But if we generally improve society in any way, it means that some of the difficulties / obstacles that people have faced so far will be more rarely faced (or maybe eliminated) by people who come after the changes.

It isn't fair any more than it was fair that people who learned to program in the 80s/90s had to buy their compilers and software and didn't have Stack Exchange. Or, more dramatically, it isn't fair any more than it's fair for people who suffered or died from infectious illness before antibiotics.

As the saying goes: we all sit in the shade of trees we did not plant, we all drink from wells we did not dig. If we're bitter about planting trees we don't get to sit under, we break the chain that lets society move forward.

Isn’t this more like Sanders taking a tree I planted and giving it to a treeless person and telling them it’s free?

I don't know what the solution to correct the past problem is. But I don't like setting the precedent that if the masses fuck up and make poor choices that they should get a pass later.

I could 100% get behind student lone forgiveness if any degree issued was paid for by debt being forgiven was made null. This protects those who figured out how to pay them off, and those who did not get degrees because of the cost. Each person would be able to chose their degree over debt -- the same decision many of made in the past.

To fix the issue moving forward, guaranteed loans need to be done away with and lenders need to weigh risk and validate loans based off merit and a degree's likelihood produce a job to pay off the loan.

A few people taking out large loans for degrees that didn't end up being worth it is an issue of personal responsibility. When an entire generation does it there's something more systemic going on.

I mean how many people on HN can say in good conscience that their Uni education was worth the money? I think mine had value in a life experiences sense but what actually landed me my first job was a passion for tinkering with code and systems that started in HS. Outside of the "having an impressive sounding degree" to put on my resume there's no way that the actual education dollar for dollar it was worth it. I had a few professors that were actually mind opening but it was the exception rather than the rule.

I realize that University education is super important to a lot of other fields but it seems like a weird argument to make in a forum of people with CS $50k-$200k CS degrees that probably got eclipsed by less than two years of work experience.

Just bailing people out without addressing the systematic problem is the worst possible thing you can do.

Here are just a few systematic problems:

- We send far too many people to universities and have no trade school infrastructure

- Our universities cost double per FTE than what other universities cost (per year). Universities are far too expensive with bloated admin staff.

- Our universities last far too long and are not selective enough

- Our universities allow students to graduate with unmarketable skills.

- Our universities are sitting on huge endowments and possess significant real estate assets yet these are not being tapped for the bailout

- students are given incorrect information or are not given accurate information about their future expected earnings and debt burdens.

- many students choose poor majors

- many students borrow too much, and the Federal government guarantees these debts.

I would be willing to listen to a comprehensive reform program. Clearly there is a problem that should be addressed. But just bailing people out to let this system continue? That's a terrible idea.

The article says yes.

This is a very bitter pill. But you get to choose how to swallow it.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+20&vers...

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_Workers_in_the_...

Along with “son of man”, it’s one of the more undefined but well known phrases from the NT.

I tend to think it’s got vastly more to do with improving the life we know than it does with anything about “getting to go to heaven if you’re good”

Until I was in adulthood I figured it meant “heaven”; that is not at all clear, actually.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingship_and_kingdom_of_God#...

[0] https://www.governing.com/topics/public-justice-safety/tns-s...

Fixing poor public policy in this case isn't subsidizing weakness; it's correcting an economic inefficiency. Somewhere between 60-70% of Americans support government funded higher ed; this is simply enacting it a bit later, retroactively (and based on polling, the support is there).

To put this into perspective, it ($1.6T) is less than 3 years of US military spending at current funding levels [1]. Pain is to be expected as the country unwinds poor decisions (education and healthcare in its current forms). Macro economic decisions should not be made emotionally, so squash the desire to argue moral hazard. We've burned up far more dollars as a country on far worse decisions.

Disclaimer: Sanders supporter, no college, no student loans

[1] https://www.thebalance.com/u-s-military-budget-components-ch...

If the government doesn't first fix higher education for people graduating highschool from now into the future, then they're not accomplishing anything. They're just buying votes.