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Re:Adversarial Collaboration by agumonkey on Sunday September 25, 2022 @10:31PM (#32978665)
Yes. And if someone knows books or discussions about this topic I want the names. Its such a strong force in social structures. Stating your truth is rarely possible, you better sing along and talk down in smaller sub groups later.
Re:Adversarial Collaboration by christophilus on Sunday September 25, 2022 @10:59PM (#32978852)
Read anything Charlie Munger writes on the topic. He said something to the effect of “A year in which you fail to kill at least one of your cherished ideas is probably a failed year.”

Anyway, he has a lot to say on the subject and on incentives and human psychology broadly.

Re:Adversarial Collaboration by AstralStorm on Monday September 26, 2022 @05:19AM (#32980998)
Nice platitude, but sometimes cherished ideas are actually true.

A better way to phrase it would be a year when you don't challenge your idea is probably a failed year. It might still win the challenge.

Re:Adversarial Collaboration by bombcar on Monday September 26, 2022 @11:22AM (#32984300)
I think the idea is you have many cherished ideas, and so many are actually false that you shouldn't have much difficulty killing one.

Or, another way of looking at it, your knowledge of so many areas is superficial and a deep dive into any one would let you know how you weren't even wrong, as the saying goes.

You can find people doing it in any HN thread about almost anything - often shows up as "why didn't they just do X". A non-domain expert with a "obvious solution" is almost always missing something major.

Re:Adversarial Collaboration by agumonkey on Monday September 26, 2022 @10:22AM (#32983478)
stuff like psychology of misjudgement ?
Re:Adversarial Collaboration by gmnash on Sunday September 25, 2022 @11:25PM (#32979045)
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/02/27/why-facts-dont...

Three mentioned in the article: * Enigma of Reason * The Knowledge Illusion * Denying to the Grave

Re:Adversarial Collaboration by seneca on Sunday September 25, 2022 @11:05PM (#32978890)
This is a large chunk of "The Elephant in the Brain", though it's present as an example of the wider thesis. The overall topic of the book is that people basically always lie about their motivations, including to themselves. I highly recommend reading it.
Re:Adversarial Collaboration by suoduandao2 on Monday September 26, 2022 @12:14PM (#32984942)
Everything handwaving freakoutery (it's a blog) publishes on egregores I found highly relevant and entertaining.

Actually, everything contemporary mentioning egregores is probably relevant - they're also called 'AI autocults', but the concept existed long before group communication became enmeshed with computer infrastructure - though the dynamics are different now than in enlightenment-era Europe, and the pre-Newtonian assumptions of the older publications throws most modern readers off.

Re:Adversarial Collaboration by robswc on Sunday September 25, 2022 @11:07PM (#32978904)
Not really books but did some undergrad research on the topic.

http://stephendavies.org/writings/mitterederEtAl.pdf

We referred to it as "issue alignment" but its gone by other things, IIRC. Basically, in theory, one could end up supporting positions that would make 0 sense outside the context of "well, I support "X" cause "team green" supports "X."

I've seen it happen often online, a lot less IRL.

Re:Adversarial Collaboration by ler0ix on Sunday September 25, 2022 @11:07PM (#32978902)
https://youtu.be/QWkWeZOQZI8

Jordan Peterson’s zebra story

Re:Adversarial Collaboration by agumonkey on Monday September 26, 2022 @10:23AM (#32983489)
I think peterson is crazy but some of this story was fun
Re:Adversarial Collaboration by ler0ix on Tuesday September 27, 2022 @03:28PM (#32999963)
I’m curious why you think he’s crazy.