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Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by cjohnson318 on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:02PM (#35284537)
I thought it was legal to film police?
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by culi on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:08PM (#35284583)
Especially in your own house...

The funny thing is this is basically the exact same story for J. Cole's "Neighbors"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nfVWiXY3WY

Basically he moved to a new bougie neighborhood and the neighbors called the cops on him accusing him of "selling dope" (the primary hook of the 1 minute song). So he took his security footage and made a music video out of it

You can see the SWAT team members casually talking to the neighbors peeking over the fence too lol

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by calvinmorrison on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:41PM (#35284829)
You forget the part where the overweight officer takes a sneak at the desserts to um.. check for cocaine?
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by irrational on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:15PM (#35284626)
> bougie

Is this a misspelling (perhaps purposefully?) of “bourgeoisie”?

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by wahern on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:19PM (#35284663)
It's a slang term more common (IME) in speech than writing: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bougie
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by jcpham2 on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:18PM (#35284656)
Yes this is exactly the slang
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by defrost on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:43PM (#35284842)
See Also: Boujee Natives by Snotty Nose Rez Kids
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by edgyquant on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:53PM (#35284900)
it’s a shortened version of it common in the US to describe people who’s style/taste/mannerisms are upper middle class.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by aaomidi on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:05PM (#35284557)
There have been states trying to ban it
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by indymike on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:26PM (#35284719)
It will be difficult for states to ban something that is protected by the constitution. Public servants doing public service have zero expectation of privacy and citizens have and absolute right to photograph and record them.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by glenda on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:35PM (#35284771)
Many states aren't outright banning it, but making filming from "too close" a form of interference.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by ffhhj on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:45PM (#35284861)
Picking an officer's head with a big ass pole microphone is not acceptable? Not standing close.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by indymike on Friday March 24, 2023 @10:22AM (#35289430)
> but making filming from "too close" a form of interference.

They are trying to, but these laws will likely fail to be constitutional because so far they are completely arbitrary and do not respect freedom of press.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by kevin_thibedeau on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:36PM (#35284779)
Some states already require two party consent for recordings. Ohio isn't one of them.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by kube-system on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:49PM (#35284884)
That pertains to audio, not anyone’s image. Which is why many security camera systems do not record audio or have settings to disable it.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by dragonwriter on Friday March 24, 2023 @02:23AM (#35285666)
> > Some states already require two party consent for recordings. Ohio isn’t one of them.

> That pertains to audio, not anyone’s image.

Approximately the same states are all-party consent for video recording any place that there is a reasonable expectation of privacy. However, reasonable expectation of privacy is different between audio of a conversation, and video.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by kova12 on Friday March 24, 2023 @01:29AM (#35285392)
That's the thing that pisses me off. If someone talks to me and I can remember it in my head, there is already a recording. Putting this recording on tape only makes it more accurate. It doesn't change the nature that recollection in one form or another has been made. So the real effect is when there is a dispute, the evidence which could otherwise be solid, becomes instead a "he said, she said" type of evidence and justice instead of being precise becomes a flip of a coin
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by thaumasiotes on Friday March 24, 2023 @02:09AM (#35285607)
It's even dumber than that. You're legally allowed to remember what people say to you. You're also legally allowed to go write down what someone just said to you; when you do that, it magically becomes much stronger evidence.

But you can't record it; that's not evidence at all.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by kube-system on Friday March 24, 2023 @02:47AM (#35285810)
Of course a recording would be stronger evidence than written notes. It just wouldn’t be legal evidence unless it was obtained legally.

One could potentially collect lots of very good evidence if permitted to ignore laws in the process.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by autoexec on Friday March 24, 2023 @03:18AM (#35286031)
I'd like to believe that there's already a sort of balance in place created by the fact that with enough evidence of someone doing something really really wrong, even if that evidence couldn't be used in a court room, that can still be presented to the public who will use that information to reach something approaching justice.

I'd like to think that if someone, especially someone in a position of power, were caught doing something truly evil that society would find an appropriate response regardless of some legal technicality and that there will always be someone willing to risk the personal legal consequences for letting the rest of us know about it. That that same risk of legal consequences would also prevent people from exposing others over trivial matters.

I'm not sure that works out in reality though. We have lots of evidence of people who have done very terrible things but have fully gotten away with it, and plenty of evidence that society is as terrible at evaluating evidence as mobs are at coming up with just responses.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by formerly_proven on Friday March 24, 2023 @02:52AM (#35285853)
Usual reminder that fruit of the poisonous tree is a US special
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by autoexec on Friday March 24, 2023 @03:06AM (#35285944)
> You're also legally allowed to go write down what someone just said to you; when you do that, it magically becomes much stronger evidence.

That isn't just magic. The longer a memory stays in your head, and the more times it's called up, the more likely that recollection is to be changed by your own brain. A written account of events shortly after they occur is a good way to protect against future damage to the memory.

It doesn't mean that what's written is accurate to start with, we know how little eye witnesses and even our own senses can be trusted, but it's probably going to be a lot better than what we think happened days/weeks/years later.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by thaumasiotes on Friday March 24, 2023 @03:51AM (#35286232)
> That isn't just magic. The longer a memory stays in your head, and the more times it's called up, the more likely that recollection is to be changed by your own brain. A written account of events shortly after they occur is a good way to protect against future damage to the memory.

> It doesn't mean that what's written is accurate to start with, we know how little eye witnesses and even our own senses can be trusted, but it's probably going to be a lot better than what we think happened days/weeks/years later.

