Plus it isn't just about the content. Running a TV network can be a massively profitable business, and in this case the money is going out of EU citizens' pockets and straight to the Russian government. Pretty contradictory to impose sanctions and spend money arming Ukraine while also giving Russia a free revenue stream.
The entire point of a free country is that people can handle the information. If not, why even bother?
These are not the actions between neutral, peaceful countries, but a full-fledged proxy war.
> War is an intense armed conflict between states, governments, societies, or paramilitary groups such as mercenaries, insurgents, and militias. It is generally characterized by extreme violence, aggression, destruction, and mortality, using regular or irregular military forces.
When you describe what the rest of us would call 'poor relations' as war, it raises the question of what you call it when thousands are drafted and brutally slaughtered. If this also is to be called 'war', then it raises the question: if you're already at war with them, what difference does it make if you decide to draft a few million young men and send them over there? Or for that matter a few strategic offensive weapons (colloquially known as nukes)?
Alternatively, you may contend that what everyone else calls "war" you call, let's say, "war 2". But in that case, your definition is unique to you, and is not terribly useful for communicating with other people.
Person A: Why ban Russian state media? Europe and Russia are not at war. Person B: No, but they are at "war prime", which has some properties of war, including banning enemy propaganda.
Did creating the extra word to split the hair help resolve that conversation? It doesn't really feel like it to me. It seems like what most people would prefer the conversation be about is whether or not it makes sense to ban enemy propaganda in a state of "war prime" (or war, for that matter).
The machine of war isn't monolithic, and what you're seeing is that certain parts of it (like shutting down opposing propaganda) can be started without other parts (like literal fighting) being needed.
Just want to point out that most EU millitaries, along with the Ukranians and the US have women as well. So there is death all around, no matter the sex.
What you consider misandry is in fact a feminist issue. Women often don't choose a life of childcare; it's something that can be forced upon them, because if they don't do it, no-one else will. Men get to choose whether to get involved. If the share of childcare was more equal, then there wouldn't be a reason to restrict leaving the country on a gendered basis.
- We literally have 1 hour and 30 minutes of war updates before the half hour evening news every night.
- We've just delivered a huge batch of anti-tank weapons to Ukraine.
- We've basically sanctioned 90% of what is possible to sanction from Russia with more sanctions coming every day, plus private companies getting ahead of themselves to exit Russia the fastest, e.g. Maersk.
- People are volunteering to fight in Ukraine and our government has officially OK'd it.
- We're already taking in refugees coming in buses from the Ukraine.
It sure feels like we're at war here in all but name.
Never thought I’d live to see that happen.
In a conflict enemy propaganda will be shut down, and enemy assets will be targeted. This means severe economic sanctions, blocking RT/Sputnik, and arming the Ukrainian armed forces to the teeth.
With luck, the Ukrainians will be able to end this without the situation getting out of hand. If not, this might escalate and get real ugly real fast.
In WW2 there was propaganda broadcast from Germany, in English and in MW to reach the UK and SW to reach the USA, by William Joyce. He was called Lord Haw-Haw because he pretended to by posh. His broadcasts were designed to demoralize the allied countries.
No doubt people in neutral countries tuned in. But that isn't really relevant. The point of the broadcasts was to reach non-neutral people wherever they might be.
He was captured in 1945 and hanged for treason.
Not officially, but they provide arms with explicit purpose of supporting one side and economically punishing the other. That's effectively a proxy war whether we call it one or not.
There's plenty of support for having sites like RT.
Greetings from a EU member in Belgium
is this not a failure of czech/european society at large instead of RT?
We also have immune systems.
But at a lower level, when the virus makes it to the cell and hijacks its machinery to spread... That's the part i was thinking of. The cell isn't to blame for being hijacked.
oho, slippery slope here. by this measure most media should be banned.
If the suggestion it's a failure of society at large because that hasn't been done before then I suppose that could make sense but if it's in response to it being done now that makes even less sense.
“Communism” equals the original sin and “communists” is basically a slur for about a century now.
