money.

But I think my main point is both of us have a way of becoming sustainable so you might as well do what makes you happy instead of working a job you hate for 8 years. Being a waiter making 40k isn't enough long term, but working your way into a higher end establishment or management is. A girl I dated started out as barista, became a store manager, and is now the regional manager and makes ~125k a year and more importantly she is a perfect fit for the job and enjoyed it the entire time.

All I'm trying to say is there are a lot of paths to a sustainable life even when following your natural inclinations.

But anyway OP responded his son's not super interested in college anyway so his plan sounds good to me anyway.

Honestly, sounds like an amazing life - both you and your friend. I’m 35 in the Bay with a NW of 250K. I am incredibly miserable because I don’t have enough money to have an upward trajectory. I’ll switch places with you in a heartbeat.

Seems to me like your hygiene factors are all taken care of, but the motivators are lacking. I hope I get to be in your situation soon, as I got laid off and trying to get back in.

I grew up having to do two part time jobs and go to school part time to put myself through college (late start too, only graduated at 25). I wasn’t financially prudent post-college either, took me a few years to get that taken care of as well. As far as I’m concerned, I don’t think I can have enough money - which I acknowledge can be a recipe for misery but I think I’m ok being miserable if I had loads of money.

I was happy with a low income until I had a kid. Then the calculus shifts. Same with physical disability or taking on caregiving responsibilities.

how do you have that much saved up at 29 ? faang salary / vest schedules ?

Yes, but your top regret would have been different had you chosen a different path. And perhaps your top regret would be worse than your current.

> every day I wake up dreading going to work

This sounds terrible. But at least you have a job. Many people wake up with dread every day for whether they or their baby will starve to death.

Also, it’s never too late to change.

You may regret it even more if you hadn’t made money.

The world is cruel and wants to see us all ground to dust. The typical HN denizen might know this at an intellectual level, but few of us have the lived experience. I sincerely hope you never have to learn how much of a privileged perspective you have.

If you don't want to be poor, don't go to university.

Academia should be a place for people who run away from money, because it's the last thing upon the list of interests for them. Academia should be a place for joy in learning concepts, and in some circumstances, which strive to be useless. Mathematics is one of the most exemplary fields for this, which is summed up quite nicely with the following quote:

"The mathematician does not study pure mathematics because it is useful. He studies it because he delights in it, and he delights in it because it is beautiful."

Never go to a university expecting to improve your wealth status, because it very likely won't happen. Turn elsewhere to find wealth.

Meanwhile in the real world, large companies and public jobs all have practically mandatory education requirements. Your pay as a public employee in Germany is literally determined based on whether you have a BSC or MSC or none.

Education is an investment, period, end of story.

If you don't do a modicum of Research before you take on tens or hundreds of thousands in debt to invest in something, that's on you and you alone.

If people were not bailed out and subsidized we would not have these issues of this magnitude.

Seems like if we don't think 18 year olds are not legally responsible enough to drink alcohol, then perhaps we shouldn't allow them to take on life-destroying amounts of debt.

you mean like this one?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis

One has to think the ROI for any financial investment in someone <25 YO towards things like education pays off more than similarly-sized investments later in life.

Regardless of whether the parent can support that tuition cost or the kid has to take on loans themselves, it should be up to the individual whether they take on that risk irrespective of the parent's financial situation, which is I think where this heavily-downvoted reply was going.

As somebody who's education was way less supported than the rest of my family, who came out with a better job than all of those others in spite of that, there's a decent chance your kid will resent being "held back" by such a choice for a very long time if you give them trade school as their only option in life.

Lots of people find ways to be successful in the arts by eventually finding something cross-disciplinary, and with the direction most non-white-collar jobs in the US are heading I wouldn't bet my kid's life on trade school. What made sense as a sentiment on Mike Rowe's "Dirty Jobs" 10+ years ago doesn't quite hold up as well today, and those projects were funded by the Koch brothers and the whole "trade school is just as good" thing should be taken with a mountain of salt. I'd love to see more data proving trade school proves better today, especially for young adults with educational backgrounds and access to learning and job opportunities whose parents are in the economic class to be browsing HN

At $6k a year like in Canada or Europe... sure.