This is great if you assume everyone is always telling the truth to the best of their ability, but that's not such a great assumption in court. Giving greater weight to notes mostly means that someone who plans to screw you over benefits from automatic victories against people who didn't plan not to get screwed.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by autoexec on Friday March 24, 2023 @03:00AM (#35285899)
I think there's a substantive difference between something you experience and recollect from the input of your own senses and something digitized, recorded, and preserved in perfect form in a format that is easily shared in every detail and easily repurposed in endless ways.

I do think that people should be able to record events that occur on their own properly, and even their own phone calls without consent of another person, but I worry about the implications of saying that our ability to remember events and the ability to log data are basically the same. Feels like a loophole that a lot of evil people and companies would happily jump through.

Generally though, I don't really see an ethical problem with data collected strictly for an individual's personal use and I guess in theory we could have two party consent laws that acknowledge that but still offer some protections.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by indymike on Friday March 24, 2023 @10:25AM (#35289457)
That doesn't apply to recording public officials doing their job.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by pjc50 on Friday March 24, 2023 @05:07AM (#35286716)
The constitution means what conservative judges say it means. It also can't stop the police carrying out violent retaliation against dissidents.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by indymike on Friday March 24, 2023 @10:21AM (#35289420)
> The constitution means what conservative judges say it means.

I'm not sure to word conservative applies. In the US you are just as likely to get a liberal judge as a conservative one in a local trial court. Most cases are never appealed, at the state level, it depends on the state if it's conservative/liberal, and at the Federal level we have judges appointed by both conservative, moderate and liberal presidents.

> It also can't stop the police carrying out violent retaliation against dissidents.

It can, however make violence expensive. We're seeing case after case cost local governments hundreds of thousands of dollars for civil rights violations and excessive force. The great equalizer has been cameras.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by drewcoo on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:23PM (#35284698)
That is American privacy! Evidence of illegal search made illegal because blue camera shyness matters.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by kube-system on Thursday March 23, 2023 @11:53PM (#35284899)
The article doesn’t read as if they are claiming they were filmed illegally.

It looks mostly like a claim about using their likeness commercially —- their personality rights. i.e. the rights someone would sign over in a modeling contract.

…Like how you can’t put Tom Hanks face on a box of cigarettes and sell it without permission. He may sue and claim that you’ve tarnished his image.

But yeah, it’s a stretch here too given the circumstances, but these laws vary by state so I have no clue how this state handles it.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by ericcumbee on Friday March 24, 2023 @12:34AM (#35285123)
I don't know what the exact test is, but if there is legitimate fundamental constitutionally protected free speech (Criticizing the government) the fact that its also commercial speech is irrelevant in my mind.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by zoklet-enjoyer on Friday March 24, 2023 @12:31AM (#35285105)
That's ridiculous. If someone breaks into a house, the homeowner has the right to do whatever they want with the video, including monetizing it. Especially since they stole from him and damaged his property.
Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by kube-system on Friday March 24, 2023 @12:57AM (#35285244)
I agree with what you’re saying but not the reason. The actions of the police don’t grant Afroman any additional rights. He had the right (at least to the music video) regardless of whether the police were right or wrong.

I believe the reason he has a right to publish this work is because he is not profiting from their likeness. He is profiting from his work of criticism. (Edit: a sibling comment points out that Ohio exempts audiovisual and political works)

Also, as a public servant in official duty, in a place where they found themselves likely to be recorded, they had no reasonable expectation of privacy.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by Broken_Hippo on Friday March 24, 2023 @03:33AM (#35286140)
If someone breaks into a house, the homeowner has the right to do whatever they want with the video, including monetizing it

I disagree, mostly because it isn't hard to get fringe cases. Drunk folks, folks with memory issues, and so on. Even if they break in, I don't think this is the sort of thing they should face public ridicule for.

I think the homeowner has the right because the folks breaking in are cops. If a cop cannot handle these facets of their job being public, they should act better. A cop in uniform is a public figure, even if they are in a private residence. An ununiformed cop is a public figure if they are doing cop stuff, especially if they are in your house.

They should be acting like someone is always watching. They should be able to handle being told bad words from people. They should be expected to always act professional. That is part of the standard we set for call center employees, after all, and we should expect folks that can ruin other people's lives to live up to better standards.

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by runlevel1 on Friday March 24, 2023 @12:49AM (#35285204)
Advertising, sure. But other uses appear specifically allowed (emphasis mine):

> Ohio Rev. Code Ann. § 2741.09 (A)(1): Right Of Publicity In Individual's Persona: Exceptions.

> (A) This chapter does not apply to any of the following:

> (1)(a) A literary work, dramatic work, fictional work, historical work, audiovisual work, or musical work regardless of the media in which the work appears or is transmitted, other than an advertisement or commercial announcement not exempt under division (A)(1)(d) of this section;

> (b) Material that has political or newsworthy value;

> ...

Source: https://codes.ohio.gov/ohio-revised-code/section-2741.09

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by kube-system on Friday March 24, 2023 @01:03AM (#35285273)
Yeah I was just using the archetypal advertising example as a demonstration of the angle they’re taking. I figured it was not legally sound.

Although, that might not cover the T-shirts…

Re:Police sue rapper Afroman for using footage of home raid ... by denton-scratch on Friday March 24, 2023 @07:46AM (#35287781)
I guess the "damages" claims don't arise from filming them, but from making the video public.

Still, it seems to me (IANAL) that the suit doesn't stand a snowflake's chance in hell. In particular, they reckon their damages not based on any actual damage, but on the earnings Afroman made from publicising them.

Well, that's what the report says; but it's from The Grauniad, and the quality of reporting in that organ has been declining rather quickly (whatever Wikipedia says about "reliable sources").