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Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by peterwwillis on Thursday October 18, 2018 @11:59PM (#18254152)
Well it depends on what part of the "West" you mean. Lots of people still hang clothes out to dry in Italy, France, Germany, Spain, etc.

In the USA, we don't hang clothes out because we changed our cultural norms with the introduction of convenience machines. Once air conditioning became affordable, we all bought it. Same for refrigerators, dish washers, garbage disposals, washing machines, and of course dryers. Having a machine to do your work for you was seen as a middle-class status symbol, in addition to relieving housework.

Once line-drying became passé, people began to dislike the sight of line-dried clothes (it reminded them of being lower-class) and so was now "unsightly". Neighborhood association bylaws were passed to ban line-drying completely, and many apartment buildings also banned the practice. So now around 80% of homes in the USA have a washer and dryer, and people in apartments use laundromats or apartment facilities.

This article from the BBC mentions the millions of U.S. homeowners who were banned from using clotheslines: https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-11417677

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dashundchen on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:09AM (#18254181)
> Why would you line-dry your clothes if you have the convenience of a dryer?

Some advantages:

1. Clothes last longer with less dryer agitation

2. Less agitation means less lint

3. Lower carbon emissions and gas/electric bills

I have a gas clothes dryer at home but I hang dry my clothes year round.

In the summer I have a line, more delicate and fade-senstitive items get hung in the shade while towels, sheets, undershirts, socks and underwear can go in the sun. If you hang them in the morning or evening when light is less intense, or bring them in as soon as they dry during sunnier hours, there's very little risk of fading in my experience. The most delicate items are hung inside on a drying rack.

In the winter or rainy periods I have a folding indoor drying rack that I hang clothes on. It takes longer but still works. During furnace weather I can leave them in front of a vent and the dry furnace air gets some humidity as well.

Some tips if you haven't hang dried before:

You may notice your clothes are stiff after air drying. Depending on your water hardness you may be using too much soap (most detergents recommend too much). Try using less, or add plain white vinegar in the fabric softener dispenser (no commercial softener)

Vinegar will soften the water, remove soap buildup from the washer and clothes, and leaves fabric soft without any other artificial softeners.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by veidr on Friday October 19, 2018 @07:03AM (#18255754)
True, but for me, all of those things are outweighed (and then some) by one simple fact: it takes me 20 seconds to move the entire load of wet clothes into the dryer. I can’t even get to the line in 20 seconds, much less hang all the clothes…

Gigantic gas-powered clothes dryer is one of the only things I miss about life in USA.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Juliate on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:09AM (#18256094)
When the weather permits, I'd rather take 5 minutes to hang clothes to dry, and then other 5 minutes to fold them.

A lot like cooking food, that's a time to let your mind wander and breathe.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by brokenmachine on Monday October 22, 2018 @12:03AM (#18272097)
I'm the opposite. Hanging up clothes is probably my least favorite thing to do.

But I still do it because it seems wasteful to use a dryer, and damages the clothes as well.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by addicted on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:09AM (#18256818)
We have a washer/dryer in our apartment. We still hang dry over 50% of our clothes because the effort involved is really minuscule, the chances of the clothes getting destroyed are significantly lower, they last significantly longer, some clothes run a risk of catching fire if the temperature is too high, and finally the clothes just feel so much nicer to wear.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by tunap on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:43PM (#18257959)
Bonus, especially if electric dryer, you save a ton of cash not running it several hours a week. In AZ, it may take clothes less time to dry, IDK, I don't own/use a dryer.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by pbhjpbhj on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:18AM (#18256140)
Death of the World is just so convenient.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by SmellyGeekBoy on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:46AM (#18257048)
What are you doing that's more appealing than spending 5 minutes outside?
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by veidr on Saturday October 20, 2018 @08:59AM (#18263080)
Well, you know; spending time with my children, programming my hobby projects, cooking, sleeping, working on my bicycle, riding my bicycle, lifting weights on my roof deck, googling the candidates on my absentee ballot, having sex, cooking something else, reading a novel, taking a bath... I mean there’s a veritable laundry list (ahem) of things I’d rather spend 5 minutes of my precious, precious time on than hanging my clothes on a line.

YMMV, of course...

(Possibly relevant: my clothes consist primarily of a few identical pairs of shorts and fatigue pants, and 20 identical heavyweight no-brand T-shirts, plus maybe a hoodie...)

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by BoorishBears on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:27AM (#18254237)
The sun will ruin clothes much faster than a properly configured dryer
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dashundchen on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:36AM (#18254266)
YMMV - it may be different closer to the equator, but in the great lakes I don't have an issue. The brightest colors and most delicate fabrics are hung inside or in shade. With a medium washer spin speed there's very little wear on the clothes.

