News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by throwaway4good on Monday January 10, 2022 @11:16AM (#29877049)
This is an absolutely bonkers story by Danish standard. The guy is amongst the highest ranking civil servants, holds the order of Dannebro. On top of this a number of Danish journalists have been "taken in for a chat" by the intelligence services.

The charges are still secret, but appears to be related to this story:

Danish secret service helped US spy on Germany's Angela Merkel: report

https://www.dw.com/en/danish-secret-service-helped-us-spy-on...

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by keewee7 on Monday January 10, 2022 @12:24PM (#29878177)
If anyone is doubting how much influence US intelligence has over Danish intelligence:

>Danish intelligence also helped the US agency to spy on the Danish foreign and finance ministries as well as a Danish weapons manufacturer. The FE also cooperated with the NSA on spying operations against the US government itself.

https://www.dw.com/en/danish-secret-service-helped-us-spy-on...

The NSA made the Danish FE spy on both the Danish and US government. That is wild.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by samwillis on Monday January 10, 2022 @12:38PM (#29878398)
> “The FE also cooperated with the NSA on spying operations against the US government itself.”

It’s long be standard practice for intelligence agencies in 5/9 Eyes to ask each other to spy on the others citizens when it would be illegal to do so themselves.

The NSA for example would find it difficult to spy on Senators, this is there way around it. And there is no denying there has be a reasonable cause to in the last four years.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by Mikeb85 on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:09PM (#29878885)
> And there is no denying there has be a reasonable cause to in the last four years.

If there's actually reasonable cause go to a court, get a warrant and investigate.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by mannerheim on Monday January 10, 2022 @02:26PM (#29880367)
We can't let archaic and outdated conventions like the Fourth Amendment get in the way of protecting citizens from themselves.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by vintermann on Monday January 10, 2022 @02:45PM (#29880796)
Getting a hand-picked guy in a wig to sign off on it is just too much effort.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by skrebbel on Monday January 10, 2022 @12:49PM (#29878581)
> And there is no denying there has be a reasonable cause to in the last four years.

Isn't this the same as saying that you don't think there should be fundamental rights for people you don't agree with?

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by samwillis on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:01PM (#29878765)
Not at all, it’s saying that sometimes rules have to bent in order for the intelligence services to go about their mission to protect the citizens of their country (including their rights). Sometimes potential threats come from within (even potentially from government ministers or civil servants) making them legally difficult to investigate quickly. Asking their mates to take a “quick look” is a good way of checking out if there is a problem that warrants further investigation.

Having said all that, I’m no expert, I’m just a John Le Carre fan.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by artificialLimbs on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:00PM (#29878746)
>> And there is no denying there has be a reasonable cause to in the last four years.

Yea who needs laws when we can just instate shadow government agencies with shadow budgets and their own set of alternative laws.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by samwillis on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:03PM (#29878809)
That’s not for a second what I am suggesting.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by netizen-936824 on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:28PM (#29879199)
Really? Because from your original comment, the NSA is circumventing protections that are in place to spy on US citizens

That is exactly what you are suggesting. These rules should not be "bent" because there are legal mechanisms to investigate that are being blatantly bypassed to make things easier

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by samwillis on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:48PM (#29879583)
First, artificialLimbs comment has been edited and toned down significantly since it was first posted.

Second, my personal opinion on how intelligent agency’s operate is irrelevant. I am only trying to inform on my understanding how they sometimes operate in relation to the original far more interesting article.

Checks and balances are obviously essential and are the priority in all cases.

Finally, while I don’t believe in the boogie man, people, anyone, can be bad.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by artificialLimbs on Monday January 10, 2022 @02:09PM (#29879991)
>> First, artificialLimbs comment has been edited and toned down significantly since it was first posted.

No it wasn't. Unless you could see what I typed into the web form before I hit submit.

>> while I don’t believe in the boogie man

Well you should. They're here. They are the NSA, the FBI, the CIA, and other government agencies that regularly operate out of bounds of legality. If the horrible things that they have done and continue to do don't shock you and create the desire for their radical change or elimination entirely, you are stupid or malicious.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by samwillis on Monday January 10, 2022 @02:25PM (#29880353)
Apologies if I’m mistaken, I just thought I recalled it being phrased differently. I’m not renowned for my short term memory.

