That passes beyond "nuisance". Extreme situations can utilize extreme language.
Objectively, the sonic onslaught of their constantly blaring truck horns is equal in effect to well-known psychological warfare tactics. It is fair and accurate to call it torture in this context.
I don't think making 80+ decibels of noise 10 feet from people's windows is even an okay way to protest, no matter who you are or what your cause is.
I used to live in this neighbourhood, right by Somerset and Metcalfe. Protests happened all the time. Some of them were anti-government, even. And none of them launched this kind of sustained assault against innocent citizens. I get the sense a lot of them think they're sticking it to the liberal elite, or something like that. But really - Centretown is (or was when I lived there, at least) one of the more affordable parts of Ottawa.
Are earplugs not a thing in Canada?
Calling honking torture is ridiculous hyperbole. That word should be reserved for the extremely serious kinds of acts it's normally used to describe, lest it become effectively meaningless.
Words themselves don't have any power, and if you try to harness the power of a concept by misusing a word that refers to it, you just cause the word's definition to shift and to weaken its association to the concept (potentially making that concept much harder to access and refer to).
Even if you could find such beasts (which I don't think you can), then you have the problem that you effectively can't use your hearing. You thought that social interactions were hard with a mask? Imagine not being able to use your hearing at all.
(yes, 60 dB is necessary because that's how much you'll need in order to sleep - the human ear has an incredibly large dynamic range and even 30 dB_SPL conversations are enough to keep some people awake for hours)
As it stands, many of the residents near these protests are being subjected to low-level sleep deprivation, which is literally torture (as in, used as such by organizations who actually want to extract information or confessions from people).
To clarify - it's not honking that's torture, it's sustained honking at a duration and intensity that will cause sleep deprivation and other psychological damage.
Completely independently of the reason that these people are protesting - this particular means is not humane.
> Even if you could find such beasts (which I don't think you can), then you have the problem that you effectively can't use your hearing. You thought that social interactions were hard with a mask? Imagine not being able to use your hearing at all.
> (yes, 60 dB is necessary because that's how much you'll need in order to sleep - the human ear has an incredibly large dynamic range and even 30 dB_SPL conversations are enough to keep some people awake for hours)
Per this (https://audiology-web.s3.amazonaws.com/migrated/NoiseChart_P...), 30 dB is rated as a "whisper." This (https://mynewmicrophone.com/what-are-decibels-the-ultimate-g...) calls 30 dB SPL a "Quiet bedroom at night."
It sounds like you're challenging me with overkill requirements meant to totally mute the horns almost like they're not there, when the realistic problem is to reduce the noise to the point where someone could sleep.
I kind of find it hard to believe that's not possible with and indoor location + silicone ear plugs (and maybe white noise if you're very sensitive).
> As it stands, many of the residents near these protests are being subjected to low-level sleep deprivation, which is literally torture (as in, used as such by organizations who actually want to extract information or confessions from people).
Again, calling it "literally torture" is ridiculous hyperbole, or at the very least invokes misleading associations. A noisy neighbor is being annoying to his neighbors, not torturing them.
Judging by your post history, you seem to be more interested in stirring up shit than actually contributing to the discussion. This bizarre defence of noisemaking jackasses fits with that.
I'm not, and I'm pretty sure your accusation violates site guidelines.
> This bizarre defence of noisemaking jackasses fits with that.
You should note I'm not defending them or their actions. I just think it's ridiculous hyperbole to call what they're doing "literally torture." If the ancestor comment had simply said they were being annoying and disruptive, I wouldn't have responded at all.
So are you going to set up crimes-against-humanity tribunals to prosecute all the noisy neighbors of the world for being torturers?
And were those truckers performing interrogations that I haven't heard about? Your comparison is as ridiculous as comparing compulsory school to prison. Yeah, you can find some similarities, but you're missing important differences that undermine the comparison.
