Good.

Reminds me of the Bill Burr bit about Steve Jobs: «New phone can't fit the old charger. This is your hero?»

Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3s-qZsjK8I

Looks like the iPhone 16, released in 2024, will be the first one without any ports.

They need to also increase the price.

I've had to replace my USB C cables a bajillion times but never once had to replace my iphone cable.

I think it's because iPhone cable has the male adaptor with the female on the device, which is a lot simpler and less prone to debris, which is what you want with a cable that gets tossed around.

The USB C cables has the female adaptor on the cable which accumulates debris and moisture. USB C also oddly has the male adaptor inside of an indentation, so with USB C you basically have two female adaptors that can collect debris.

I would much rather replace a cheap USB C cable than a phone. Nearly every Apple user I know has had to replace their iPhone because their lightning port stopped working.

I'm sorry, but this is complete FUD. This simply isn't a failure mode that's even remotely common by any measure.

The only thing that approximates this is that pocket lint can accrue inside the port, as small amounts of lint are repeatedly pressed into the port when inserting the connector. USB-C is susceptible to this too for exactly the same reasons: frequently-used female port that spends most of its life in a lint-generating pocket. As more is packed in, we push on the connector a little harder until the debris is deep enough to prevent contacts from connecting.

You can scoop it out in two seconds with a safety pin or other thin metal probe. And again, USB-C is equally susceptible to this failure mode.

I'm sorry, but you're just spreading more FUD.

I've never had an issue with my USBC ports on my phones or billion other USBC devices going bad.

OTOH, it's a frequent problem for iPhone users. In my circle, it's frequent enough that even my brother who works for Apple has this issue, and it's frequently (but not always) severe enough that the phones require replacements, instead of the $5 cable. And that was my point from the beginning: USBC is designed so that the failure mode affects the cheap, easily replaceable cable rather than the expensive device it is connecting to.

Have you tried using an Apple USB-C cable? They're much higher quality than the random cables you get off Amazon.

Lightning port, compared to USB C, is almost indestructible. There's no way you damage it by pulling cable sideways. Do the same with USB... Apple should upgrade Lightning to fully support USB C protocol but leave connector as is. But we'll see how they respond to another senseless EU idea...

Yeah I like the design of the lightning port better than USB C.

This is misinformation, the USB-C connector is designed to outlast it's cables. A common problem with USB-C is that the connector get's filled with "stuff", and rather than picking it out they just jam their cable in harder til it's packed full.

The Lightning port has less of this problem because it's smaller but I've seen my colleague use a SIM-card removal tool to pick things out of his iPhone connector too.

The reason "USB-C is bad" is because you're comparing some of the highest quality manufacturing (Apple) with others. Apples USB-C on the Macbook is really solid.

> This is misinformation, the USB-C connector is designed to outlast it's cables.

That's the wrong measure; outlasting cables is inadequate.

The correct measure is how long a USB-C connector lasts.

In my experience, the "tongue" in the USB-C connector gets broken in about two years. That forces me to buy a new phone, and hope that it arrives before my old phone's battery dies.

As to "you're doing it wrong" or "you're supposed to clean it every 30 insertions", it's freaking consumer connector. It should just work.

Meanwhile, I've never seen a lightning connector fail. The cords do, and they cost too much, but they're just cords.

And, yes, the lightning connector could/should be more robust.

> That's the wrong measure; outlasting cables is inadequate.

Only if you don't realize the reason they're built that way is to not wear the connector down, they're designed to last "forever".

> In my experience, the "tongue" in the USB-C connector gets broken in about two years. That forces me to buy a new phone, and hope that it arrives before my old phone's battery dies.

I've never seen or heard anyone break the tounge of the USB-c.

> it's freaking consumer connector. It should just work

There are physical limitations to this and lightning are also prone to the issue.

> Meanwhile, I've never seen a lightning connector fail. The cords do, and they cost too much, but they're just cords.

