News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by blacklight on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:10AM (#34117483)
This is probably the #500 post on HN that reads "help I've been locked out of my Google account for Kafkaesque/inexplicable reasons and I have nobody to reach out to".

If you're still using Google products as your primary drivers, then it's entirely your fault.

Do yourself a favour in 2023: drop Google and all the filthy excrement that they produce. There's plenty of much better alternatives, and from a purely market-based perspective Google deserves to rot in hell for all of its sins and shitty products.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by throw0101c on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:38AM (#34117773)
> If you're still using Google products as your primary drivers, then it's entirely your fault.

This is mostly true for any of the free offerings.

If you're paying for the '…for Business' stuff (perhaps with your own domain), then there's probably more availability for recourse and contacts (especially since they're charging your credit card, so they have some form of link to a real human being).

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by tag2103 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:48PM (#34119157)
I've had a Google domain for several years hosting my private email, I'm migrating everything to protonmail (including my Companies) in 2023.

FYI- It is the exact opposite. There is zero support without multiple support tickets, their UI is full of antipatterns. I get to pay and not only do they scan my emails (they claim they stopped that practice, sure) they also won't allow Google Workspace (formerly GSuite) to utilize features like Google Family. I have a tertiarty public account that right now I can't access because I'm travelling and have run afoul of the Google gods and in the Admin console zero way to force allow a login. And I'm paying for that wonderful granular control.

I for one hope the wave of GPT based AI wipes them off the face of the internet, they are valueless. Their search is a joke now. They've been adversarial to the user community for years and reminds me the terrible taste of a monopolized- because lets face it that's what they are- ecosystem with ZERO concern or care about their end user. <insert lilly tomlin phone company skit here>

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by coffeeblack on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:17AM (#34117566)
This, plus if you have no Google Takeout backup.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by gatonegro on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:48AM (#34117882)
A few days ago I was going through an old Gmail account, and decided to get my data through Takeout. Told me it'd take a few hours, and the next day I had a link ready. Click the link, enter the password, it tells me I need a verification code that it wants to send to an address that stopped existing 15 years ago.

As it turns out, Google is not sufficiently convinced that I am in fact the owner of the account, so it refuses to let me download the data. I don't feel inclined to spend time trying to figure out this nonsense, but thankfully none of the information in that account is particularly important. I'll take it as a sign that I should just move away from Google, because next time the information on an account could be actually important, and I'd be screwed.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by blacklight on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:57AM (#34117979)
Takeout is a feature that Google was kind of forced to implement because of GDPR compliance. But they still try their best to make it so bad that people won't think of using it.

First, getting to a point where you can actually schedule the creation of a zip takes a lot of clicking around - just to make sure that people won't bump into it unless they're explicitly searching for it.

Second, the process is painfully slow (on purpose). Last time I used it was to download my YouTube subscriptions and playlists to import them into my Piped instance. Even though I only have about 100 subscriptions, and only two playlists with about 20 items each, the process took almost two days to complete. By then I had already made a script that scraped the content from their HTML (and it only took me 5 minutes), and another one that did the same but using the YouTube API. If it takes less than a second to get the playlists and subscriptions of a user, I don't see a single reason why generating a Takeout CSV with the same information should take 2 days. I was determined (and tech-savvy) enough to script my way out of it, but many users just get discouraged and give up the idea of exporting their Google data entirely.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by toomuchtodo on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:54AM (#34118585)
If you use a cloud storage provider Takeout supports (Dropbox, OneDrive, Box), it can be configured to auto export on a cadence. I have Takeout scheduled to export every two months to my Dropbox /apps path (you have to renew this schedule very year unfortunately).

> Automatically create an archive of your selected data every 2 months for one year. The first archive will be created immediately.

https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3024190?hl=en

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by jsnell on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:59AM (#34118637)
Takeout was created in 2011, well before the GDPR existed or before there was any other kind of regulatory requirement for it.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by gatonegro on Saturday December 24, 2022 @01:51PM (#34119847)
I tried Takeout on my main account, and I have to say I'm surprised. Took about an hour to process and it allowed me to download everything.

