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Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by dmix on Sunday January 05, 2020 @11:29AM (#21961986)
> Even the handles on the gas pumps get buffed down regularly so that “the customer does not put his hand on something dirty,” he says

This is what most UX designers do for a living. They think about the small details which get overlooked while everyone is in a rush to build out x feature/functionality.

It's what creates emotional connections to products and services which builds strong customer loyalty and helps word of mouth.

Just like how they used to know your name at your local small grocery store, those intimate details go a long way. And in commoditized situations people are willing to spend more time/money or go out of their way to use your product.

Dan Norman talks a lot about this in his "Emotional Design" book. It's the design stuff that goes beyond merely functionality and most efficient problem solving (ie, obsessing about fewest clicks to do x, instead of the wider experience where adding a communication step might improve the emotional experience).

But often it is a luxury for many smaller firms struggling to just get the functionality part right, which is why this person buying up gas stations, providing time and capital, and giving them the attention they needed is working so well.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by doodliego on Sunday January 05, 2020 @10:15PM (#21966128)
This guy is putting customers first, which is the exact opposite of most UX design philosophies I've been on the receiving end of. The entire discipline prioritizes minimalism, copying Apple, and making random changes to the interface just so they have "accomplished" something, which is how you get randomly broken messes like Youtube.

If UX designers made a gas pump, it would be a featureless white pillar with a single button and a hose and it wouldn't work.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by andykx on Monday January 06, 2020 @12:29AM (#21966733)
For better or worse, UX is as much about curating a company “image” as it is about creating user-friendly interfaces. When users see that your website looks like Apple’s, they immediately think, “Wow, this company is the real deal.” This part of the user’s experience is, unfortunately, the focus of many marketing/design teams.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by eric-hu on Sunday January 05, 2020 @10:22PM (#21966153)
Design is a broad field. I believe you're mistaking UX design for visual design or industrial design.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by dmix on Sunday January 05, 2020 @11:48PM (#21966516)
UX is one of the most abused terms. So I'm not surprised he's mistaking what it really means.

So many big firms hire mediocre "designers" out of college and they wireframe whatever the project managers tell them to and they do what they are told.

I better term is just "product designer" but I like UX designer as the name encompasses it perfectly... your job is to know and understand the users experience inside and out, and make it as ideal as possible.

When done right, just like programmers who push back on stupid features because they often have a better grasp of what "good software" compared to the average "business person". Another bad group is the non-startup people who come from older, bigger IT megacorps and run product development, which is a disaster waiting to happen but I've heard of many examples of this.

I should also note I'm only talking from my experience working with startups and SMBs. I personally don't know much about operating design within a giant company.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by specialist on Sunday January 05, 2020 @10:45PM (#21966268)
File under "Can't Prove It, But I Know It's True":

Those crappy UIs were the result of PHBs sabotaging the work.

I stopped doing UI. It was pointless. We'd mock things up. Validate with usability testing. Rinse, lather, repeat. Until it was spotless.

And then it'd all get trashed by someone(s) with a corner office.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by mc3 on Sunday January 05, 2020 @11:33PM (#21966480)
UX is completely about the end user. A UX should be studying how people are using a product, see where they trip up and get confused and design a better experience as a result.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by mbyrne on Monday January 06, 2020 @01:17PM (#21971488)
A hose is not very elegant and should be removed. It would look much cleaner to have the gasoline just squirt into the car's open gas tank. Possibly with some LEDs around the gas pump's flush-mounted nozzle to create sparkles in the gasoline stream as it arcs through the air into the gas tank fill hole. Finally, clean hands!
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by drcross on Monday January 06, 2020 @04:50AM (#21967915)
YouTube is terrible. I have ample space on my dual screens to display controls while watching a YouTube video. Everything from scrubbing, speed control and volume changes should be a single click away at all times.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by deftnerd on Wednesday January 08, 2020 @10:47AM (#21992401)
For optimization, I would just make it easy to remove the payment process and selecting the fuel grade.

Everytime a car drives up, use a camera to determine their license plate number. If they are a new customer, ask them if they want to save their payment information and fuel grade preferences. If so, everytime they come back, the pump can display "Welcome back John Doe, you can begin pumping".

