Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings in pricing by procedure

Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by rpmisms on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:43PM (#28619351)

Not technically "insurance", these are cost-sharing companies. Often religious due to Obama's brilliance.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by lotsofpulp on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @02:12PM (#28619723)

Is there evidence that Obama wanted those religious exemptions and bullshit cost sharing plans? I would be willing to bet that was a concession to other politicians in Congress in order to get ACA passed.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by rpmisms on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @02:29PM (#28619927)

I'm thankful the concession was made. The lower price of cost-sharing made it possible for my parents to keep eating while providing for the family.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by rconti on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:07PM (#28620399)

That's great until the church decides your parents are sinners and refuse to cover anything, and have no consequences for stealing their money.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by good8675309 on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:33PM (#28620731)

People voluntarily join health sharing groups. They are run by non-profits, some of which have no religious affiliation.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by rpmisms on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:25PM (#28620634)

They're not church-run organizations. This is reductionist, inaccurate, and I would go so far as to say bigoted.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by rconti on Saturday September 25, 2021 @05:17PM (#28656248)

You're welcome to think that about me, but health sharing is almost entirely scams using "religion" as a cover. See my other link in this thread. I'm happy for your family that they got a good one.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by nickff on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @02:53PM (#28620238)

The parent comment never said anything about President Obama's desires regarding the Affordable Care Act, just that his 'brilliance' resulted in this outcome.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by paulddraper on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @08:18PM (#28623784)

You misread. Parent thought those are a decent option and it's unfortunate that their availability is restricted.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by loeg on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:44PM (#28619379)

They are required to have some shared religious belief to be exempt from the ACA.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by derwiki on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:37PM (#28619269)

Is it illegal to state you don’t have insurance when you do? Or is this product not considered Insurance in the legal sense?

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by mullingitover on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:47PM (#28619420)

I don't think it is. Sidecar Health is doing just fine on this model[1]

It's pretty perverse that you, an insured person, would have to lie about having insurance because the provider would charge you more for being insured.

[1] https://cost.sidecarhealth.com

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by stonemetal12 on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:03PM (#28620352)

The same goes for pharmacies. Walmart advertises $4 generics. If your insurance has a $25 drug co-pay, then they will charge you the full $25.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by Y_Y on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:46PM (#28619405)

I do this. Once my insurance company got upset that my procedure was so expensive and rang the hospital. The hospital immediately tripled the price. The insurance became even more upset and asked me to fix it. Still much cheaper than the equivalent procedure in the USA.

It's not illegal here, but in any case nobody asks, I just tell them I'm paying cash.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by toomuchtodo on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:45PM (#28619389)

It's not insurance. They're "fixed indemnity plans." Sidecar Health is the one I'm familiar with.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/usc-brookings-schaeffer-on-he... (Fixed indemnity health coverage is a problematic form of “junk insurance”)

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by travoc on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:44PM (#28619373)

Health care consumers are absolutely free to pay providers directly even if they carry insurance coverage.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by scohesc on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:43PM (#28619357)

They could be running as a "health spending account" where you can spend the money on whatever you want provided it's health-related. You don't technically have "insurance" but you're insured.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by michael_j_ward on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @01:44PM (#28619371)

Please provide an example or two.

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[dead]

Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by good8675309 on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @02:43PM (#28620105)

Scams? They paid for my $6000 colonoscopy which caught early cancer, my daughters stitches, my wife's allergy specialist, my son's rocky mountain spotted fever, etc. etc. $500/mo for our family of 5 and we've been on it for nearly 10 years. But yes, please tell me more how this service that is way cheaper than insurance, is a community of people helping each other, and covers way more than insurance, is a scam.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by DaveExeter on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @04:44PM (#28621532)

> $6000 colonoscopy

Six grand to shove a camera up your butt? That's the real scam!

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by lowkey_ on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:03PM (#28620343)

Can I ask what service you use? I'd be interested in checking it out.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by good8675309 on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:18PM (#28620535)

Sure, I use Samaritan Ministries. I've tried other health sharing groups but Samaritan has been the best experience. They also have the best tech platform with the best user experience that I've seen. Samaritan is for christians but there are other health sharing groups that don't have that requirement.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by rhacker on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:55PM (#28621004)

No, this technique works with plain old insurance companies too. It's just that no one does it because they mistakenly give the hospital their insurance info - because, guess why? They ASK.

Also, healthcare sharing ministries are not scams. However they are simply not guaranteeing payment. It sounds like the truth of it is that the "guarantee" of payment is what makes traditional insurance expensive. Is that worth it? I think that's up to each individual.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by monocularvision on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:02PM (#28620341)

I personally know several families that are a part of these co-ops and they have had incredibly expensive things fully paid for. What makes you call them a scam?

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by svmegatron on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:13PM (#28620466)

Can you elaborate on this? My gut agrees with you 100%, but I can't puzzle it out.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by hartleybrody on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @02:40PM (#28620061)

> (they’re scams).

citation or story?

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by 0xcde4c3db on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:40PM (#28620825)

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/lauraturner/christian-h...

They're not inherently scams, but a major reason that the "premiums" are lower is that they have hardly any legal mandate to actually provide anything, which comes as a surprise to some members who are denied reimbursement. Their authority to deny "coverage" (scare quotes because that's not, technically, what they provide) is huge. In particular, HCSMs frequently deny reimbursement on the basis of conservative religious morality. Got an STD while unmarried, or cheating on your spouse, or just in an open marriage? You can't ask your good Christian neighbors to pay for that. Drug addiction or mental illness? The cure is more Jesus. Abortion? Not even to save your life. You get the idea.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by good8675309 on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:51PM (#28620952)

If you agree to a contract and then break the terms of the contract why would you be surprised when things aren't covered? It's the same thing with insurance companies. Also, many of these examples are broad generalizations that may apply to some but not all of the health sharing groups out there.

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by rconti on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:07PM (#28620389)

Here's a good start.

https://openargs.com/oa497-christian-health-sharing-is-a-sca...

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by good8675309 on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @03:29PM (#28620683)

I think instead of using a blanket statement and calling them all scams, the OP should have said that some are scams. That goes for pretty much any service out there. Here's a site with over 900 reviews of different health sharing communities. Some there are clearly scams by the terrible reviews.

https://healthsharingreviews.com/

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Re:Hospitals lift curtain on prices, revealing giant swings ... by loeg on Wednesday September 22, 2021 @06:39PM (#28622941)

> some [healthcare ministries] are scams. That goes for pretty much any service out there.

Not really? Which of the highly regulated healthcare insurers do you feel are scams?

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