While I was waiting on that, I finally paid for a proper email service and migrated my domain, so I have a copy of my Gmail data and a working, Google-free email service now.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by koonsolo on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:15AM (#34118193)
Google takeout is horrible. It either doesn't work or partly works.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by darkhelmet on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:59AM (#34118638)
I remember trying to download an archive of my email a few years ago. Hah, that was fun. I had a number of tries but each time the archive it gave me had between 20% to 50% of the total email messages.

It's been unreliable for years.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by Kiro on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:29AM (#34117703)
I'm currently converting so many disgruntled LastPass users to Chrome's built-in password manager. It's fantastic and I love Google. What is your opinion on that?
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by moistofreason on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:34AM (#34117731)
Onepassword beats both by a mile. Worth every penny.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by sgc on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:36AM (#34118399)
I have been using KeePass and variants for a long time, and have never had any problems with it on a variety of devices.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by hulitu on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:43AM (#34117825)
> I'm currently converting so many disgruntled LastPass users to Chrome's built-in password manager. It's fantastic

Some people never learn.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by grepfru_it on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:50AM (#34117905)
Bitwarden/vaultwarden
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by macrolime on Saturday December 24, 2022 @10:52AM (#34117922)
Did you forget a /s?
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by blacklight on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:04AM (#34118049)
Are you aware of the fact that Chrome stores credentials in a simple SQLite database whose encryption can basically be bypassed if the user is logged into the system? https://www.quora.com/Is-it-true-that-Chrome-stores-your-use...

If you left LastPass because of its security flaws, then using Chrome's passwords is a bit like driving a scooter with a pasta pot on your head because you feel like a normal helmet is too unsafe.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by coffeefirst on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:27AM (#34118310)
I'd say if something is important—as in it would be a huge mess if you were locked out of it suddenly—it's a good idea to pay for it.

You can switch browsers and search engines at the drop of a hat. Primarily email, password manager, and long term document storage, not so much.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by harshalizee on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:09AM (#34118113)
But realistically how do you do it? I've stopped signing up for any new Google products for well over half a decade now. Even moved my email to protonmail. I have a little over 500 accounts tied to my Gmail over the last two decades. Moving them is a pain but still possible. The problem arises when it comes to existing accounts with byzantine financial institutions. Trying to change email addresses that are linked to you as the username is nigh impossible in many cases. Quite a few institutions won't let you use an email that comes from protonmail or a custom domain. So, many times I'm forced back into using a Gmail address to prevent a whole host off other issues
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by anonymousiam on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:55AM (#34118609)
Your point about the inability to change your email address with certain institutions resonates with me. Some companies have no consideration for the possibility that one of their customers might need to change their primary email address.

Last year I was notified by Audi that my email address had been compromised in a data breach. As the spam volume to that mailbox increased, I decided to change it. I discovered that I cannot change the email address associated with my Audi account. When I contacted their Technical Support group, they advised me to delete the whole account (which failed), and create a new one.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by badrabbit on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:15PM (#34118788)
But it is free excrement
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by nzealand on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:31PM (#34118959)
Financial institutions are the most frustrating when it comes to email notifications to custom domains. Often times the confirmation email comes through fine, then the email notifications fail to be sent. Luckily with all financial institutions it's easy (probably too easy) to call them up and change your email address.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by Beltalowda on Saturday December 24, 2022 @01:14PM (#34119448)
> Quite a few institutions won't let you use an email that comes from protonmail or a custom domain. So, many times I'm forced back into using a Gmail address to prevent a whole host off other issues

As in, they check "if domain != 'gmail.com' { fuckyou(); }"? Or as in "they MTAs are not very good and just don't deliver email"?

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by harshalizee on Saturday December 24, 2022 @02:58PM (#34120506)
Literally that. If your email domain doesn't come from a set of whitelisted domains (gmail, yahoo, msn, etc.) they just don't let you create an account.