After America worked so hard to unleash the most destructive weapon in human history, everyone should have cowed and crowned them the undisputed hegemons of the Earth. The idea of anyone daring to set themselves up as an antipode was extremely offensive.
Even after the fall of the USSR and the convenient appearance of Muslims and Chinese offering themselves as adversary to All That We Cherish, apparently the West can’t resist such a big and easy dart board to pin their failings upon;
Unrest in foreign nations? It’s the Russians. Division at home? Damn Ruskies again.
I wonder if some racism also comes into play here; Here we were, after so much War, with all the white nations agreeing to get along hereafter, but then there’s these “other” white people who are somehow different and don’t want to play along.
After we snuff out Russia, who will we turn upon next?
Honestly, I see this anti-Russia stuff as using the Ukraine tragedy to hide racist motivations. Way I see it, Russia is the only white nation in the world that has tried to stand up to woke bullies and is not conforming to the woke and egalitarian zeitgeist that the rest of the west is drinking. The west has just been waiting for the opportunity to launch a full on "justified" hate campaign to bully them into submission, like they do everything else these days under the guise of fairness and justice.
Sorry but it has to be said as all alternative opinions are being silenced and being removed from the world. I wanted to check this whole "RT is propaganda" claim by watching some RT and found out that it's been removed from the main distributor in South Africa. Half way across the world and some company or agency decided to jump in and ban a Russian television channel? You tell me straight that isn't retribution and/or coordinated censorship.
By invading Ukraine and - in particular - threatening the use of nuclear weapons, Russia did the equivalent of shouting "fire" in a crowded theatre. Under the circumstances, the world is absolutely right to come down like a tonne of bricks on anything and everything Russian that might be used to justify those threats.
I don't think you realise the gravity of the situation.
BTW if you want alternative opinions there are plenty of non-RT ones out there. No-one's pulling China's CGTN off satellites, for example.
Take a look at maps of NATO expansion:
https://old.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/t37zf4/countries_j...
If America was concerned about Russian nukes in Cuba, shouldn’t Russia be concerned about an alliance encroaching up to their literal border?
BTW, "NATO expansion" was there for a reason, and you don't get to claim that the new members didn't want to join of their own initiative. Every post-communist country that wants to keep their self-determination is worried about falling back into being Russian puppets once more.
This is a very US perspective I think. Here in Germany there are many that think communism is fairer than capitalism (although perhaps unrealistic to attain). Insulting something/someone by saying something is communist or someone is a commy is not really something that happens here (except perhaps in politics).
[Edit] Just to add some perspective:
Communist parties in european parliament
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_communist_parties_repr...
Even large european countries have communist parties, some even voted into office (such as france, spain) and in the case of Spain even in the ruling coalition.
Implying this is a western view neglects to realize how much US vs. Soviet propaganda has shaped the US population.
I think the general consensus here is that the USSR was a shitty totalitarian state that failed for shitty totalitarian reasons. Communism was just what they called their brand of totalitarianism. In reality it was a corrupt dictatorship.
It has nothing to with the average Russian, but everything to do with the Government, the dictator, and those who willingly support them.
That isn't to say the west hasn't done anything wrong. But by my account, we can pin the following on Russia:
- Installing puppets in foreign governments
- Schroeder
- Trump / GOP
- Pushing for Brexit
- Sent children to war
- Committed 11 distinct war crimes in just 8 days, including shooting civies and children that were fleeing, hospitals, and wearing UN and Ua colours.
Russia isn't the problem, the problem is the person at the driver seat that is actively threatening a nuclear holocaust.
>>> - Installing puppets in foreign governments
>>> - Schroeder
>>> - Trump / GOP
>>> - Pushing for Brexit
What .... Trump and GOP are russia plants? got proof?
- First day of war, Trump praises Putin for his behaviour, on tape, call him a genius [1, 4].