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by wpietri on Sunday January 05, 2020 @03:56PM (#21964022)
I agree this kind of thinking is good, but disagree that it should be concentrated in a role with a title like UX Designer.

Ultimately, we make things that serve other people. All of us need to pay attention to how our work impacts the users we serve. Experts can help with that, but the Lone Design Ranger isn't nearly as powerful as a cross-functional, user-focused team.

I would also suggest that at least in tech, smaller firms aren't the problem here. As you say yourself, the small, neighborhood grocery store can get this stuff right just by paying attention. I think the big problems come at scale, where managerialism and over-focused metrics can easily disempower people and get them focused on the wrong thing.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by reaperducer on Sunday January 05, 2020 @10:37PM (#21966224)
I agree this kind of thinking is good, but disagree that it should be concentrated in a role with a title like UX Designer.

In the company I work for, we call it "customer experience." We have an entire team of people who work face-to-face with actual customers, observing how they interact with our products and services to improve things.

It's why we have a 96% satisfaction rating in an industry where 40% is considered off the charts good.

But this will never fly in the tech sphere because it requires actual feet on the ground and talking to wetware. Some middle manager along the way would say, "it doesn't scale" and the project would get shelved.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by wpietri on Monday January 06, 2020 @12:59AM (#21966862)
It definitely happens in parts of the tech world! I've been part of teams that are really good at iterating based on actual customer experience.

However, you're right that it's too rare. The number one problem I've seen is that executives are convinced that they already know what users need. And when they get real data disproving their hunches, they really don't like it.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by dmix on Sunday January 05, 2020 @04:24PM (#21964221)
Completely agree with everything you said.

Remember when Google was still small and functional enough to produce excellent software with a good focus on design consistently? I do and I miss them. But all good things fade over time.

Clearly Google haven't architected a system that can put (or attract) the right talent in control of the right places. Small fast growing firms naturally attract talent and "game recognizes game" usually so it was easier for them back in the day.

It's just interesting to think of all the firms with a legitimate pool of great talent simply not executing properly (Magic Leap is the perfect example of this). It's a sad waste of resources which is heavily responsible for the people running things (IMO).

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by cushychicken on Sunday January 05, 2020 @12:04PM (#21962228)
>Just like how they used to know your name at your local small grocery store, those intimate details go a long way. And in commoditized situations people are willing to spend more time/money or go out of their way to use your product.

Additionally - it also shows how there are things that you never expect that have a positive impact. Suggests to me that there are so many factors that affect people's product choices, and that many of the factors that drive a certain choice are not fully understood by either the buyer or the seller.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by dmix on Sunday January 05, 2020 @12:20PM (#21962365)
Startups can waste so many cycles optimizing for bullshit that's for sure. Or at least the tiny details that may or may not improve the product experience, or more important the revenue part.

Doing to the right optimizations at the right scale is a difficult balance. A lot of startups are investing thousands (or more important critical hours of runway time) in making super pretty websites and mobile apps when a simple non-JS HTML page where they figure out who their customer is or what product they really should be selling.

But then there are products where the mobile/web app's UX is the product because the industry is old/stagnant and haven't figured out tech. For example there are quite a few startups whose sole purpose is making buying insurance on your phone easy from a UX standpoint. Taxi companies could have made cellphone GPS/app driven services long before Uber but didn't, etc.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by andonisus on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:04PM (#21963172)
I really don't buy any of the UX spiel that you laid out. I guess it depends on what kind of product you're buying, but I have never personally had a personal connection to any (technology) product. The only UX I care about is the application being responsive and doing what it says it's going to do. Additionally, I have never once recommended a product because it has evoked an emotional response for me.

To be clear, I am not saying that UX as whole is not needed, but I do not need someone who has made a career of it to elucidate me on the finer points of emotionally connecting with a user via tooltips and the like.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by jkaptur on Sunday January 05, 2020 @03:21PM (#21963772)
Most engineers I talk to insist that they don't have an emotional connection to products or software. Then we start talking about their favorite text editor...
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by Infinitesimus on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:39PM (#21963451)
> The only UX I care about is the application being responsive and doing what it says it's going to do

UX as a field goes well beyond pretty UIs.