In contrast, my experience with the dryer is clothes and up looking threadbare and worn from a high heat dryer. Just look at how quickly the lint trap fills up.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by BoorishBears on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:41AM (#18254287)
I’ve found most wear on clothes comes from people who only used timed washes on high heat

I wash my clothes and dry them according to type with automatic settings which end the cycle early if the clothes are dry before the full cycle is complete

On the flip side when I lived in a place where dying clothes outside was the norm there was no avoiding sun bleached clothes unless you dryer your clothes at night (which only partially worked because it was a tropical climate)

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by pbhjpbhj on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:22AM (#18256165)
I line dry and have tshirts that are over 20 years old. I've lost clothing to a washer that broke a paddle though.

Another benefit of line drying is you don't need to iron, we don't iron clothing. The only times I've ironed in the last couple of decades is job-interviews and attending Buck House.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by peterwwillis on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:50PM (#18258014)
I haven't needed to iron in a long time and I use dryers. Wash on medium and dry on permanent press. Remove immediately and hang or fold. As long as you don't pack the dryer with heavy items, clothes come out wrinkle-free.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Symbiote on Friday October 19, 2018 @04:57AM (#18255241)
I've only lived at 50-55° N, and 99% of my clothes are black. They seem to last much longer without fading if I don't use a dryer. On cheaper t-shirts, the dryer gradually ruins the elastic around the neck.

I use the dryer for clothes that don't matter, and line dry the nicer ones.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by AstralStorm on Friday October 19, 2018 @06:41AM (#18255662)
Mostly because the tumbling damages the material by abrasion. The damaged fibres look dull and hold the pigment much worse.

Likewise washing without tumbling is much gentler but clothes dry a lot longer.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Symbiote on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:01AM (#18257152)
I took some super-macro photos to try and see this, but there wasn't as much difference as I hoped.

The second photo is my newest t-shirt, and the fourth is the oldest.

https://imgur.com/a/8wzFWki?

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by ChristianBundy on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:21PM (#18257784)
> but there wasn't as much difference as I hoped

That looks like a huge difference to me, the first shot looks super old whereas the last shot looks brand new. What sort of difference were you hoping for?

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Symbiote on Friday October 19, 2018 @02:54PM (#18259041)
Yeah, but the fourth is an old item. The second is the newest.

I wonder if I'm looking at it the wrong way, and all the "fluff" has been sucked out of the fourth one by the dryer, which probably weakens it.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Angostura on Friday October 19, 2018 @04:27AM (#18255066)
Possible, but I'm not convinced that this is a given. You have UV v mechanical tumbling and deformation. Line drying is also quite a lot faster on on a warm day.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Cthulhu_ on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:33AM (#18255404)
Even on a not so warm day, the moving air really helps dry it out a lot faster. Not as fast as a dryer maybe but still. Plus, outdoor air freshness. If you don't live near a major road anyway.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by petre on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:04AM (#18255275)
We dry them on the other side. Also, we avoid leaving them in the sun more than an hour or so. The dryer stays outside during the night and is moved inside in the morning during work days or left for about an hour in the sun otherwise then moved inside.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by coldtea on Friday October 19, 2018 @06:58AM (#18255737)
Not in my experience.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by SmellyGeekBoy on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:47AM (#18257060)
Presumably with this in mind you make sure to keep them well covered every time you go outside wearing them?
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by caf on Friday October 19, 2018 @07:34AM (#18255918)
If you're worried about items fading, just hang them inside-out.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by kseistrup on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:54AM (#18256359)
And one more reason:

Line-dried clothes and beddings smell wonderful (even if you use detergents and softeners that don't contain perfume) after hanging out to dry.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by mercutio2 on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:45AM (#18257039)
That’s funny. The main reason I don’t line dry my clothes is because I dislike the way they smell after being line dried.

To each his/her own!

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by saiya-jin on Friday October 19, 2018 @04:26AM (#18255064)
+1 for vinegar, I would add that it helps a lot with sporty clothing that you sweat through and through often. Especially with synthetic, they tend to get some nasty stench that doesn't go away with normal washing. Vinegar helps with that
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by petre on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:02AM (#18255265)
Doesn't vinegar destroy your washing machine?
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dashundchen on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:25AM (#18256912)
Maybe on some models - I've been doing it for years and I have no issue.