- Second day of war, Trump doubles down, on tape. [1]
- When asked whether [Trump] made a mistake calling [Putin] a genius, Moskow Mitch dodges the question, responds that Putin is a "ruthless thug". [2]
- [Repeatedly] met with Putin with no staff / note takers. [3]
- [The first time] Trump was impeached over holding aid of $400m from Ukraine. [4]
- Trump sides with Russia against FBI at Helsinki summit [5]
- Trump veto'd sanctions against Russia [6]
- Trump says it's 'common sense' to include Russia in G7 [7]
- Trump revealed highly classified information to Russian foreign minister and ambassador [8]
- Trump offered to help Putin with wildfires while ignoring wildfires in US [9, 10]
And the list keeps growing, consider looking into Manafort under the light of these events.
As for Schroeder, consider that he pushed for gas, is a close friend of Putin and didn't extend lifetimes of Nuclear plants, and after leaving his position he became board member in Gazprom [11, 12, 13]
[1] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic...
[2] https://www.newsweek.com/mitch-mcconnell-calls-putin-ruthles...
[3] https://www.vox.com/2019/1/29/18202515/trump-putin-russia-g2...
[4] https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-statement-ukraine-cris...
[5] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44852812
[6] https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/27/us/politics/senate-russia...
[7] https://www.reuters.com/article/us-g7-summit-trump/trump-say...
[8] https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trump...
[9] https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-russia-trump-putin-wi...
[10] https://democrats.org/news/fact-sheet-trump-ignored-and-refu...
[11] https://www.politico.eu/article/outrage-germany-ex-chancello...
[12] https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-10562307...
[13] https://www.theglobeandmail.com/world/article-former-german-...
Trump didn’t call Putin genius, he called Putin’s tactics genius. Which (at first) it definitely did seem like.
- Trump calls Putin "savvy" https://youtu.be/UsTH-WqbEu8?t=80
- Trump defends praising Putin https://edition.cnn.com/2022/02/26/politics/trump-cpac-putin...
> The problem is not that Putin is smart, which, of course, he's smart
And sorry, it wasn't a genius, it was a stupid flop filled with greed and hubris.
Jesus Christ touch some grass.
> "The problem is not that Putin is smart, which, of course, he's smart," Trump said. "The problem is that our leaders are dumb... and so far, allowed him to get away with this travesty and assault on humanity."
Trump is smart, which is why he recommended Europe arms itself and reduces dependence on Russian gas during his term. Other Western leaders are dumb, because they didn’t listen to him (Merkel, Biden - shut down nuclear, stop domestic oil production, invest more in Russia). Putin is smart because he exploited this weakness.
If dumb Western leaders were at least as smart as Trump, we wouldn’t be in this situation. I predict another dumbass similar situation with China, soon.
Russia probably wouldn't have succeeded in sabotaging American politics or sewing so much discord via Trump just being himself if half the country didn't happen to also want to see the system burn, albeit to a different end (an alt-right, anti progressive populist revolution.)
[0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_20...
[1]https://www.npr.org/2021/03/16/977958302/intelligence-report...
- Trump wanted to sell US gas to EU in 2018.
- Trump wanted to pull out of NATO -> weaker NATO weaker response to Putin's invasion in 2019.
- Germany cut nuclear because Schroeder, friend of Putin's. See links above.
What weakness did Trump "exploit" and "how"? Also, citations needed.
> If dumb Western leaders were at least as smart as Trump, we wouldn’t be in this situation.
Yes, if western leaders were as smart as Trump, Ukraine would have been lost already, and covid would have ravaged Europe like it did with US.
Trump was impeached twice, the vote exceeding the required majority of the House of Representatives in each case. Impeachment is similar to indictment in the normal criminal process: a formal laying of charges.
Trump was not convicted in the trial resulting from either impeachment by the required 2/3 of the Senate, however.
If the West includes new joiners from behind the Iron Curtain, then let me tell you that any "demonisation" of Russia is deserved.
I'm too young to have experienced the communist times, but based on what I heard from my parents and from history, being a forcible subject to Russia sucks. And this is exactly what Russia is trying to achieve in Ukraine (if not just outright destruction instead).
I was willing to give Russia a loan of trust and see how its post-USSR identity evolved. Unfortunately, it seems like that hope wasn't met with reality.
How are you to get on the Tor network?
Soon your crypto portfolio will vanish too ;)
If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.
Making it illegal to route packets to them and to circumvent the block? Garbage tier laws.