UX designer could drive your example because they looked at the users of the product and realized that like you, they care about a very responsive system.

Detecting that someone finds the product too slow could eventually materialize a backlog item to make page load times twice as fast etc.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by Plyphon_ on Monday January 06, 2020 @06:15AM (#21968247)
Absolutely correct. A UX designer will have the stake at the table with all sorts of decisions that impact the user experience.

For example:

Two competing microservices? One has a spin up time of 0.3 secs, the other 1 sec. The first is two times the price. It is the job of the UX designer to understand the impact of the longer spin up time to understand if it would impact the user experience.

The UX designer then works with the Product Manager to build a business case for the correct service and thus you've made a decision that impacts the UX but is not a UI or interaction based conversation.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by untilHellbanned on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:09PM (#21963201)
You fell into the "doesn't work on me, so it doesn't work on anyone" trap.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by andonisus on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:12PM (#21963222)
Should I speak for everyone else? I cannot presume to share anything but my own personal experience. To that end, I am simply relating my experience with UX designers and the evangelists of it.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by gbasin on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:15PM (#21963240)
I think I'm similar. Although it's hard to rule out that little details don't have a subconscious impact on my preferences.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by andonisus on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:29PM (#21963350)
It very well could have an impact; who knows? I guess my point is that I feel that UI design should include UX as part of its guiding principles. You don't build a UI just to build a UI -- you build it to be used (hence, UX). How can you have UI without UX? Why does it therefore need to be a separate role? Shouldn't UI designers, by definition, include UX as part of their design? If your response to this question is that a UX designer would guide the UX of an entire platform, I could buy that. But that is not typically how a UX designer's role is described to me.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by Plyphon_ on Monday January 06, 2020 @09:04AM (#21969163)
It's a good question - and the simple answer is -

Usability and interaction design is most certainly part of UX. However, the skills needed to be a competent visual designer match (in terms of difficulty, time to execute, etc) that of being a UX designer. Simply put, in order to go deep enough on either craft, you need to dedicate to one side or another.

There are many dual 'UX/UI' roles out there, but they tend to be weighted toward the UI side, maybe with some user testing tacked on the end or some journey work.

Sole UX roles are much deeper in their reach within an organisation and consist of much, much more than just wireframing and making visual deliverables.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by lostgame on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:53PM (#21963569)
That’s why, as far as I’ve seen - it’s typically called UI/UX?

They certainly go hand in hand but IMHO good UX is much more important than the way the UI is displayed, which I think can honesty be more influenced by aesthetic and personal preference.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by jayd16 on Sunday January 05, 2020 @04:00PM (#21964050)
Bad UX can certainly create an emotional response.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by jariel on Sunday January 05, 2020 @03:01PM (#21963636)
Almost every consumer product is sold and marketed on the basis of emotional connection.

More likely than not, you're just not aware of it, which is normal.

FYI the emotional connection is not just made 'via tooltips', it's usually a package affair.

The article is a good example: the product (gas) and price didn't change, one could argue cleanliness was changed but that's a little doubtful unless the old station was disgusting. What changed was probably brand, colours, lighting, atmosphere, modern appearance - all pretty superficial stuff that has nothing to do with the actual product - gasoline. And yet it makes a big difference to most people, probably including you and I. We probably don't notice we were more likely to pull into the big, lit, white, modern looking gas station with the brand we recognised - over the off-brand gas next door, which is identical.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by ficklepickle on Monday January 06, 2020 @06:32PM (#21974772)
I don't know why this is down voted. I think you are correct.

That is exactly why brands use bright colours. It appeals to the part of the brain that evolved to recognize ripe fruit, for example.

As uncomfortable as it is to admit that these things may influence our behaviour, it is the reality. No person is completely immune.

Free will is largely an illusion. We act on impulses, then the conscious mind comes up with a plausible explanation for that action.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by jariel on Tuesday January 07, 2020 @02:43PM (#21983911)
I'm not sure free will is a total illusion but we definitely make decisions on cruise control all day long.

