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Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by Landmarks on Thursday June 25, 2020 @04:40PM (#23645433)
How successful has it been to switch to Bitcoin? I hear mixed things about it and wonder how many actually use this currency.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by jpkoning on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:30PM (#23645946)
As the article points out, Sci-Hub relies on bitcoin for international donations but the majority of its donations come via Yandex.Money, a Russian version of PayPal. I guess that means that most of its donations come from Russians and other CIS nationals with access to Yandex.Money.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by mudlus on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:29PM (#23646505)
Some things that are good for Russia, or terrorists, are good for everyone.

One of those is free and open scientific research.

Bitcoin was designed for just this kind of purpose.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by StavrosK on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:00PM (#23646764)
Why are "Russia" and "terrorists" mentioned in the same breath?
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by lecarore on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:20PM (#23646897)
I think I understand the meaning of the comment (some things that are good for terrorists, like an untraceable currency or messaging app) are good for everyone. Then to be fair Russia has a very relaxed view on copyright (just having a look at VK or yandex music.. it's just full of pirated Western content) and Russian activists are often the first adopters of privacy apps. Ну да, он это не так хорошо сказал.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by metrokoi on Thursday June 25, 2020 @10:48PM (#23648194)
It's interesting that Russia, which is seen as semi- or outright Fascist by many Americans, is much more free than the U.S. is. At least in terms of information freedom and surveillance. The further removed an individual is from the seat of world power, the less necessary it is for every aspect of their lives to be controlled.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by catsdanxe on Friday June 26, 2020 @06:04PM (#23657589)
Your internet is way more censored that ours and Putin is planning on making his own great firewall.

>Putin Signs 'Russian Internet Law' To Disconnect Russia From The World Wide Web

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by metrokoi on Saturday June 27, 2020 @01:23AM (#23659711)
Who's internet? I'm not from Russia.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by a1369209993 on Thursday June 25, 2020 @08:47PM (#23647562)
Because jpkoning mentioned Russians and terrorists are the usual excuse used to pretend that secure (ie not amenable to blackballing) banking infrastructure is a bad thing, when in fact it's

> good for everyone.

with the exception of repressive govenments that want to shut down things like Sci-Hub.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by hedora on Thursday June 25, 2020 @11:34PM (#23648414)
The leaders of those governments will eventually figure out how to launder their bribes through bitcoin (if they haven’t already), and then it’ll be good for the oppressive governments too.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by catalogia on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:11PM (#23646842)
I read that as wry.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by pishpash on Thursday June 25, 2020 @11:18PM (#23648329)
Isn't it great to be in a multipolar world? The greatest threat to human progress is a monopoly on power.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by Obi_Juan_Kenobi on Thursday June 25, 2020 @10:29PM (#23648111)
Transaction fees are a real issue with Bitcoin.

Most of the time, they are suitable for standard payment amounts, but they can spike to quite high levels that make only large amounts worth transacting. This is due to network capacity limitations.

Furthermore, anyone that does not wish to hold BTC - understandable due to its significant volatility - must convert it again into the preferred currency.

Fees = friction, and there's enough friction now that people will only use it when it provides some significant utility.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by ur-whale on Thursday June 25, 2020 @04:55PM (#23645596)
Bitcoin isn't necessarily well aligned to what people usually think of as a "currency".

It's an entirely new beast in the financial instrument space.

It does bear some characteristics of traditional currencies, but not all of them.

Specifically, as it works today, and until Lightning gets some traction, BTC isn't very convenient for small day to day transactions like buying a cup of coffee.

On the flipside, it does have attributes that traditional currencies strictly do not have.

For cases such as the OP, there is no other financial instrument on the planet that will cut it (other than things like Monero / ZCash / MimbleWimble).

Besides being antifragile and censorship resistant, there is also a very strong case to be made for Bitcoin in the 'preservation of wealth' niche (if you are strongly insensitive to short-term volatility, and capable of playing on a 5 year time horizon, that is).