I don't put a ton in, and I imagine most of it is neutralized by leftover soap residue and a relatively hard water supply.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dsfyu404ed on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:50AM (#18256325)
It will accelerate corrosion and rust. Modern, higher end machines are probably going to use stainless for all the affected parts but I wouldn't risk it on an expensive newer machine. Older machines are more likely to have non-stainless parts and if you've got an older machines you probably don't want to accelerate its demise.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Grazester on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:31AM (#18256957)
Wouldn't chlorine bleach also have the same effect on your washing machine since it is quite the oxidizing agent?
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @04:00AM (#18254923)
> Neighborhood association bylaws were passed to ban line-drying completely, and many apartment buildings also banned the practice.

Land of the free where you can shoot a person that enters your garden but you can't dry out your clothes there because it's unsightly.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by jerf on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:57AM (#18256373)
"Land of the free where you can shoot a person that enters your garden but you can't dry out your clothes there because it's unsightly."

Freedom encompasses freedom of association, where you may voluntarily agree to additional restrictions as part of such an association. The definition of freedom you seem to be using is incoherent. You can't have both the "freedom" to enter into a voluntary contract and also the "freedom" to violate the contract at will. The two are contradictory.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by athenot on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:27AM (#18256549)
As a rebuttal, you are never really free from getting shot because applying your "freedom of association" to that topic results in so much controversy as to be practically unfeasible.

Back to the topic at hand, this is pitting the aestethic feelings of some versus the right of others to be thrifty and efficient (and green, as line-drying is definitely more environment-friendly than using a machine which pulls 2-5KW of power).

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by jimmy1 on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:05AM (#18256794)
> the right of others to be thrifty and efficient

It would be much more thrifty and efficient if I could walk around naked and shit and piss where ever I want, because then I wouldn't have to buy clothes, clean them, or waste money on flushing a toilet.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by HarryHirsch on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:11AM (#18257217)
Yes, you are free to choose the school district for your children. It just so happens that many of the better ones are HOA-encumbered, and it's HOAs where you find these overbearing rules that supposedly help protect the value of your home, or something.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:39PM (#18257930)
Freedom to go somewhere else is the most basic freedom there is. Saying you are free just because you have that basic freedom is a bit much.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:45AM (#18256658)
Are you free to not enter neighbourhood associations so you can put your laundry outside?

I honestly don't understand how all that freedom neighbourhood association restrictions work.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by leetcrew on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:54AM (#18256733)
it's actually really simple. some (but not all) neighborhoods have neighborhood associations that have bylaws. if you don't like the bylaws, you go live in a different neighborhood.

pretty much everyone who lives in these kinds of places has at least one rule on the books that they think is dumb, but at the end of the day most people do actually want their neighbors to cut their lawns and stuff like that, so they choose to live somewhere that has at least some of these restrictions.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:27PM (#18257838)
> if you don't like the bylaws, you go live in a different neighborhood.

What if I own land there because I bought it or inherited it? At which point do I freely enter those free neighbourhood associacions and agreements? Are they attached to the land? How exactly are they free if they are bundled? Is it like "freely" agreeing to see ads because if I don't agree I'll be cut out from the service?

In my country interaction between people that live side by side is regulated by actual law and since it's universal it's limited. Like no emission of unbearable smells or actual poison and no constant noise. It's nobody's business if his neighbour cuts grass provided he doesn't do that all the time with especially loud lawnmower.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by plorkyeran on Friday October 19, 2018 @01:09PM (#18258171)
If you own property that's not part of a HOA and your neighbors decide to form one, you can just choose not to join it if you don't want to. If you're buying land, you should find out whether or not it is part of a HOA before buying it, and if it is part of one make sure that it has rules which are acceptable to you.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by amanaplanacanal on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:29PM (#18257846)
I've never understood this. I live in an older neighborhood which was built long before HOAs existed. Actually I have never lived in a neighborhood with an HOA, and I'm over 60. I've never seen any of the evils that those folks worry about.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by woah on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:46AM (#18257056)
They work in the same way as restaurant dress codes
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dsfyu404ed on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:46AM (#18256304)
>Neighborhood association bylaws...

HOAs and the people who subject themselves to them are a self selecting group who want that kind of stuff. In some wealthy suburbs the town government functions basically like a HOA trying to maintain property values by keeping the "wrong" people out and keeping the "wrong" kind of development from happening. However, local governments mostly don't concern themselves with this level of micromanagement, it's the exception not the rule.

Caring about "unsightly" things is universal to rich busybodies worldwide. It's not about freedom, it's about doing things that inconvenience poor people so they don't move to your neighborhood.