The gas station is actually evidence of this: literally the utility of the product does not change, but more revenue ...

I think maybe it's an offence to Engineers to posit that they are not 'in control'. It takes some right-brain thinking to get this it's all a little counterintuitive.

But it's definitely reality. For the quickest possible introduction to really odd marketing concepts that are true, I'd recommend the '22 Immutable Laws of Marketing'. For an Engineer, it's like getting hit in the head with a frisbee.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by bitexploder on Sunday January 05, 2020 @01:49PM (#21963071)
Quick Trip is a national gas chain that does all of these little things right. Always clean. Good bathrooms. Pumps always work and are clean. Checkout is always fast even when the store is really busy. Excellent product selection for a convenience store. Bright and welcoming. That is how I characterize them. This engineer is helping other stations have that same polished feeling.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by criddell on Sunday January 05, 2020 @04:14PM (#21964147)
If you are ever in central Texas, check out Buckee's. There's one near Waco that blows my mind. Something like 120 gas pumps. The bathrooms are spotless and in the men's there are probably 50 or 60 urinals and a similar number of stalls. The store attached to the gas station is pretty big too and has just about every kind of junk food and some decent bbq as well.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by Aloha on Sunday January 05, 2020 @05:09PM (#21964507)
Bu-cees is a Texas phenomenon - gas stations the size of a Costco, reasonable prices inside and out.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by indecisive_user on Sunday January 05, 2020 @03:07PM (#21963673)
I was going to mention QT. Though most their locations are in the Midwest. The only chains that even come close to the same quality and consistency are Racetrac or _some_ circle K's.

I pretty much always choose to stop at a QT if I can just because of all the little things you mentioned that they do better than every other gas station.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by pochamago on Sunday January 05, 2020 @03:56PM (#21964021)
Discovering a favorite gas station chain in each region of the US is one of those hobbies it always feels weird to talk about, but there's no doubt that Racetrac is the king of Texas
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by bitexploder on Monday January 06, 2020 @01:06AM (#21966903)
Pilot was also a cross country institution for my family. We went from GA to Milwaukee many times over the years. Those Pilot stations were all very familiar after 10+ years. You just know they will be well lit, safe, clean gas, snacks, quick checkout etc. very customer focused.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by celticmusic on Monday January 06, 2020 @10:36PM (#21976587)
agree 100% with this, especially the checkout always being fast.

They place counters on _both_ sides of each checkout (and there's 3). They'll check a person out on the left of the register, then while that person is gathering their stuff up off the counter, they start checking the person out on the right. Almost like a zipper merge.

and it's very very effective.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by WalterBright on Sunday January 05, 2020 @03:18PM (#21963750)
> Just like how they used to know your name at your local small grocery store,

When I was in college, there was a small restaurant nearby, Burger Continental. The owner knew us students, and when ordering he'd always upgrade our orders for free, usually with a big flourish. We knew why he was doing it, but we still enjoyed him doing it and patronized his establishment a lot.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by bitexploder on Monday January 06, 2020 @01:13AM (#21966939)
There are definitely lessons for software makers. Slack had this. Great custom emoji support. Just enough Markdown support. Many other little things that just work. Their recent “rich editor” changes are universally reviled at my company. Even our non technical staff hate it. It took them like 5 minutes to learn old way and they used it fine. This would be analogous to something like adding a feature to gas pumps that slows everyone down or leaves you feeling vaguely annoyed because you made me go through too many screens at the pump.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by lotsofpulp on Sunday January 05, 2020 @11:58AM (#21962187)
>And in commoditized situations people are willing to spend more time/money or go out of their way to use your product.