All I see is broken iPhone cables, not that it matters though, since we're discussing connectors.

And, yes, the lightning connector could/should be more robust.

No.

https://media.idownloadblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/i...

See those teeny metal thingies in there? That's how an USB-c cable looks inside, why you ask? Because that's the most unreliable part of the connector (other than filling up with crap).

I mean if you're so incredibly violent you break the tounge then lightning would indeed be better, but that's not a common failure mode. It's designed for wear and tear, not violent bending forces.

What happens when usb version N+1 has another incompatible plug type again

The European law is supposed to have a provision in it for review and modification - so in the event we get USB-D or whatever, there should be a mechanism to incorporate that in.

This kind of law practically guarantees there will be no usb-D, E, or X. It hardcodes inertia

It already exists for micro-USB, and USB-C was developed later - evidentially, this claim does not appear to be true.

The law itself may have stifled the creation of other power systems; we may have had micro-usb-G by now without it

Because every year we need a different connector for the same shit. The only thing that was changes was Google restricting access to filesystem over USB.

Apple is selling phones with Lightning, so it doesn’t seem to be true that they have been required to use micro-USB.

The point is when a new incompatible plug happens you have to replace your existing accessories, and accessory manufacturers have to choose which hardware is supported, or everyone has the dreaded adapters.

I'd rather have one adapter that fits between all my old and all my "new" devices than 99 competing standards with no adapters whatsoever.

HN commenters have spent years complaining about Apple's adoption of usb-c, except in the single case of it being forced on iDevices, where it is clearly the only thing that could possibly be considered.

Almost every "universal" device I go out to buy today requires a usb-c adapter, despite the apparent prevalence of usb-c Android devices?

Ipods do not have USB-C.

You just store it on Github, like any respectable library. /s

Related ongoing thread:

EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31652291 - June 2022 (839 comments)

Good luck with this one, USB-C is a protean system with as much variation as a giant jar of jelly beans, from compatible but non-compliant interfaces (see my previous rant on Nintendo Switch) to multiple standards that render things undependable. My Nitecore batteries refuse to charge from an Apple charger but are happy with a Raspberry Pi charger.

I've got one Apple charger that's compatible with all my devices and one that's compatible with all devices except my System76 laptop, it doesn't like the 30 something watt charger.

Things that work: All Android phones, Macbook, System76 Laptop, Sony Headphones, JBL BT Speaker, some cheap-o tiny RC car.

All devices don't need to implement everything, I'm happy just being able to bring one charger, one powerbank and a couple of cables with me along with my devices. I was on a trip just the other day where I brought the powerful Apple charger I have, my Xiaomi powerbank, Phone, Speaker, Headphones and laptop.

I'd say this is a lot better than how it was not too many years ago, so I'd say they've succeeded.

My guess is that the Nitecore works with the RPI charger because it doesn't actually negotiate anything, just deliver a voltage on the power-pins. Your Nitecore gear is to blame for the trouble you're experiencing, I'd still say having one "smart" usb-c and one "stupid" is better than everyone having their own physical interface.

I have been looking for an RC car that charges with USB-C, where did you find one?

It was something like this one: https://www.banggood.com/Turbo-Racing-C72-RTR-1-or-76-2_4G-S...

It's a really tiny one, with a one cell battery. The problem you'll experience looking for USB-C to charge your RC is that it's not "possible" (You'll need a charging controller on your car instead) since the batteries are usually more than one cell and therefore needs balancing and such. Also when you're charging you're allowing currents up to 5 amps in most common chargers, when I'm in a hurry mine goes to 20 amps, this is above what USB-C is rated for, so you'd have to negotiate the latest 200+w power, transform it to the right voltage etc...

I recommend you give that one up for now, sadly.

Yeah, I have young kids and the last thing I need is 3 cars, each with a removable battery, dedicated battery charger, etc.