I’m not American and so have little interest in their internal politics other than as a spectator.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by netizen-936824 on Monday January 10, 2022 @03:05PM (#29881257)
I think you should be interested, because whether you like it or not the politics and actions of these organisations effect everyone globally

That's why we should all care

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by jonnybgood on Monday January 10, 2022 @04:20PM (#29882718)
Collection and analysis of intelligence on a US person by a US intelligence agency is subjected to the same laws no matter where it came from. There is no way around it. If GCHQ collected and NSA analyzed and used that intelligence in any way then the law regarding US persons applies. I'm not aware of anywhere in the law that makes exceptions for these cases.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by kevin_thibedeau on Monday January 10, 2022 @05:20PM (#29883633)
There is a way around it for people subject to a background investigation. The 4A gets suspended for them by EO12333. Technically not "the law" but you don't see Congress doing anything about executive overreach.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by aerostable_slug on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @07:21PM (#29900494)
You choose to get a clearance. You choose to allow investigators access to protected health records. None of it is done without consent; it's effectively at the applicant's request.

Don't like it? Don't apply for a job that requires a clearance.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by jollybean on Monday January 10, 2022 @04:27PM (#29882826)
There are practical reasons for the US to work with Danish intelligence (and others) that would have nothing to do with circumventing the law.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by JackFr on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:15PM (#29878994)
> The NSA for example would find it difficult to spy on Senators,

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/31/cia-admits-spy...

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by aahortwwy on Monday January 10, 2022 @07:08PM (#29885086)
> And there is no denying there has be a reasonable cause to in the last four years.

Yes there is. The US has domestic intelligence agencies, why should the NSA be engaging in domestic intelligence when it's explicitly not their mandate?

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by tomjen3 on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:33PM (#29879271)
This may be an extreme belief, but I don't think we need intelligence services to operate anywhere wear regular courts would be an answer. The FBI can get a warrant if they have a reason and the intelligence services obviously don't stop things they should, such as corruption and child sex abuse.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by hlbjhblbljib on Monday January 10, 2022 @04:15PM (#29882629)
> It’s long be standard practice for intelligence agencies in 5/9 Eyes to ask each other to spy on the others citizens when it would be illegal to do so themselves.

This goes against the actual agreements in place, where they have to treat the other citizens as their countries do.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by jollybean on Monday January 10, 2022 @04:22PM (#29882753)
It's not wild at all.

A Danish arms manufacturer planning on doing a deal with Gaddaffi during sanctions era?

A member of the White House in Europe to meet with Russian contacts, off his calendar, in the middle of an investigation into possible illicit ties between the White House and Russia?

The Head of US Olympics suspected of taking of bribes, having meeting with Addidas in Copenhagen with big money changing hands?

There are plenty of things like that going on.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by dybber on Monday January 10, 2022 @12:46PM (#29878526)
And it has been going on for 25 years, the deal being cited as the reason Bill Clinton visited Denmark in the 90’s (we usually never get visits from US presidents)
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by LatteLazy on Monday January 10, 2022 @03:30PM (#29881804)
People think it's west Vs China or USA vs others. It's not. It's these "services" Vs the people they're meant to be serving.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by skinkestek on Monday January 10, 2022 @03:51PM (#29882197)
It is also the west vs China.

Although not Westerners against Chinese (my kids are welcome to play with the Chinese kids next door and the Chinese next door are just as welcome as any other neighbor to a garden party).

But it should be the world against crimes against humanity.

And then we Westerners will also have to clean up our own systems; that is just as important, but a smaller task.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by trasz on Monday January 10, 2022 @05:49PM (#29884051)
It’s not China who killed million random civilians in the Middle East. Was there a more severe crime against humanity in the past two decades?
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by somesortofsystm on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @05:14AM (#29889628)
Wasn't just a random million. Iraq lost 5% of its population to America's war of aggression.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by aerostable_slug on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @07:32PM (#29900607)
Rwanda would come really, really close. It's arguably worse because those people weren't collateral damage — their deaths were the point of the exercise.

We don't know how many people have died as a direct result of Chinese internal policies and we likely never will. They certainly cannot be believed with any statements about human rights, imprisonment, or executions on any level. I would likely extend that to education due to rampant cheating and the interests of the central government (to look as good as possible regardless of the facts), but that is a separate conversation.