It depends if your customer has money to spare and/or if they value the improvements. Walmart succeeded precisely because people don't care about anything other than price for commodities.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by Cthulhu_ on Sunday January 05, 2020 @12:01PM (#21962205)
I think in this particular case it's largely unconscious - people (speaking for myself at least) don't look at whether a fuel pump handle has been buffed, instead they'll have a general feeling of "this station feels nicer than most".
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by dsfyu404ed on Sunday January 05, 2020 @01:35PM (#21962962)
Yeah, and the hordes of price sensitive customers will have no problem passing up your "nice" gas station for the one that's consistently 5 cents cheaper.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by JumpCrisscross on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:10PM (#21963210)
> hordes of price sensitive customers will have no problem passing up your "nice" gas station for the one that's consistently 5 cents cheaper

It's not obvious that these measures would boost the price. An owner might accept lower margins for scale. Or they may cut costs that don't matter, but which everyone dogmatically incurs, to incur the ones that do.

An in any case, segmentation is a thing. Targeting premium customers is a profitable strategy. It's also a virtuous cycle, since each premium customer gives you resources to expand your lead while depriving your competitors of their business (e.g. for upsold services).

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by iudqnolq on Sunday January 05, 2020 @05:37PM (#21964675)
> An in any case, segmentation is a thing.

Which is apparently why the engineer owns both discount (Arco) and premium (Shell) stations.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by reaperducer on Sunday January 05, 2020 @10:42PM (#21966255)
Yeah, and the hordes of price sensitive customers will have no problem passing up your "nice" gas station for the one that's consistently 5 cents cheaper.

Clearly untrue, at least where I live.

There are two thriving chains of gas stations that do well because they offer superior customer experience. There are often lines inside and outside.

Then there are half a dozen other chains that are bare-bones and sell the gas for up to 30¢ a gallon cheaper. They don't have nearly the traffic as the nice chains.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by syshum on Sunday January 05, 2020 @12:34PM (#21962486)
That is not the full story of why Walmart Succeed, the Old School walmart (back in Sam Walton's day) was not competing on price, but on Value (Service + Price) and they successed

Walmart of today still competes on more than Price, but it is Convenience + Price. For me this is the ability to get my Oil Change Supplies, my Furnace Filters, a new pair of shoes, a belt and my Groceries all in 1 store, with 1 checkout, and I can get into that store and out of it getting everything I need for 1-2 weeks in under 30-45mins

Often times if I price shopped for every item there are places that are lower in price than Walmart, and some that are higher, but on the whole those minor fluctuations are not worth going to 5 different stores to get the "lowest price"

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by specialist on Sunday January 05, 2020 @10:50PM (#21966291)
My sister dragged me, kicking and screaming, to one of those new Walmart Neighborhood Markets. I was shocked to learn that it didn't suck. They definitely invested in their self checkout things (unlike Kroger). I even found some foods which didn't contain HFCS. I've been back a few times.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by jariel on Sunday January 05, 2020 @02:55PM (#21963582)
Funny though, it may not be the pumps. That just might be an expression of their strict cleanliness. It maybe some other aspect that actually brings in customers. Or possibly the sum totality of 'clean' and not any one thing.

Assuming it's not product or price, it's interesting to note how a professional appearance makes the difference.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by WalterBright on Sunday January 05, 2020 @03:22PM (#21963779)
> Funny though, it may not be the pumps. That just might be an expression of their strict cleanliness. It maybe some other aspect that actually brings in customers. Or possibly the sum totality of 'clean' and not any one thing.

In the early days, Ray Kroc focused on McDonald's always having spotless bathrooms. Moms knew this and would stop at McD's on road trips because the bathrooms were reliably clean. Nobody else was doing that at the time.

Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by greedo on Tuesday January 07, 2020 @11:29AM (#21981463)
Kroc and Fred Turner would also walk around the entire block at a McDonalds location, picking up trash.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by Noos on Monday January 06, 2020 @05:59AM (#21968184)
It's probably location. The busier gas stations are on well-traveled roads or close to highway exits and on ramps; the ones that aren't do less business. Location gets ignored a lot, but it matters so much.
Re:A former Egyptian engineer found the secret to building a... by partyboat1586 on Monday January 06, 2020 @06:07AM (#21968210)
This only applies if you are not the only company providing the particular service your customers need and you don't provide any key extra features that no other service provides. I've worked on some apps (through an agency) with really poor UX but 50k monthly active users because they provide a niche thing people need so the people are willing to put time into working out the interface.