[EDIT]: To answer your question more precisely, Bitcoin has most definitely been a success story for sites like sci-hub, Wikileak and generally speaking, people who try to speak truth to power.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by mirimir on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:42PM (#23646089)
> To answer your question more precisely, Bitcoin has most definitely been a success story for sites like sci-hub, Wikileak and generally speaking, people who try to speak truth to power.

Also for VPN providers, and their customers. And generally for people who want to buy stuff and lease online services ~anonymously. If one mixes well enough, that is.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by Nursie on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:16PM (#23646872)
And avoids using a mixer that decides to screw you over, and avoids using a mixer that gets taken down because hey - guess what? That's basically money laundering and the jail time for that sort of thing can be pretty hefty.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by wbobeirne on Thursday June 25, 2020 @08:52PM (#23647592)
> avoids using a mixer that decides to screw you over

Most mixers use CoinJoin, which gives you trustless assurances that you won't lose your money. The worst thing you'll lose is your time.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by teddyh on Friday June 26, 2020 @02:47AM (#23649381)
A mixer is not “money laundering”. As I understand it, “money laundering” is when you conceal from somebody, usually the tax authorities, the reason you have the money. If someone has no income to speak of, and still has a lot of cash, that’s suspicious. A “mixer” in this case would be analogous to exchanging the physical bills for bills with different serial numbers. But this does not alleviate suspicion, the problem of the money being unexplained remains. So they can “launder” the money; i.e. pretend that they have a hair salon business or something similar, and then declare that a lot of people are coming to their salon and spending money, even though there aren’t. But this now provides an explanation for the amount of money they have; the money is now “laundered”, even though it’s the same physical cash as before.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by mirimir on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:20PM (#23646896)
That's true. You never mix any more than you're willing to lose. And sure, it's money laundering. But money laundering in defense of freedom from oppression is OK, as I see it.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by Nursie on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:50PM (#23647138)
So long as you're ok with your coins getting mixed with (and thus providing cover for) the more criminal stuff, I guess.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by mirimir on Thursday June 25, 2020 @08:55PM (#23647608)
I'm OK with that. And it's impossible to avoid, if you're using systems with any chance of protecting your privacy. Also, criminals tend to attract lots of attention, and they're often careless, so they act as canaries.

There is the concern that you'll end up with Bitcoin that's been tainted in one way or another. However, at least some mixing services get coin from miners, so it's clean. And you can check for that in the blockchain.

That's mostly a concern when you're mixing Bitcoin before converting it to meatspace fiat. If you're anonymizing Bitcoin purchased with meatspace fiat, it doesn't matter so much if some is tainted. Or at least, it won't unless tainted coin gets blacklisted.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by nfin on Thursday June 25, 2020 @09:42PM (#23647887)
Admittedly (!) exaggerated, but are you not also providing cover for criminals by doing not essential things (like playing tennis), because criminals would be catched easily if no law abiding citizen would do that kind of things, right?

Just a thought

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by DEADBEEFC0FFEE on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:52PM (#23646196)
It's not that easy to be anonymous with Bitcoin. Eventually you have to pay for Bitcoin, and that going to involve cash or trust, neither is simple.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by mirimir on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:00PM (#23646759)
Mirimir earns his Bitcoin, so there's no cash involved.

But no matter how you get the Bitcoin, you can get whatever degree of anonymity you want, by mixing it many times. You mix via Tor and nested VPN chains, with a different Whonix VM and mixing service for each mix.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by lallysingh on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:25PM (#23646461)
Bounce through monero first.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by RandomBacon on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:51PM (#23647141)
Might as well just stay in Monero. If you have to pay someplace that doesn't use Monero, just use XMR.to to pay (converts Monero to Bitcoin).
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by bitcointruther on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:07PM (#23646810)
you can buy bitcoin KYC free on bisq.network (but there is a premium). Very low risk of loss of funds. You can even use zelle which is supported by most banks.