I have accounts in the US, EU and Asia due to family, etc. and this kind of restriction is fairly common in EU/Asia

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by Beltalowda on Saturday December 24, 2022 @06:59PM (#34122522)
> this kind of restriction is fairly common in EU/Asia

Interesting; I can't say I recall ever encountering such a restriction anywhere, including banks, and I have or had bank accounts in a number of European (and other) countries. I've encountered other problems, but not this. Not that I'm doubting your experience of course; just interesting I never had problems with it.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by ticviking on Saturday December 24, 2022 @04:28PM (#34121234)
I've lost thousands of dollars of digital content at google. I was really salty about it for a while, but sacrifice is the price of liberty. It is a small sacrifice to not do business with companies that demand I do business with other companies that refuse to provide customer service.

I do a lot more business in cash locally as a result. Finding a good local bank that will let me physically show up to deal with problems with my money was the hardest part due to the massive consolidation in that industry, but the result is that I am more connected to my community and more resilient to many types of problems.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by joe__f on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:13AM (#34118163)
I've been thinking to move away from Gmail for a while now, what alternatives do you suggest?
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by kornhole on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:31AM (#34118355)
First of all, buy your own domain from Gandi.net, hover, namecheap, or wherever you prefer. Then get an email account at a private provider who let's you use your own domain: fastmail, gandi, proton, tutanota.. As long as you keep paying for your domain registration, you are not beholden to a mail provider.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by sph on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:32AM (#34118366)
Fastmail with your custom domain. I am a user, I am not paid to advertise them. I do not miss Google at all.

If you do not like Fastmail, still get your own domain for emails.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by Freak_NL on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:14PM (#34118776)
Migrating to Fastmail is pretty painless too if you already have your own domain.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by beardbound on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:36PM (#34119017)
I moved to fast mail a couple of years ago and got my mom to move to and I’ve been a happy customer the whole time it’s great. I moved when I started getting concerned about how reliant I was on google. Now my core services are spread across several different companies. I also am not affiliated in any way.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by harrisonpage on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:35AM (#34118387)
fastmail.com
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by incrudible on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:15AM (#34118185)
Stop answering e-mails. No, seriously.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by kilroy123 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:26PM (#34118911)
fastmail with custom domain
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by MerelyMortal on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:44PM (#34119104)
I did with Fastmail and a custom domain name. Very easy (Fastmail has a Gmail import tool), highly recommended.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by tag2103 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:50PM (#34119173)
Anything- including RFC 2549 based communications. =)
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by blacklight on Tuesday December 27, 2022 @05:53AM (#34147536)
I've been using Protonmail with 3 custom domains for a few years, but I'm quite upset by the state of their bridge. They struggled a lot with IMAP compatibility, they only test it on Thunderbird, Outlook and Apple Mail before releasing it, and you can't connect to the bridge from another machine (well, you can technically set up an SSH tunnel or use socat to forward the localhost ports, but that's a hack that is not officially supported nor advised).

I'm now considering switching to Fastmail or Tutanota.

Or even run my own mail server. I used to do that until a couple of years ago, but I eventually got frustrated by all the dumb rules that Google and Microsoft (but mostly Microsoft) set in place to discourage people from running their own servers.

However, given the amount of time that I've already spent to debug the Proton bridge and open PRs to fix their sh*t, I must acknowledge that running my own Postfix server and spending a couple of hours to set up the right DNS records would have probably saved me a lot of time (and money).

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by ScottyAdams0 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:20AM (#34118244)
Isn’t this a moderated forum? You can call google a doo-doo head, but not YC companies I guess. It’s also laughably out of touch to say Google products are low quality. There are many complaints listed here because we never hear Google’s side of the story. You have no clue if this guy got banned because he did something bad and is just venting that they crushed his crypto spam boy or whatever.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by harrisonpage on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:37AM (#34118411)
> It’s also laughably out of touch to say Google products are low quality.