At the current rate, all ~13 million Uighurs in mainland China will effectively cease to exist in a generation or three. They'll still exist in genetic terms, but their culture will have been erased except for small pockets of holdouts, who will be hunted down and assimilated/imprisoned. This isn't to minimize the death toll of the War on Terror, but rather to not allow seriously bad actors to escape the scrutiny they deserve.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by trasz on Wednesday January 12, 2022 @03:21AM (#29903768)
Why are Uighurs going to “cease” given their population is steadily increasing? And how is their culture eradicated when there are government programs to help it, and it’s being taught in schools?
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by aerostable_slug on Thursday January 13, 2022 @02:36PM (#29925637)
What are you talking about? The central government even banned a list of popular names to give newborns (sorry Muhammad, you can't have Muhammad Jr.).

They are being culturally blunted and they will likely eventually be bred out of being a distinct group.

https://apnews.com/article/ap-top-news-international-news-we... https://apnews.com/article/ap-top-news-international-news-pr... https://www.voanews.com/a/east-asia-pacific_voa-news-china_c... https://share.america.gov/china-coerces-uyghur-women-into-un...

The latter two links are indeed .gov propaganda outlets, but their reporting on this issue is accurate. It's very easy to find more sources.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by didntknowya on Monday January 10, 2022 @08:51PM (#29886146)
apparently some crimes against humanity are worse than the others
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by LatteLazy on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @02:29AM (#29888627)
I'd like that. It should be that. But it's really not. No one is actually willing to take any action on China sadly.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by decebalus1 on Monday January 10, 2022 @11:55AM (#29877708)
Do you mean 'Dannebrog' (Dannebrogordenen)?

Dannebro reads like a title a fraternity would give you

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by cinntaile on Monday January 10, 2022 @12:03PM (#29877833)
Welcome to our secret order where everyone is called Daniel, we're all brothers.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by throwaway4good on Monday January 10, 2022 @12:11PM (#29877950)
Yeah - missing the g - it is serious business in dk though:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Dannebrog

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by perihelions on Monday January 10, 2022 @06:27PM (#29884586)
>"Anton Michelsen was made a part of Royal Copenhagen A/S who is now the supplier."

If anyone's seen Alfred Hitchcock's Topaz (1969), that's where they filmed the opening scene where the KGB pursues the Soviet defector through central Copenhagen. The porcelain factory in the film is (was?) the real-life company's ceramics factory.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by kzrdude on Monday January 10, 2022 @12:46PM (#29878523)
The 'g' is not sounded out loud anyway in Dannebrog, so your interpretation still lives, I can happily report.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by rvense on Monday January 10, 2022 @04:57PM (#29883278)
Exactly. If you prononuce it "Dannebrok" we will complain.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by pomdapi on Monday January 10, 2022 @01:39PM (#29879383)
Oh jeez, so that bunch of drunk Danish students I've seen do all the bars in the street was in fact a wild pack of Dannebros...

Duly noted.

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by miohtama on Monday January 10, 2022 @11:18AM (#29877093)
Do fiber cables land in Denmark, or what special does Denmark have to make it a good partner for NSA?
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by poizan42 on Monday January 10, 2022 @11:29AM (#29877264)
Exactly, more specifically Blåbjerg is one of the landing points of TAT-14 as well as Havfrue/AEC-2.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by hammock on Monday January 10, 2022 @11:22AM (#29877165)
They are Nine Eyes (coalition that excludes Germany), willingly cooperative and with different charter/regulations than NSA. Bit of a tautological answer and I hope another commenter has more insight.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by 4gotunameagain on Monday January 10, 2022 @11:23AM (#29877170)
https://www.submarinecablemap.com/

Also Denmark has been a US protectorate for quite a while for reasons (e.g. Thule airforce base)

Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by pc86 on Monday January 10, 2022 @11:29AM (#29877268)
"Protectorate" has a very specific definition and Denmark is most certainly not one.
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by phkahler on Monday January 10, 2022 @02:07PM (#29879963)
When the head of the agency can't stop the agency from doing something he doesn't like...
Re:Danish intelligence chief held over suspected info leaks,... by manquer on Monday January 10, 2022 @09:31PM (#29886567)
Heads have only nominal control over any decently sized organisation. There are myriad ways in which people below can circumvent any restrictions placed.

A example from this issue would be how NSA used Danish intelligence to bypass restrictions placed by Congress.

The military tries hard to achieve this kind of alignment but even there it can be hard, a good historical example is Japanese Navy and army during second world war .