From there, send your coins through a samouari whirlpool https://samouraiwallet.com/whirlpool

Then send them wherever you like.

There is still some counterparty risk (what if you're buying coins from the CIA, or whatever), but it's almost minimal.

Buying coins from a Bitcoin ATM is even easier, if there's one near you.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by mirimir on Thursday June 25, 2020 @08:56PM (#23647619)
Bitcoin ATMs probably have surveillance cameras.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by bitxbitxbitcoin on Thursday June 25, 2020 @09:05PM (#23647669)
Bitcoin ATMs definitely have surveillance cameras - if they don't, the area surrounding their location do. As far as I know there are only a handful of older Bitcoin ATM brands that don't have a camera and even the brand I'm thinking of Lamassu has added cameras in their later models.[1]

[1] https://lamassu.is/faq

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by Nursie on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:16PM (#23646878)
> Buying coins from a Bitcoin ATM is even easier, if there's one near you.

Enjoy those massive fees!

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by LeoPanthera on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:39PM (#23646048)
There are forks of Bitcoin that solve (most of) these problems and make it more usable as an actual currency, rather than a gold-like store of value. "Bitcoin Cash" is the most famous, there are others.

Frankly the failure of "original" Bitcoin to adapt to use as a currency seems to me to be a total failure of vision.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by octocop on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:46PM (#23646146)
With that logic the wright brothers made a shitty airplane. Bitcoin will exist forever, it will be like the Egyptian pyramids for our ancestors.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by ahnick on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:48PM (#23646159)
My understanding of Bitcoin Cash and Bitcoin SV is that they have just increased the blocksize the clients can handle. Is there something more to them than that?
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by zhoujianfu on Thursday June 25, 2020 @11:14PM (#23648314)
Not really, but the result is essentially no fees. And thanks to Moore’s Law there’s no trade-off for it. Bitcoin (Core) is insane for having high fees.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by SnowProblem on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:30PM (#23646975)
Yes. It's really worth dwelling on the long-term implications of terabyte+ sized blocks and fees of a thousand of a cent. This is where BSV is heading and everything changes at that scale. New use cases are unlocked. Old architectures need to be rethought. It's the most interesting technology I've encountered in a long time and it's a gem of entrepreneurship opportunity for those that can stomach swimming upstream.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by fsckboy on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:06PM (#23646317)
there's also sidechains, segwit, and lightning network which shrink and consolidate transactions to increase the number of them that can fit in a block
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by ur-whale on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:49PM (#23646172)
> seems to me to be a total failure of vision.

First, the market seems to strongly disagree with you [1]

Second, what seems to me a total failure of vision is trying to shoehorn something as new and disruptive as Bitcoin in the old and worn out yoke of currencies as they used to exist. There's paypal for that.

[1] https://www.tradingview.com/symbols/BCHBTC/?exchange=COINBAS... (choose the 5 yr. view)

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by Geee on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:35PM (#23647023)
Coinbase has 30M+ users. Extrapolating from that I'd say roughly 100M people use Bitcoin to some extent, and it's growing pretty rapidly (20% growth on /r/bitcoin subscribers this year). Using means storing or transferring value in Bitcoin.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by retube on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:50PM (#23646185)
"currency"
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by sdinsn on Thursday June 25, 2020 @05:56PM (#23646236)
> wonder how many actually use this currency.

100% of cyber criminals use Bitcoin, that's a lot of people!

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by foobar_ on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:01PM (#23646272)
100% criminals also use cash. The real problem is 0.0001% can use Bitcoin in any real sense of cash.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by catsdanxe on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:03PM (#23646290)
Criminals prefer monero or another privacy coin.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by qtplatypus on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:35PM (#23647016)
Criminals prefer Western Union and Apple store gift cards.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by wolco on Thursday June 25, 2020 @10:35PM (#23648135)
Google play cards..
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by pfundstein on Thursday June 25, 2020 @11:40PM (#23648448)
That's a strange thing to say without any substantiation. How many cryptolockers use Monero over Bitcoin? How many carding forums accept Monero over Bitcoin? How many darknet markets use Monero over Bitcoin? How many scammers scam you into buying them Monero over gift cards/western union/wire transfer/bitcoin?