And in the noisy neighbors scenario, are they just loud as a by-product of their self-centered preferences or are they making noise intentionally to make everyone miserable and get something they want? Either way, they are causing sleep deprivation and constant stress, which is a form of torture. In the second scenario, it's even done intentionally as a means to an end. Even so, folks are rarely prosecuted for crimes against humanity even for the most grotesque mistreatment of under a dozen people.
Comments elsewhere in the thread cite 120+ dB horns outside and about 80 dB indoors.
80-60=20. Let's say the earplugs only have to be 50 dB (and that the average person can sleep with 30 dB of noise in their ears at night) - I still bet you can't find any that fit the requirements above.
There's no "overkill requirements" - I'm handing you concrete, realistic numbers that are reflective of real life and you're trying to handwave them away.
> A noisy neighbor is being annoying to his neighbors, not torturing them.
You literally didn't read one of the last sentences of my comment - "To clarify - it's not honking that's torture, it's sustained honking at a duration and intensity that will cause sleep deprivation and other psychological damage."
Please read before responding.
Earplugs will dull the noise, but if I can't take a nap over two guys having a conversation at that distance, I really doubt most folks' ability to get a good night's sleep over truck horns. The earplugs will probably mitigate the physical damage done by the noise, but I highly doubt they do much for the psychological stress. People lose their ability to focus and sometimes their sanity due to injuries that cause a constant ringing in their ears. Even if you can reduce the volume, the constant noise is a type of torture.
Edit: Found the Noise Reduction Rating for a number of different types of hearing pro that I've used in the past. The best one was rated at 33, meaning it roughly reduces the noise by something like 33 decibels. That pair, of course, being the ubiquitous neon yellow 3M product with flames on the sides for enhanced performance. I don't wear them myself because while they're fashionable, they're incredibly uncomfortable for me. This also appears to be among the best non-powered hearing pro that's available on the market. They will take an uncomfortably loud worksite at 105 dB down to effectively under 80 dB and more-or-less within a safe range for hearing. Not a pleasant level for sleeping though, by any means, although I can pull it off myself if I'm tired enough. When you start talking about a truck horn which those earplugs might or might not be able to quiet down close to the level of that 105 dB you'd experience with no hearing pro on a worksite, you're past potential hearing damage and well into a range where there is no reasonable escape from the barrage of sound.
Edit 2: Most of these earplugs in the 25-33 NRR range are definitely available at the hardware store if anyone needs to know that. They're more expensive per pair and seem to come in higher count containers, but they're there and much cheaper than the doctor's visits and hearing aids will be in the future. If you find yourself in a situation where the background noise is uncomfortable at all, please, please, get yourself some if at all feasible. Half the old dudes I've worked with in my life did not think it was worth the hassle and I'm tired of having to scream in people's ears to communicate. Also all the near misses because you have to either throw something at them or close the distance if you see a dangerous situation they don't and need to warn them.
Unlike people with fixed addresses, they can just up and move to a quiet part of the city to sleep, and then drive back after.
If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. Note this one:
"Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive."
I'm arguing a slightly different thing, that authorities are quite aware and tolerant of the situation in many cases, so they don't care to do much.
If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.
You pretty much proved my point by diminishing the one particular source of noise that you personally don't consider "as bad".
How about 24hrs? Now that's torture, or as we Americans like to claim "enhanced interrogation"... [Enemy combatants were exposed to sensory deprivation which included 24hrs of American heavy metal music and 24hrs of flood spotlights to prevent sleeping.]
I get it, after living peacefully before these protests started it might appear as torture, however it is again just annoying behavior not torture. As mentioned by other comments, ear plugs are a thing, sleeping pills could help, glass of warm milk perhaps.
You have options in this scenario, unlike when you are being physically tortured, you have no options but to endure.
Anyway, noise is noise, whether it comes from a truck, or a dog, a party, or w/e. If you're unable to understand that, then I guess this discussion is futile.
It's not just trucks blowing their air horns. That would have been annoying. A bunch of them installed train horns and during the first week were honking them 24/7. It was loud enough to cause hearing damage indoors. I'd be impressed if a dog could bark that loud.