Have you used their Nest products? Absolute garbage.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by MPSimmons on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:25AM (#34118295)
In my opinion, the issue with Google's products is not and never really has been that they're "low quality", it's that, when you DO have problems with them, there is absolutely no recourse or support option. The reason that the parent mentioned that there have been 500 support threads for someone being locked out of their Gmail (or site de-listed, or literally any other change that Google has the ability to make) is that there is no accountability or infrastructure to get support.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by ScottyAdams0 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:36AM (#34118407)
Ok you’re just gonna assert something demonstrably false. Ok, I just feel a need to respond and say, no. They do customer service at Google better than any company I’ve ever seen.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by kaibee on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:44AM (#34118485)
> Ok you’re just gonna assert something demonstrably false. Ok, I just feel a need to respond and say, no. They do customer service at Google better than any company I’ve ever seen.

Did you accidentally cross over from some parallel universe or something? In your world, did Trump win in 2016 and lose in 2020? Just checking.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by sph on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:30AM (#34118340)
Let me repeat it for those in the back: If you're still using Google products as your primary drivers, then it's entirely your fault.

Your email is your most prized possession. It is more important than your credit card number. At least you can call your bank if someone steals it. Also, _ALWAYS_ use your own custom domain for emails. Do not host it @someone-else.com

Stop using a free service from a terrible company that can lock you out at any time and, for Heaven's sake, stop recommending it to non-technical people!

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by Freak_NL on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:13PM (#34118767)
> […] stop recommending it to non-technical people!

Excepting loved ones, there is not much of a choice is there?

If you help set them up in a way that covers all the basics (personal domain, mail hosted at one of the current batch of paid, reliable parties like fastmail.com), then whenever something goes wrong, or whenever the friction to do something (anything!) is too high, it's not only your fault, but they'll lose trust in anything that doesn't look like a megacorp.

The other alternative is to just point them to Apple/Microsoft/Google where everything just works¹, and when things go tits-up (which, statistically speaking, only happens to a small percentage of people) they'll just blame that faceless megacorp, knowing full well that real choice is limited to those with technical know-how (or direct access to them).

I dislike the status quo, but aside from making sure I and my family aren't stuck like this, I don't see much leeway to change it.

1: It doesn't. But it will feel like it does, which is all that matters, and when it doesn't work, they'll just blame themselves.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by 650REDHAIR on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:13PM (#34118770)
Do you host your own email?
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by forgotpwd16 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:42PM (#34119083)
You can have an email with custom domain without having to host it. Though, even for that, not sure how easy will be for a non-technical person to set up. Maybe there're services making it simple.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by pseudo0 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @11:43AM (#34118480)
Their requirements have gotten pretty insane. I have a couple of old Gmail accounts I used for low-priority stuff (signing up for forums, mailing lists where I might get spammed) and they are both now locked out for "security reasons". I have strong passwords, correctly provided the previous password, have the recovery email, but I jump through all the hoops just for them to tell me to F off. And these are 10+ year old accounts with no issues! Thank goodness I don't use Gmail for my primary email address, I moved that ages ago.
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by zxcvbn4038 on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:23PM (#34118878)
That is pretty harsh. The only way to resolve problems with Google like this is to know someone on the inside that can help, or to generate enough outrage on social media that some service team someplace takes notice and reaches out to help the guy.

What the poster can do in the future is enable 2FA on his Google accounts as that seems to streamline password recovery. At minimum add a phone and backup codes. Even better add a couple yubikeys (and maybe drop the phone after adding yubikeys because phones are super easy to compromise)

Same goes for GitHub.

Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by nzealand on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:36PM (#34119014)
The poster can also be patient. I've been locked out of infrequently used google accounts before. Eventually the account will be unlocked. If you ignore it for a few days (also pretty harsh.)
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by blacklight on Tuesday December 27, 2022 @05:46AM (#34147506)
Some people who get locked out of their Google accounts may be unable to use their phones, access their photos, receive and send emails, or do their day-to-day work on shared documents. How can you say "just be patient and wait a couple of days"?
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by prlambert on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:32PM (#34118971)
"Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community. Edit out swipes." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
Re:Help Locked out of 10 years Gmail account by sergiomattei on Saturday December 24, 2022 @12:59PM (#34119261)
What do you suggest? Asking honestly as a long time google user.