Sure many support Monero, but none at the exclusion of Bitcoin.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by loeg on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:07PM (#23646321)
As far as I can tell, criminals prefer to get paid. Bitcoin is accessible to customers.
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by ajkdhcb2 on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:26PM (#23646475)
Customers don't want to put themselves at risk either. Most illegal activity is rapidly switching to monero as people learn that Bitcoin is easily traceable unless people take confusing and expensive countermeasures. It's not difficult to swap between different cryptocurrencies and there are major exchanges in almost all countries to directly get monero anyway
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by grawprog on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:50PM (#23646675)
The problem of turning money to and from monero still seems to exist though. That point where I want to take some of that monero and turn it into cash to buy tangible illegal things nearby and that other point where I want to take some illegal cash and turn it into moneros. At that point, that money needs to pass through a system that records its existence.

With cash, that money can change hands hundreds of times without it ever being tracked by anyone.

The only way a digital currency can ever be safely used for illegal activities if if it can be used and acquired as freely, easily and as anonymously as cash.

From what i've seen there's no digital equivalent to 'handing someone a suitcase full of cash in a dark alley' or receiving your 'cheque' at the end of the day as a wad of cash in an envelope.

With that cash, I can immediately turn around and spend it on some illegal shit and no record any where will ever exist of me being paid or having purchased illegal things. I can then go and spend that money just as easily in a store, where again, no records of where that money came from exists. It'll just appear(or reappear most likely) in circulation magically when the store records it as profit.

Creating a digital currency like this that actually functions as a currency seems unfeasible. Cash only works as it does because everybody just kind of agrees it does or because the government says it does I suppose.

As an addendum and disclaimer, I wrote a lot of this from a first person point of view, that was for dramatic descriptive purposes only and not from any actual personal perspective or activities.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by icebraining on Thursday June 25, 2020 @07:39PM (#23647055)
Monero works like that just fine. You just have to actually use it for everything, rather than convert into physical cash. Just get your provider of tangible things to accept Monero.

If you really need cash, you can also just (physically) go to someone who has cash and tell them "I'll transfer you some Monero coins if you give me some cash and don't record that you did".

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by grawprog on Thursday June 25, 2020 @08:11PM (#23647307)
Ok so, for a more tangible example, I hand Buddy several pounds of drugs, Buddy hands me cash, I can walk to the store immediately and use said money to acquire things. Likewise, I could turn around, go talk to other Buddy and buy more drugs, all within 5-10 minutes of receiving said handful of cash.

Until a digital currency allows this with the same level of anonyminity and ease, it's not viable as a replacement to cash. Go betweens and other things will still involve some third party to facilitate the conversion to real currency. That's the problem. This digital currency must be equally as legitimately and illegitimately useful immediately upon receipt with no hassle with any and all transactions directly doable in said currency without the need for any third party involvement or recording.

Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by chensformers on Thursday June 25, 2020 @06:39PM (#23646585)
So shouldn't Monero be more popular?
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by ajkdhcb2 on Thursday June 25, 2020 @08:37PM (#23647491)
Barely anyone understands this technology well, and so they listen to celebrity Bitcoiners that have a vested interest. It's also difficult to find the one good alternative project among is a sea of well-funded scams. Marketing is important. Real usage is also a niche activity compared to speculation at this stage
Re:Blackballed by PayPal, Sci-Hub switches to Bitcoin by Acrobatic_Road on Thursday June 25, 2020 @11:18PM (#23648327)
This is a good thing. We don't want Monero to get too popular just yet. Let the people who really need privacy find it while the politicians are still fixated on Bitcoin.