For every horror story about an American HOA there's an equivilent

>Land of the free where you can shoot a person that enters your garden

Outside some very specific circumstances shooting someone who is on your property is likely to put you behind bars regardless of what state you do it in.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by leetcrew on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:16AM (#18256865)
> Caring about "unsightly" things is universal to rich busybodies worldwide. It's not about freedom, it's about doing things that inconvenience poor people so they don't move to your neighborhood.

it might have that effect in some cases, but I don't necessarily think that's the intent. people put a lot of effort into making their home and yard look nice and they want to live with other people who also care. I live in a quiet lower-middle class neighborhood and people will be all over me if I don't cut my lawn for a few weeks; it's not just a "rich people" thing. I don't call them busybodies though. I get to enjoy the product of their work every time I sit on my porch, so I don't mind doing my part to make the street pleasant.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by bitexploder on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:14AM (#18256469)
Castle doctrine is scary. Someone has to be threatening you, but it definitely is a thing. See: Trayvon Martin.

I like my HOA and it isn’t to keep poor people out. No more than high rent in SF is to keep poor people out. Market forces do that. I don’t think HOA is some evil force. I am biased of course, I live in a neighborhood with an HOA. Towns have building codes and appearance codes as well, sometimes for practical reasons, often purely for aesthetics.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dsfyu404ed on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:53AM (#18256723)
>Castle doctrine is scary

Not having castle doctrine is equally if not more scary. The idea that I could wind up in jail because I didn't make enough effort to retreat within my own home is not exactly comforting. The idea that one has to retreat within their own home or personal vehicle is just kind of absurd to begin with. I can through my own actions greatly reduce the (already minuscule) chances of getting shot by someone else in their home. I cannot through my own actions effect (or at least not to nearly the same extent) the chances of having my life threatened by someone else.

I don't live somewhere "nice" by HN standards (I'm perfectly fine with where I live). While my house will probably never be robbed it will also probably never catch on fire yet I have smoke alarms and a couple fire extinguishers.

>and appearance codes as well, sometimes for practical reasons, often purely for aesthetics.

This is the HOA-esque behavior I'm talking about. Yes, it's common in suburbs of SF, on Long island, etc. It's not the norm.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by rconti on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:33PM (#18257888)
I'm not sure I'd say HOAs are common in the suburbs of SF. Maybe the exurbs. HOAs are more common in what you might call sprawl, newer neighborhoods, and most suburbs of SF are old enough that they don't have HOAs. Unless you're talking, like, out in Danville or something.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by bitexploder on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:05AM (#18257172)
I agree in general about castle doctrine, BTW. The laws aren’t always clear in their scope around when, where, and how you can defend yourself and if they are even constitutional. Inside of your home seems like an obvious place you don’t have to retreat.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by snerbles on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:14AM (#18257234)
Even California has castle doctrine laws.

Many are unaware that in the U.S. the police is not responsible for an individual's personal safety; see Warren v. District of Columbia, Town of Castle Rock v. Gonzales, etc.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:51PM (#18258027)
> The idea that one has to retreat within their own home or personal vehicle is just kind of absurd to begin with.

If my home had two pairs of doors I'll be rushing through second one the moment I thought someone would try to brake in through the first one. Not because I had to, just because defending your stuff with your life and health is a bad choice. You have one life and body that will not be the same again after it's shot or stabbed or beaten, but you can always earn more money and get more stuff.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dsfyu404ed on Friday October 19, 2018 @01:54PM (#18258577)
>You can always earn more money and get more stuff.

I can't just buy another wife

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:13PM (#18260114)
I thought it goes without saying that I'd grab her along the way. Unless she can move only in a wheelchair then I'd have to reconsider my position but we are getting into very specific scenarios.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by snerbles on Friday October 19, 2018 @02:14PM (#18258744)
I take it you're not a parent.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:15PM (#18260128)
No. I'm not, but if I was, I'd grab my kid(s) on my way out. That's still prefferable to keeping them in wooden house of flying bullets.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by brandonmenc on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:45AM (#18256655)
Trayvon Martin was an application of "Stand Your Ground", not the Castle Doctrine.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by leetcrew on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:09AM (#18256820)
> Castle doctrine is scary.

only if you spend a lot of time in other people's houses uninvited.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by bitexploder on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:03AM (#18257156)
It depends on the state. Castle doctrine laws and stand your ground laws often get intertwined in some states. It isn’t a properly simple term to define.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by coldtea on Friday October 19, 2018 @06:57AM (#18255733)
Or collect rain water in your own yard.

Or walk by police while black...

There are so many similar examples, that I wonder what this "free" part refers to anymore...

(Of course back in the day, even back in 1920 or so, Europe was a lot more regulated than the US).