Just wish there was something you could plug into an existing charger and go

Traxxas has their ID charging system where you can share the same charger across all cars, they're safe to use and all. Balances cells every time, supports storage charging and such.

That'd be my recommendation, my father happens to be a reseller so I've got some know-how :)

First require uniformity of function (without regard for appropriateness, future innovation, etc). Second, require specific sources (those with political connections) because “reasons”. USB-c chargers today, usb-c chargers from FaviCorp tomorrow. Zero power systems innovation the day after that.

Please don’t let politicians dictate technical design decisions.

This comment is nakedly just a slippery slope fallacy.

Slippery slope is not a fallacy [0] when applied appropriately. The path to unintended consequences does not exist without this law

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope

Please don’t let Big Tech dictate technical design decisions.

If there is one area I don't want innovation it's the power connector to my mobile phone.

So you’d like to go back to the enormous power bricks of 1999?

THe connector has nothing to do with the efficiency of the psu.

you're missing the point; the 5.4v round charge port of my 1999 Cricket could have become "the standard"

A phone could charge fine with a 5.4v round charger.

The only reason they dictated is general tech failure.

Good.

I would support more of this kind of thing.

Every once in a while, we can bump the connector and get real gains along with savings due to far better alignment between devices and the various connections they require.

Oh excellent, everyone's accessories need to be replaced now, and then with every subsequent usb update?

It will perhaps apply for newer phones...

> everyone's accessories need to be replaced now

No. iPhone users can use/share with Android users.

only those android users using usb-c, not those with the various preceding usb's.

You are correct, it's only ever lightning accessory that becomes junk, despite lightning preceding usb-c, and having more physically robust construction.

I switched from Android to to iPhone SE- mostly as a matter of longevity and relatively cheap repair prices.

Lighting is not better, it slides out more easily, it’s connections are less consistent (if you’re using a headphone adapter you will get disconnects), and it just doesn’t feel as good.

Physically Lightning is better - way more robust and resistant to potential damage. There's literally no way you damage connector on normal daily usage.

I don’t damage my ports I don’t have a frame of reference for them not being robust.

I do know that I can’t really use headphones with my iPhone because the experience blows because they disconnect. I do know that often my phone isn’t charged because the connection from the charger wasn’t good. C type is a better experience and the only time I’ve had a defective or damaged C port was on a sub $100 BLU phone

Try taking a toothpick and scraping in the inside of the lightning port. In my experience when the connection gets flakey its pocket lint building up.

Be careful not to crape the walls too hard though, that could damage the clamping pins that connect to the cable. Only go inwards.

This is misinformation, the USB-C connector design is more robust than the lightning port. The reason there's a "tab" in the middle of the phone connector is so that the cable can grasp onto it with spring-loaded contact areas. In the lightning connector the spring-loaded pins are in the phone instead of in the cable, these spring loaded things are what breaks in the connector (if it isn't just full of lint which you can get out). The reason why it appears the lightning connector is better is because Apple manufacturers high-quality devices.

Lightning is designed to wear out the contact, USB-C is designed to wear out the cable.

Those android users who are using usb-c are definitely most of them. I haven't seen an Android phone on the market in years that isn't USB-C. And those few who are left are the outliers, politicians have to focus on the masses. It's not like there aren't adapters in those cases anyways.

Lightning only supports USB 2 speeds - not the most future proof standard, even if it is more robust

Lightning does support USB 3 speeds.

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MK0W2AM/A/lightning-to-us...

Only accessories got access to those speeds, not charging cables (because just like USB-C, it would be a nightmare of telling fast and slow cables apart).

Rather than move 5 gpbs data rate support from iPad Pro to other devices like the iPhone, they decided to replace lightning with USB-C on the iPad Pro.

Not everyone; only the minority who were using non-USB chargers.

Um, why am I supposed to have been checking if my ancient USB peripherals are USB-C compatible? Asking for a friend.. :)