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by josefresco on Friday October 19, 2018 @07:26AM (#18255871)
Or disconnect your house from the grid (see: Florida)
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by planteen on Saturday October 20, 2018 @10:02AM (#18263334)
Is that true? Snopes makes me think it is just a rumor.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/is-it-illegal-florida-powe...

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by skc on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:53AM (#18256719)
Wait, you cannot collect rain water?
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by rhinoceraptor on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:01AM (#18256774)
AFAICT the only place where it's restricted (it used to be illegal, now you can collect 110 gallons) is Colorado.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by coldtea on Friday October 19, 2018 @01:35PM (#18258394)
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by peterwwillis on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:41AM (#18257006)
Where bullets are dirt cheap and homelessness is a crime, but it's illegal to live in an affordable tiny home, and if you're a certain skin color it's rote for politicians to make it impossible to you to vote...

There's an updated "American Pie" song in here somewhere...

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by toyg on Friday October 19, 2018 @03:18AM (#18254751)
It might also be the cultural influence of the UK, where dryers are a basic necessity (because of very high humidity and poor weather most of the year). I grew up in Italy and didn’t even know what a dryer was before I moved to England, where they’ve been ubiquitous since forever.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by mike-cardwell on Friday October 19, 2018 @04:58AM (#18255245)
I've lived in England for nearly 40 years, in various different cities. Probably lived in a dozen or more houses during that time. Not one of them had a drier. I don't recall seeing one in any of my friends houses either. Always see clothes on washing lines all over the place.

So I think you might be stretching it a bit to say that they're ubiquitous here.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by toyg on Friday October 19, 2018 @06:30AM (#18255611)
Seriously? In the North literally every house has one.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by mike-cardwell on Friday October 19, 2018 @07:13AM (#18255808)
I grew up in the North. I live in the Midlands now. They're uncommon in both locations.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by toyg on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:19AM (#18257280)
I just asked in my work chat, about a dozen Englishmen, based around Lancashire and Yorkshire; all have either a dryer or a washer-dryer; one guy in London has a washer-dryer. These are not rich people, just middle-class IT guys.

In my experience, the only flat I've rented that didn't have a dryer was a student hole in Preston that didn't have a washing machine either.

Maybe it's a sign of the times, maybe Lancashire is a cluster of dryer-lovers, but this is my anecdata.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by mike-cardwell on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:40AM (#18257486)
Yes. Some houses have them and some don't. I'm also referring to mostly middle class people. I think the only thing that we can take from this thread of anecdata is that the following two statements are false:

"In the North literally every house has one."

"they've been ubiquitous since forever"

Clearly, neither of these things are true.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Symbiote on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:00AM (#18255255)
No-one I knew in the Midlands or south of England used a dryer. I lived in 10 houses in London, and never had a dryer.

(I can't comment on the north, Scotland etc; I haven't been in enough private houses there.)

There's usually a breeze, and unless it's actually raining the clothes dry soon enough outside.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by roxya on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:39AM (#18256606)
I can't access the source of these statistics without registering but:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/289140/tumble-dryers-in-...

Shows that only a little over half even have dryers. One look around from my back garden tells me that this is fairly accurate (if anything, I would say more than 50% of my neighbours dry on a line outside)

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by SmellyGeekBoy on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:49AM (#18257074)
Dryer ownership doesn't tell the whole story either... We use ours a handful of times every year, when we need to wash and dry something in a hurry. I imagine plenty of others go unused most of the time as well.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by jfk13 on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:57AM (#18256375)
Ubiquitous? Hardly. I grew up in England (in a comfortably-off middle-class home), and didn't live in a house with a dryer until I was around 50.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by Angostura on Friday October 19, 2018 @04:29AM (#18255074)
for about 8 months of the year our clothes are dried in the garden, here in London
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by C1sc0cat on Friday October 19, 2018 @07:22AM (#18255845)
Only in the last say 30 years
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by fraudsyndrome on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:12AM (#18254190)
Actually in Australia a lot of apartments are banned from drying clothes outside their tiny balconies too because it looks "poor".

>Same for refrigerators, dish washers, garbage disposals, washing machines, and of course dryers

Ime, dryers aren't the same as the others as they tend to ruin clothes used so a reliance on them is bad

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by nell on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:42AM (#18257018)
There is some sort of love of rules and law in America that other places handle very well through culture. Coming from India, I have family both in cities and villages. Rich and poor. Everyone tries to keep their home as tidy as possible for them. Zero laws on how to maintain your house.

In America “You’re free to do whatever you want”

Conditions apply.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by csours on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:54AM (#18257106)
When I was a kid (late 1980s) we had to move our clothesline from the front yard to the back yard.

The other problem with drying clothes outside is pollen, pollution and other allergens and irritants.